Learn Something New Every Day

[narlacat]

<<There is no proof that John Ramsey is a liar, it is not a fact, it is only your opinion>>

He lied to his first wife and carried out an affair.
JR is indeed a liar.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Holdontoyourhat,

If you consider the creation of the garrote and its application after JonBenet was dead, say to fabricate a staging, to be incorrect, why does your reasoning not extend to the ligature or cord itself?

What need is there for that, JonBenet is a 6-year old girl. To any adult she will offer little or no resistance. An older person's hands are sufficient to asphyxiate JonBenet, there is no need for a ligature, in your own words that would seem counterproductive and redundant!

There is more than enough information to demonstrate that the garrote was created after JonBenet was killed, but not enough to conclusively prove that she was not asphyxiated by the ligature alone.

This also includes the forensic evidence linkage to Patsy in the paint-tote, duct-tape, and the knotting on the garrote.

If JonBenet had been asphyxiated by the garrote as claimed, then what is the source of all the abrasions and contusions that are below the neat circumferential line left by the ligature?

If JonBenet had been garroted as claimed then there should be little or no injuries beneath the ligature, and possibly extended petechiae above along with obvious fingernail markings indicating a struggle.



.

There is no information, as you claim, that in any way demonstrates the garrote was made after JBR was killed.

There's no linkage to PR in the paint tote, duct tape, or knotting.

Of course there would be all kinds of injuries beneath and around the ligature that the killer used on JBR. Why would you think there should be little or no injuries around the ligature?

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

"Again, with that business. Look at me. No violent history. Could I have done this. You betcha!

"So the evidence suggests the garrote was used on JBR to move her quietly downstairs, and not used as a prop for staging."

What evidence are you looking at?

Sorry, Super-D, but you couldn't have done this without a violent history.


:laugh:

The evidence is JBR moved from her bedroom to the basement, with ligature injuries to her neck, and the ligature device still attached.

 

[Brefie]

Sorry, Super-D, but you couldn't have done this without a violent history.


:laugh:

The evidence is JBR moved from her bedroom to the basement, with ligature injuries to her neck, and the ligature device still attached.

How do you explain Scott Peterson? He had no violent history.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

How do you explain Scott Peterson? He had no violent history.

Laci Peterson isn't a 6 year old girl sleeping in bed on Christmas night, is she?

 

[Brefie]

Laci Peterson isn't a 6 year old girl sleeping in bed on Christmas night, is she?

Um, no. She was 27, pregnant and it was Christmas eve. Conner wasn't even born.

What's your point? Mine is that people do murder those they are supposed to cherish on the holidays, even when they haven't done it before.

 

[UKGuy]

There is no information, as you claim, that in any way demonstrates the garrote was made after JBR was killed.

There's no linkage to PR in the paint tote, duct tape, or knotting.

Of course there would be all kinds of injuries beneath and around the ligature that the killer used on JBR. Why would you think there should be little or no injuries around the ligature?

Holdontoyourhat,

Your interpretation of the forensic evidence is not shared by others, not least the BPD, and FBI.

Of course there would be all kinds of injuries beneath and around the ligature that the killer used on JBR.

really, why should there be all kinds of injuries?


.

 

[BBB167893]

"There is no information, as you claim, that in any way demonstrates the garrote was made after JBR was killed."

Her hair was tied up in it. Seems a bit suggestive to me.

"There's no linkage to PR in the paint tote, duct tape, or knotting."

Oh, YEAH!? There's the little matter of her clothing fibers in ALL three of those places!

"Sorry, Super-D, but you couldn't have done this without a violent history."

Hmph, I say. You put me in the right circumstances, you'd be amazed what I can do. The dark side is strong in me.

"How do you explain Scott Peterson? He had no violent history."

Susan Smith...Andrea Yates...Darlie Routier...it's a long list.

 

[Brefie]

"How do you explain Scott Peterson? He had no violent history."

Susan Smith...Andrea Yates...Darlie Routier...it's a long list.

It sure is, SDave....still waiting for the POINT.

 

[Toltec]

Yes but the RDI theory doesn't explain the foreign DNA under her fingernails and the matching foreign DNA on her panties. It doesn't explain the red ink drawing of a heart on the palm of her hand or the pineapple in her digestive system or the secret visit by Santa after Christmas. It doesn't give satisfactory explanations for why the Ramseys called the police so early in the morning when if they had left it a bit longer they could have devised a much better coverup plan and could have even gotten rid of the body. It doesn't give a satisfactory explanation of how a father or mother with absolutely not a hint of blemish in their past histories wrt any form of sexual abuse or violence towards either of their children would, out of the blue, commit a crime that included both forms of deviant behaviour at their most extremes.

They are just the things that come to mind immediately. There are probably other things too if I spent more time thinking about it.

And what do you call serving up your daughter to Pedophiles constitute???

 

[Camper]

I had a lightbulb thought today, most likely stirred by while visiting my young daughters home the other day.

I was sitting in the family room, when I heard strange noises 'behind me', since the chair was near the wall with curtains hanging, there was no one behind me to have made the noise.

Just an ah ha moment, the baby monitor speaker was plugged in there and my sorta new grandbaby (8 months old) was doing baby stuff noises on the second floor.

Now the thought, does anyone remember a baby monitor being mentioned that could have been still plugged in and in use, working for JonBenets room?

OR for that matter an intercom for the entire house?

.

 

[Brefie]

I don't know about either, but I'll give you my opinion (SHOCK!!)

JBR was too old for a monitor

An intercom for a house that size would be commonplace around here, especially with renovations as recent as they did them.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

How do you explain Scott Peterson? He had no violent history.

I can't explain SP. Whether or not he had a violent history is unknown to me.

Your point is that just because a person has no history of violence doesn't mean they can't snap and kill a family member on a holdiay. Your point is that it happens all too often.

My point is that anyone who kills, whether they are a family member or not, has a history that enabled them to do so 'ideologically'. I'm sure if you look into SP's past, there's something that enabled him to viciously murder his own wife.

Whoever killed JBR is enabled ideologically to murder a child. That person is harder to find, since some of the motives present in spousal murder (triangles, revenge, etc) just aren't there with a 6 year old. You'll have to dig deeper than even SP, deeper into the murky depths of ideological development, to find someone capable of child murder.

PR and JR have exposed their pasts, and don't compare to SP in any way.

 

[BBB167893]

"It sure is, SDave....still waiting for the POINT."

What point would that be?

"Your point is that just because a person has no history of violence doesn't mean they can't snap and kill a family member on a holdiay. Your point is that it happens all too often."

It does happen all too often.

They had a psych profile of Patsy done. It said that she was suffering from severe mental disorders. How about that?

 

[Nuisanceposter]

The person who killed JonBenet didn't have to 'idealogically' prepared to kill her if JonBenet's death was the result of an accident and not premediatated in any way.

If it was an accident that the killer decided needed to be covered up, then the killer only had to be prepared to dish out corporal punishment, perhaps even without a history of it, maybe because of the stress of the holidays and having to pack and travel and an upcoming 40th birthday on top of a daughter who had an ongoing issue with soiling herself (especially when she desperately needs 'that child' to be perfect, because, my god, her own image is being affected.)

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

The photo of JBR's injuries around the tight ligature shows there was no accident. JBR was fighting against the garrote that was robbing her of air. It was used as a weapon for murder, not as a prop for a coverup of an accident.

Since JBR was murdered, and she's only 6 years old, the killer must have therefore been ideologically prepared to do it. The ransom note sort of eluded to this fact.

 

[BBB167893]

"If it was an accident that the killer decided needed to be covered up, then the killer only had to be prepared to dish out corporal punishment, perhaps even without a history of it, maybe because of the stress of the holidays and having to pack and travel and an upcoming 40th birthday on top of a daughter who had an ongoing issue with soiling herself (especially when she desperately needs 'that child' to be perfect, because, my god, her own image is being affected.)"

How much more do you need?

"The photo of JBR's injuries around the tight ligature shows there was no accident."

You misunderstand. The head blow was the accident. The garrote was used to deflect suspicion from the Ramseys.

"JBR was fighting against the garrote that was robbing her of air."

No, she wasn't. That's another deLOUsion. There were no marks from her scratching herself trying to get away. If there were, they would have been obvious, AND JB would have had mounds and mounds of her own skin under her nails. She didn't.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

No, she wasn't. That's another deLOUsion. There were no marks from her scratching herself trying to get away. If there were, they would have been obvious, AND JB would have had mounds and mounds of her own skin under her nails. She didn't.

Of course she was.

Her hands were bound by the second ligature. Kinda hard to scractch yourself when your hands are tied up. How can JBR have mounds of her own skin if she can't move her hands?!?

If the R's are so guilty, how come RDI has to obfuscate even the basic evidence (second ligature with multiple loops).

 

[BBB167893]

Of course she was.

Her hands were bound by the second ligature. Kinda hard to scractch yourself when your hands are tied up. How can JBR have mounds of her own skin if she can't move her hands?!?

If the R's are so guilty, how come RDI has to obfuscate even the basic evidence (second ligature with multiple loops).

Then why did Smit say she'd been clawing at her neck? He can't even keep that straight!

Hands tied up! Pshaw! Her hands were tied so loosely the coroner just slipped the bindings off. Plus there was ample cord length between her hands. You can't tell me I can't see with my own eyes.

The only obfuscation is on the part of the RST. As Michael Kane said, the police file contains the answers to these questions.

 

[Jayelles]

Then why did Smit say she'd been clawing at her neck? He can't even keep that straight!

Hands tied up! Pshaw! Her hands were tied so loosely the coroner just slipped the bindings off. Plus there was ample cord length between her hands. You can't tell me I can't see with my own eyes.

The only obfuscation is on the part of the RST. As Michael Kane said, the police file contains the answers to these questions.

I think the marks on her neck are "all wrong" to have been clawing at the garotte.

If you look carefully at these marks, you will see that they are in the wrong place and pointing in the wrong direction. They are BELOW the garotte and pointing in an angle towards the middle of her throat.

http://www.jameson245.com/csneck.jpg

Try acting out how you would remove a ligature around your neck. Note where your fingernails would be. Your *finger*nails would be above the ligature and pointing straight down.