Jodi Arias TAKES THE STAND #37 *may contain graphic and adult content*

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  • #961
I'm leaning towards the head shot first and got out. Stranger things have happened in this world, and the defense will hang onto that. After the first shot the gun may of jammed, and Travis got out and Jodi had the knife. Jodi knows that Travis wouldn't hurt her, but stop her and call 911. Jodi couldn't let that happen.

I just listened to the blood spatter evidence and I may have to rethink things. There was no blood spatter evidence in the shower, walls, ceiling, etc except on the shower floor and threshold.
 
  • #962
And let us not forget the BTK killer, Dennis Rader!

Rader attended Butler County Community College in El Dorado, earning an associate degree in electronics in 1973.[5] He then enrolled at Wichita State University and graduated in 1979 with a bachelor's degree in administration of justice.

Solid employment: Rader worked as an assembler for a camping gear firm and then, from 1974 until 1988 (then later worked as a dog-catcher).

Rader was a member of Christ Lutheran Church and had been elected president.

He was married for 34 years.

AFAIK - he had no prior arrests before the BTK murders (10 or so).

So it appears to me you can have a steady life outside of your psycho side. Scary isn't it?

MOO

Mel

This is a cardinal curiosity of psychopathy for me given all other factors. Hervey Cleckley agrees with you in his Mask of Sanity.
 
  • #963
Well, I'm thinking he was face down when his throat was slit at the end of the hallway. For the blood to drip backwards and down his back he must have been in a different position at some point in between for the wounds above his neck to bleed backwards and so profusely.

Jodi cut the arteries of his neck. The wound to his neck was cut back almost in line with his ear. Blood would have be gushing out of that wound running down either side of his neck because he was not sitting up. You can see it in the pictures because she is pulling him back towards the bathroom and he is on his back. jmo
 
  • #964
The more I think about it, the more I think this was Jodi's plan:

Secretly travel to Mesa to either
a) get Travis back
or
b) kill him

After their sexual encounter he probably rejected her overtures and indicated he was still going to Mexico, or she got the sense from something else that it was over for them.

She intended to kill him in the shower, let him bleed out, rinse his body, dismember him and dispose of the body. She returns to CA and plays dumb.

The whole camera thing was probably another one of her devised "games", so that he knew she was in the bathroom and she could get close to him without him wondering what she was doing peeking in the shower.

She shoots him once. The gun jams and she can't get off a 2nd shot (here is where her plan goes South). Travis is stunned but physically able to get out of the shower and go to the sink. She panics and resorts to the knife (may have taken her some time to get it and come back)

She then inflicts stab wounds to his chest, which he partially deflects with his hands. Once he is almost incapacitated, he falls to the floor and crawls where she finishes him with blows to the back and the slit throat. Also, I wouldn't be surpised if she is actually trying to decapitate him, but isn't strong enough to sever his spine.

She then does the best job she can of trying to clean up the crime scene as planned by rinsing his body, washing sheets, etc. Realizing it is a futile effort and that her risk of being caught be a roomate increases the longer she stays, she panics and flees.
 
  • #965
But (IMO) she didn't want to leave a mess.....thinking all the cleanup would be easier in the bathroom with the tile floor etc...



In hindsight I do not think it possible to get much messier and why not hire a crew to take video, seriously she documented this to a tee.
 
  • #966
When you cut someone's throat the first thing that would drain would be the head, I would think. Plus Dr. Horn said all the blood was from the throat and there was no blood residue from the gunshot wound, I believe. jmo

There have been people on here very familiar with .25 gun shot wounds as well as people familiar with gun shot head wounds in general. They have explained how a lack of blood residue could be possible even if the gun shot was first.
 
  • #967
ITA! And I was watching today when they were replaying the money/loans bit of the trial and she said she gave him 699 because he was overdrawn at the bank. Just prayin that the pros HAS his bank statements, that would be another whopper to catch her in!

I'm guessing she would say that's what he told her, rather than that he showed her his bank statements to prove it. Most of the things she's testifying to without reference to tangible evidence like texts and photos are things that can't be proven or disproven one way or another.

Plus, if the state could prove that Travis did have money at the time, then (if anyone on the jury were to believe anything Jodi says) that would make him the liar and not her. I don't see the State going there. Plus, I have a feeling that Travis's financial affairs probably were not as rosy as one might think by the outward appearance.
 
  • #968
I never got the impression that JA was a golddigger (I know you did not say that) or that $$ was that important to her based on her former boyfriends' lifestyles when she was with them and she did not work at high paying jobs.

I think if she were after a man's money she would have picked somebody other than TA, without roommates. And if the $699 check was for reimbursement to TA and she was paying him for the car and he gave her a job cleaning house, well, where are the freebees that a golddigger would expect?

If I were a golddigger, I would expect the man to pay for all the above and kick the roommates out of the house and be college educated and have a non-MLM job where there is a dependable salary. (medical ins? retirement plan? in the event I got him to marry me) That is just me. :moo:


Well, your options of actually marrying one of the "wealthy" ones are limited to letting them get to know you, and STILL wanting to marry you.
Her history of dating UP the chain of stable, financially responsible men was evident.
In fact, Wilmont even mentions it in her opening that she was looking for financial security - not love - financial security.
 
  • #969
When you cut someone's throat the first thing that would drain would be the head, I would think. Plus Dr. Horn said all the blood was from the throat and there was no blood residue from the gunshot wound, I believe. jmo

Heart pumps blood via the carotid artery to the brain. The carotid was severed so the blood was pumping freely to the outside the body until there was no blood volume left to pump.
 
  • #970
I am board certified neuroradiologist and have examined hundreds of gunshot wounds to the head and neck, mainly by CT scans. Cranial MRIs are generally not done in acute GSW to the head because of acuity and artifact generated by metal. Embedded metal in a brain would move precipitously in 1.5 T magnetic field.
The trajectory of the bullet was downward and slightly obklique from TA right to left. The bullet penetrated the right frontal bone, just above right brow, entered the anterior cranial fossa, and “probably” grazed or penetrated some the anterior right frontal lobe white matter. The bullet then exited out of the anterior cranial fossa somewhere to the left of midline – ie planum sphenoidale or left orbital roof then entered TA left infratemporal fossa.
There is also possibility that the fragment did not proceed in a straight direct A to B course. Course depends on muzzle velocity, kinetic energy of a 25 caliber projectile, bullet fragment spin and disintegration, bullet fragment interaction between the inner and outer table of skull. There may also have been some ricochet phenomenon operative although Horn’s report was not clear here.
The bullet fragment lodged near the left mandibular condyle. I am unclear if the left side of the upper nasopharynx near the torus tubarius was injured or not. There is insufficient detail in Horn’s report to identify with precision exactly where bullet exited out of the anterior cranial fossa.
Kinetic energy and fragment spin would traumatize TA right frontal lobe. But TA would still be very much conscious and still be completely mobile. The bullet fragment trajectory was far away from the right motor strip or the right internal capsule.

Am not sure what you are saying here. Was the ME right or not? If not, why does it matter?

Also, the ME actually dealt with the tissue, no one else. Does that make the ME more or less authoritative? Does it make the ME stupid? Just wondering.
 
  • #971
Just want to say to those interested...

There is no psychological diagnosis of psychopathy.

From:

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy"]Psychopathy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

"While no psychiatric or psychological organization has sanctioned a diagnosis of "psychopathy" itself, assessments of psychopathy are widely used in criminal justice settings in some nations and may have important consequences for individuals."

The book Mask of Sanity was written in 1941. A whole lot has changed in the world of psychology since then.
 
  • #972
I just listened to the blood spatter evidence and I may have to rethink things. There was no blood spatter evidence in the shower, walls, ceiling, etc except on the shower floor and threshold.

The blood on the shower floor could have been from his neck and the body does purge fluids after death. The shower walls were way too clean and his body had been washed because there was a cup inside the shower. She would have wanted to wash all the DNA off of him from her and that could be why the shower walls are so clean. Also she would have been covered in blood so how did she clean up because there were no traces of blood after the entrance to the hallway from the bedroom. Did she clean up in the shower or in the tub? We may never know. jmo
 
  • #973
I have a question. Does anyone remember Jodi saying that the ninjas took money from Travis' wallet before they left?
 
  • #974
I think that is a big possibility because the orange towel in the washer that had bleach spots all over it was originally white. If you look at the pictures of Travis' linen closet he only had white towels. Jodi did not clean up, other than herself so I could see her stabbing him while he was drying his hair. He would have never suspected it. jmo

Actually she did try to clean up according to the blood spatter expert. If you recall, the pic of the linen closet showed water/blood wicking on the box and the floor and rug had evidence of water
 
  • #975
I have a question. Does anyone remember Jodi saying that the ninjas took money from Travis' wallet before they left?

I was just listening to the interrogation and she said the male ninja took money from her wallet, but she still had a bunch of cash in her jeans.

Actually, she said the bulk of her cash was in her jeans; $80 that was comprised of 4 $20 bills.

:roll eyes:
 
  • #976
I just listened to the blood spatter evidence and I may have to rethink things. There was no blood spatter evidence in the shower, walls, ceiling, etc except on the shower floor and threshold.

The entire shower stall had been washed clean. There wasn't any blood on Travis anywhere either because it was all washed off. Well, there was a little bit of blood spatter on his neck because the gasses were coming out and the neck wound was bubbling creating the spatter.

Some people cannot stomach to see the crime scene photos and I don't blame anyone for that. I've seen them and they are out there if you want to see them for yourself but Travis's entire body was washed off before she left.
 
  • #977
I have a question. Does anyone remember Jodi saying that the ninjas took money from Travis' wallet before they left?

I do recall that, I think she said $40 or $60 bucks? Just enough for cab fare. :)
 
  • #978
Jodi cut the arteries of his neck. The wound to his neck was cut back almost in line with his ear. Blood would have be gushing out of that wound running down either side of his neck because he was not sitting up. You can see it in the pictures because she is pulling him back towards the bathroom and he is on his back. jmo

Yes, this is another possibility.
 
  • #979
Ok she does not go into how he got stabbed.

-------------

End of Video 1 Detective is asking her if it makes sense to her they left her alive. She says no it doesn't make any sense. He is confronting her about her cut. He said this is the most far fetched story he has ever heard.

Detective: There is a reason you did this and you refuse to tell me. Maybe its just because you are cold and calculated.

He is asking her where the gun is she said she doesn't have it. He said thats what people say when they "had" it..you used it, I know you have. You touched it.

Jodi: I don't think i've ever fired a gun, I'd done bows and arrows and squirt guns

Detective: So you are going to continue to tell me you didn't do this.

Jodi: I did not kill Travis. I'm not the brightest person. If I was going to hurt Travis I don't think I could stab him, i'd have to shoot him. Continuously until he was dead. I'm not too worried about prints. I wouldn't stab him.

IF IF i had it in me, the least I would have done was make it quick. He was still alive

Detective: Yes he was, he was alive for a while. and I knew that he'd was shot first and possibly tried to get away and fight back.

Jodi: I think he was in shock. He was here, outside the shower.

Detective: then he was here, you pulled him this way and tried to get away and he could not go any further.

Jodi: he said he couldn't move, he said he could not feel his legs.

(at one point she is pointing from maybe the shower to out of the bathroom toward where the big blood puddle is and says something like "it's not really that far")

Detective: this doesn't make any sense

Jodi: ((making arm movements to say he was still conscious up here)) (waving arms) I'm trying to think... he wasn't standing up. He wasn't on his legs on his feet on his knees, he wasn't walking. I'm trying to think .. he could sort of use his legs but he couldn't stand up.

Detective: Just crawling?

Jodi: ya

Detective: You are going to continue with that story

(chit chat between them)

Jodi: I'd still like to say something to his family. Maybe i could write them a letter

Detective: I don't know. I'm not going to provide you with that address. They know where you are and where you're going to be. Next time i see you you'll be in Phoenix, that cool? Well you're going there regardless.
 
  • #980
Well, I'm thinking he was face down when his throat was slit at the end of the hallway. For the blood to drip backwards and down his back he must have been in a different position at some point in between for the wounds above his neck to bleed backwards and so profusely.

I think the blood we see in the pic is simply after she flipped him over to drag him. IMO

I agree with what you posted otherwise.


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