JonBenét Ramsey Case: My Theory & Key Questions

[Meara]

@Meara

OK. Well and good. Still, how did Patsy relay the RN to John? And why immediately disregard its warnings?

I reviewed the Rams' initial police interviews and the 911 call. JR first read the note when he joined PR downstairs after checking on Burke. PR dialed 911 at 5:52 AM and told the operator they had a ransom note while JR was still reading it. The call lasted 1:13 min. PR began calling the Whites and the Fernies immediately afterwards. The first police officer arrived at 5:59. So the short answer to your question is that John had no way to get rid of the note even if he wanted to.

If you believe the Rams. Alternatively, and more likely in my view, the writing and reading took place much earlier (more on this later). However that process went - collaboratively, PR only, several drafts, etc. - and whatever JR thought of the final version, he knew they only had so much time, and that an iffy RN with clues to an intruder and motive was still a safer bet than a 10-word note or none at all. He might even have thought the rambling mix of elements sounded suitably deranged and could work to their advantage. He figured out (maybe was advised?) that they didn’t need to stage/tell a story so good that it virtually proved their innocence, only one good enough to make the police unsure of their guilt.

JR is intelligent, but it's possible to overestimate his judgment at the time. I mean, he's the one who gave police the cringey story about breaking the basement window months earlier and stripping down to his socks and skivvies to climb in…..and also said he was wearing the same outfit when he read the RN. Wait, what?

Maybe JR was in his socks and undies while reading the note, and that experience colored his thoughts when he made up the basement window story? JR says he was in his bathroom shaving when he heard PR scream and ran down the back stairs to the 2nd floor. Later, police found his bathrobe on the floor of his study, perhaps cast off on his way to the shower at 5:30. But, he would have to have gone back through the study to reach the stairs. It was December. Why not grab the robe on the way, especially if he didn’t know what awaited him or how long he’d be downstairs? The dots don’t quite connect.

I have a theory that the reading-the-note story is as fake as the basement window story, and that the reason the socks and underwear image kept intruding on JR’s thoughts was that it was trauma-related; that he actually was dressed that way at some point during the night, perhaps when he was molesting JBR, or when he didn’t want to get fluids or fibers on his clothes as he cleaned up evidence and staged the discovery scene.

I' reply to your later post as soon as I can : )

 

[CloudedTruth]

JR is intelligent, but it's possible to overestimate his judgment at the time. I mean, he's the one who gave police the cringey story about breaking the basement window months earlier and stripping down to his socks and skivvies to climb in…..and also said he was wearing the same outfit when he read the RN. Wait, what?

Maybe JR was in his socks and undies while reading the note, and that experience colored his thoughts when he made up the basement window story? JR says he was in his bathroom shaving when he heard PR scream and ran down the back stairs to the 2nd floor. Later, police found his bathrobe on the floor of his study, perhaps cast off on his way to the shower at 5:30. But, he would have to have gone back through the study to reach the stairs. It was December. Why not grab the robe on the way, especially if he didn’t know what awaited him or how long he’d be downstairs? The dots don’t quite connect.

The dots don't connect, do they?

JR was / is intelligent, however this clearly was out of his wheelhouse / over his head in some ways. Time was limited and in IMO the initial blow to the head was accidental. So there probably was an aspect of panic that played a role. Mistakes were made but the waters were effectively muddied enough so that we are still trying to figure it all out all these years later.

By the time officer French arrived, JR was fully dressed. So in the space of 7 minutes from the time that the 911 call was made and French arrived, JR read the note went back upstairs and got dressed and was back downstairs standing behind PR when she opened the door. PR said she only saw the first couple of lines, and yet was able to relay "Victory" and SBTC" to the dispatcher from the last page. My money is on they knew what the note said and weren't reading it for the first time while calling 911.

 

[Meara]

The dots don't connect, do they?

By the time officer French arrived, JR was fully dressed. So in the space of 7 minutes.....

Exactly!

 

[Meara]

@Meara

Your above outlined possibilities concerning the RN are well reasoned. There is the outlier view exposed by Pat Brown that Burke was the author, and that he copied his mother's writing style. That intruder(s) wrote the RN is typical of IDI contortions.

I'm glad you brought this up. Burke did well in school and played sports but had difficulty with handwriting. It's one reason I discount Pat Brown's theory that BR wrote the note. It's also one of the details of the case which, when considered with others, makes me think he is on the autism spectrum, since that problem is among the symptoms of ASD in males.

The RN warned that the family was being "monitored". If the Rs deemed the RN as genuine, they displayed exceptional courage in contacting LE without reflection. Also, the ransom amount of 118k indicated that S.B.T.C had inside knowledge about John, which ought to have given him pause, if he were indeed under surveillance. John's security links to LM should have cautioned him professionally. Workaholic instantly forgets the responsibilities of his lucrative business?

You raise interesting points. I'm not sure courage was involved. PMPT reports that JR told a British TV host he decided to call the police because he realized he and PR didn't have the resources to close the airports and block the roads. The statement suggests that his first choice was to obey the kidnappers, but he was afraid a foreign faction would try to take JBR far away or out of the country. Is any of this true; or, is it something he thought up to tell police in case they asked and then used to embellish/reinforce the foreign faction narrative on the talk show? We should suspect the latter. By his own account, JR had barely begun to read the note when he told PR to dial 911. So when did he make that crucial decision? To me, this complication indicates JR knew the RN’s contents before 5:52 AM, that he and PR had planned how the discovery/911 call scene would unfold, and that JR was prepared to spin the foreign faction ruse, as needed. I say this because, although calling police to get the airports and the roads out of Boulder sealed was supposedly the basis for one of the most important decisions of his life, and were “the first thoughts that went through his mind,” they must have gone fast and out the other side, because nowhere in the accounts of that morning are they ever mentioned.

I used to think it was very significant that JR didn’t notify Lockheed but have changed my mind. People are supposed to read everything in their hiring contracts and the employee manual, but few actually do, even though they sign off on it. Most people read the most important parts and skim through the rest, knowing that much of it is information they’re unlikely to need and can easily look up if they ever do. You’re right, though; several factors should have made him put 2 and 2 together. And didn’t.

Good luck in hunting down the details of how Patsy gave her husband the RN! The lack of their fingerprints (or anyone's) on it is not proof of dissembling; but, it is noteworthy, and similar in this regard to the MagLite and its batteries.

Thanks! Their accounts are all over the place! However, this fits with my theory that they agreed on the central elements of the discovery/911 call scenario but didn’t work out all the details. This would explain why they are clear on the same points and vague on the same points

Inevitably, the RN is connected to the timeline. As it took 25 minutes to write as is, the latest it could be begun was around 5:25am, in order for PR to place her 911. There is the Practice Note, as well as torn out pages from inside Patsy's pad, on which the note was written. How much more time? It cannot be said with certainty that PR 'discovered' or 'found' the RN. Her doing so is just part of the official scenario. So, Patsy finds the note, gives it to JR, and they call BPD at once, before either of them searched the house. When PR was with the operator, did JonBenet's father run around frantically calling her name? -JONBENET! WHERE ARE YOU? - (Oh, that might wake up Burke.) - LA had to instruct daddy to search the house from "top to bottom".

Yes. Especially the point that we don’t know for sure whether PR found the note on the stairs. I don’t think she did. Lots to say about this. For another post…

Patsy dialed 911 at the very last plausible moment before the morning flight out of state. Whether she knew or not that the RN was bogus, she failed to mention JonBenet by name during the call ("I'm the mother."/"She's blonde.")

A detail that troubles us all. My goodness, if you call the animal shelter to see whether they have your lost dog, you tell them its name! Patsy being center stage? Afraid she'd come undone if she said JonBenet's name? Distancing?

An odd aspect is that the RN has no connection to the WC tableau. The note is from greedy terrorists, yet the scene suggests a pedophile. S.B.T.C was not scrawled on the walls. There was no message to fat cat Mr. Ramsey. Assuming that the RN were written after the murder, why not try to explain what had to be found? If the chronic SA were intrinsic to the killing, why incorporate a final assault involving PR's brush as staging. Even if not staging, it betrays awareness about what had been occurring with JB. Why make apparent what you wanted to obscure? The disconnect could be the result of overlapping or putative scenarios? Or one hand not knowing what the other was doing in the limited time available? Another IDI contortion is that the FF just chanced upon a child, who was already a SA victim.

This is really interesting. It has been noted that ransom kidnappers and pedophiles have different motives, and that the two types don’t coincide; and that the baffling staging may be the work of two different people. But I haven’t seen these ideas before. "...the RN has no connection to the WC tableau." “Why make apparent what you want to obscure?” That framing might apply to other aspects of the case.

 

[proust20]

@Meara

The FBI dismissed the terrorist angle at once. Attribiting the crime to an actual terror group should have lent more credibility, but put the Rs in actual danger. S.B.T.C seems modeled on the SLA, which kidnapped Patty Hearst. The RN has similarities to the Lindbergh baby RN, with its demands for certain denominations. During the infamous CNN IV, Patsy said that there were two people 'out there', who knew what happened to JonBenet. So, in Patsy's mind the FF consisted of only a pair of individuals.

Patsy, at least, appeared overwhelmed during the funeral and memorial. Heavy meds, that would prevent her from uttering the wrong words? Back in Boulder, she quickly reverted to type. ("Go back to the drawing board.") Keep in mind that PR had enough grit and nerve (Narcissism?) to parade in a swimsuit before a national audience in the Miss America pageant. There were other minor shows that led up to the big time. Obviously, she was used to standing up under scrutiny.

Another oddity about the RN is that, on the 26th, John handed over to BPD PR's notepad that was used to write the RN, with The Practice Note still inside. Done innocently or a frame attempt?

IMO the RN was an amalgam of previous ones. The staging also seems to have overlays of different concepts. But whatever - it worked well enough for no one ever to be charged.

 

[CloudedTruth]

@Meara

The FBI dismissed the terrorist angle at once. Attribiting the crime to an actual terror group should have lent more credibility, but put the Rs in actual danger. S.B.T.C seems modeled on the SLA, which kidnapped Patty Hearst. The RN has similarities to the Lindbergh baby RN, with its demands for certain denominations. During the infamous CNN IV, Patsy said that there were two people 'out there', who knew what happened to JonBenet. So, in Patsy's mind the FF consisted of only a pair of individuals.

Patsy, at least, appeared overwhelmed during the funeral and memorial. Heavy meds, that would prevent her from uttering the wrong words? Back in Boulder, she quickly reverted to type. ("Go back to the drawing board.") Keep in mind that PR had enough grit and nerve (Narcissism?) to parade in a swimsuit before a national audience in the Miss America pageant. There were other minor shows that led up to the big time. Obviously, she was used to standing up under scrutiny.

Another oddity about the RN is that, on the 26th, John handed over to BPD PR's notepad that was used to write the RN, with The Practice Note still inside. Done innocently or a frame attempt?

IMO the RN was an amalgam of previous ones. The staging also seems to have overlays of different concepts. But whatever - it worked well enough for no one ever to be charged.

That's an excellent point about PR's statement that "two people" were out there that knew what happened. IIRC the next thing she said was the person who did it and someone he told, or something to that effect. Many people have over the years surmised that she was inadvertently referring to herself and JR, which of course is possible, but it also indicates she knew darn well there was no FF. She also refers to "a" killer and that "there's someone out there". Both statements indicating a singular perpetrator.

I also found interesting in that interview when she speaks about America having been so deeply hurt by this, and suffering because they've lost faith in the American family.....referring to two specific crimes that involved murders committed by family members, Susan Smith and OJ Simpson. Freudian slip? There are a few times in the CNN interview when we see JR shoot her some looks about what she just said or is concerned about what she's about to say.

She was by the accounts of some of the close friends who were present when Dr. Beuf showed up with the controlled substance, medicated to a degree that sounds like over-medicating to me. I believe both BF and PW related that she was so out of it she couldn't use the bathroom by herself or even take care of basic hygiene needs. This went on for more than just a few days. We saw JR essentially mouthing words to her during the CNN interview. I think it's a very real possibility that she was medicated as an attempt to control what she said. We have seen in subsequent police interviews where she and JR were interviewed separately, that she would answer questions a certain way, go home and then come back and correct what she had said the day before. IMO PR was the wild card. Imagine if police had followed protocol on that first day instead of following the orders to treat the R's like victims and not suspects. Had they been interviewed separately immediately, this case may have been solved on day one.

I also feel there was a bit of potential framing going on, from both parents. The personal references in the RN and the tone that it takes at times are very interesting. There was some tension present there, some resentment. I also think it's a fascinating aspect that on that first day (12/26) JR and PR remained completely separated from each other until they left the house after the body had been found. They were in different rooms, neither one comforting the other at any time throughout the day. But within a few days, they became literally attached at the hips, always together presenting a united front. It's an interesting dynamic and perhaps a telling evolution.

 

[nursetoolie]

Hi all, I’ve just started diving into the JonBenét Ramsey case after watching the Netflix series, so please bear with me as I’m still piecing everything together. I’m hoping someone here can clarify a few points for me that are crucial to my theory

My Key Question:
Was it ever definitively proven whether JonBenét’s body had been taken outside and then brought back into the house? Or was it confirmed that she had been in the basement the entire time?

I feel this detail could be vital in understanding what actually happened.

My Theory:
I believe more than one person was involved—likely two, but possibly more. Here’s how I think it played out:

1. Background:
- The perpetrators were possibly known pedophiles who had observed JonBenét and other children at public events, like pageants.
- They might have been part of a network that bought and sold photos, possibly involving the shady photographer connected to the case.
- One or both of them could have abused JonBenét before, either in her home (without the family knowing) or somewhere else.

2. The Night of the Crime:
- The “kidnappers” were likely under the influence of drugs or alcohol.
- One of them hid inside the Ramsey house while the family was out. During this time, they wrote the bizarre ransom note—perhaps while high—and explored the house.
- The ransom amount ($118,000) might have come from noticing John Ramsey’s work documents, or the intruders already knew about his bonus.

3. The Crime Itself:
- Once the family returned and went to bed, the intruder waited until everyone was asleep.
- Unable to resist his urges, he went to JonBenét’s room. While under the influence, he used the garrote during the assault, which may have caused her death unintentionally.
- he placed her in a suitcase, intending to carry her out through a pre-planned escape route where his accomplice was waiting.

4. Things Go Wrong:
- When they opened the suitcase outside, they realised she was dead. In a panic, they argued—one blaming the other for her death.
- At some point, her head struck a hard surface (or was struck), either because they dropped her or because of a mistaken attempt to ensure she was dead.
- Panicked, they abandoned the plan, leaving her body in the basement instead of removing it from the house.

Questions That I’m Still Stuck On:

1. If the parents hadn’t called the police right away, could the perpetrators have returned her alive?
- The ransom note threatened to kill her if law enforcement was contacted—could they have been serious about that?

2. Were the perpetrators really interested in the ransom money? The note feels like a diversion to me.

3. Is there any possibility the body was brought back into the house after the family called the police? This seems unlikely, but the note’s warning about law enforcement makes me wonder.

4. What do we know about the Ramseys’ alcohol supply? Could the intruder have consumed something while writing the note?


I’d love to hear your thoughts on this theory and whether the details I’ve questioned could change the narrative. This case has so many layers, and I’m eager to see what the community thinks?

EDIT: Another thought: the person or people involved might have come down from whatever drugs they were on and decided not to go through with taking her. They could have panicked and left her where she was or thrown her back down.

I believe Jonbenet was murdered by the same men, sbtc, that murdered the Mueller family in AR in Jan 1996. S.B.T.C. Stands for Silent Brotherhood The Covenant. They were a small group of white supremacist and are considered terrorist. There is a documentary on Chevie Kehoe from 1999 which includes an Arkansas detective named Aaron Duvall, this is a great resource to understand the level of violence this group was inflicting on the public. They murdered Sarah Powell, the 8 yo daughter of Nancy Mueller. IMO her murder was very similar to JonBenet. The men’s shoe print found at the scene of JonBenets murder is very similar to the shoes Chevie Kehoe was wearing in the shootout with the Oh state troopers in Feb 1997. They found duct tape in the suburban which is listed in the 52 pg court docs in the murder trial from the Jan 1996 murder.
I believe they were in the house already when the Ramsey family got home. I believe they were trying to leave with Jonbenet but left her. They left the note with the intent of getting the payment.
Israel keys grew up with the Kehoe boys in Colville WA. Their murders all look very similar

There’s enough rabbit hole info online for you to see this too!
Lmk if you need any help finding these resources.

 

[proust20]

@nursetoolie

Some Qs: By what means did the intruder(s) arrive at and depart from the Rs residence? Car, bike, or on foot? If by car, where was it parked for all that time? How did they locate the size 12s? Did they feed JonBenet pineapple?

 

[nursetoolie]

@nursetoolie

Some Qs: By what means did the intruder(s) arrive at and depart from the Rs residence? Car, bike, or on foot? If by car, where was it parked for all that time? How did they locate the size 12s? Did they feed JonBenet pineapple?

Honestly, I’m not a detective. I am 100% sure the ransom note was them. Do some digging promise you will see it too. The stun gun marks were from a cattle prod they used on Sarah Powell also. The details are for the fbi to figure out cause we know boulder pd is useless. John Ramsey recently said he got a letter in the mail from a woman that said her ex husband murdered his daughter, Chevie Kehoe had two wives at the time…they both divorced him I’m betting that letter was one of them. Please watch the documentary go look at the court docs, they were bombing buildings, murdering, kidnapping, and breaking into people’s houses waiting for them to get home. There’s two men’s dna/shoe prints if I were an fbi agent I’d go look through the case file that put them in prison.

 

[CloudedTruth]

Some additional Q's: How would the SBTC know about the Ramseys, in particular since there is no record of SBTC ever having been in Colorado or operating there? As in the Mueller case where they were looking for gold, valuables and guns, one would have to assume they were after something similar at the Ramseys since that was their usual M.O. Why would they think the Ramseys had such items stashed at their home, and why did they then not kill the rest of the family if JB did not reveal to them what they wanted to know as they did with the Mueller's and Sarah?

 

[nursetoolie]

Some additional Q's: How would the SBTC know about the Ramseys, in particular since there is no record of SBTC ever having been in Colorado or operating there? As in the Mueller case where they were looking for gold, valuables and guns, one would have to assume they were after something similar at the Ramseys since that was their usual M.O. Why would they think the Ramseys had such items stashed at their home, and why did they then not kill the rest of the family if JB did not reveal to them what they wanted to know as they did with the Mueller's and Sarah?

I believe these are all really great questions. I do not think they were operating in Colorado necessarily, but they had been in and out of Colorado, Texas, Arkansas, Utah, Washington….they were in Ohio when the shootout happened in Feb 1997. I wish I could answer your questions and maybe if boulder would have let the fbi take the case it could have been resolved earlier. If you watch the interviews with Israel Keyes and the FBI he has no reasons for kidnapping and robbing the places he did. These boys were all raised on a compound that taught hate and violence. That’s all I can say. I did come across a document that stated one of the family friends said one of the members molested her daughter so there’s a lot of information about what these guys were going from 1995 until 1997 when they were arrested. I’m compiling all the information I have found so anyone can access it and go thru it yourself.

 

[nursetoolie]

Some additional Q's: How would the SBTC know about the Ramseys, in particular since there is no record of SBTC ever having been in Colorado or operating there? As in the Mueller case where they were looking for gold, valuables and guns, one would have to assume they were after something similar at the Ramseys since that was their usual M.O. Why would they think the Ramseys had such items stashed at their home, and why did they then not kill the rest of the family if JB did not reveal to them what they wanted to know as they did with the Mueller's and Sarah?

Kirby Kehoe and John Ramsey were both in the navy in 1966.
Kirby Kehoe is the one that told Chevie Kehoe to rob the Muellers.
Kirby Kehoe was angry and it had something to do with the military.
I’m still digging.