John did not sexually abuse JonBenet

[aussiesheila]

BUT, the autopsy reports also says "extensive hemorraghing (sp?)". So I am confused. Can you enlighten me on the bleeding in the brain and let me know if you can clear this up for me on whether there is more bleeding than Wecht presents. Thanks very much. Solace )

The autopsy refers to an "extensive area of scalp hemorrhage", not "extensive hemorrhage". The amount of bleeding both externally and internally was actually quite small for a head wound of that size. The explanation for the small amount of bleeding is, in all likelihood, that the neck ligature found on the body was in place and being tightened and restricting the flow of blood to her head when the head blow was inflicted.

 

[sissi]

Yes, Aussie is correct, the amount of bleeding totaled 7cc, a teaspoon is 5cc.

 

[capps]

This may be "out there",but I've often wondered why she didn't have a tremendous "goose egg"?

 

[BBB167893]

"Yes, Aussie is correct, the amount of bleeding totaled 7cc, a teaspoon is 5cc."

That was just in one area, though. There were three separate areas of bleeding plus a massive bruise. Not only that, but the brain was swollen.

Head wounds are a funny thing. There have been cases where there was no blood despite a massive injury. Kerry Braga (I think that was his name) said so. Plus, Werner Spitz and several other experts say the blow came first.

Her head could have been covered with something, capps. Just spitballing on that.

 

[sissi]

It seemed, and I am waiting to view the program again, that her forehead was bulged. Not swearing to this, I don't have a tape. It looked like her one eyebrow was higher than the other and her forehead looked odd like her head was split in half. Again, I will have to view it again to be certain.

 

[capps]

"Her head could have been covered with something, capps. Just spitballing on that."

SuperDave,

Thanks for that info. I didn't realize that if your head is covered it may prevent a goose egg.
Now when I have a really hard day at work,and start slamming my head against the wall,I'll remember to cover my head so I won't look ridiculous with bumps all over my head,when I go out to dinner later that night.

Thanks SuperDave!!!

 

[BBB167893]

"Her head could have been covered with something, capps. Just spitballing on that."

SuperDave,

Thanks for that info. I didn't realize that if your head is covered it may prevent a goose egg.
Now when I have a really hard day at work,and start slamming my head against the wall,I'll remember to cover my head so I won't look ridiculous with bumps all over my head,when I go out to dinner later that night.

Thanks SuperDave!!!

If that was an attempt at sarcasm, it was not appreciated. But it depends, I suppose, on what you cover it with. Look, I'm no expert. These are just educated guesses.

 

[capps]

If that was an attempt at sarcasm, it was not appreciated. But it depends, I suppose, on what you cover it with. Look, I'm no expert. These are just educated guesses.

SuperDave,

No it was not sarcasm,I really didn't know. The rest was a joke,sorry you took it any other way.

It's a holiday ... just trying to lighten up a bit.

 

[BBB167893]

Sorry. A few years of this have made me a bit sensitive. I used to be an RST, you know.

But you give me an idea. That's probably the one thing I haven't tried yet!

 

[Britt]

This may be "out there",but I've often wondered why she didn't have a tremendous "goose egg"?

From what I've read, a goose egg forms when blood is restricted to a certain area. Maybe in JB's case the blood spread out and didn't collect in any one spot enough to form a lump.

 

[Toltec]

The point of impact on JonBenet's head was toward the back...where it was pulverized. The impact caused the eight inch crack, extending all the way to the orbital area.

The autopsy report says blunt force trauma. My theory is that the flashlight was used to strike JonBenet. JonBenet could have been lying on her tummy when she was struck.

 

[BBB167893]

From what I've read, a goose egg forms when blood is restricted to a certain area. Maybe in JB's case the blood spread out and didn't collect in any one spot enough to form a lump.

The autopsy would seem to agree with that.

 

[Nuisanceposter]

The Maglite really makes me wonder. The Rs didn't recognize it, but they would have tried to claim to not recognize JonBenet herself if that would have made them look less guilty.

They owned a flashlight very similar, if not the same.

The Maglite at the scene had been thoroughly wiped down, including the batteries inside, which indicates to me that it may have very well been the instrument that fractured JonBenet's skull.

The hardest thing for an RDI like me (I subscribe closely to ST's theory - I believe she was hit first then strangled, but what hit her?) to figure out is - if the killer was a Ramsey, why would s/he have the flashlight on hand to crack JB's skull with, if indeed that was the item?

Perhaps Patsy went to have JonBenet use the toilet during the night as was her custom and had the flashlight for that, instead of turning on lights when people are asleep. But then I think, wasn't there a bathroom right off JonBenet's room? Was it Burke's custom to have his bedroom door shut while he was sleeping? Would having a light on even have bothered him?

What about JonBenet's personal flashlight? I believe I read, and I'll go check DOI as soon as I get done with this, that JB had a flashlight in her room that was kept there for if she needed it.

Now I keep wondering about the sequence of events. I used to think JB was strangled, then hit...then I changed my mind and now I think it looks more like she was hit and then strangled. If she was strangled first then I could see the flashlight - the killer choked her near to death and then got the flashlight in consciousness of guilt and desire to be secretive and then cracked her head...but if she was hit first and then strangled, I have to wonder how the flashlight, if indeed the weapon, plays into it.

Sorry to ramble but there's so much endless odd stuff about this case that I can't help but ponder it all again and again.

 

[Britt]

- if the killer was a Ramsey, why would s/he have the flashlight on hand to crack JB's skull with, if indeed that was the item?

Perhaps Patsy went to have JonBenet use the toilet during the night as was her custom and had the flashlight for that...

Yes, very possible, since apparently the light switch in JB's room didn't operate the light, but the fan... so in the dark, perhaps the flashlight was used to see the way to the bathroom or to the lamp by the beds:

According to Linda Wilcox, a former Ramsey housekeeper:

LINDA WILCOX: Gut feeling more than anything. But even now, more than then, I would (something) on everything I have that a stranger did not kill JonBenet. The lay of the house doesn't...it would be very difficult. Possibly, there are people who are professional. But then they would have done a professional job. Lots of little things contribute to my belief. Someone who didn't know that house, really well, couldn't have done what they done (sic) without being noticed. It's not possible. It is physically impossible. You had to know little things. Like for example, you walk in the room and hit the switch, the light doesn't come on. See, cause when the room was redone, they put in a ceiling fan, one of the metal ones, without a light kit on it. The only light in her room was the lamp between the two beds. You have to physically walk over and turn it on. It isn't run by the switch. The switch was meant to run the overhead ceiling light which was removed to install the ceiling fan.

http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/07211998lindawilcoxon-pb.htm

 

[Nuisanceposter]

All right, good info, thanks! That answers that for me.

I find it interesting to note that nowhere in the beginning of DOI where the Rs are talking about finding JB gone and calling police do they mention the Maglite on the counter. You'd think if this was a real kidnapping, they'd notice right off that a strange flashlight was there and they'd mention that to police right away.

They also don't say who handed the ransom note to the police. It just says, "Another officer, Officer Veitch, I believe, comes in after he moves the squad car to the next block. He is shown the ransom note."

 

[Jayelles]

I've been reading the autopry report and trying to make sense of the head injury. I see the part which mentions the 7-8ccs of blood, but it also mentions "extensive" haemorrhaging no the brain covering an area 7x4 inches. Do these both refer to the same area of bleeding?

 

[BBB167893]

I've always heard they were the same area, Jayelles, but it may not have been after all.

Okay, so with this information, it makes some sense that a flashlight would be in there.

OR

sometimes I think Patsy might have caught someone messing with JB and it was the first thing she found. She swung, missed, hit JB, etc.

I get confused myself!

 

[aussiesheila]

This may be "out there",but I've often wondered why she didn't have a tremendous "goose egg"?

Yeah capps, it's definitely "out there" because no-one else has thought of it before! Or else they have thought it, but haven't posted it. (credit point to capps).

Another indication that JonBenet was all but dead when the head blow was inflicted.

 

[aussiesheila]

That was just in one area, though. There were three separate areas of bleeding plus a massive bruise. Not only that, but the brain was swollen.

The three separate areas of bleeding were one underneath the other SuperDave, JonBenet was only hit over the head once.

 

[aussiesheila]

The point of impact on JonBenet's head was toward the back...where it was pulverized. The impact caused the eight inch crack, extending all the way to the orbital area.

The autopsy report says blunt force trauma. My theory is that the flashlight was used to strike JonBenet. JonBenet could have been lying on her tummy when she was struck.

Toltec, do you really think that an injury like that could have been made by a flashlight, even a large heavy one wielded by a strong person?

To me the physics isn't right. I forget the equation but doesn't force = mass X velocity or something? Wouldn't either the mass or the velocity have had to be very large to create a wound like that? I am having difficulty believing the force required could have been achieved with a torch and an arm swing.