MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #5

[ForensicMass]

Are you so concerned about the store because you know someone who was there at that time? You mentioned working in Princeton. So , clearly you know people there and/or in the surrounding area. (and have been to the store).

I've been to the store probably every single day I've ever worked in town, since I don't pack lunch and I try to avoid eating pizza (only other option in town). My concern is that when I am in town, it's all very quiet. Not much at all going on ever. Except at the store. There are always people coming and going. It is without a doubt the busiest 1,000 square feet in the town. I'm sure every local has been in there, and most people who pass through or are there infrequently, like me, have also been there. The liklihood that the killer has been there seems incredibly high. And the fact that VANESSA was likely there just before the murder is no coincidence, in my mind. I used to know the people who owned that store - a guy and his wife. She used to be there whenever I was there, but then had a child and I didn't see her much thereafter. He was a jack of all trades and an entrepreneur with several businesses going on. For some reason though I think they had sold the place a while ago. Can anyone see if it has changed hands in the last few years?

 

[ForensicMass]

One more thing.
If this was someone that did see her at the store, that doesn't narrow it down to a local. It was a Sunday, and I am sure a lot of people that stopped at that store that day were from out of town, having the time, not driving straight to work etc.

Totally agree. It could be a local or an outsider seeing her at the store. I do believe The person was there. So the question is who else was at the store.

 

[Kickoff61]

I've been to the store probably every single day I've ever worked in town, since I don't pack lunch and I try to avoid eating pizza (only other option in town). My concern is that when I am in town, it's all very quiet. Not much at all going on ever. Except at the store. There are always people coming and going. It is without a doubt the busiest 1,000 square feet in the town. I'm sure every local has been in there, and most people who pass through or are there infrequently, like me, have also been there. The liklihood that the killer has been there seems incredibly high. And the fact that VANESSA was likely there just before the murder is no coincidence, in my mind. I used to know the people who owned that store - a guy and his wife. She used to be there whenever I was there, but then had a child and I didn't see her much thereafter. He was a jack of all trades and an entrepreneur with several businesses going on. For some reason though I think they had sold the place a while ago. Can anyone see if it has changed hands in the last few years?

You do Scientist work in Princeton?

 

[ForensicMass]

You do Scientist work in Princeton?

Yes that is correct. My educational background is in chemistry and toxicology.

 

[Kickoff61]

Interesting. I didn't think there was industry in rural Princeton?

 

[ForensicMass]

Interesting. I didn't think there was industry in rural Princeton?

You're absolutely correct in that assumption as well. I don't know of any industry there off the top of my head. There is definitely nothing right in the "downtown" area. I am a consultant hired by the town to deal with various environmental issues.

 

[Kickoff61]

You're absolutely correct in that assumption as well. I don't know of any industry there off the top of my head. There is definitely nothing right in the "downtown" area. I am a consultant hired by the town to deal with various environmental issues.

Oh I see.

 

[ForensicMass]

Oh I see.

I've been working in Princeton periodically for a period of about 10 years now. I work in a lot of rural communities around Massachusetts New Hampshire and Vermont ( as well as in the larger cities of course). I've been in just about every small town general store or coffee shop in the entire state of Massachusetts at one time or another. I have to say that Princeton is easily one of the quietest places in the state. There are very few unkept properties. Overall it certainly appears to be upper-middle-class when you are there. In general nothing happens there Except for near that store. The overall level of activity there far exceeds any other place in town. There are a couple of picnic tables out in the front and in the summer it is not unusual to see a couple of younger kids hanging around. And granted my guard has never been up when I have been there and I have never been on the lookout for suspicious characters but I have to say that I can never recall seeing anyone obviously out of the ordinary.

 

[Kickoff61]

I've been working in Princeton periodically for a period of about 10 years now. I work in a lot of rural communities around Massachusetts New Hampshire and Vermont ( as well as in the larger cities of course). I've been in just about every small town general store or coffee shop in the entire state of Massachusetts at one time or another. I have to say that Princeton is easily one of the quietest places in the state. There are very few unkept properties. Overall it certainly appears to be upper-middle-class when you are there. In general nothing happens there Except for near that store. The overall level of activity there far exceeds any other place in town. There are a couple of picnic tables out in the front and in the summer it is not unusual to see a couple of younger kids hanging around. And granted my guard has never been up when I have been there and I have never been on the lookout for suspicious characters but I have to say that I can never recall seeing anyone obviously out of the ordinary.

Well it sounds like you know the state well and have traveled a lot.

 

[ForensicMass]

Well it sounds like you know the state well and have traveled a lot.

Let's take the angle that this was done by a local person living in the five town area or nearby.

populations of the neighboring towns are as follows:
Paxton Princeton Hubbardston all around 4000 people each

Sterling, Westminster, rutland all around 8000 each

Holden approximately 18,000

How close do you all consider to be "local "?.

For those who think for sure it was a local approximately how close do you think he had to have lived to know about this obscure cart path in Princeton ?

Let's see what kind of hypotheticals we can generate about this guy

 

[Inthedetails]

Let's take the angle that this was done by a local person living in the five town area or nearby.

populations of the neighboring towns are as follows:
Paxton Princeton Hubbardston all around 4000 people each

Sterling, Westminster, rutland all around 8000 each

Holden approximately 18,000

How close do you all consider to be "local "?.

For those who think for sure it was a local approximately how close do you think he had to have lived to know about this obscure cart path in Princeton ?

Let's see what kind of hypotheticals we can generate about this guy

I don't think he needed to be local-local. Perhaps someone with a job that involves driving around.

jmo

 

[ForensicMass]

I don't think he needed to be local-local. Perhaps someone with a job that involves driving around.

jmo

OK but would somebody who is just driving around the area know about the location of the cart path ? I could be misunderstanding everyone but I think that a large part of the basis of thinking that it was someone local is that he is believed to have known about the cart path.

So you're thinking not necessarily Princeton but perhaps within 10 miles? 20 miles?

 

[Rocky1]

Let's take the angle that this was done by a local person living in the five town area or nearby.

populations of the neighboring towns are as follows:
Paxton Princeton Hubbardston all around 4000 people each

Sterling, Westminster, rutland all around 8000 each

Holden approximately 18,000

How close do you all consider to be "local "?.

For those who think for sure it was a local approximately how close do you think he had to have lived to know about this obscure cart path in Princeton ?

Let's see what kind of hypotheticals we can generate about this guy

I am going to say so local that he was able to lurk, and see her during her run.
I can't get the Bicycle theory out of my mind, so, I won't say he lived along the route that she jogged on, per say, but close enough where he pedaled that road often.
I'd still love for anyone to come up with a reason why the bicycle theory doesn't work, so I can expand my thinking. I have posted reasons why I think him being on foot didn't happen, and the car theory, but I can't for the bicycle theory.

 

[Kickoff61]

OK but would somebody who is just driving around the area know about the location of the cart path ? I could be misunderstanding everyone but I think that a large part of the basis of thinking that it was someone local is that he is believed to have known about the cart path.

So you're thinking not necessarily Princeton but perhaps within 10 miles? 20 miles?

??? Confused here. You were the one saying it was someone driving around from out of town that attempted to abduct her at the cart path?

 

[Inthedetails]

OK but would somebody who is just driving around the area know about the location of the cart path ? I could be misunderstanding everyone but I think that a large part of the basis of thinking that it was someone local is that he is believed to have known about the cart path.

So you're thinking not necessarily Princeton but perhaps within 10 miles? 20 miles?

I don't think the cart path was as obscure as others think it is. I think someone who is used to looking for such paths (to pull off for a lunch break, take a hike, urinate, etc) would not find it that difficult to spot. There was a guard rail that ended where there would be access off the road to reach the location where she was found, giving a good hint there was some sort of path. It wasn't invisible to someone who either was familiar with the stretch of road and/or someone who is observant beyond looking only at the pavement.

I would guess within 20 miles seems reasonable, but that's truly a guess. I'm thinking if you had a job that involved driving, you still would live within, well, driving distance.

JMOPINION

 

[DeDee]

I've been to the store probably every single day I've ever worked in town, since I don't pack lunch and I try to avoid eating pizza (only other option in town). My concern is that when I am in town, it's all very quiet. Not much at all going on ever. Except at the store. There are always people coming and going. It is without a doubt the busiest 1,000 square feet in the town. I'm sure every local has been in there, and most people who pass through or are there infrequently, like me, have also been there. The liklihood that the killer has been there seems incredibly high. And the fact that VANESSA was likely there just before the murder is no coincidence, in my mind. I used to know the people who owned that store - a guy and his wife. She used to be there whenever I was there, but then had a child and I didn't see her much thereafter. He was a jack of all trades and an entrepreneur with several businesses going on. For some reason though I think they had sold the place a while ago. Can anyone see if it has changed hands in the last few years?

First Name: Stephen
Middle Name: P.
Last Name: Zottoli
Full Name: Stephen P. Zottoli
Title: President
Address: Worcester Road
Princeton, MA
Company Name: Mountain Barn, Inc.
Principal Address: Po Box 115 174 Worcester Rd.
Princeton, MA 01541


Mountain Barn, Inc. is a Massachusetts Domestic Profit Corporation filed on January 2, 1998 . The company's File Number is listed as 043403087.

The Registered Agent on file for this company is Phillips S. Davis and is located at 370 Main Street Suite 1200, Worcester, MA 01608. The company's principal address is Po Box 115 174 Worcester Rd., Princeton, MA 01541.

The company has 2 principals on record. The principals are Phillips S. Davis from Worcester MA and Stephen P. Zottoli from Princeton MA.

https://www.bizapedia.com/people/massachusetts/princeton/stephen-zottoli.html
https://www.bizapedia.com/ma/mountain-barn-inc.html

 

[ForensicMass]

I am going to say so local that he was able to lurk, and see her during her run.
I can't get the Bicycle theory out of my mind, so, I won't say he lived along the route that she jogged on, per say, but close enough where he pedaled that road often.
I'd still love for anyone to come up with a reason why the bicycle theory doesn't work, so I can expand my thinking. I have posted reasons why I think him being on foot didn't happen, and the car theory, but I can't for the bicycle theory.

As we talked earlier, I never see any casual bike riders. Only the pro looking type with spandex and gear. And I never see one of them with a backpack, which I think this guy had if he didn't have a vehicle. Given all the stuff VANESSA was missing and the possibility of equipment to commit the crime.

One thing I like about the bike or foot theory is the willingness to assume that she was not transported back there from somewhere else. If we accept that in this case, I wish we could also accept it in the case of a vehicle. I do not believe she was relocated beyond perhaps the immediate side of BSR.

 

[Rocky1]

I don't think the cart path was as obscure as others think it is. I think someone who is used to looking for such paths (to pull off for a lunch break, take a hike, urinate, etc) would not find it that difficult to spot. There was a guard rail that ended where there would be access off the road to reach the location where she was found, giving a good hint there was some sort of path. It wasn't invisible to someone who either was familiar with the stretch of road and/or someone who is observant beyond looking only at the pavement.

I would guess within 20 seems reasonable, but that's truly a guess. I'm thinking if you had a job that involved driving, you still would live within, well, driving distance.

JMOPINION

Actually,having traveled that road quite often,during this summer, that path is rather hard to see untill you are almost 90 degrees to it.It looks a lot more open on Google maps. No place to hike really, and not like there is a pond, or scenery to take a lunch break on. A place to urinate, yes, if you were on foot, or on a bike.

 

[ForensicMass]

First Name: Stephen
Middle Name: P.
Last Name: Zottoli
Full Name: Stephen P. Zottoli
Title: President
Address: Worcester Road
Princeton, MA
Company Name: Mountain Barn, Inc.
Principal Address: Po Box 115 174 Worcester Rd.
Princeton, MA 01541


Mountain Barn, Inc. is a Massachusetts Domestic Profit Corporation filed on January 2, 1998 . The company's File Number is listed as 043403087.

The Registered Agent on file for this company is Phillips S. Davis and is located at 370 Main Street Suite 1200, Worcester, MA 01608. The company's principal address is Po Box 115 174 Worcester Rd., Princeton, MA 01541.

The company has 2 principals on record. The principals are Phillips S. Davis from Worcester MA and Stephen P. Zottoli from Princeton MA.

https://www.bizapedia.com/people/massachusetts/princeton/stephen-zottoli.html
https://www.bizapedia.com/ma/mountain-barn-inc.html

That is good information and could be helpful, The mountain barn restaurant is not the same as the mountain side market store where she was believed to have been. mountainside market is on Hubbardston road


Everything is called Mountain this and mountain that over there, it does get a little bit confusing

 

[Mountain man]

First Name: Stephen
Middle Name: P.
Last Name: Zottoli
Full Name: Stephen P. Zottoli
Title: President
Address: Worcester Road
Princeton, MA
Company Name: Mountain Barn, Inc.
Principal Address: Po Box 115 174 Worcester Rd.
Princeton, MA 01541


Mountain Barn, Inc. is a Massachusetts Domestic Profit Corporation filed on January 2, 1998 . The company's File Number is listed as 043403087.

The Registered Agent on file for this company is Phillips S. Davis and is located at 370 Main Street Suite 1200, Worcester, MA 01608. The company's principal address is Po Box 115 174 Worcester Rd., Princeton, MA 01541.

The company has 2 principals on record. The principals are Phillips S. Davis from Worcester MA and Stephen P. Zottoli from Princeton MA.

https://www.bizapedia.com/people/massachusetts/princeton/stephen-zottoli.html
https://www.bizapedia.com/ma/mountain-barn-inc.html

This is ownership information on the Mountain Barn not the market in question. Yes the ownership of the market changed hands in recent years.