Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #13

[Wishbone]

I didn't say that. But I will say that the UN is a joke. JMO.

Add in countries that just give lip service to the same issue and take no action thus allowing the problem to continue.JMOP

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Add in countries that just give lip service to the same issue and take no action thus allowing the problem to continue.JMOP

That sounds reasonable to me.

 

[MassGuy]

They’ve had some hilarious propaganda mistakes recently, but this one is way up there.

Palestinians claim Mohammed Nazal had his arms broken by Israel while he was in jail...only thing is we have the video of him being released to the Red Cross and his arms are perfectly fine.

Someone at the Palestinian propaganda office is gonna lose their job....

https://x.com/avivaklompas/status/1729656239263494339?s=46&t=1LeaTK_fug_ONwN11qOyUw

 

[JennieM]

2m ago

Egyptian media reports that a preliminary understanding has been reached to extend the truce​

Egypt’s Al-Araby Al-Jadeed newspaper is reporting that a preliminary understanding has been reached to extend the truce for two more days, under the same conditions that are currently being observed. The paper has quoted Egyptian officials as its source.

Israeli officials confirmed to the Haaretz newspaper that the proposal was being examined, but has not yet been confirmed. Haaretz reports an Israeli source as saying the agreement on an extension depended on whether Hamas is able to release 10 additional Israeli hostages a day.

As we reported earlier, with fewer women and children remaining in captivity extending the truce may require Hamas to free at least some Israeli men for the first time.

Israel says 30 Palestinians released after 12 hostages returned from Gaza – as it happened

Israel says Palestinians have been freed after nine women, a child and two foreign nationals were handed to the Red Cross

www.theguardian.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

To be honest, I don't think 1) Netanyahu has the backing of his people to do that, and 2) I doubt after this war, and all the global protests, that the world will allow that to occur without serious objection and consequences. jmo

So far Israel has only faced consequences from neighbors, so maybe this time will be different.
I remember right before Obama left office the US abstained a vote on Israel on the Security Council and you would think the world ended by the Israeli response.

 

[Dotta]

Thanks for this. Now I better understand why there are so many Palestinians incarcerated in Israel.

And now I don't feel quite as bad about the many bombs being dropped by IDF. This^^^ kind of helps explain that response. Thank You for the context.

Putting vast numbers in prisons seems not to be a solution judging by the mess the whole world is now watching, no?
After all, the whole nation cannot be incarcerated.
Unless it is a gulag.

JMO

 

[Dotta]

That and there were some domestic issues, resulting in decreased number of troops. Although without actual numbers, I have no idea how much the troop issue played into it. Another source had stated more troops were focused on the West Bank in recent months.

At least 250 killed in unprecedented Hamas attack in Israel; prime minister says country is "at war"

The escalation comes after weeks of heightened tensions along Israel's volatile border with Gaza, and heavy fighting in the Israeli-occupied West Bank. It also comes at a delicate time for Netanyahu's far-right government, with hundreds of soldiers in the military reserves have either pulling out of training sessions or promising they won't report for duty over government's deeply divisive plan to weaken the Supreme Court.

The divisions within army ranks have threatened to undermine Netanyahu's reputation as a security expert who would do anything to protect Israel and the cohesion of an institution crucial to the stability of a country locked in low-intensity conflicts on multiple fronts and facing threats from Lebanon's Hezbollah militant group.

It seems the secret service was more interested in political opponents of the ruling party than terrorists behind the fence.

And the military more involved in protecting the settlers in WB than securing the border with Gaza.

It all starts with politics.

JMO

 

[JennieM]

6m ago
Jason Burke

The chances of the truce being extended much beyond 10 days appear slim, analysts say.

One reason is that both sides are running out of hostages or prisoners whom they can free relatively painlessly. The Palestinians released from Israeli jails so far are mainly women and children. So, too, are the hostages freed by Hamas in Gaza. In the brutal calculations of such things, neither category includes “high value” individuals. Among the hostages, these would include military personnel. Among the prisoners, it may mean high-profile political leaders, those accused of very serious crimes and others thought to endanger Israel’s security.

One possibility is that the current ceasefire could be extended to include elderly and sick people among the remaining 180 or so hostages and the thousands of Palestinians in Israeli jails. But that would postpone, not prevent, the coming trial of strength.

Nour Odeh, an analyst and commentator based in Ramallah, said that phase 2 would not be a continuation of phase 1. “[This] is when we get into the hardball. The civilian hostages is one thing, but the soldiers is another. Hamas have said all along they want ‘all for all’ [all the hostages for all the prisoners in Israel] but I don’t think [Benjamin] Netanyahu will accept such a high price.”

She added: “The likelihood of a resumption of bombardment and also a ground offensive in the south [of Gaza] continues to loom large.”

To reconcile the apparently conflicting goals of freeing the hostages and “crushing” Hamas, Israeli officials and many analysts say military pressure is the only way to force the organisation to make concessions – despite the cost in civilian life and harm to Israel’s international reputation.

Read more
Hostage talks show a battered Hamas is far from down and out

Israel says 30 Palestinians released after 12 hostages returned from Gaza – as it happened

Israel says Palestinians have been freed after nine women, a child and two foreign nationals were handed to the Red Cross

www.theguardian.com

 

[katydid23]

In America the president is concerned regarding humanitarian issues for civilians waiting for the next promised bout of bombing to be inflicted on them.
Can't be too many buildings left standing undamaged.

The damage to hospitals is unbelievable and cannot all be due to badly aimed or misfiring Hamas rockets. Winter will come and with it will come starvation; exposure to the elements; disease and death.

That is a tragic thing...truly heartbreaking.

And what kind of damages have been done to the children who witnessed their parents being slaughtered some raped, in their own homes? And those who saw their kids kidnapped or beaten, stabbed---etc etc....there are thousands and thousands of horribly damaging memories and events like that. None of these people will feel truly safe ever again. What kind of damage has that done? It will be generational.

The hundreds of families who have seen videos of their loved ones chased down in the streets by terrorists and shot, left for dead, and some taken hostage. Then the vile attackers took videos of the deaths and sent them to surviving family members, hoping to instill as much fear and terror as possible. This entire nation has been shaken to the core.

In the future, when the Gazan people are dealing with exposure to the elements, there will be lots of foreign aid, much from America and Western countries, and from Arab countries, to help prevent the diseases and starvation.

Buildings will be rebuilt, there will be shipments of food, and medicines. But will they change their hearts and understand the damage that was done to both sides?

This is a land and its people bombed back into the dark ages: I try to avoid using Godwin's law in discussion, but Good Lord if there ever was an occasion it is now when the parallels are so in your face it is staggering.

Could that be projection on your part? If you feel the staggering need to call someone out using Godwin's law maybe look in the mirror?

This is not for the benefit of Jews world wide or even in Israel. It is political and for the benefit of what is in real terms a small group of political idealists tramping over anything which is not them.

It is not 'political'----it is about humans breaking into other humans homes at sunrise and stomping them and stabbing them and feeling joyful as they film the mass murders. There ids no politics involved-->>pure hatred.

The hostages were not really an issue when they got in the way of blood lust to kill off Hamas, until the outrage engendered and led by their families - and good on them - became a real political issue.

Hamas took the hostages in order to try and protect themselves from retaliation by using the hostages as shields. It didn't work.

If the US president can't influence and curtail this ruling party then they are definitely out of control.
There has been a lot more than an eye for an eye in revenge for the 7th, there has been a holocaust.

The holocaust ended with 6 million deaths. Neither of these events are anywhere near the holocaust.

My opinion

https://www.newsmax.com/world/globaltalk/israel-gaza-hamas/2023/11/28/id/1143854/

 

[PommyMommy]

2hr ago

4-year-old US-Israeli released from hospital two days after being returned to Israel​

Avigail Idan is reunited with her aunt Liron and uncle Zuli at the Schneider children's hospital on November 27, 2023. (Schneider hospital)

Avigail Idan, 4, an American-Israeli citizen kidnapped from Kibbutz Kfar Aza on October 7, has been released from the hospital two days after she was returned to Israel.

Idan’s parents were murdered by Hamas terrorists in last month’s onslaught. She was later abducted while hiding with four neighbors, who also have been released.

Idan, who was held by Hamas for 52 days, will stay with her aunt’s family.

 

[PommyMommy]

3m ago / 7:03 PM PST

Hundreds gather to support family still in captivity, including 2 young boys​

At what is now known as Hostage Square, just outside the Tel Aviv Museum of Art, a few hundred people gathered tonight to support the Bibas family. Yarden and his wife, Shiri were kidnapped by Hamas from Kibbutz Nir Oz on Oct. 7, along with their two boys — 4-year-old Ariel and now 10-month-old Kfir.

"These two young little redheads really got in the hearts of everybody in Israel and also in the entire world,” said Yarden’s sister, Ofri. She called the last seven weeks a “nightmare.”

Yarden, Ariel, Shiri, and Kfir Bibas.Bibas family

More hostages to be released after Gaza cease-fire is extended

Follow NBC News' latest coverage of the Israel-Hamas war: More hostages and prisoners to be released; U.S. pushes for further extension in Qatar talks.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

Putting vast numbers in prisons seems not to be a solution judging by the mess the whole world is now watching, no?
After all, the whole nation cannot be incarcerated.
Unless it is a gulag.

JMO

6m ago
Jason Burke

The chances of the truce being extended much beyond 10 days appear slim, analysts say.

One reason is that both sides are running out of hostages or prisoners whom they can free relatively painlessly. The Palestinians released from Israeli jails so far are mainly women and children. So, too, are the hostages freed by Hamas in Gaza. In the brutal calculations of such things, neither category includes “high value” individuals. Among the hostages, these would include military personnel. Among the prisoners, it may mean high-profile political leaders, those accused of very serious crimes and others thought to endanger Israel’s security.

One possibility is that the current ceasefire could be extended to include elderly and sick people among the remaining 180 or so hostages and the thousands of Palestinians in Israeli jails. But that would postpone, not prevent, the coming trial of strength.

Nour Odeh, an analyst and commentator based in Ramallah, said that phase 2 would not be a continuation of phase 1. “[This] is when we get into the hardball. The civilian hostages is one thing, but the soldiers is another. Hamas have said all along they want ‘all for all’ [all the hostages for all the prisoners in Israel] but I don’t think [Benjamin] Netanyahu will accept such a high price.”

She added: “The likelihood of a resumption of bombardment and also a ground offensive in the south [of Gaza] continues to loom large.”

To reconcile the apparently conflicting goals of freeing the hostages and “crushing” Hamas, Israeli officials and many analysts say military pressure is the only way to force the organisation to make concessions – despite the cost in civilian life and harm to Israel’s international reputation.

Read more
Hostage talks show a battered Hamas is far from down and out

Israel says 30 Palestinians released after 12 hostages returned from Gaza – as it happened

Israel says Palestinians have been freed after nine women, a child and two foreign nationals were handed to the Red Cross

www.theguardian.com

Excellent reminder on where it's headed.
Probably most of the prisoners Israel released, were women and children that were never criminally charged.

Will Netanyahu cave and release Marwan Barghouti.
I believe he'll have pressure coming at him from the North, East West and South to do so in exchange for Israeli soldiers.

 

[Vern]

To deal with information emanating from a war zone (or anywhere, really) one must seek to view the larger picture presented from different sources for information.
One cannot expect information coming from protagonists to be accurate without verification from other independent sources being factored into the equation.

Hamas delays second hostage release until Israel lets aid into northern Gaza​

Reuters
Nov 25 (Reuters) - The armed wing of the Palestinian militant group Hamas said on Saturday that it had decided to delay the second round of hostage releases until Israel is committed to letting aid trucks enter northern Gaza.

Hamas delays second hostage release until Israel lets aid into northern Gaza

The armed wing of the Palestinian militant group Hamas said on Saturday that it had decided to delay the second round of hostage releases until Israel is committed to letting aid trucks enter northern Gaza.

www.reuters.com

This was debunked days ago when the footage was released of the aid trucks actually arriving into the northen Gaza strip - led by a flatbed loaded with hospital beds. The Aid Organizations also confirmed that the full compliment of 200 trucks as agreed to was allowed into the Gaza. Then Hamas changed it's claim to state that fuel and cooking fuel trucks weren't being allowed ... then that footage and confirmation from the Aid Orgs of the requisite numbers of them arriving and being distributed was shown.

That's when Hamas finally settled back to the Israeli's breaching the ceasefire because "prisoners with the most time in prison were to come first".

If you recall, that's when Qatar and Egypt immediately got all over Hamas to "comply" with the ceasefire by midnight as their claims were garbage. Their so many excuses debunked by footage and aid orgs one after the other. Then, mysteriously, a Mom and child who had been kept together the entire time and whom were slated for release (14 hostages and 42 prisoners ready to go) were suddenly separated by Hamas and Mom did not make it onto the van to the Red Cross. Interesting. What petulent tantrums Hamas is playing with people's lives.

Regardless, Israel will come knocking - especially if a single ONE of those hostages and POWs remain. Good on them.

 

[Dotta]

One thing I’ve not understood is why Egypt has a blockade against allowing Palestinians in to their country? Or why no other Arab country will accept them. I get Palestinians not wanting to leave their home but everything I’ve read says no one else will take them en masse so that the civilians can leave even if temporarily.

What country is prepared to suddenly host over 2 million people?

Why would the nation suddenly leave their homeland?

 

[PommyMommy]

"You shouldn't expect anything from the Red Cross. Documents from World War II indicate that they had written reports after visiting Auschwitz, saying that everything is fine and nothing is happening."Maurice Ifergan, Policy Analyst

https://twitter.com/x/status/1729541196479910204

 

[JennieM]

40 min ago

Hamas has given Israel list of hostages expected to be released Wednesday​

From CNN's Kaitlan Collins and MJ Lee

The list of the sixth set of hostages expected to be freed has been given to the Israeli government, and families are being notified, two sources familiar with the matter tell CNN.

This will be the second release in the extension of the truce.

November 28, 2023 Israel-Hamas war

Twelve hostages, comprising 10 Israelis and two Thai citizens, were released by Hamas on Tuesday, according to officials. Thirty Palestinians were also freed from Israeli prisons, officials said.

edition.cnn.com

47s ago

List of hostages to be freed on Wednesday released - reports​

Israeli media are reporting that Benjamin Netanyahu’s office has received a list with the names of the Israeli hostages that Hamas intends to release on Wednesday, the sixth group of hostages to be freed as part of the temporary truce.

The families of those on the list have reportedly been informed.

Israel says 30 Palestinians released after 12 hostages returned from Gaza – as it happened

Israel says Palestinians have been freed after nine women, a child and two foreign nationals were handed to the Red Cross

www.theguardian.com

 

[PommyMommy]

This is NOT the first time Hamas has exploited ambulances for terrorism. Watch to find out the grim truth behind Hamas’ terrorist tactics.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1729692104996094016

(Documented back to 2004)

 

[margarita25]

 

[margarita25]

 

[Vern]

There are differences between kidnapped hostages and prisoners released from prison after committing crimes.

The reunions in Israel have been families rejoicing.

Some of the joyous reunions in Gaza have ended with large crowds waving Hamas flags and with the returning prisoner yelling into a microphone their death threats and violent chats.

And chants by the masses led by one of the released for all Jewish blood (aka Calls for GENOCIDE).

And beating then summarily executing three Palestinians on mere allegations.

That's the reality of what is being dealt with and exprienced and it is the difference between good and evil.