MA - Conrad Roy, 18, urged by friend, commits suicide, Fairhaven, 13 July 2014

[Hoosgirl]

Her mom said Michelle saw a counselor after his death and continued to text his phone (71 times!).

Side note ... she is going to have major texting withdrawals with her bail conditions.

http://www.thesunchronicle.com/news...cle_e3f9d454-12cb-5ad0-b6a2-6c40c47a1b2e.html

 

[Theforeigner]

I can't help thinking about what amount of bad and dangerous influence MC had on Roy, and him develop depression and anxiety, through those 3 years they knew each other.

I mean thinking of that kind of sick/evil/manipulative mind MC apparently has, I'm beginning to suspect that she might have been a huge reason why Roy developed depression and anxiety.

As I understand it Roy was, by nature, a highly sensitive and therefor vulnerable person, and if he fell in love with this twisted, IMO sociopath, MC, I have no doubt that their relationship was extremely damaging to his mind and soul

 

[Miss Muffet]

I can't help thinking about what amount of bad and dangerous influence MC had on Roy, and him develop depression and anxiety, through those 3 years they knew each other.

I mean thinking of that kind of sick/evil/manipulative mind MC apparently has, I'm beginning to suspect that she might have been a huge reason why Roy developed depression and anxiety.

As I understand it Roy was, by nature, a highly sensitive and therefor vulnerable person, and if he fell in love with this twisted, IMO sociopath, MC, I have no doubt that their relationship was extremely damaging to his mind and soul

I'm sure she was damaging, but she couldn't have caused his social/school anxiety. They didn't even attend the same school and rarely saw each other. Being highly sensitive is a sign of anxiety disorders that already exist.

 

[Lulu14]

If I was suicidal, I would hope that my closest friend would urge me to seek help. Not urge me to climb back into the carbon monoxide filled truck.

He also has other friends, and family. Why did he never reach out to them? Why did he put this entire suicide burden on just one person?

Honestly, if my child committed suicide and I had no idea that he was in such a bad place, I would shut the hell up. It is a major failure when he confides in a girl he knows rather than in you, his mother.

 

[Miss Muffet]

He also has other friends, and family. Why did he never reach out to them? Why did he put this entire suicide burden on just one person?

Honestly, if my child committed suicide and I had no idea that he was in such a bad place, I would shut the hell up. It is a major failure when he confides in a girl he knows rather than in you, his mother.

My goodness! It's awful you're blaming his mother!

You obviously do not understand mental illness. You can't parent it away for goodness sake.

 

[Lulu14]

Okay Schuby. Let her walk with no felony so one day you can find out that she happens to be your child's guidance counselor. Or maybe your relative's therapist. No harm no foul. Just charge her with a mis demeanor and let her continue helping others. Ok.

There's a difference between being in an appointed position of authority over someone, and being their equal. That's why a college professor can get in trouble for sleeping with his 20 year old student, but not with an 18-yo Walmart cashier.

The girl in this case had no psychological training, and I don't think there was any action required of her (like it is from mandated reporters, for instance).

 

[Lulu14]

My goodness! It's awful you're blaming his mother!

You obviously do not understand mental illness. You can't parent it away for goodness sake.

I am not blaming his mother.

If you cannot parent it away, then how come you can friend it in?

It is either awful and there is nothing you ca do, or not. You can't have it both ways, one for the parent and the other for the friend.

And I do understand mental illness for better than I would like to, actually.

 

[LvsAMystry]

,

I am not blaming his mother.

If you cannot parent it away, then how come you can friend it in?

It is either awful and there is nothing you ca do, or not. You can't have it both ways, one for the parent and the other for the friend.

And I do understand mental illness for better than I would like to, actually.

But you did blame the mother at least somewhat, you said it was a failure on her part that he hadn't confided in her. His family was aware he had issues, he was under treatment but you can't keep someone under lock and key. She was being a parent and had gotten him help, and I'm certain had she been told a plan of suicide was imminent she would have done everything in her power to intervene. She wasn't given that opportunity because the person he chose to turn to actually encouraged it, and even when he expressed doubt at wanting to go through with it she still encouraged him throughout the DAYS ahead. Then in the moment when he got out of the vehicle expressing doubt, she encouraged him again - "get back in."

 

[hockeymom4]

This case just sickens me. It sickens me that someone who should have been a friend encouraged someone to end their life instead of get them help. That is NO friend. It pains me immensely. I feel for him and his whole family. atbher age she should know to get help or at the least not tell him get back in the car. I feel everywhere we turn we are hearing about teens or younger committing suicide because they are bullied by others. When are we going to start making people accountable for the words that come out of their mouth or the words they type? Not everyone is strong enough to take the hateful things people say and certain people are praying on them. IMO, that is what happen here. She knew he was vulnerable and she prayed on him. Just me, but it starts with the parents, I see ALL over the Internet adults speaking with snark, a condescending and rude, bulling like tone. Where do the kids pick it up? Hmmm, I wonder.

I follow a few celebrities on Instagram and one posted a picture of her child. The nasty comments followed from adults and were so nasty and hateful about her kid. He is less than two. She posted and said she will not be posting any more pictures of her children. So, to my point, let's be better examples for our children.

One more point, I flash back to when my nephew was around 11. He came to me and told me a girl from his school was being picked on and she said she was suicidal and he didn't know what to do. I got tears in my eyes. What a friend and amazing kid. He WAS 11 and knew what to do. I let his mom know and she called her mom. That is what this girl should have done, especially since she is WAY older. If an 11 year old knows to seek help, why did she think she should not seek help and instead tell him to get back in the car?

Sorry for being all over the place. I have SO many emotions about this.

 

[DexterMorgan]

In my opinion, the thread title is misleading. It's not that someone 'made' someone else commit suicide, but it's that someone 'encouraged' or 'counseled' someone else to commit suicide. And so, regarding issues like culpability, we're not talking about someone who pulled a trigger, but someone who was involved as an accessory, or worse, and so there is still potential culpability there.

Bottom Line:

How is this thread title misleading? Did you read the text where she said that he got scared and tried to back out and I made him get back in there and do it .

This was straight from the horse's mouth. So the title is not misleading because the perp expresses this herself.

 

[DexterMorgan]

It doesn't take a gun to make a mentally ill person abandon that brief moment of clarity of not wanting to kill themselves.

1) He was mentally ill

2) While on the phone with her; He had a brief moment of clarity and was starting to back out.

3) At that moment she verbally took his mental life preserver and used her mind control on his mental illness to make him abandon that brief moment of clarity and to get back in there and kill himself.

Jmo

 

[tlcya]

I agree, use of the word made in the thread title suggests she forced him or he had no free will. She encouraged it, she pushed him when he expressed doubts, but he was not forced or made to do anything.

That does not change the fact that I find her behavior reprehensible and quite possibly criminal.

 

[Miss Muffet]

The thread title is accurate because that's the charge against her.

 

[tlcya]

A Plainville student has been indicted on a charge of involuntary manslaughter

SNIP

“Based on the totality of the investigation, it is alleged that Ms. Carter had firsthand knowledge of Roy’s suicidal thoughts,” Bristol DA spokesman Gregg Miliote said in the statement. “Instead of attempting to assist him or notify his family or school officials, Ms. Carter is alleged to have strongly influenced his decision to take his own life, encouraged him to commit suicide and guided him in his engagement of activities which led to his death.”

http://www.boston.com/news/local/ma...mit-suicide/YTKrB4keYwzenzKq3YU7gN/story.html

 

[HMSHood]

I agree. She bullied him into it. Grrrrrr...she was evil towards him.

Psychopath comes to mind. Just imagine her getting a thrill from this and doing it again someday.

Jodie Jr

Michelle Carter sounds like another Lori Drew, who got others to harass Megan Meier to suicide. Got shades of Lori Drew. Drew has a lot in common with Jodi Arias, Casey Anthony, or Jerry Sandusky, which I see in Michelle Carter. Narcissistic psychopaths.

Would be interested in Carter's upbringing. I wonder if Carter was driven by some perceived slighting or rejection from Conrad Roy.

 

[Dogface]

Fact: no one can make anyone do or say anything.

Fact: she is a horribly sick person herself, and could have intervened in a number of ways to keep this from happening. Could she have prevented him from suicide if she had no notice of his attempt? Of course not. But she did. When a person is standing on a ledge about to jump you don't tell them to jump. Which is what she did. And I'm sorry, telling a suciidal person to carry out their plan should have a legal ramification.

I'm not one for adding frivolous laws to the law books, but failing to intervene when someone is threatening suicide should be a law. Morally, reporting something like that should be a given, sadly, morals are in apparent decline, and it needs to be a legal issue.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I agree, use of the word made in the thread title suggests she forced him or he had no free will. She encouraged it, she pushed him when he expressed doubts, but he was not forced or made to do anything.

That does not change the fact that I find her behavior reprehensible and quite possibly criminal.

Fact: He was mentally ill and she was one of the voices in his head that made him do it while he was having 2nd thoughts. Btw: She knew he was mentally ill.

 

[HMSHood]

She's innocent! Family of honor student accused of encouraging boyfriend to commit suicide over text say she was trying to help him ...as friends claim she was 'looking for attention' after he died
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...elp-friends-claim-looking-attention-died.html

The family of a high school honor roll student accused of encouraging her friend to kill himself before raising thousands of dollars for suicide prevention has insisted she is innocent.

Michelle Carter, 18, has been charged with involuntary manslaughter in the death of Conrad Roy III, who died of carbon monoxide poisoning in his idling truck in Fairhaven, Massachusetts, last July.

When Roy texted Carter that he wasn't sure he should take his life and had climbed out of the vehicle, she allegedly texted him: 'Get back in.'

Some description of her.

But classmates interviewed by police after the tragedy described her as someone who craves attention and is known as the girl who 'cries wolf'.

Carter also claimed the pair had been dating 'on and off' for two years, but Roy's best friends claim they had never heard of her.

According to court documents seen by the Herald, one friend added: 'She was a very nice, outgoing person but she requires a lot of attention and reassurance.

Another said Carter has a history of being the 'girl that cried wolf,' and sometimes (it) was hard to tell if she was being totally truthful.'

Sounds like histrionic and borderline with narcissism to me.

 

[LietKynes]

She's innocent! Family of honor student accused of encouraging boyfriend to commit suicide over text say she was trying to help him ...as friends claim she was 'looking for attention' after he died
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...elp-friends-claim-looking-attention-died.html



Some description of her.




Sounds like histrionic and borderline with narcissism to me.

RSBM

When the 'thanks ' button isn't enough.
This perp is just.... ick. There are other words I won't use here. I feel her friends and relatives are in denial about what she is truly like. Disgusting.
Shades of Jodi Arias, indeed. It's all "about HER".

And what if in years to come she has a husband and/or a child ? What if she wants to "help" them ? The term "Munschausen by Proxy Syndrome" comes to mind.
I do not think she should just be able to walk away from what she has done. This young man had his entire life ahead of him. I wish I could tell him there will be a better day coming. --Unless you're dying from an incurable illness ; there is usually a ray of light somewhere on your horizon. And even for those who are sick and want it to end, leaving this world should be their own choice after counsel with trained professionals and consulting with loved ones if possible.
Not some 'attention w---e'. Just so angry for this Conrad and his loved ones !!
Imo.

Rest gently Conrad.

 

[Cubby]

BBM for focus

I was trying to write a response to this thread last night using nearly these exact same words, but I couldn't get it to come out right.

I may still be unable to do so, but I am going to try.

I don't agree with the thread title either, because IMO no one can "make" another person do anything, except under physical force, which was clearly not the case here.

Michelle might have told Conrad to get back in the truck, but she could not and did not "make" him do it. He did it of his own volition.

My perspective stems from having one of my best friends commit suicide and agonizing over what I woulda/coulda/shoulda done, or not done, to prevent it. All the materials I consulted that were aimed at suicide survivors emphasized that no one can be held responsible for the actions of another.

I won't belabor the point but I doubt anyone can think of a situation in which "But Officer, xyz made me do it" is a valid defense.

Similarly, how many parents here would accept their child trying to excuse bad behavior with "Susie made me do it"? I expect the more typical response would be "If Susie told you to jump off the roof, would you do it?"

I am not minimizing what at this point appears to be Michelle's reprehensible treatment of Conrad in his state of desperation. Whether that treatment equates to legal culpability in his death will be decided in a courtroom, and IMO that's as it should be.

But IMO there's no way she "made" him commit suicide.

I see it a little differently. I'm not sure how to word this also, but let me try. I liken Conrad's situation to someone who is unable to give consent. A minor can not give consent for an illegal relationship. A drunk can't give consent. Conrad was in a state of mind he was unable to make rational decisions for himself and was coached, coerced, encouraged to do so by Michelle.

There are laws protecting vulnerable people. Michelle's behavior was predatory. IANAL, so I'll have to watch and see how this proceeds through the courts, but Michelle's behavior was like that of a vulture and it should not be overlooked because she couldn't make someone do something.

Someone who has never experienced the extreme despair one suffers with depression probably won't understand how the mind works in irrational ways when suffering from mental illness. All she had to do was notify someone who was able to help Conrad and instead she played on his despair.