LA - Officer fatally shoots Alton Sterling outside store, Baton Rouge, 2016

[Betty P]

Yeah, I have to say--- I have never been to jail and I still have a very healthy fear of authority. If they tell me get out, hands up- I get out! Hands up! With a yes, sir and a no, sir. No mouthing off. No I dont have to. No forcing me to do anything. My heart beats out of my chest for a ticket. I cant imagine being so defiant to law enforcement, ESPECIALLY if I have a history. I know good and well how to make things go smoothly and how to escalate the situation.

There's no evidence that the victim became defiant. The store owner says it escalated very quickly. By the time he got to the door of his store, LE had already thrown the man onto the hood of the car and then onto the ground. It sounds like they just walked up and attacked him.

The victim had been selling CD's, etc. in front of his friend's store for 5 or 6 years, according to the store owner. If Baton Rouge had a good community policing program, the police would already have been acquainted with Sterling and known he was not a violent or dangerous person. The whole thing could have been avoided.

 

[Elley Mae]

There's no evidence that the victim became defiant. The store owner says it escalated very quickly. By the time he got to the door of his store, LE had already thrown the man onto the hood of the car and then onto the ground. It sounds like they just walked up and attacked him.

The victim had been selling CD's, etc. in front of his friend's store for 5 or 6 years, according to the store owner. If Baton Rouge had a good community policing program, the police would already have been acquainted with Sterling and known he was not a violent or dangerous person. The whole thing could have been avoided.

bbm, That's why I don't/won't trust what he says.

 

[Betty P]

Still photos from video in front of the store. Shows the victim standing facing the officer with his left arm raised and away from his body. LEO in front of him is aiming something, probably the stun gun. The other officer is pulling out some kind of weapon. Next frame shows them shoving him onto the hood of a car, then down on the ground. Looks like it all happened very quickly

 

[Everyday Grace]

New information about the 911 call:

A homeless man made the 911 call that brought police to the convenience store where Alton Sterling was shot dead, a senior law enforcement official told CNN on Thursday.

Sterling was selling CDs outside the Triple S Food Mart early Tuesday in Baton Rouge, the official said, when the homeless man approached him and asked for money.

The man was persistent, and Sterling showed him his gun, the official said.

"I told you to leave me alone," Sterling told the man, according to the official.

The homeless man then used his cell phone to call 911, the official said.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/07/us/baton-rouge-alton-sterling-shooting/

 

[ArianeEmory]

bbm, That's why I don't/won't trust what he says.

Do you have the same distrust for friends of the *shooter* in these situations? Or is just the dead people's friends who lie?

 

[Irish_Eyes]

Do you have the same distrust for friends of the *shooter* in these situations? Or is just the dead people's friends who lie?

I was just about to post about this in response to Betty's post above. Sterling had a long rap sheet that includes repeated violent offenses. The store owner said he was nice. This isn't a contradiction, people can be complex. I bet the officers likely also have family and friends who love them and could tell you about their many good deeds. Doesn't mean that they couldn't have acted improperly in this case.

Yes, we often do not see things dispassionately when they involve our own family and friends. That's true even when the situation is minor, but this guy saw his friend shot in front of him. That's major. It would be practically impossible for him to look at this situation dispassionately and objectively. That doesn't mean he isn't being truthful about what he saw. But yes, those emotions often do color our perceptions of what we see.

Suppose the store owner, instead of being a friend, had been someone who disliked Sterling. Someone who made comments to the media like "That guy's always been pretty shady. I never liked him and it really bothered me when the landlord let him set up in front of the store," and his take on all this was much more pro-police. Wouldn't we also assume that person's interpretation of what he saw might be affected by how he viewed Sterling?

 

[katydid23]

We don't know that Sterling had the opportunity to think to tell LE to look at the surveillance video. I understand from a friend living in Baton Rouge that all videos were confiscated by LE immediately after the shooting, and without a warrant. If Sterling did not brandish a gun at someone, we will never know.

When LE FIRST arrived, they asked him to comply with orders, they would have detained him, frisked him, and THEN they would have spoken to him about the 911 call. At that time he could have said he never brandished a gun. The store owner could have been a supportive witness, etc.... But we never got that far because he willfully resisted every request by LE, taking it down a dangerous road.

 

[LietKynes]

When LE FIRST arrived, they asked him to comply with orders, they would have detained him, frisked him, and THEN they would have spoken to him about the 911 call. At that time he could have said he never brandished a gun. The store owner could have been a supportive witness, etc.... But we never got that far because he willfully resisted every request by LE, taking it down a dangerous road.

RSBM

Damn right.
Alton may have had a fine relationship with the business owner.. but his (Alton's) record speaks for itself. Strange when people make hero out of someone without understanding their past.
Alton took this initial request to be talked to and possibly frisked/fined to a tragic level.
This may sound harsh -- but I for one am glad both officers were able to return to their families that night.

On another note; it's interesting a homeless man called the cops on Alton -- how could he afford a phone ?
And why won't the police or media release his name ? It would help calm things down. The way some news outlets are reporting this-- you'd think the police just drove up and confronted Alton without even speaking to him first.

I'd imagine their body cams would show both leo's gave him every chance to comply.
:moo:

 

[scmom]

I think the name of the homeless man being released would probably not benefit him in the public's eye. After all, if he hadn't called 911 we'd not be here discussing this situation.

 

[Everyday Grace]

Possible that the homeless 911 caller has a cellphone through the Lifeline Assistance program.

Or a phone configured for 911 emergency calls only. I work with a family violence shelter and we make emergency only phones available for clients who do not have a phone. The phones are usually donated and reconfigured.

 

[katydid23]

Sadly, there are a lot of 'working' homeless people in coastal California. Housing is so ridiculously expensive. Many people work jobs, and have cell phones and clean clothes, but have no apartments.

 

[scmom]

I think the Instagram video shows the body cam of the officer kneeling with his back to the camera lying on the pavement between his legs. GRAPHIC though.

 

[LietKynes]

I think the name of the homeless man being released would probably not benefit him in the public's eye. After all, if he hadn't called 911 we'd not be here discussing this situation.

RSBM

Wonder if he (homeless guy) gave a false name to the police ? Like for his own anonymity .
Absolutely crazy the way some people are commenting on this--as if they were all right there watching this go down.

Not here at WS, though !
I like how we can agree to disagree.

I'm curious if Alton had had any previous physical scuffles with le ? Where he --even if it ended in arrest-- felt he'd achieved the upper hand ?

Tbh, if I'm being pulled over for just speeding (very seldom), I do exactly what the police or state trooper says. Last thing I want is to risk being fined even more, or struggling and maybe getting tased.
Off-topic a bit -- As a kid who grew up in a rural farming community--I've accidentally touched a few electric fences and some of them were set at a fairly high voltage. Painful and scary.
You just obey and comply and if you feel wronged you have your day in court--- NOT right there with the police.
:moo:

 

[Elley Mae]

Do you have the same distrust for friends of the *shooter* in these situations? Or is just the dead people's friends who lie?

I don't trust anyone.

 

[al66pine]

I'm not sure officers need to wait until the suspect is retrieving the gun in his pocket, when he isn't complying. By then it could be too late. There was a witness that said he was tased at least two times and it had no affect on him.

Agreeing w your post: LEOs do not always need to wait until gun is pointed at them. Or even drawn. Depends on circumstances.
If officers must always wait until the suspect is retrieving the gun, it may very well allow suspect to fire, injuring or killing others, LEOs, or self.
Person carrying gun pants pocket may shoot w gun still in pants pocket. Possible w gun in holster in pocket, or in pocket w no holster.
Search for "shoot through holster." Many co's design, manuf, & sell for many types of handguns, specifically to shoot while in pocket, purse, fanny pack, etc. A sample image:


http://www.bing.com/images/search?q...28E150A100BD071F961A54C5EB0474214&FORM=IQFRBA

I doubt many ppl carrying guns in shoot thru holsters are crackshots when shooting that way. Harder to aim, more dangerous for everyone, imo.
Ditto re ppl carrying a gun without holster, loose in pocket.

Both ^ carry methods are kinda sorta like driving w no seat belt, no shoulder harness, etc. JM2cts.

 

[carbuff]

For some trason, Tapatalk posted my reply on the wrong thread.

 

[al66pine]

Someone posted, asking if AS had a history of violence or resisting arrest (my paraphrasing).
Tho some of these bolded arrests were quite a while back (and we DK which, if any, resulted in convictions or serving time), the 2016 arrests tell me (just mho) that AS was not an upright, law abiding person. Also suggests to me that he may have been selling something else along the CDs, and LEOs may have had reason to suspect him of ^ same. JM2cts, could be all wrong.

Sterling's mother revealed to the media that Sterling had a prior history with police that included felony arrests. Court records show his arrest history includes:

9/09/96 aggravated battery
10/31/97 2nd degree battery
1/06/98 simple battery
5/04/00 public intimidation
9/20/00 carnal knowledge of a juvenile
9/04/01 domestic violence
5/24/05 burglary of an inhabited dwelling place
7/11/05 receiving stolen things
9/12/05 burglary of inhabited dwelling place
3/17/06 simple criminal damage to property, simple robbery, simple theft, drug possession, misrepresentation during booking, simple battery, aggravated battery
4/12/06 aggravated battery, simple criminal damage to property, disturbing the peace, unauthorized entry
4/04/08 domestic abuse battery
6/03/09 resisting an officer, drug possession, receiving stolen things, possession of stolen firearm, illegal carrying of a weapon with CDs, sound reproduct without consent
10/12/09 illegal carrying of weapon, marijuana possession
8/13/15 failure to register as a sex offender
4/08/16 failure to register as a sex offender
6/14/16 ecstacy and marijuana possession

http://www.wafb.com/story/32384244/sterling-shootingpolice-dispatch-tapes-obtained

Thx again for the list. My bolding.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Do you have the same distrust for friends of the *shooter* in these situations? Or is just the dead people's friends who lie?

I wouldn't trust the friends of the officers either especially if they were investigating. I'm glad to see the FBI is in charge of this investigation.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Someone posted, asking if AS had a history of violence or resisting arrest (my paraphrasing).
Tho some of these bolded arrests were quite a while back (and we DK which, if any, resulted in convictions or serving time), the 2016 arrests tell me (just mho) that AS was not an upright, law abiding person. Also suggests to me that he may have been selling something else along the CDs, and LEOs may have had reason to suspect him of ^ same. JM2cts, could be all wrong.

Thx again for the list. My bolding.

I think he served time at lease twice. Consider this is scuttlebutt from his FB linked on first page.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Still photos from video in front of the store. Shows the victim standing facing the officer with his left arm raised and away from his body. LEO in front of him is aiming something, probably the stun gun. The other officer is pulling out some kind of weapon. Next frame shows them shoving him onto the hood of a car, then down on the ground. Looks like it all happened very quickly

View attachment 97892

Actually, in the middle frame, the officer was rushing him and knocked him down which is how they all ended up on the ground. You're right that things escalated quickly.