Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #7

[Brightchaser47]

We have tunnels under my city, but they are coal mines' ones

Ditto

 

[Momoffourboys]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716902785269342268

 

[Chimera]

Very interesting and enlightening article.

But I’m stuck on why they would lower an alive calf into the tunnel? My first thought was for food source, but would there be another reason?

Sorry if this is a dumb question. I am an animal lover and it just struck me as strange.

My .02 is that it's for meat, as in veal ?
It's not like Hamas can just go to their local grocers , esp. if one of their misfired rockets destroyed it.

Those tunnels wouldn't be conducive to raising cattle, no matter how large.
C02 emissions from manure would make the tunnels untenable.

Which makes me wonder how Hamas killers are dealing with sanitation down there ?
Prob. no plumbing to speak of.
Omo.

 

[Momoffourboys]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716906369679597967

 

[Momoffourboys]

Very interesting and enlightening article.

But I’m stuck on why they would lower an alive calf into the tunnel? My first thought was for food source, but would there be another reason?

Sorry if this is a dumb question. I am an animal lover and it just struck me as strange.

Underground cattle trade thrives in Gaza tunnels

When the calves were hauled out of the tunnel from Egypt on Tuesday, they could hardly stand up.

www.reuters.com

 

[dotr]

Very interesting and enlightening article.

But I’m stuck on why they would lower an alive calf into the tunnel? My first thought was for food source, but would there be another reason?

Sorry if this is a dumb question. I am an animal lover and it just struck me as strange.

Underground cattle trade thrives in Gaza tunnels

When the calves were hauled out of the tunnel from Egypt on Tuesday, they could hardly stand up.

www.reuters.com

OCTOBER 21, 2008

''Underground cattle trade thrives in Gaza tunnels​

By Nidal al-Mughrabi
''RAFAH, Gaza Strip (Reuters) - When the calves were hauled out of the tunnel from Egypt on Tuesday, they could hardly stand up.
After a terrifying, 1000 meter (yard) underground trip into the Israeli-blockaded Gaza Strip, what the young cattle wanted most was a long drink of cool water.

Underground livestock smuggling has increased dramatically ahead of Eid Al-Adha, the day of sacrifice due December 10, when Muslims the world over slaughter animals and feed the poor to seek God’s forgiveness.''

Oct 26, 2010
Weeks before Gaza residents celebrate the Muslim festival Eid al-Adha, the tunnels leading to the Gaza Strip from Egypt are busy smuggling cows for the holiday feasts. (Oct. 26)

 

[MyBelle]

Israel had better listen or they will lose their allies' military support:
JMO

'Humanitarian pause' in Hamas-Israel war is urged to aid Gaza civilians

The United Nations, United States and Canada appealed on Tuesday for a humanitarian pause in the Israel-Hamas war to allow safe deliveries of aid to civilians short of food, water, medicine and electricity in the Israeli-besieged Gaza Strip.

www.reuters.com

GAZA/JERUSALEM, Oct 24 (Reuters) - The United Nations, United States and Canada appealed on Tuesday for a humanitarian pause in the Israel-Hamas war to allow safe deliveries of aid to civilians stricken by shortages of food, water, medicine and electricity in the Israeli-besieged enclave.

International pressure for unimpeded aid to Gaza rose as the health ministry in the Hamas-ruled territory reported that Israeli air strikes had killed more than 700 Palestinians overnight. Ministry spokesman Ashraf Al-Qidra said this was the highest 24-hour death toll in Israel's two-week-old siege.

 

[justtrish]

It is already within the contingency plans (CONPLANs).

The military never starts from scratch for anything. In order to start 'executing' on those plans however ... word needs to come from the top to 'act'. IE: following their Commander in Chiefs Orders.


Example: CONPLAN LASER (Pandemic Response) has existed on the books: how to go about effecting executing a national response to a pandemic outbreak since shortly after the flu outbreak of 1918. All CONPLANs are regualarly pulled out and dusted off, updated to reflect new technology, transportaition, new threats and other items that would +/- affect the CONPLAN. etc. When the CONPLAN is then ordered to be 'executed' it becomes an OPLAN (Operational Plan). In 2020, it became OPLAN LASER.

I can guarantee you that all the Planimals (Military Planners) have been extremely busy at all the Joint Headquarters etc putting the CONPLAN through it's paces, executing the OPP (Operational Planning Process) to provide several CoAs (Courses of Action) for the powers-that-be to select from. It's what we do. They are ready for this ... and many other things. It's why they monitor world affairs 24/7/365 in those Joint HQs.

The US has also been asking citizens who wanted to leave these hotspots to begin doing so back on 8 Oct IIRC.

I understand this. I know they've been flying people out, but also making them repay for the flight. How many aren't able to do that? I think if any time is the time to not worry about the money it's when Americans are in danger in war zones. This was not even a thought the day before it happened. No increased threat levels that I know of and clearly Israel wasn't even aware of a possibility of the attack at the level that it was. The US wastes money on so many things and then in this very real dire situation for some Americans they will offer them to fly out, but they sign a paper saying they will pay it back? I guess it just doesn't sit well. We could have been getting so many people out over the last 2 weeks and maybe we were, but again are they all saying they'll pay back the cost of the flight? What about those that can't buy a ticket right now or pay it back are they just out of luck? I know it's so easy for me to say things and not be in the situation so I don't doubt they are trying to do the right thing. I just see how awful the exit from Afghanistan was. Are we waiting until the airport is damaged or the possibility for planes to safely come and go is taken away? Now the entire ME seems to be a hot spot and Americans I think will always be a target for some groups. Once Israel enters on the ground, I worry things will escalate everywhere.. we've known this was coming and so seeing the announcement now just feels a bit late in the game. I pray they all can get out safely if they wish to.

 

[Gypsy Road]

The level of preparation for the attack was significant. That took a lot of planning and cooperation from MANY people.

 

[dotr]

rbbm

Trudeau says his government supports 'pauses' in the Israel-Hamas war, after defence minister rejects ceasefire

Bill Blair also dismissed growing calls, including within his own caucus, for a ceasefire in the war between Israel and Hamas.

nationalpost.com

''Trudeau reiterated that Hamas is a “recognized terrorist organization” that has committed “unspeakable atrocities” but would not go as far as Defence Minister Bill Blair who said Tuesday morning that Hamas needs to be “eliminated as a threat, not just to Israel but to the world.”

“I have no expectation that a terrorist organization would respect international law or any call for a ceasefire,” Blair told reporters on his way to a cabinet meeting on Tuesday morning''.

Israel vows again to destroy Hamas, rejecting calls for a cease-fire in Gaza at a major UN meeting

UNITED NATIONS (AP) — Israel vowed again to destroy Hamas, rejecting calls from the U.N. chief, the Palestinians and many countries at a high-level U.N. meeting on Tuesday for a

www.thestar.com

'UNITED NATIONS (AP) — Israel vowed again to destroy Hamas, rejecting calls from the U.N. chief, the Palestinians and many countries at a high-level U.N. meeting on Tuesday for a cease-fire and declaring that the war in Gaza is not only its war but “the war of the free world.”
Israel’s Foreign Minister Eli Cohen also dismissed calls for “proportionality” in the country’s response to Hamas’ surprise attacks on Israel on Oct. 7 that killed 1,400 people and has since led to more than 5,700 Palestinian deaths in Gaza according to its Health Ministry.
“Tell me, what is a proportionate response for killing of babies, for rape (of) women and burn them, for beheading a child?” Cohen asked. “How can you agree to a cease-fire with someone who swore to kill and destroy your own existence?”

 

[MyBelle]

I understand this. I know they've been flying people out, but also making them repay for the flight. How many aren't able to do that? I think if any time is the time to not worry about the money it's when Americans are in danger in war zones. This was not even a thought the day before it happened. No increased threat levels that I know of and clearly Israel wasn't even aware of a possibility of the attack at the level that it was. The US wastes money on so many things and then in this very real dire situation for some Americans they will offer them to fly out, but they sign a paper saying they will pay it back? I guess it just doesn't sit well. We could have been getting so many people out over the last 2 weeks and maybe we were, but again are they all saying they'll pay back the cost of the flight? What about those that can't buy a ticket right now or pay it back are they just out of luck? I know it's so easy for me to say things and not be in the situation so I don't doubt they are trying to do the right thing. I just see how awful the exit from Afghanistan was. Are we waiting until the airport is damaged or the possibility for planes to safely come and go is taken away? Now the entire ME seems to be a hot spot and Americans I think will always be a target for some groups. Once Israel enters on the ground, I worry things will escalate everywhere.. we've known this was coming and so seeing the announcement now just feels a bit late in the game. I pray they all can get out safely if they wish to.

I hope those unable to leave Israel are in safe shelters provided by aid organizations such as the Red Cross.

JMO

 

[Arkay]

Israel had better listen or they will lose their allies' military support:

I saw Biden on the Today Show and when he was questioned, he said no ceasefire until the hostages are all returned safely.

@dotr also provided a link in which Canada says a ceasefire doesn’t get honored by terrorist organizations.

The return of the hostages is Israel’s first priority along with eliminating the Hamas terrorists. They are a sovereign nation and IMO they are weighing the pros and cons of how much to acquiesce to their allies.

Israel is the victim here. They will do what is best for their nation. They owe nothing to Hamas nor to those who support them.

IMO

 

[MyBelle]

I saw Biden on the Today Show and when he was questioned, he said no ceasefire until the hostages are all returned safely.

@dotr also provided a link in which Canada says a ceasefire doesn’t get honored by terrorist organizations.

The return of the hostages is Israel’s first priority along with eliminating the Hamas terrorists. They are a sovereign nation and IMO they are weighing the pros and cons of how much to acquiesce to their allies.

Israel is the victim here. They will do what is best for their nation. They owe nothing to Hamas nor to those who support them.

IMO

BBM. There was no justification for the Hamas terrorist attack. But the 700 families that were blasted into oblivion by the launching of bombs on their homes isn't a humane response.

JMO
Najib Jobain, Samy Magdy and Ravi Nessman

Oct 24, 2023, 01:09 PM EDT

Israeli Airstrikes Surge In Gaza, Killing Dozens At A Time In Destroyed Homes, Witnesses Say

The airstrikes crushed residential buildings and buried families under rubble, as Gaza health officials reported hundreds killed in the past day, including children.

www.huffpost.com

 

[Gypsy Road]

Interesting how well planned the taking of hostages was. Seems people from all walks of Palestinian life were complicit, including doctors and pharmacists, unless Hamas held them at gunpoint making them cooperate- which I highly doubt, but you never know. The organization seems to be huge and doesn’t just include soldiers- or whatever you call them.

 

[justtrish]

Interesting how well planned the taking of hostages was. Seems people from all walks of Palestinian life were complicit, including doctors and pharmacists, unless Hamas held them at gunpoint making them cooperate- which I highly doubt, but you never know. The organization seems to be huge and doesn’t just include soldiers- or whatever you call them.

Exactly! How many of those are sympathizers, supporters, quicketly cheering them on and encouraging them? This has been a concern during many wars. Look at Vietnam.. kids thowing grenades, or being used to deliver explosives.. soldiers having to kill kids and strugging forever with that decision, but sometimes the kids were the enemy and they never knew who was and wasn't. Same thing in Iraq and Afghanastan. Sometimes the kids or the woman were concealing a vest with explosives.. they never knew what they were going to encouter and not all kids were harmless. I think all kids are "innocent" in the sense they don't know what they are doing if an adult is asking them to do these awful things, but many kids have participated in setting off IEDs and soldiers have to make a quick decision on if that kid means them harm. They are never the same if the return from a war like that where they may have harmed children and woman, but often those children and woman are NOT neutral. It's hard for the "good guys" because that is something America would not do.. we can't understand that level of awful.. but it exists. People sacrifice their woman and children in order to blow up the enemy.

 

[Arkay]

BBM. There was no justification for the Hamas terrorist attack. But the 700 families that were blasted into oblivion by the launching of bombs on their homes isn't a humane response.

So, IMO, humane responses should be directed at humans.
You did see all the thousands of civilian men in Gaza who participated in abusing and violating the kidnapped Israelis once they were hauled across the border?

As for families, you did see that Israel gave multiple warnings in Arabic, warning them to leave for their own safety?

Did Hamas notify Israelis, in Hebrew, that they should leave their kibbutzes before they were attacked?

This seems very asymmetrical to me .

 

[Leve]

BBM. There was no justification for the Hamas terrorist attack. But the 700 families that were blasted into oblivion by the launching of bombs on their homes isn't a humane response.

JMO
Najib Jobain, Samy Magdy and Ravi Nessman

Oct 24, 2023, 01:09 PM EDT

Israeli Airstrikes Surge In Gaza, Killing Dozens At A Time In Destroyed Homes, Witnesses Say

The airstrikes crushed residential buildings and buried families under rubble, as Gaza health officials reported hundreds killed in the past day, including children.

www.huffpost.com

Did you know several hundred thousand civilians died due to the War on Terror? The US led but the UK, France, and Russia all took part in the actual bombings ect.

There were no "pauses" called for in the 1 st two weeks.

The US, a country of 339 Million, lost 2901 people on 911. Israel (9.3 million) lost 1400+ in a terror attack. I say folks need to sit down and let Israel do what they need to do.

 

[PrairieWind]

BBM. There was no justification for the Hamas terrorist attack. But the 700 families that were blasted into oblivion by the launching of bombs on their homes isn't a humane response.

JMO
Najib Jobain, Samy Magdy and Ravi Nessman

Oct 24, 2023, 01:09 PM EDT

Israeli Airstrikes Surge In Gaza, Killing Dozens At A Time In Destroyed Homes, Witnesses Say

The airstrikes crushed residential buildings and buried families under rubble, as Gaza health officials reported hundreds killed in the past day, including children.

www.huffpost.com

It is very unfortunate. But I don't see an alternative. Hamas is going to be destroyed. It Hamas that chooses to hide amongst the civilians.

 

[Momoffourboys]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716926424383443180

 

[Momoffourboys]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716925826942566566