MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #25 Retrial

[Snoods]

With the way many of the jurors are negatively reacting to Yuri, they are going to lose their freaking minds when Former Trooper Proctor testifies! I can’t wait. I think this being a younger jury definitely helps the defense.

 

[jepop]

I think that the question "And this would have been the moment you dropped him off at the party?" and her answer “Yeah, yeah, it would have had to have been” is in reference to when she could have hit him and why she would even ask herself or out loud, did I hit him?

The 'he didn't look mortally wounded', can mean when she saw him in the snow that morning. That is how I read it before I even heard how Jackson explained it in the opening statement.

I didn't watch opening statements, and I have not watched any of the interviews, other then the small clips they have played between witness testimony. When the trial is over, I will go watch them

That is the way it reads to me too and imo that's the meaning. It's a no brainer isn't it? There's not gotcha moment there. Jmo

 

[Anniesflowers]

This happened at the first trial too. It was as if the defense were doing the CW's job but in reverse and doing it so well ( in reverse) that it was forgotten periodically that the CW owned the burden of proof. Jmo

Is there a way to know how many witnesses the CW has left?

 

[missy1974]

I doubt the defense will be able to find a 'context' clip of Karen saying she meant John didn't look mortally wounded when she found him, buried under snow, as per AJ's explanation.

She was giving him CPR and asking if he was dead.

JMO

I also don't think she fully comprehended that he was bleeding. I remember JMc (I think?) saying that KR at one point that morning after they found John, KR had commented something about wondering if she got her period because of the blood on her hands. Goes along with, she didn't think he was 'mortally wounded', she thought he was dying of hypothermia.

I thought the period thing was odd when it was said and was confused, but now I can understand it. Didn't she also say or think she had her period at the hospital (maybe someone knows this answer so I don't have to go look lol)

JMO

 

[Izzylizzy]

From the horse's mouth, BH testified himself he had no interaction with Karen Read that night. At about 7:40.

IMO:
BH's testimony is a must listen.
So looking forward to hearing from him again.

 

[missy1974]

That is the way it reads to me too and imo that's the meaning. It's a no brainer isn't it? There's not gotcha moment there. Jmo

I think we all tend to pick statements apart ... and I think this case definitely shows how confirmation bias works. People hear what they want to hear, or read what they want to read. JMO

@tara83 keeps pointing it out, and it's my biggest hurdle too... the evidence does not show me so far that he was hit by a car. The CW needs to show me how that is possible. I don't have another explaination for his injuries, but I was swayed by ARCCA during the 1st trial, partially because they did their thing independent of both sides. Can't say I have ever watched a trial with an expert that was not employed/hired by either side initially.

 

[wyome]

I also don't think she fully comprehended that he was bleeding. I remember JMc (I think?) saying that KR at one point that morning after they found John, KR had commented something about wondering if she got her period because of the blood on her hands. Goes along with, she didn't think he was 'mortally wounded', she thought he was dying of hypothermia.

I thought the period thing was odd when it was said and was confused, but now I can understand it. Didn't she also say or think she had her period at the hospital (maybe someone knows this answer so I don't have to go look lol)

JMO

This is a good point. I remember reading if she thought she had her period, asking that to someone.

Not unlike a Lizzie Borden defense.

 

[Izzylizzy]

With the way many of the jurors are negatively reacting to Yuri, they are going to lose their freaking minds when Former Trooper Proctor testifies! I can’t wait. I think this being a younger jury definitely helps the defense.

So far the only things I have heard about the jury is what you said, they're younger and I also heard that there's a retired police officer on the jury.
Attorney Mark Bederow was referring to the retired officer and he's a reliable source.
In many high profile cases there are mini-bios on the jurors but not this one or for Lori Vallow Daybell's last trial.
imo

 

[jepop]

I think we all tend to pick statements apart ... and I think this case definitely shows how confirmation bias works. People hear what they want to hear, or read what they want to read. JMO

@tara83 keeps pointing it out, and it's my biggest hurdle too... the evidence does not show me so far that he was hit by a car. The CW needs to show me how that is possible. I don't have another explaination for his injuries, but I was swayed by ARCCA during the 1st trial, partially because they did their thing independent of both sides. Can't say I have ever watched a trial with an expert that was not employed/hired by either side initially.

I agree, we tend to pick apart statements. However in this instance I think the piece of transcript in question is not open to a relativity analysis on intended meaning. Imo it's not cryptic but logically clear as to meaning. I'll stick to that opinion and own it as my response to the original post implying that this was a gotcha moment for the cw.

As to ARCCA and the non-fit between JO's injuries ( including the dog claw looking deep symmetrical abrasions on JO's right arm ) and the damage to the tail light, and the physics of impact forces and cause and effect in the tail light damage vs no contusions, broken bones and the rest, I 100% agree with you!

 

[Izzylizzy]

I'm real curious after making an arrest how ATF agent Brian Higgins would respond if the suspect/defendant tells him they never made the calls or received the calls that their phone records show to an illegal arms dealer.
lol

 

[New Penny]

There's much speculation that the CW will not be calling Brian Higgins to testify and if not the defense most certainly will.

BH tells AG that he left the Alberts after an hour because they had no whisky and had to drink beer which he doesn't like.
He also told AG that before getting to the Waterfall he had 3-4 drinks at another bar then I gather he was drinking at the Waterfall too?
He left the Alberts to go to the police station where he had an office to do "administration work" and then at later date he added to "move vehicles", driving under the influence too.

Is that not against police policy, working and driving police vehicles under the influence?

BH changed his story on why he went to the police station throughout.


@35:00

I have a sneaking feeling BH carries Jameson’s AT ALL TIMES

 

[nightowl1975]

I'm real curious after making an arrest how ATF agent Brian Higgins would respond if the suspect/defendant tells him they never made the calls or received the calls that their phone records show to an illegal arms dealer.
lol

Likely only Canton Police officers and their trained family members are talented enough to butt dial like what’s seen in this case.

 

[keek]

BH HAS to have pretty bad liver damage, cardiac too. Just reading last nights posts about the drinking, many posts, descriptive, I was sooooooooooo alcohol logged feeling! FLOATING, awfuuuuuul. DRINK, DRINK, DRINK, in all the texts between BH and KR. Just I could never survive it! I mean how much can a body physically take is what I mean, seems daily for sure. I don't mean going out for drinks, I mean all that whisky down the neck sounded all day every day. Diabetes? IMO

 

[K9T2L]

Professor Was Accused of Hitting Cop Boyfriend with Car, Leaving Him to Die. Does New Evidence Exonerate Her?

Karen Read has been charged with second-degree murder, motor vehicle manslaughter and leaving the scene of a collision in the death of her off-duty Boston Police Officer boyfriend John O'Keefe.

people.com

Karen Read has been charged with second-degree murder, motor vehicle manslaughter and leaving the scene of a collision in the January 2022 death of her off-duty Boston Police Officer boyfriend John O'Keefe outside a Canton, Mass., home.

She's pleaded not guilty to the charges.

Leading up to his death, the couple of two years reportedly spent the night drinking and bar hopping with friends before Read, 43, dropped O'Keefe, 46, off at the home of a fellow off-duty police officer for an after-party, PEOPLE previously reported.

Prosecutors say as O'Keefe exited the vehicle, Read allegedly proceeded to make a three-point turn during a winter storm, striking her boyfriend in the process before driving off.

After O'Keefe failed to return home hours later, Read allegedly went looking for him, before finding his body in a snowbank outside the home where she allegedly left him.

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[K9T2L]

As a 19 year veteran of law enforcement , 11 being a K9 handler/trainer and nationally certified instructor, the marks located on his arm , going by the photo and numerous past K9 apprehensions where I/we actually documented like supposed to( see attached pic for comparison) I have little to no doubt that these marks are from a dog, namely, the dog the homeowner Brian suspiciously rehomed immediately afterwords….this pic is from one of my last apprehensions of a burglary suspect we located hiding in brush…notice any similarities??

 

[K9T2L]

As a 19 year veteran of law enforcement , 11 being a K9 handler/trainer and nationally certified instructor, the marks located on his arm , going by the photo and numerous past K9 apprehensions where I/we actually documented like supposed to( see attached pic for comparison) I have little to no doubt that these marks are from a dog, namely, the dog the homeowner Brian suspiciously rehomed immediately afterwords….this pic is from one of my last apprehensions of a burglary suspect we located hiding in brush…notice any similarities??View attachment 585196

As far as the evidence layed out re: DNA testing coming back to “pork or pig” , this is more likely than not from the treat, “pig ear” dog chew, or type of bone the dog had recently and prior to the incident

 

[K9T2L]

.

.

Possible Theory:

When John approached the door to go inside the dog, which had been known to be aggressive and not friendly to “strangers” was either outside or laying on porch and was startled…K9 defense mode kicked in , as most all dog have (commonly known as “prey drive/defense drive”) and he showed aggression towards John which caused John to take off running, slipped fell, hit head and broke drink glass possibly falling on it causing glass to impale parts of face area ( per medical examination evidence) and in a dazed , confused manor stumbled out to yard while trying to run away, shoe (black/white sneaker) came off in the process and unfortunately John , possibly trying to run towards Karen’s vehicle pulling off down the street, fell to his final resting place….

Thoughts??

Either way, that’s one more theory that casts more reasonable doubt on the State of Mass very weak, and horribly investigated case

 

[iamshadow21]

As a 19 year veteran of law enforcement , 11 being a K9 handler/trainer and nationally certified instructor, the marks located on his arm , going by the photo and numerous past K9 apprehensions where I/we actually documented like supposed to( see attached pic for comparison) I have little to no doubt that these marks are from a dog, namely, the dog the homeowner Brian suspiciously rehomed immediately afterwords….this pic is from one of my last apprehensions of a burglary suspect we located hiding in brush…notice any similarities??View attachment 585196

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[Malleeboy]

Maybe we need a separate list of all police failures in this case.
IMHO the police failing have been so consistent and comprehensive, that the Defence ought to be given the presumption that the most favourable reading for the Defence should be applied to all police evidence that has not been properly handled.

Body position not properly recorded
Crime scene not secured
Failure to initially properly search crime scene, then when additional evidence is found, failure at that point to do a thorough search with professional unit, but allow pieces to be discovered over long period.
No proper storage of evidence, blood evidence in solo cups and shopping bags!
SUV not photographed and not stored correctly
Police recuse themselves from interviews due to possible conflict of interest but continue to process evidence and have access to evidence
No proper photos of just above every piece of evidence
Lots of taillight shards collected but no proper chain if custody, no proper evidence logs, locations not recorded.
Shoe bag wrongly labeled, with wrong shoe and location
Garage (sallyport) video mysteriously inverted, and attempting to pass it of as correct.
Failure to collect key witness (all three in the car should have been promptly interviewed) testimony so login after the event.
Failure to take individuals to be interviewed at police station being recorded and not allowed to align accounts
Failure to search house in front of which the victim was found and to which he had been invited to an event.
Material witness (Brian Albert) continues to have access to evidence at Canton PD

Then there is Ex Trooper Proctor, lead investigator
Making lewd comments about defendant
Not recusing himself due to links to deceased and witnesses
Appearing to accept offer of a gift from witness, but instructing it be given to wife.

 

[missy1974]

Possible Theory:

When John approached the door to go inside the dog, which had been known to be aggressive and not friendly to “strangers” was either outside or laying on porch and was startled…K9 defense mode kicked in , as most all dog have (commonly known as “prey drive/defense drive”) and he showed aggression towards John which caused John to take off running, slipped fell, hit head and broke drink glass possibly falling on it causing glass to impale parts of face area ( per medical examination evidence) and in a dazed , confused manor stumbled out to yard while trying to run away, shoe (black/white sneaker) came off in the process and unfortunately John , possibly trying to run towards Karen’s vehicle pulling off down the street, fell to his final resting place….

Thoughts??

Either way, that’s one more theory that casts more reasonable doubt on the State of Mass very weak, and horribly investigated case

Can I get the defintion of theory?

I don't see any explaination that doesn't involve the dog.

Did he startle the dog?
Was the dog protecting someone?

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