MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #5

[Rocky1]

Good thought- The street view images in google appear to be from August 2011, though. You would have to find a bell tower with the aerial imagery in google earth (taken aug 23 2016), and since they patch the aerial images together it probably has to be nearby Princeton to have been captured at same time/day

I did find a clock, but, as you say, the image was from 2011, and I wasn't able to focus using the 2016 image.
What I'd like to know is why so many think a torch was used, and how they come to that conclusion?
If you look at the crime scene photos, and the burnt log about 4" in diameter laying horizontal, to me it looks like soot from unburned hydrocarbons. Torches burn clean. I was thinking it was from a wood fire, meaning all the perp needed was a bic lighter to start it. There was plenty of fuel laying around from the wood.

 

[Inthedetails]

I did find a clock, but, as you say, the image was from 2011, and I wasn't able to focus using the 2016 image.
What I'd like to know is why so many think a torch was used, and how they come to that conclusion?
If you look at the crime scene photos, and the burnt log about 4" in diameter laying horizontal, to me it looks like soot from unburned hydrocarbons. Torches burn clean. I was thinking it was from a wood fire, meaning all the perp needed was a bic lighter to start it. There was plenty of fuel laying around from the wood.

I'm thinking it was a lighter, too. No reason I think that other than it seems like a simple answer.

jmo

 

[Kickoff61]

If we are going on the cover up theory: If he was from the area and did this at that location (as people speculate) , then if he spontaneously decided to cover up the DNA left behind from the fight (but didn't have the means to do so), he would then have to return home to get the means. It would then be more likely he takes whatever means back in his vehicle, quicker, avoid scratches and item(s) seen , then it would be to walk or run back on the street.

If people think it is too risky for him to take vehicle back to the scene, that does not seem more risky then trying an abduction, leaving vehicle parked on the side of the road as he does everything, then go back to the vehicle for something he just happens to have to do the cover up and back to her to do that (all the while the vehicle parked there ) for anyone to come along or stop by.

 

[Kickoff61]

I did find a clock, but, as you say, the image was from 2011, and I wasn't able to focus using the 2016 image.
What I'd like to know is why so many think a torch was used, and how they come to that conclusion?
If you look at the crime scene photos, and the burnt log about 4" in diameter laying horizontal, to me it looks like soot from unburned hydrocarbons. Torches burn clean. I was thinking it was from a wood fire, meaning all the perp needed was a bic lighter to start it. There was plenty of fuel laying around from the wood.

I wondered about that too regarding people's idea of a torch. But then again, the person would have to have a lighter (if spontaneously deciding to get rid of DNA after the fight). Not all people do have one. So if the person didn't, they would need access to that or matches , having to get that somewhere just the same.

 

[Rocky1]

I wondered about that too regarding people's idea of a torch. But then again, the person would have to have a lighter (if spontaneously deciding to get rid of DNA after the fight). Not all people do have one. So if the person didn't, they would need access to that or matches , having to get that somewhere just the same.

He could be a smoker, or a pyro.

 

[Kickoff61]

He could be a smoker, or a pyro.

If so, yes, he would probably already have one.

 

[Kickoff61]

Is there room to park hidden , on the path?

 

[ForensicMass]

I'm thinking it was a lighter, too. No reason I think that other than it seems like a simple answer.

jmo

A lighter is definitely the simplest of explanations. What leads me to agree with earlier posters that perhaps a torch was used is that there were circular shaped burns a parent in crime scene photos some vertical distance off the ground. It was surmised that those were test spots, based on the photographs that look to me to be A reasonable assertion. Secondly if a lighter and wood were used, I would expect that the Burns would not be concentrated to target areas of the body. Had fire been made with wood and she been placed in it I would expect the Burns To be more widespread. Finally, a wood fire would certainly have generated a lot more smoke. And earlier poster confirmed that the wind direction was away from BSR at the time, so the smoke may not have been an issue (if it was blowing into the woods). But using a torch would have certainly been more discrete

 

[ForensicMass]

I wondered about that too regarding people's idea of a torch. But then again, the person would have to have a lighter (if spontaneously deciding to get rid of DNA after the fight). Not all people do have one. So if the person didn't, they would need access to that or matches , having to get that somewhere just the same.

Many torches have a built-in igniter and a lighter would not be necessary.

 

[Inthedetails]

A lighter is definitely the simplest of explanations. What leads me to agree with earlier posters that perhaps a torch was used is that there were circular shaped burns a parent in crime scene photos some vertical distance off the ground. It was surmised that those were test spots, based on the photographs that look to me to be A reasonable assertion. Secondly if a lighter and wood were used, I would expect that the Burns would not be concentrated to target areas of the body. Had fire been made with wood and she been placed in it I would expect the Burns To be more widespread. Finally, a wood fire would certainly have generated a lot more smoke. And earlier poster confirmed that the wind direction was away from BSR at the time, so the smoke may not have been an issue (if it was blowing into the woods). But using a torch would have certainly been more discrete

We don't know the extent of burns on her body. They could be small, for all we know, and for torture rather than evidence covering. They could be cigarette burns or something more extensive. We simply do not know.

I know there are photographs that look like burned wood, but again, we don't really know.

I'm thinking it was something small like a lighter because of ease (it's a common item for people to have handy) and because it wouldn't cause smoke or attention from anyone who might be nearby.

Total speculation. JMOpinion.

 

[Kickoff61]

Many torches have a built-in igniter and a lighter would not be necessary.

Right. I was responding to Rocky bringing up use of a lighter being used and so I was saying, if so, the person would have to have the lighter on hand or have to get one.

 

[Kickoff61]

We don't know the extent of burns on her body. They could be small, for all we know, and for torture rather than evidence covering. They could be cigarette burns or something more extensive. We simply do not know.

I know there are photographs that look like burned wood, but again, we don't really know.

I'm thinking it was something small like a lighter because of ease (it's a common item for people to have handy) and because it wouldn't cause smoke or attention from anyone who might be nearby.

Total speculation. JMOpinion.

You are right. We don't know. Most of the information on this case is unknown which is why there is widespread speculation. All speculation, lack of facts.

In my opinion over all , it does not appear to be an amateur and it does not appear sloppy as people say. I think it is very calculated and any sloppy appearance could be from his plans being disrupted with her unexpected level of fighting.

 

[Inthedetails]

You are right. We don't know. Most of the information on this case is unknown which is why there is widespread speculation. All speculation, lack of facts.

In my opinion over all , it does not appear to be an amateur and it does not appear sloppy as people say. I think it is very calculated and any sloppy appearance could be from his plans being disrupted with her unexpected level of fighting.

Is that particular spot on the path used by teens or others as a fire pit, hang-out area? I'm thinking it isn't, but worth asking.

Perhaps the fire idea came as an afterthought, after seeing that the area was used for fires in the past??

Just brainstorming, nothing more....

 

[Kickoff61]

Is that particular spot on the path used by teens or others as a fire pit, hang-out area? I'm thinking it isn't, but worth asking.

Perhaps the fire idea came as an afterthought, after seeing that the area was used for fires in the past??

Just brainstorming, nothing more....

Good question. I don't know? Some locals come in here who may know.

 

[Mountain man]

Is that particular spot on the path used by teens or others as a fire pit, hang-out area? I'm thinking it isn't, but worth asking.

Perhaps the fire idea came as an afterthought, after seeing that the area was used for fires in the past??

Just brainstorming, nothing more....

No I don't believe that is the case. There are WAY more secret, discreet places in town than this spot. It was asked before if you could get a car into the area and yes you could.

 

[Kickoff61]

No I don't believe that is the case. There are WAY more secret, discreet places in town than this spot. It was asked before if you could get a car into the area and yes you could.

Ok Thanks Mountain Man

 

[Rocky1]

Is there room to park hidden , on the path?

No. You can get off the path some but not hide. The path gets rough the further back you go.

 

[Kickoff61]

No. You can get off the path some but not hide. The path gets rough the further back you go.

Ok. So it would still be seen, if pulled in.

 

[ForensicMass]

We don't know the extent of burns on her body. They could be small, for all we know, and for torture rather than evidence covering. They could be cigarette burns or something more extensive. We simply do not know.

I know there are photographs that look like burned wood, but again, we don't really know.

I'm thinking it was something small like a lighter because of ease (it's a common item for people to have handy) and because it wouldn't cause smoke or attention from anyone who might be nearby.

Total speculation. JMOpinion.

It would seem odd to me to take a lighter directly to someone's face, only because of the small flame. The burns on the vertical tree were fairly apparent in close up photos back in the first or second thread. They couldn't have been made with a lighter. I definitely agree that a lighter would be the simplest answer, but those burns just don't appear to fit. As far as the burns on her body, you're correct, we really don't have any definitive information. But the photo of the circular type burns on the tree are at least somewhat indicative of something else being used. If a lighter was used to start a fire at ground level, Burns should emanate from that point and taper up the tree. But the burns in the photo are clearly "floating" and circular. Having been a scout, and lighting my own share of fires, always with matches or a lighter, those burns look odd to me.

 

[Inthedetails]

Ok. So it would still be seen, if pulled in.

If a vehicle could pull in but still be seen, I'm starting to consider that she was harmed/killed elsewhere and then dropped off near where he grabbed her. (Why he didn't dump her far away is a puzzle, but he obviously didn't. Sorta seems like he wanted her found, doesn't it?)

IDK.

jmopinion at the moment.