Intruder theories only. No posts from rdi members allowed

[CherCher]

Exactly. Not that was know of. And there was an attack on another little girl 8 months later in the same town.

Was there ANY evidence at all that it could have been the same person who killed JB? Even a tiny bit of tDNA?

 

[CherCher]

I don't agree. I think that note points to someone who was trying to make a name for themselves by shaming them. I believe it was someone with something to prove.

Really? Why?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Was there ANY evidence at all that it could have been the same person who killed JB? Even a tiny bit of tDNA?

Not that I am aware of but that does not mean it is not related at all. They both went to the same Dance studio. He was in their house for hours before they came home.

 

[Tawny]

Was that person ever caught? I'm not familiar with that case at all.

 

[TroyinTX]

Was that person ever caught? I'm not familiar with that case at all.

No.


Read below:

Back to Intruder Theories

Acquaintance Sexual Predators

Acquaintance Pedophile Stalkers
Erotomania is another possible motivation. Suspects have included John Mark Karr, Randy Simons and the as-yet-unidentified assailant of a 14 year old who attended the same dance studio as JBR.

"Amy" Attacker
The "Amy" Attacker Theory
Another possibility is the intruder who, just 9 months after JBR's murder, surreptitiously entered a house while mother and daughter (known as "Amy") were present and sexually assaulted a 14 year girl who attended the Dance West, the same dance studio attended by JBR; this raises the possibility that the same individual stalked JBR after noticing her at the studio.

Incriminating Evidence Against the "Amy" Attacker
* 14-Year Old Dancer. "Nine months after the slaying of JonBenet Ramsey, a girl who attended the same dance studio as the young beauty queen and lived just two miles away was assaulted in her bed by an intruder while her mother slept nearby." Possible similarities to the JBR killing include:
Attended Same Dance Studio. Girl performed at same dance studio as JBR took lessons: Dance West. Thus perp may have seen both girls at the same location.
Public Performances. Like JBR, Amy had performed in several public functions in Boulder in the year before her death, giving the perp another potential opportunity or motive for targeting her.
Close Proximity in Space and Time to JBR Killing. Amy lived 2 miles from Ramseys and the assault occurred on Sept. 14, 1997, only 9 months after JBR died.
Ease of Entry May Denote Prior Experience. "He was like a ghost," recalls Amy's father. "We couldn't figure out where he came from, or where he went." "By the time the Boulder police arrived, the man was long gone. Because the intruder had gotten in and out of the house so easily, Amy's father began to think this wasn't the first time he had done something like this."
Family Away When Perp Entered House. The family was out of the house from late afternoon on the eve of the crime, until after dark. "That night, Amy's father was out of town. After catching a movie, Amy and her mother returned home late. What they didn't know when they entered the house was that there was already an intruder inside" (CBS News).
Perp Waited 4-6 Hours Before Entering Bedroom. The intruder may have waited at least four hours before entering Amy's second-floor bedroom. "Amy's father, who asked that his identity be obscured, agreed to talk about what happened that night: "My feeling is he got into the house while they were out and hid inside the house, so he would have been in there for perhaps four to six hours, hiding" (CBS News).
Sexual Assault Occurred at Night While Parent Sleeping. The perp found Amy in bed and assaulted her in the house while mother was sleeping. "Before going to bed, Amy's mother turned on the burglar alarm. Around midnight, Amy woke up to find a man standing over her bed, his hand over her mouth. "She remembered the intruder addressing her by her name," says Peterson. "He said, 'I know who you are.' He repeated those things a few times, apparently. 'I'll knock you out. Shut up.'" (CBS News).
Sexual Assault Included Digital Penetration and Oral Sex. Amy was sexually assaulted by penetration of finger or object and orally.

****Exculpatory Evidence Favoring the "Amy" Attacker****
Age Discrepancy. Pedophiles typically focus on victims of similar age. Normally, a pedophile whose interest was in 6 year olds would not be particularly interested in 14-year-olds.
No "Personal" RN Left in Amy Attack. This theory does not explain the ransom note containing "personal" language directed at John Ramsey; no similar ransom note was found in the "Amy" case, although it is not clear how things would have turned out had the mother not interrupted the attack. "Peterson says Amy's mother heard whispering, and proceeded through the doorway, and saw a person, who just brushed her aside and quickly made his escape by jumping out a second-floor window" (CBS News).


(Source: http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682445/Acquaintance Intruder Theories)

 

[CherCher]

Was that person ever caught? I'm not familiar with that case at all.

Yeah, I remember hearing something about that, but need a link to the source, I can't find it on any search. How was it known that the person came into the house "hours before" if the person was never identified?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Was that person ever caught? I'm not familiar with that case at all.

Not that I can find.

http://www.acandyrose.com/s-september97-intruder.htm

Here is some on the subject.

"On Sept. 13-14, 1997, an intruder got into a Boulder home occupied by a mother and daugher. The father was out of town when the crime occurred. The girl was 14 years old. There was no sign of a forcible break-in. It's unclear how the intruder got in, but he may have entered through a back door that was unlocked before the mother went to bed that night.

The intruder apparently snuck in and hid in the house for several hours, waiting until 3:00 a.m. before going to the girl's bedroom. He wore black clothing, knew the girl's name and knew his way around the house in the dark. The house had motion detectors and an alarm system which were set at 11:00 p.m., but he didn't set off the alarm.

The mother and daughter didn't recognize the man, but thought he may have been 20 to 30 years old. The girl "described the suspect as having white skin and blond hair sticking out from underneath" a baseball cap, which he wore backwards. He left little forensic evidence. A couple of unidentified latent fingerprints were obtained.

The family believes that the suspect is "someone who is good at sneaking into people's homes." They think "the suspect snuck into the home during the day and hid in the house." The family "believed that the suspect may have been the same suspect as in the JonBenet Ramsey murder." They "believed that the M.O. of the suspect was similar to that in the Ramsey case."

The case has some parallels to the Ramsey case, but also some significant differences. In the 1997 case, the intruder was threatening, but he didn't inflict any bodily injuries. He didn't appear to have any weapons. He didn't try to remove the girl from her room.

The 1997 intruder didn't rape the girl. He penetrated her digitally and licked her vagina. He stated that oral sex was his objective. He didn't have his pants down. He left no semen. He spent 3 to 5 minutes with the victim before he was interrupted. He woke the victim at about 3:00 a.m. by tapping her on the shoulder and placing his hand over her mouth. He spoke these phrases:

"I'm not here to hurt you."
"If you scream, I will hurt you."
"If I was here to hurt, I would have knocked you out."

The police report says the girl "believed that the male was old by the way he spoke, but described him as in his 20s by the way he was dressed. She noted that his baseball cap was dark blue or black with a small baseball player on the back of the hat..."

The report continues: "The male placed his hand over her mouth, and spoke to her telling her not to scream... She pushed the male away from her and the male called her by name and told her to stop moving. She described the male as getting really mad... He pulled her underwear to one side..."

The mother describes herself as an "extremely light sleeper." She heard rustling noises and whispers. She called out to her daughter, but when her daughter didn't reply, the mother grabbed a can of mace and approached the door of her daughter's room. At that moment, the intruder bolted out of the girl's room, ran into the mom's bedroom, went through french doors onto a landing and jumped from the second floor to the ground. He hasn't been identified.

The family was dissatisfied with the quality of police work. The family had to request that the police fingerprint the house more thoroughly. Linda Arndt was in charge. Tom Wickman, Tom Trujillo and other detectives also worked on the case.
"

 

[CherCher]

No.


Read below:

Back to Intruder Theories

Acquaintance Sexual Predators

Acquaintance Pedophile Stalkers
Erotomania is another possible motivation. Suspects have included John Mark Karr, Randy Simons and the as-yet-unidentified assailant of a 14 year old who attended the same dance studio as JBR.

"Amy" Attacker
The "Amy" Attacker Theory
Another possibility is the intruder who, just 9 months after JBR's murder, surreptitiously entered a house while mother and daughter (known as "Amy") were present and sexually assaulted a 14 year girl who attended the Dance West, the same dance studio attended by JBR; this raises the possibility that the same individual stalked JBR after noticing her at the studio.

Incriminating Evidence Against the "Amy" Attacker
* 14-Year Old Dancer. "Nine months after the slaying of JonBenet Ramsey, a girl who attended the same dance studio as the young beauty queen and lived just two miles away was assaulted in her bed by an intruder while her mother slept nearby." Possible similarities to the JBR killing include:
Attended Same Dance Studio. Girl performed at same dance studio as JBR took lessons: Dance West. Thus perp may have seen both girls at the same location.
Public Performances. Like JBR, Amy had performed in several public functions in Boulder in the year before her death, giving the perp another potential opportunity or motive for targeting her.
Close Proximity in Space and Time to JBR Killing. Amy lived 2 miles from Ramseys and the assault occurred on Sept. 14, 1997, only 9 months after JBR died.
Ease of Entry May Denote Prior Experience. "He was like a ghost," recalls Amy's father. "We couldn't figure out where he came from, or where he went." "By the time the Boulder police arrived, the man was long gone. Because the intruder had gotten in and out of the house so easily, Amy's father began to think this wasn't the first time he had done something like this."
Family Away When Perp Entered House. The family was out of the house from late afternoon on the eve of the crime, until after dark. "That night, Amy's father was out of town. After catching a movie, Amy and her mother returned home late. What they didn't know when they entered the house was that there was already an intruder inside" (CBS News).
Perp Waited 4-6 Hours Before Entering Bedroom. The intruder may have waited at least four hours before entering Amy's second-floor bedroom. "Amy's father, who asked that his identity be obscured, agreed to talk about what happened that night: "My feeling is he got into the house while they were out and hid inside the house, so he would have been in there for perhaps four to six hours, hiding" (CBS News).
Sexual Assault Occurred at Night While Parent Sleeping. The perp found Amy in bed and assaulted her in the house while mother was sleeping. "Before going to bed, Amy's mother turned on the burglar alarm. Around midnight, Amy woke up to find a man standing over her bed, his hand over her mouth. "She remembered the intruder addressing her by her name," says Peterson. "He said, 'I know who you are.' He repeated those things a few times, apparently. 'I'll knock you out. Shut up.'" (CBS News).
Sexual Assault Included Digital Penetration and Oral Sex. Amy was sexually assaulted by penetration of finger or object and orally.

****Exculpatory Evidence Favoring the "Amy" Attacker****
Age Discrepancy. Pedophiles typically focus on victims of similar age. Normally, a pedophile whose interest was in 6 year olds would not be particularly interested in 14-year-olds.
No "Personal" RN Left in Amy Attack. This theory does not explain the ransom note containing "personal" language directed at John Ramsey; no similar ransom note was found in the "Amy" case, although it is not clear how things would have turned out had the mother not interrupted the attack. "Peterson says Amy's mother heard whispering, and proceeded through the doorway, and saw a person, who just brushed her aside and quickly made his escape by jumping out a second-floor window" (CBS News).


(Source: http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682445/Acquaintance Intruder Theories)

Interesting, but completely unlike JB's murder. First off, no murder. No ransom note, no hiding of the body in a far off room...too many variables. AND was there any dna?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Interesting, but completely unlike JB's murder. First off, no murder. No ransom note, no hiding of the body in a far off room...too many variables. AND was there any dna?

And it was after that event when he could have changed things..

Criminals evolve.. What I find interesting is there was no rape then either. With JBR they had all the time in the world, And no rape, That says to me that it was not possible or not what they were looking for.

 

[Tawny]

Rapist =/= Murderer

 

[TroyinTX]

^

Yes, there are some similarities, but nothing hard hitting enough to say the two are related. Heck, this could have just been some pedo that was influenced by the JB case.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

^

Yes, there are some similarities, but nothing hard hitting enough to say the two are related. Heck, this could have just been some pedo that was influenced by the JB case.

That is possible. But we don't know that. Not every crime is exactly the same even by the same perp.

 

[Tawny]

Actually, that's not entirely true. Serial criminals generally have the same MO. Small differences maybe, but overall, more similarities than not. That's why there are profilers.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Actually, that's not entirely true. Serial criminals generally have the same MO. Small differences maybe, but overall, more similarities than not. That's why there are profilers.

No. Not all the time. Some things may stay the same and some may change. There are many killers who used different weapons or approaches.

We have no idea if that is the case here because he was not caught EITHER.

It is not always exact..

 

[Tawny]

So, then, if that is the same perp, who attacked a different girl not related except by a dance class, then it wasn't a personal vendetta against the Ramseys.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

So, then, if that is the same perp, who attacked a different girl not related except by a dance class, then it wasn't a personal vendetta against the Ramseys.

Maybe, Maybe not. To me the Ramsey crime feels personal. But this could have just been someone who got a taste for it then and tried again.

Because after this, no more reports there. It was someone pretty adept at breaking in places.

 

[Tawny]

So, he/she got a taste for breaking and entering and assault, and then is never heard from again?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

So, he/she got a taste for breaking and entering and assault, and then is never heard from again?

That could mean they left the state, died, Who knows..

But we know for a fact it happened here and he is gone after the attack on Amy.

 

[TroyinTX]

The Ramsey killer also waited much less time before attacking JB. It is estimated that she was killed between 11pm and 1am; the Ramsey's claim they went to bed I believe by 11 or 11:30pm. IMO, an intruder took a HUGE risk attacking JB so shortly after the household went to bed. This has always bothered me; the attack happened so soon after the family went to bed and they STILL did not hear anything; how could an intruder be sure that the family had fallen in deep enough sleep to go and abduct JB from her bedroom?

 

[Tawny]

I feel like that is a very remote thing to grasp onto to try to make it 'fit' the JBR case. It seems like it was a random break in, or the case of a pervy stalker or something. There is nothing remotely similar to the JBR case except that they went to the same dance studio, which is normal when girls live in the same area in a neighborhood with money. JMO