MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #34 Retrial

[Odeto BJ]

Att'd example of finished bulkhead door install....from advertising per:

Install a Basement BulkHead Door

How to Install a Basement Bulkhead Door System: Egress is required in building codes and ensures that homes have plenty of exits

extremehowto.com

Offered for information only

 

[mzmarymac]

And look at how that turned out last time. I bet the defense is going to go hard on getting jury instructions that the jury actually understands! No reason for confusion on the instructions.

The defense needs to insure it is made clear that the 3 charges are all independent of one another. We should have had 2 NG verdicts last trial and only been looking at the manslaughter charge at this point.

 

[nightowl1975]

Hos long do we think the jury will deliberate?

I think it’ll either be very, very quick or it’s going to take a while. It’ll depend on if they want to review all of the info presented.

 

[LittleSeaTree]

I'm going to say this. When I heard that a witness called out his kids' birthday, I hadn't had my coffee yet and forgot what planet I was on and for some reason I thought they were talking about a CW witness (thinking maybe I missed all of Rentscher." My first thought was like, honestly can't stand the guy but so what? Let him wish his kid a happy birthday. Not a big deal. Now that I realize it is a defense witness, I still don't care. Such a non-big-deal. Much like the ham sandwich, isn't going to make a

Brennan done with this witness.

Hos long do we think the jury will deliberate?

I keep having a fantasy that they come back after only like two hours with their not guilty verdict. And during those hours, they just had their feet up on the table eating ham sandwiches. A feel good fantasy in this kooky world

(ok, I clearly need help with un-attaching, sorry!)

 

[MerlinFalcon]

I’m still trying to process what Brennan did today. He would have looked so much better saying he had no questions for Dr. Renschler than making all the comments he did. His tone is such a turn off and it sounded like he didn’t know what he was talking about so often over the last two days.

Did I hear Dr. Renschler say he knew about the X-rays when he wrote the report? And if so, when? If that’s the case, seeing the X-rays yesterday wasn’t a surprise to the defence.

 

[missy1974]

Curious what everyone thinks about the decision to not put on a rebuttal. From what I understand, CW had 3 witnesses to bring back, including Welcher, and now none?

Regardless of your leaning on G or NG, what do you think is the strategy? Does Hank feel he has a good enough case not to bring them? Or does he just think it will make bad worse? Serious thoughts, please.

I think that Brennan knows what Welcher would come in and say... after that cross exam today of Dr. R ... Welcher's abilities/competency/report was demolished today (by Brennan's questions AND Dr. R's answers) and he had nothing to gain by calling him again at this point.

As I was watching, I am sure my mouth was open ... couldn't believe the questions, and the answers were even worse for the CW. I am watching LYK right now and my thoughts are being validated. I am interested to hear what Peter thinks about Brennan not brining Welcher back

 

[missy1974]

I’m still trying to process what Brennan did today. He would have looked so much better saying he had no questions for Dr. Renschler than making all the comments he did. His tone is such a turn off and it sounded like he didn’t know what he was talking about so often over the last two days.

Did I hear Dr. Renschler say he knew about the X-rays when he wrote the report? And if so, when? If that’s the case, seeing the X-rays yesterday wasn’t a surprise to the defence.

BBM and made bigger.

YES! He had them for his initial report. That was for the FBI, before the 1st trial.

 

[nightowl1975]

I have to believe that some of the replies I’m seeing here are rage bait. Or CW witnesses just trying to salvage what little remains of their dignity and reputations. Bc I cannot even….

 

[Odeto BJ]

Curious what everyone thinks about the decision to not put on a rebuttal. From what I understand, CW had 3 witnesses to bring back, including Welcher, and now none?

Regardless of your leaning on G or NG, what do you think is the strategy? Does Hank feel he has a good enough case not to bring them? Or does he just think it will make bad worse? Serious thoughts, please.

IMO: Every time HB has asked a defense expert to hypothesize, his question has been predicated on the Lexus hitting JOK. Every one of those witnesses has qualified their answer by stating first: I don't believe there was a collision....and a couple even identified with Welcher and his outer space comment, that pure and rampant supposition can lead to almost any outcome.
So if Brennan can't establish the basic mechanism by which JOK was injured, how can rebuttal witnesses do anything other than argue over maybe 5-seconds, once again? I do not think he can make much of a dent in the testimony of the last 3 experts, all of whom handled cross without yielding much of anything.
Purely from a BARD standpoint, the CW has failed miserably. Injury wise, the CW-ME is not going to help... Their crash reconstructionist was key but overall failed, especially when opposed by or alternatively compared to the ARCCA tandem.
I believe that HB has seen the handwriting, and feels it is now time to take his money and run.

JMO

 

[Tricia]

ANNOUNCEMENT: YEARLY GUARDIAN MEMBERSHIP NOW AVAILABLE​

For less than $ 3 a month, you can become a Websleuths Guardian and help ensure Websleuths continues to operate ad-free and stronger than ever.
Now we have our annual Guardian plan. You pay for l2 months and you get l4 months. For less than l0 cents a day you can keep Websleuths running smoothly with no ads. CLICK HERE to become an annual Guardian.
THANK YOU ALL
Tricia
PS. Please do not discuss on this thread. CLICK HERE if you have questions

 

[TDoc72]

Hos long do we think the jury will deliberate?

Red Sox are playing Friday night, so I’m hoping the jury will be sitting on their couches w/a beer and a clear conscience. #NotGuilty
~~~~
If I were a juror, my first deliberation would be “hos come we had several witnesses saying there was no collision?”

 

[cocomod]

Sounds like Brenner is a deflated balloon with no fire left. Lol!

Nah, he doesn't want Welcher impeached and embarrassed more after seeing a true professional on the stand!

 

[MerlinFalcon]

I haven't been following the case as closely as many of you, and I did not follow the first trial. A friend from that area told me about the case. The friend thought she was not guilty, so I started following it with that in mind. However, I am leaning toward "guilty" for several of the reasons @arielilane listed above. Especially because KR said : "I hit him." Like @mrjitty said, the experts are being paid to testify, so I largely discount that testimony. I believe it was a drunken accident, and she may have convinced herself she didn't hit him. I also don't believe there was a conspiracy by the friends. I think the friends think/know she hit him, and they wanted to make sure that the authorities knew that. I thought Jen McCabe was believable. I say this even though I am disgusted by the drinking culture in that area.

There is also another question I have. I think early in this trial it was testified that KR tried to call her parents at least three times in the hours after she returned to John's house? Has it been testified as to why a 40ish year old woman would call her elderly parents in the wee hours of the night after returning home very drunk after she dropped her boyfriend off at a friend's house? Was she very troubled about something? Maybe she kept thinking, "Did I hit him? I think I may have hit him! Should I go back to see if I hit him? Let me call daddy, he'll tell me what to do!"? Does anyone know anything else about these calls? Or have an opinion as to why she would make them?

Even though I think she's guilty, I am not very invested in the outcome. Certainly, the last three years have been very punishing for her. I think she will get off, or there will be a hung jury.

You should read about it and/or watch some of the testimony on you tube. There are a lot of lawyers and former cops who are enraged by everything that happened in both trials.

As far as Karen calling her parents repeatedly, some people are very close to their parents. She had no idea where John was but knew something bad happened to him because he would have never left his niece home alone. Karen was supposed to go to her home ahead of the snow storm so he knew the niece would be alone so when she woke up and saw he hadn’t returned, she knew it was bad.

Jen McCabe lied repeatedly. She kept saying she made butt calls over and over to John. She also lied about calling her sister just after 5 am even though the records showed she called her and that the call was answered. She lied to the FBI when they came to call and said she was her sister. She told them she had to go into her house to brush her teeth and in that ten minute span made 5 phone calls, including to John’s mother. She told the FBI she made two calls and when her husband told her not to lie to the FBI she called them back and said she made five.

 

[waldojabba]

Hos long do we think the jury will deliberate?

This they get the case Friday they will be beck by the following Friday. JMO

 

[mzmarymac]

Hos long do we think the jury will deliberate?

We won't have a verdict Friday of this week or even Monday of next week. I'd say the verdict will come Wednesday or Thursday.

 

[jepop]

We won't have a verdict Friday of this week or even Monday of next week. I'd say the verdict will come Wednesday or Thursday.

I'll go for midweek next week too. Wednesday. Might change after listening to closing arguments to sooner! I'm so sure AJ will hit it out of the ball park.

 

[waldojabba]

Curious what everyone thinks about the decision to not put on a rebuttal. From what I understand, CW had 3 witnesses to bring back, including Welcher, and now none?

Regardless of your leaning on G or NG, what do you think is the strategy? Does Hank feel he has a good enough case not to bring them? Or does he just think it will make bad worse? Serious thoughts, please.

1 Welcher report was shown to prove absolutely nothing. If he returned to the stand it would be impossible to defend his conclusions. My heart breaks for the 400 k.
2 The pesky issue with the X-rays. Welcher said there were none of the hand or arm for him to review. But those X-rays did exist. Hank just never put them into evidence. It’s a Big mess up/ problem he did not want the jurors to understand
3 Hank knows he proved nothing beyond a reasonable doubt. He appealed to the jurors today indirectly using Dr R. Asking Dr R “wouldn’t you just use your Common Sense”? To me he was asking the jurors to believe what they saw re the tail light fragments etc and conclude Karen hit John - to use their common sense. Only problem is there is not enough to string together to get to that conclusion.
JMO

 

[Odeto BJ]

We won't have a verdict Friday of this week or even Monday of next week. I'd say the verdict will come Wednesday or Thursday.

I'll take Tuesday for 47 pieces of plastic and one sticky hair...

LOL

 

[lohrtabitha]

Holy cow, did they say why?
Welcher took the money and ran?
IMO

In his new Lexus!

 

[Seattle1]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932912722921869442