Kyron Horman General Discussion thread 2023 - 2026

[Truth Prevails]

And the only source for Terri claiming she parked in the lot is - again - Desiree.

Witness TK saw the truck in the parking lot.

"I just saw him (Kyron) in the gym, and I saw the truck out in the parking lot," he [TK] said Wednesday. [TK] said Kyron was looking at other students' science fair projects, seemed happy and was with friends. … He said when he saw Kyron in the gym he didn't see Terri with him. He and his family have turned over pictures they took at the science fair to investigators, but they've been asked not to disclose the timeframe in which he saw Kyron.

Kyron's mother claims Terri planned disappearance

{p}In a Tuesday interview with NBC's "Today" show, Kyron's birth mother - Desiree Young - reiterated her accusation that Terri Horman was involved. Young said she believes Kyron's disappearance was "very planned."{/p}

katu.com

 

[Truth Prevails]

The baby was with Terri the whole time. She was noted in the list given by the police as having been in the school with her that morning. She was seen by a witness just after 9:30 with Terri in a store.

[Pg 37] Desiree noticed, as did others, that [baby “K”] acted angry at Terri. She avoided her mother and didn’t go to her to be held. Instead, she went to Desiree and the others. Was [baby “K”] reacting to the stress in the house? Or to something that had happened that day? If only she could speak about what she’d seen, Desiree thought. She had presumably been with Terri all morning in the school and in the truck. Terri had said so.

"Boy Missing · The Search for Kyron Horman" by Rebecca Morris​

Speculation only: (Timeframe: unknown length of time between 8:15 a.m. and 8:45 a.m.) What if the witness who kept an eye on baby “K” while Terri was out in the parking lot came forward?

I’m sure there are many more witnesses we have not heard from than the few we have heard from.

Perhaps this is how law enforcement confirmed the person in the truck when it was parked at the school between 8:15 a.m. and 8:45 a.m. was Terri and not DeDe. JMO

 

[Truth Prevails]

The police at the time gave the correct spot - the shoulder of the road, just before the access road - and never gave any hint she had lied about that.

At the link above, regarding one prong of the presser only, law enforcement was seeking additional witnesses to confirm the movements of the F250 while it was parked at the school that morning; and to confirm who was seen in or around it. One person? Two people? They included three positions they were interested in: 1) outside the school’s front fence on the shoulder of NW Skyline Boulevard; 2) up a gravel path in front of the school’s playground, and 3) the school’s south parking lot.

What they did not offer in that article was confirmation of where Terri parked and the statement that she did not lie.

In no particular order, by August 11, 2010, Terri had failed three polygraphs; been caught in two plots to have Kaine killed; tried to kidnap baby “K”; had a torrid sexting affair and revealed the location where Kaine and the baby were hiding (from her); lived with DeDe for more than 11 days; had “friends” purchase burner phones for secret discussions; hired a criminal attorney; and had been forced out of Kaine’s house and retreated to her parents house in Roseburg. There is probably more but that’s what comes to mind at the moment.

Kyron was missing and they couldn’t find him. Law enforcement knew Terri lied. They weren’t holding those kinds of pressers to vindicate her parking spot. My opinion only, of course.

 

[Truth Prevails]

GZ mentions posing here. Is the idea that GZ had two distinct encounters with Terri and Kyron in the classroom, one at 8:15 and another at 8:45 and despite being interviewed extensively by media and for the book, she somehow failed to mention this?

BBM GZ was a busy, responsible mom who served as president of the PTA and had a part-time job. It's safe to say she was time-conscious. Unlike 8-year-old witness TP.

GZ didn't reveal everything to the media. Not everyone does, especially when being asked not to do so by law enforcement.

A little more of what she witnessed on June 4, 2010, was revealed in the book but Kyron had been missing for 10 years by then. Terri (and DeDe) had been very vocal in the media and elsewhere muddling the details of the investigation. They were pretty much controlling the narrative.

I appreciate that the book gave us a few more details to consider. Maybe GZ still hasn't revealed everything. She was probably parked in the school parking lot and left the classroom right after Terri, Kyron, and the baby. She is a very credible witness. My opinion only.

 

[Alleykins]

In this Dateline broadcast, originally aired November, 12th 2010, GZ is interviewed. She confirms Terri took the picture, and it's stated it was taken "around 8:30 am".
The broadcast is broken up into about 1 minute segments. You can find GZ's segment about 10 frames in, using the slide bar at the bottom to advance the segments.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Desiree says the GPS has been verified on the picture of Kyron taken at the school science fair on June 4, 2010.

It was taken at 8:45 a.m. The 2nd link confirms the picture was taken in Kyron's classroom.

[June 4, 2019] [15:15] MJ: And do you think that he made it to school that day? What is your working theory on that because I know that some people thought that maybe the picture had been taken before.
Desiree: Nope. I know for sure, 100%, the picture was taken in the school. It’s GPS—it’s confirmed; it’s verified. We know exactly what time she took the picture, where she was at. And it’s confirmed with technology. So, she was in the school at 8:45 taking that photo of Kyron in front of his exhibit. I know that she left the school; she left with Kyron. And we have eyewitnesses that place them outside the school in route to the truck. It’s from that point where it gets unknown.
Kyron Horman Discussion Thread 2017-2019

[Nov. 25, 2015] [1:23] Host: What time did Kyron go missing?
Desiree: It was exactly between 8:45 a.m. and 8:55 a.m. ...
Desiree: He was in his classroom. He got the photo taken by Terri, and he, apparently according to eyewitness accounts, multiple adults that can vouch for the fact that Terri walked out the side entrance of the school with Kyron in tow and we know this because Kyron’s friend even saw him with her right outside the school.
The search for missing Oregon boy Kyron Horman

 

[Truth Prevails]

In this Dateline broadcast, originally aired November, 12th 2010, GZ is interviewed. She confirms Terri took the picture, and it's stated it was taken "around 8:30 am".
The broadcast is broken up into about 1 minute segments. You can find GZ's segment about 10 frames in, using the slide bar at the bottom to advance the segments.GZ confirms Terri took the picture but she does not state it was taken "around 8:30 a.m." The host explains GZ places Terri and Kyron at the school around 8:30 a.m. which starts the timeline of Terri's day. Further down it confirms GZ saw Terri take the picture but no time is given. The host goes on to ask GZ if Kyron was happy.

May I ask you to please double-check and post more of the quote? I can't seem to find where "it's stated it was taken "around 8:30 am".

There are three short clips of GZ being interviewed. I watched all three and I searched the transcript below the clips. I found where it states that Terri and Kyron arrive at school around 8:30 a.m. But nothing about the picture being taken at 8:30 a.m.

The following is what I found. I typed out the whole transcript but I'm posting only a portion. I could post the whole thing if anyone wants to read it.

[GZ]: Kyron is one of the sweetest, most loveable, happy guys I’ve ever met. Just always has a smile on his face, and he makes people laugh and he has many, many friends. There’s not anyone in that school that isn’t a friend of Kyron’s. …
Host: [GZ] also has a distinct recollection of seeing both Kyron and his stepmom Terri at the science fair, and this is important. She places Terri and Kyron at the school around 8:30 a.m., which starts the timeline of Terri’s day. [GZ] even remembers chatting with Terry about some school t-shirts.

...​

Host: [GZ’s] account dispels the rumours that Terri and her stepson never made it to school that day and that Terri somehow faked the now-famous photo of Kyron with his science project.
[GZ] I remember seeing Kyron in front of his project, and Terri took a picture of him; took one with him in front of it, and then one with just the project alone.
Host: You saw her take that picture?
[GZ]: I saw her take the picture. Absolutely.
Host: How happy was Kyron?
[GZ] Really, really happy and real excited, very proud of his project.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Well, yes, it does seem insignificant. However, to my understanding, it had enough significance that it allowed her to qualify for immunity for her part in Kyron's disappearance. So, I can't help but wonder if it was indeed insignificant. JMO

ORS 136.619 – Immunity of witness compelled to testify

A witness who, in compliance with a court order issued under ORS 33.085 (Compelling testimony of witness) or 136.617 (Motion to compel…

oregon.public.law

How is that related to her immunity?

GZ mentions posing at that link, yes; but a time is not given for when she saw Kyron posing. GZ saw Kyron three times that morning: 1) when she first arrived (her daughter was in Kyron's class); 2) when Terri took Kyron's picture; and 3) when GZ was leaving the school she saw Terri, Kyron, and the baby supposedly heading off to look at the other science projects.

And yet that is not reflected in any of the statements GZ gave. In fact, I believe you are the only one who has ever made that claim, not even Morris or Desiree.

KGW:

Parent [GZ] said she last saw Kyron in the morning, when he posed in a classroom in front of his red-eyed tree frog science project. She said her daughter is one of Kyron s best friends and she knew him well.

OregonLive:

At 8:15 a.m., Skyline PTA President Gina Zimmerman arrived at the school and saw Kyron with his stepmother in front of his exhibit.

From the Dateline segment, using your transcription:

[GZ]: Kyron is one of the sweetest, most loveable, happy guys I’ve ever met. Just always has a smile on his face, and he makes people laugh and he has many, many friends. There’s not anyone in that school that isn’t a friend of Kyron’s. …
Host: [GZ] also has a distinct recollection of seeing both Kyron and his stepmom Terri at the science fair, and this is important. She places Terri and Kyron at the school around 8:30 a.m., which starts the timeline of Terri’s day. [GZ] even remembers chatting with Terry about some school t-shirts.

...​

Host: [GZ’s] account dispels the rumours that Terri and her stepson never made it to school that day and that Terri somehow faked the now-famous photo of Kyron with his science project.
[GZ] I remember seeing Kyron in front of his project, and Terri took a picture of him; took one with him in front of it, and then one with just the project alone.
Host: You saw her take that picture?
[GZ]: I saw her take the picture. Absolutely.
Host: How happy was Kyron?
[GZ] Really, really happy and real excited, very proud of his project.

Boy Missing, ch 1

[GZ], saw Kyron in Miss Porter’s room. He was seen downstairs visiting the classroom of Scott McBeth, his kindergarten and first-grade teacher. Then he and his stepmother went back upstairs, using different staircases.

Boy Missing, ch 4

On the morning of June 4, [GZ] and [MZ] were in the children’s classroom, as were Terri and Kyron. [GZ] saw Terri take a photograph of Kyron standing in front of his tree frog exhibit. [GZ] remembered the frog pond was made of Saran Wrap. “Kyron was very happy, very excited about his tree frog project,” [GZ] later said. “Let me take one of [MZ], too,” Terri said, and she took a photo of [MZ] with her exhibit on turtles.

[GZ] left around 9 a.m. for her job at a restaurant. The last time [GZ] saw Terri and Kyron was after Terri took the photo of [MZ]. Kyron and his stepmother were walking away by themselves, presumably to view some of the other science projects.

If not for Desiree's much later claim that the picture was taken at 8:45, would anyone think these are not the same event?

Rebecca Morris, the author of Boy Missing--The Search for Kyron Horman, interviewed GZ for the book. These are not Desiree's statements, BTW.

[---]

[Pg 57] [GZ] told police she had seen Terri take Kyron's photo in front of his science exhibit. That was at 8:45 a.m.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

No, the bolded (by me) sentence was not by Desiree, but it was not by GZ either. It was by Morris. If there ever was a book crying out for footnotes and sources...

I keep coming back to the same issue, the timeline. This is what Terri says happened:

8:15 ca - arrived at school with Kyron and daughter, walked to the classroom, took the picture, chatted with teacher and others.

8:30 ca - began walking around the school looking at other exhibits, ended up in McBeth's classroom downstairs.

8:45 - walked up separate staircases from the bottom floor, Kyron walked to his classroom while Terri said goodbye.

This matches up perfectly with the statements of GZ. She was there to see the pictures taken, talk to Terri and when Terri and Kyron left, she thought they were going to see other exhibits. It fits with the timeline, not too busy.

And then there is the other scenario:

8:15 - Terri and Kyron arrive at the school. GZ sees Kyron in front of his project (and talks to Terri about T-shirts), Terri tells Porter she is taking Kyron out of the groups (that will not be formed for another 30 minutes) to go tour together.

8:30 - Terri and Kyron do their tour, at some point Terri leaves Kyron inside the school to go sit in her truck for a while. She then goes back into the school, finds Kyron and takes him back to the classroom.

8:45 - Terri takes a picture of Kyron, a picture of just his science project and a picture of MZ, tells the teacher that she's taking Kyron to his appointment, which GZ thinks means she's taking him on (another) tour of the fair.

It's contrived, contradictory, convoluted, and yes, unbelievable.

Witness TK saw the truck in the parking lot.

"I just saw him (Kyron) in the gym, and I saw the truck out in the parking lot," he [TK] said Wednesday. [TK] said Kyron was looking at other students' science fair projects, seemed happy and was with friends. … He said when he saw Kyron in the gym he didn't see Terri with him. He and his family have turned over pictures they took at the science fair to investigators, but they've been asked not to disclose the timeframe in which he saw Kyron.

Kyron's mother claims Terri planned disappearance

{p}In a Tuesday interview with NBC's "Today" show, Kyron's birth mother - Desiree Young - reiterated her accusation that Terri Horman was involved. Young said she believes Kyron's disappearance was "very planned."{/p}

katu.com

That would depend on the details of his statement. People use shorthand a lot, and being parked by the shoulder of the road can just as easily be said as being in the parking lot. But there is another option - the truck he saw outside wasn't Terri's, but another truck of the same, common variety that people could easily confuse for Terri's. Remember how many white truck sightings were reported from that day, like the one up at hwy 30 or in a side-street across the road from the Horman's? All with female drivers, none of which were Terri?

Speculation only: (Timeframe: unknown length of time between 8:15 a.m. and 8:45 a.m.) What if the witness who kept an eye on baby “K” while Terri was out in the parking lot came forward?

I’m sure there are many more witnesses we have not heard from than the few we have heard from.

Perhaps this is how law enforcement confirmed the person in the truck when it was parked at the school between 8:15 a.m. and 8:45 a.m. was Terri and not DeDe. JMO

So now we add a new element to the timeline - Terri leaves the baby with another person inside the school so she could go sit in the truck and make a call? When so many extra elements have to be postulated just to make sense of a theory, perhaps the theory isn't all that solid.

Kyron was missing and they couldn’t find him. Law enforcement knew Terri lied. They weren’t holding those kinds of pressers to vindicate her parking spot. My opinion only, of course.

Or - more likely - they were stuck, had nothing to go on, and were desperately grasping at straws. The results speak for themselves, I think.

 

[Truth Prevails]

The book muddled and confused things, and can't be taken as a serious account of what happened. Sorry. Desiree's always evolving story goes against what we know from the earliest days. Desiree wasn't there when Terri took the picture. Terri was. GZ was. Porter was. None of those who were there have ever said the picture was taken at 8:45.

Wait, what? Ms. Porter was there, too? Kyron’s homeroom teacher was there?

Do you have a supporting link?

It would make sense, but I have never seen any statements from her.

It seems Desiree and Tony heard Terri say it:
[Pg 38] Desiree and Tony heard Terri describe her day. Terri said she had taken the photo of Kyron at 8:45 a.m. and walked out of the school with [the baby, “K”] at 8:50 a.m. She said she had parked the truck in the school parking lot.

"Boy Missing · The Search for Kyron Horman" by Rebecca Morris​

Desiree wasn’t there, but Desiree does communicate with law enforcement. She is Kyron’s mother. She knows the picture was taken at 8:45 a.m.

 

[Truth Prevails]

OK, so let's look at what Desiree's latest story is:


Except the groups weren't formed until after 8:45, so why would Terri need to take Kyron out of a group that hadn't formed yet? They're not going to form the groups before school has started and before the buses arrived.


Teleporting witnesses, since if CL was in the classroom when Kyron's picture was taken, and the picture was taken at 8:45 (both of which Desiree claims in the book) how did he suddely appear in the parking lot to see Terri and Kyron leave together?


From chapter 2 of the Morris book:


Not only that, but why would the teacher then expect him to be gone all day, and not sound the alarm when he didn't return at 11?

In my opinion, while the posting referred to in this comment was written publicly by Desiree, it was addressed directly to Terri. So, from Kyron’s mother to the stepmother, who she holds responsible for her son’s disappearance.

Classy Desiree is not arguing or debating; she is telling Terri what she knows as fact.

Her words stand. I would be remiss to debate them.

However, I would like to contribute the following linked quote concerning the talent show.

It was reported in the MSM that Kyron was supposed to be in the talent show. Desiree and Kaine didn’t want to confirm it because they were asked not to talk about the timeline. Even in the book, that information was held back. Desiree has her reasons, I’m sure. I love that she can be calculating and strategic. Desiree is a very intelligent woman. Again, JMO

[June 7, 2010] Schreiber said Kyron was supposed to perform in the school's talent show at 1 p.m. but she didn't see him there.
Still no trace of Kyron Horman as police, FBI conclude third day of search

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Wait, what? Ms. Porter was there, too? Kyron’s homeroom teacher was there?

Do you have a supporting link?

It would make sense, but I have never seen any statements from her.

Teachers were supposed to be in their classrooms, so she should have been there, and we know from other statements that the "mishearing" incident as Terri exited the classroom, occurred. Either way, she was in the school and testified about it. Desiree wasn't.

It seems Desiree and Tony heard Terri say it:
[Pg 38] Desiree and Tony heard Terri describe her day. Terri said she had taken the photo of Kyron at 8:45 a.m. and walked out of the school with [the baby, “K”] at 8:50 a.m. She said she had parked the truck in the school parking lot.

"Boy Missing · The Search for Kyron Horman" by Rebecca Morris​

Desiree wasn’t there, but Desiree does communicate with law enforcement. She is Kyron’s mother. She knows the picture was taken at 8:45 a.m.

If that actually happened, we still haven't been given the actual statement from Terri. We have no idea if Desiree and Tony correctly understood or relayed what was actually said. This is almost a decade later, and while Desiree claims she took notes, I doubt she did so at that time.

The picture wasn't taken at 8:45. That is incredibly obvious, especially with how it makes the timeline of the morning completely ridiculous, as I've pointed out multiple times now.

8:15 - Terri and Kyron arrive at the school. GZ sees Kyron in front of his project (and talks to Terri about T-shirts), Terri tells Porter she is taking Kyron out of the groups (that will not be formed for another 30 minutes) to go tour together.

8:30 - Terri and Kyron do their tour, at some point Terri leaves Kyron inside the school to go sit in her truck for a while. She then goes back into the school, finds Kyron and takes him back to the classroom.

8:45 - Terri takes a picture of Kyron, a picture of just his science project and a picture of MZ, tells the teacher that she's taking Kyron to his appointment, which GZ thinks means she's taking him on (another) tour of the fair.

It's contrived, contradictory, convoluted, and yes, unbelievable.

Do you think this is a realistic timeline?

In my opinion, while the posting referred to in this comment was written publicly by Desiree, it was addressed directly to Terri. So, from Kyron’s mother to the stepmother, who she holds responsible for her son’s disappearance.

Classy Desiree is not arguing or debating; she is telling Terri what she knows as fact.

Her words stand. I would be remiss to debate them.

Her words completely fail to stand. Why, if Kyron was expected back at 11, didn't the school sound the alarm then?

It shows the mutable nature of Desiree's accusations. She gets some info, who knows from where, and suddenly the whole plot changes. The picture at 8:45, the supposed parking lot witnesses, the changed times from the shopping trip and gym - all of which clash with info we already knew - didn't appear until 2015. That's after the failed GJ push, after Desiree's civil suit ended with a whimper, after Dede's immunity deal and testimony to the GJ, after the finalized divorce and long after any meaningful movement in the investigation. A whole year had passed with essentially nothing happening. And then, suddenly, these bombshells appear. Note, too, the changing nature of how she got the info. First it was technology (presumably metadata) that pinpointed the time. Yet in the book, it's Terri just saying the time, straight up:

[June 4, 2019] [15:15] MJ: And do you think that he made it to school that day? What is your working theory on that because I know that some people thought that maybe the picture had been taken before.
Desiree: Nope. I know for sure, 100%, the picture was taken in the school. It’s GPS—it’s confirmed; it’s verified. We know exactly what time she took the picture, where she was at. And it’s confirmed with technology. So, she was in the school at 8:45 taking that photo of Kyron in front of his exhibit. I know that she left the school; she left with Kyron. And we have eyewitnesses that place them outside the school in route to the truck. It’s from that point where it gets unknown.
Kyron Horman Discussion Thread 2017-2019

Desiree and Tony heard Terri describe her day. Terri said she had taken the photo of Kyron at 8:45 a.m. and walked out of the school with Kayla at 8:50 a.m. BM, ch 3

BBM. For what reason would 8:45 need to be established with technology, if Terri herself had just said so?

The eyewitnesses were never mentioned before 2015 either. In the book, it sticks out like a sore thumb - chapter 24, where Desiree is informed about the landscaper by the MCSO. In the middle of the conversation, between them telling her about the MFH plot and the failed sting, it just gets shoved in there - oh, and by the way, there were also witnesses who saw them leave together, here are their names. And then it just isn't touched upon again until chapter 62, which - you guessed it - takes place in 2015.

But there is something interesting about the paragraph in ch 64:

When he asked her who she believed was responsible for Kyron’s disappearance, Desiree didn’t need to think twice. “Terri Horman, his stepmother.” As proof, she mentioned that several witnesses, including a couple of adults, had seen Terri leave the side entrance of Skyline Elementary with Kyron on June 4, 2010.

This was information that the MCSO had initially released, then rescinded, then told Desiree was true. “I didn’t understand why they wanted that detail kept tight,” she said later.

When did the MCSO initially release this information? In chapter 24 she specifies it was a few weeks before Jun 27th. Yet I can't find any trace of it. It seems to have gone completely unnoticed by this forum, which I personally find highly unlikely.

There's so much of that in the book. We see the information given to the media, and then some unidentified detective talks to Desiree alone and says "actually it was like this", always confirming her priors.

However, I would like to contribute the following linked quote concerning the talent show.

It was reported in the MSM that Kyron was supposed to be in the talent show. Desiree and Kaine didn’t want to confirm it because they were asked not to talk about the timeline. Even in the book, that information was held back. Desiree has her reasons, I’m sure. I love that she can be calculating and strategic. Desiree is a very intelligent woman. Again, JMO

[June 7, 2010] Schreiber said Kyron was supposed to perform in the school's talent show at 1 p.m. but she didn't see him there.
Still no trace of Kyron Horman as police, FBI conclude third day of search

And yet that is the opposite of what Desiree said. In the book, in public statements, up until this very year.

 

[Truth Prevails]

And yet that is the opposite of what Desiree said. In the book, in public statements, up until this very year.

Deisree is Kyron's mother. She doesn't have to say anything at all. Ever. She does not have to defend herself. She wants to find her son and she wants justice for her son.

The fact that she stays actively involved in her 7-year-old missing child's case is admirable. She organizes searches for Kyron. She holds car washes and washes vehicles herself to raise funding. Desiree is magnificent in her devotion to her son. Her pain is still palpable after all these years.

She also has a very busy life and doesn't live on social media platforms.

Whenever and if ever she chooses to enlighten us with a nugget of information we will never get from law enforcement, I appreciate it.

She doesn't release information off-the-cuff. She doesn't tailor the information to fit what's being said on social media.

Desiree is in control.

Justice for Kyron! Justice for Kyron! Justice for Kyron!​

 

[Truth Prevails]

The picture wasn't taken at 8:45.

Link, please.

 

[Truth Prevails]

And yet that is not reflected in any of the statements GZ gave. In fact, I believe you are the only one who has ever made that claim, not even Morris or Desiree.

KGW:


OregonLive:


From the Dateline segment, using your transcription:


Boy Missing, ch 1


Boy Missing, ch 4


If not for Desiree's much later claim that the picture was taken at 8:45, would anyone think these are not the same event?

Not one of those articles gives a time for when the picture was taken. They are professionally written and make their statements clear.

We don’t have to check our common sense at the door. But sometimes we do.

As bloggers in 2010, we all desperately wanted a time for when the picture was taken. We knew the time had not been released. Yes, we knew. We absolutely knew. We could read and process what we were reading.

But we wanted to make a timeline for Kyron’s case. So, we read as many MSM articles as we could find and—without a linkable source—went ahead and “supplied” a time to suit our purposes. The thought never entered our minds that Terri would manipulate it into her timeline.

As it turned out, the time was wrong. It was a bad idea, shameful even, but it seemed like a good idea at the time. I hope we have learned a lesson.

I realize it upsets the carefully crafted narrative of Terri’s timeline which she has worked so hard on.

I am reminded of the famous quote: “Oh, what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive.” YMMV

I did not realize that I was the only one to claim GZ saw Kyron three times that morning, but I feel the MSM link and the two citations back it up. I will share some of my thoughts on how I connected the dots.

Terri and Kyron were already in Kyron’s classroom on the 2nd floor when [GZ] and her daughter arrived. Terri and Kyron were dropping off Kyron’s coat and backpack and getting ready to visit Kyron’s homeroom teacher and return library books downstairs. Kyron was so very proud of his project. They stopped to look at it before he left to go downstairs. It had been set up in his classroom the day before.
8:15 a.m. [GZ,] president of the school PTA, arrives and sees Kyron with his stepmother in front of his exhibit.
Kyron Horman: Timeline of events since boy's disappearance

The first bell sounded at 8:45 a.m. and all children reported to their homerooms to be divided into groups to tour the science fair. Terri and Kyron returned too, and pictures were taken by Terri, including the now iconic photo of Kyron in front of his science project, one of GZ’s daughter in front of her project, and one of KH in front of his project.
[Pg 57] [GZ] told police she had seen Terri take Kyron's photo in front of his science exhibit. That was at 8:45 a.m.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

Around 9:00 a.m., parents began to leave for home or work as their children were settled into their groups. Terri had not been at the science fair the day before for the actual presentation (as she explained on Dr. Phil) so the three of them went around on their own, per Kaine, 2nd par. GZ saw them leaving Kyron’s classroom as she happened to be on her way out.
[Pg 50] [GZ] left around 9 a.m. for her job at a restaurant. The last time [GZ] saw Terri and Kyron was after Terri took the photo of [GZ’s daughter]. Kyron and his stepmother were walking away by themselves, presumably to view some of the other science projects.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

 

[Truth Prevails]

I keep coming back to the same issue, the timeline. This is what Terri says happened:



8:15 ca - arrived at school with Kyron and daughter, walked to the classroom, took the picture, chatted with teacher and others.



8:30 ca - began walking around the school looking at other exhibits, ended up in McBeth's classroom downstairs.



8:45 - walked up separate staircases from the bottom floor, Kyron walked to his classroom while Terri said goodbye.



This matches up perfectly with the statements of GZ. She was there to see the pictures taken, talk to Terri and when Terri and Kyron left, she thought they were going to see other exhibits. It fits with the timeline, not too busy.

Is this a new timeline from Terri? Could you provide a supporting link, please?

I have a link for her June 5th email timeline. And I have a link for her alibi timeline. But nothing for this, so far.

I’m not surprised it matches perfectly with the statements of GZ. Terri is probably following along and making the necessary adjustments as required.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Deisree is Kyron's mother. She doesn't have to say anything at all. Ever. She does not have to defend herself. She wants to find her son and she wants justice for her son.

The fact that she stays actively involved in her 7-year-old missing child's case is admirable. She organizes searches for Kyron. She holds car washes and washes vehicles herself to raise funding. Desiree is magnificent in her devotion to her son. Her pain is still palpable after all these years.

She also has a very busy life and doesn't live on social media platforms.

Whenever and if ever she chooses to enlighten us with a nugget of information we will never get from law enforcement, I appreciate it.

She doesn't release information off-the-cuff. She doesn't tailor the information to fit what's being said on social media.

Desiree is in control.

Justice for Kyron! Justice for Kyron! Justice for Kyron!​

I don't see how any of that is relevant to what I am writing. I have no interest in either praising or disparaging Desiree. My sole interest is finding out what happened to Kyron, and to do that I have to judge the information and the sources that we have. And it is undeniable that Desiree has added to and changed her stories over the years, so I can't regard her as a reliable source. That is not a judgment on her, by the way. Memory is famously unreliable and often affected by strong emotion, like grief and resentment. What we can do, what we should do, is look at what she's saying and ask: does this fit with what we know? Does it make sense?

And, sadly, the answer to both of those questions is "no".

Link, please.

This is the whole paragraph I wrote.

The picture wasn't taken at 8:45. That is incredibly obvious, especially with how it makes the timeline of the morning completely ridiculous, as I've pointed out multiple times now.

You can add an IMO to it, but I thought the meaning was clear. I detailed my reasoning - with links - in this post.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Not one of those articles gives a time for when the picture was taken. They are professionally written and make their statements clear.

We don’t have to check our common sense at the door. But sometimes we do.

As bloggers in 2010, we all desperately wanted a time for when the picture was taken. We knew the time had not been released. Yes, we knew. We absolutely knew. We could read and process what we were reading.

But we wanted to make a timeline for Kyron’s case. So, we read as many MSM articles as we could find and—without a linkable source—went ahead and “supplied” a time to suit our purposes. The thought never entered our minds that Terri would manipulate it into her timeline.

As it turned out, the time was wrong. It was a bad idea, shameful even, but it seemed like a good idea at the time. I hope we have learned a lesson.

But the time still hasn't been released.

I realize it upsets the carefully crafted narrative of Terri’s timeline which she has worked so hard on.

But Terri has not had anything to do with it. She was famously quiet about it for years. The reason to be skeptical about Desiree's new information is that it doesn't match the info we already have.

I am reminded of the famous quote: “Oh, what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive.” YMMV

I don't believe Desiree intends to deceive, but I think it's clear that her "new" information has tangled into knots. This is unlike "Terri's" timeline, which was always simple, logical and realistic.

I did not realize that I was the only one to claim GZ saw Kyron three times that morning, but I feel the MSM link and the two citations back it up. I will share some of my thoughts on how I connected the dots.

Terri and Kyron were already in Kyron’s classroom on the 2nd floor when [GZ] and her daughter arrived. Terri and Kyron were dropping off Kyron’s coat and backpack and getting ready to visit Kyron’s homeroom teacher and return library books downstairs. Kyron was so very proud of his project. They stopped to look at it before he left to go downstairs. It had been set up in his classroom the day before.
8:15 a.m. [GZ,] president of the school PTA, arrives and sees Kyron with his stepmother in front of his exhibit.
Kyron Horman: Timeline of events since boy's disappearance

Note the phrasing. "In front of his exhibit".

The first bell sounded at 8:45 a.m. and all children reported to their homerooms to be divided into groups to tour the science fair. Terri and Kyron returned too, and pictures were taken by Terri, including the now iconic photo of Kyron in front of his science project, one of GZ’s daughter in front of her project, and one of KH in front of his project.
[Pg 57] [GZ] told police she had seen Terri take Kyron's photo in front of his science exhibit. That was at 8:45 a.m.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

Yet without Morris's insertion of 8:45 here, this matches the phrasing used in all the other, actual statements by GZ where the times given are 8:15 and 8:30. It's always Kyron "in front of his exhibit". There is nothing from any of GZ's statements that even slightly indicates multiple sightings.

Around 9:00 a.m., parents began to leave for home or work as their children were settled into their groups. Terri had not been at the science fair the day before for the actual presentation (as she explained on Dr. Phil) so the three of them went around on their own, per Kaine, 2nd par. GZ saw them leaving Kyron’s classroom as she happened to be on her way out.
[Pg 50] [GZ] left around 9 a.m. for her job at a restaurant. The last time [GZ] saw Terri and Kyron was after Terri took the photo of [GZ’s daughter]. Kyron and his stepmother were walking away by themselves, presumably to view some of the other science projects.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

But GZ doesn't say she saw Terri and Kyron leave when she left. All she says is that they left the classroom after the picture was taken. If this happened later (around 9:00), why would GZ believe they were going on a tour, when this is the time the groups were supposed to be formed?

Is this a new timeline from Terri? Could you provide a supporting link, please?

I have a link for her June 5th email timeline. And I have a link for her alibi timeline. But nothing for this, so far.

I’m not surprised it matches perfectly with the statements of GZ. Terri is probably following along and making the necessary adjustments as required.

No, not new. It is the same sequence of events she gave on Dr Phil. She gives the time of 8:15 in the interview, while other articles have established 8:45 as her claimed time of exit (no one has disputed this). 8:30 is one of the times given for GZ seeing Terri in the classroom.

The important thing here is the sequence of events, which is also the same as the one given in chapter 1 of the Morris book:

Kyron was seen in his classroom, room 213, at the southwest corner of the main floor of the school. Kristina Porter, or Miss Porter, as the children called her, was the teacher of his combined second- and third-grade class. Kyron’s stepmother took a photograph of him standing in front of his science project. He was seen by his friends Carson, Tanner, Kurtis, and Ellie, who were also in Miss Porter’s class. Terri also took a photo of Ellie with her turtle exhibit.

Ellie’s mother, Alice Jacobsen, saw Kyron in Miss Porter’s room. He was seen downstairs visiting the classroom of Scott McBeth, his kindergarten and first-grade teacher. Then he and his stepmother went back upstairs, using different staircases. Kyron’s friend Tanner passed him on the stairs at the front entrance. Terri said she stood at the top of the stairs at the east end of the hallway, by the gym, and waved at Kyron as he entered his classroom.

Again, the main issue with Desiree's new sequence is that it doesn't fit with the info we have, is convoluted and contrived and doesn't fit within the brief 30 minutes:

8:15 - Terri and Kyron arrive at the school. GZ sees Kyron in front of his project (and talks to Terri about T-shirts), Terri tells Porter she is taking Kyron out of the groups (that will not be formed for another 30 minutes) to go tour together.

8:30 - Terri and Kyron do their tour, at some point Terri leaves Kyron inside the school to go sit in her truck for a while. She then goes back into the school, finds Kyron and takes him back to the classroom.

8:45 - Terri takes a picture of Kyron, a picture of just his science project and a picture of MZ, tells the teacher that she's taking Kyron to his appointment, which GZ thinks means she's taking him on (another) tour of the fair.

Is this a logical sequence of events?

 

[Truth Prevails]

8:15 - Terri and Kyron arrive at the school. GZ sees Kyron in front of his project (and talks to Terri about T-shirts), Terri tells Porter she is taking Kyron out of the groups (that will not be formed for another 30 minutes) to go tour together.

8:30 - Terri and Kyron do their tour, at some point Terri leaves Kyron inside the school to go sit in her truck for a while. She then goes back into the school, finds Kyron and takes him back to the classroom.

8:45 - Terri takes a picture of Kyron, a picture of just his science project and a picture of MZ, tells the teacher that she's taking Kyron to his appointment, which GZ thinks means she's taking him on (another) tour of the fair.

It's contrived, contradictory, convoluted, and yes, unbelievable.

Do you think this is a realistic timeline?

Again, the main issue with Desiree's new sequence is that it doesn't fit with the info we have, is convoluted and contrived and doesn't fit within the brief 30 minutes:

8:15 - Terri and Kyron arrive at the school. GZ sees Kyron in front of his project (and talks to Terri about T-shirts), Terri tells Porter she is taking Kyron out of the groups (that will not be formed for another 30 minutes) to go tour together.

8:30 - Terri and Kyron do their tour, at some point Terri leaves Kyron inside the school to go sit in her truck for a while. She then goes back into the school, finds Kyron and takes him back to the classroom.

8:45 - Terri takes a picture of Kyron, a picture of just his science project and a picture of MZ, tells the teacher that she's taking Kyron to his appointment, which GZ thinks means she's taking him on (another) tour of the fair.

Is this a logical sequence of events?

This has been asked twice: once referring to it as a realistic sequence and, secondly, referring to it as a logical sequence.

My response is here, but it's my pleasure to post it again.

Terri and Kyron were already in Kyron’s classroom on the 2nd floor when [GZ] and her daughter arrived. Terri and Kyron were dropping off Kyron’s coat and backpack and getting ready to visit Kyron’s homeroom teacher and return library books downstairs. Kyron was so very proud of his project. They stopped to look at it before he left to go downstairs. It had been set up in his classroom the day before.
8:15 a.m. [GZ,] president of the school PTA, arrives and sees Kyron with his stepmother in front of his exhibit.
Kyron Horman: Timeline of events since boy's disappearance

The first bell sounded at 8:45 a.m. and all children reported to their homerooms to be divided into groups to tour the science fair. Terri and Kyron returned and pictures were taken, including one of GZ’s daughter in front of her project, and one of Kyron’s friend KH in front of his project.
[Pg 57] [GZ] told police she had seen Terri take Kyron's photo in front of his science exhibit. That was at 8:45 a.m.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

Around 9:00 a.m., parents began to leave for home or work as their children were settled into their groups. Terri had not been at the science fair the day before for the actual presentation (as she explained on Dr. Phil) so the three of them went around on their own, per Kaine, 2nd par. GZ saw them leaving Kyron’s classroom as she happened to be on her way out.

[Pg 50] [GZ] left around 9 a.m. for her job at a restaurant. The last time [GZ] saw Terri and Kyron was after Terri took the photo of [GZ’s daughter]. Kyron and his stepmother were walking away by themselves, presumably to view some of the other science projects.

Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris​

 

[Truth Prevails]

Teachers were supposed to be in their classrooms, so she should have been there, and we know from other statements that the "mishearing" incident as Terri exited the classroom, occurred. Either way, she was in the school and testified about it. Desiree wasn't.

Could you provide a link or supporting information on where I could find the "other statements that the "mishearing" incident as Terri exited the classroom, occurred", please?

Specifically, I would appreciate a link directing me to the "other statements" that verify the "mishearing" incident did occur as Terri exited Kyron's classroom.

Thanks!

 

[Truth Prevails]

BBM. For what reason would 8:45 need to be established with technology, if Terri herself had just said so?

7-year-old Kyron Richard Horman was missing. Law enforcement would confirm the time and location the last known picture of him was taken, as they would for any missing child. With technology. It would be standard procedure. They don’t have to settle for eyewitness accounts anymore. It just takes a little time due to search warrants and busy labs.

Especially in a case like Kyron’s where the last known picture of him was taken by the last known person to see him, about 10 minutes before he vanished. Oh, yeah. Law enforcement confirmed the time and place the picture was taken. You bet they did.

Little boys don’t vanish. Kyron didn’t vanish. Where is Kyron?

Just my humble opinion, of course.

I need to see his face right now. Kyron, the beautiful little boy with the huge smile. Loving her and dependent on her to love him back. Dressed in a CSI t-shirt. Where is he?

https://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/photo/kyron3jpg-42b82154c5c24430.jpg