Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread #27

[Veidt]

But according to the news, this guys phone also placed him near the apartment at the 'critical' time. This is why he was looked at, in the first place.

With criminal past he would be an obvious point of investigation. In any country and in any case.

BBM. Obviously. Which is why I think he's being looked at all.

IMO his presence at the club could be due to any number of reasons. Maybe he went there to seek a job, to meet up with former colleagues, to drop off or pick up something related to his time there like paperwork or a CV. We don't really know. In a more far-flung way, maybe he could even have been there earlier and left his phone behind.

Someone suggested he could be related to the robberies taking place around that time. I don't discard that possibility and if he was, maybe he was there to scout the area but between stealing objects to kidnapping a child there's still a big difference.

I tend to think less of disgruntled employee seeking revenge to ex employee who had knowledge of access and area who just might have been inclined to either kidnap or worse

There are people out there who do take kids unfortunately what the motivation is highly complex - they take amazing risks once they get going

Snipped. I think that yes maybe a former or even current (at the time at least) employee could have done it, not out of spite but because they could. In this scenario however, it could have been anyone who was employed by the club that year or up to a couple of years before the kidnapping.

We know that And a lady cook plus the maintenance man who came to fix the McCanns blinds also have the same surname.

As someone else has also pointed out already... it's a very common last name. Unless the cook and the maintenance man are also Cape Verdian I doubt they're related.

ESPECIALLY after he had lost his job appparantly a YEAR before the child went missing, and had been working since then....

Its like being in a pink spinning washing machine i get vertigo as it is lol.

Do you have a source for the fact that he lost his job in 2006? I've asked before and I'd like to know. I'm not trying to be snarky or dismiss your posts, I really do want to know.

 

[gord]

I googled Robert Black because I had no clue who he was. This guy was a pedophile. He would kidnap and rape the girls. We don't know anything about this suspect except that he allegedly had a criminal record for robbery (?)

absolutely - I am certainly not saying that this guy is another Robert Black - I was just making the point that unfortunately in our society there are people like him ( rare thank God )

Hence if we are looking at a lone abductor - you don't have to look for complicated motives of disgruntled employee etc

The person (s ) unknown could just be plain evil

anyway all speculation etc

 

[haden]

Funny enough so does the new PJ cop lol...her name is Helena Monteiro I wonder if she is a distant relative....

Its such a common name.

Like Smith in the UK.

I know, I've seen that before I posted. And also Portuguese attorney-general Fernando Jose Pinto Monteiro, who shelved the case the first time.

Still, the couples often both worked in OC.. it came to attention when the staff lost their jobs..and they blamed Madeleine's case for it.

And I just was curious if this was the case for this guy(s) too?

But now in another new portuguese article the 'widow' is mentioned as 'girlfriend' so she wouldn't have his surname, I guess..

 

[~n/t~]

I know, I've seen that before I posted. And also Portuguese attorney-general Fernando Jose Pinto Monteiro, who shelved the case the first time.

Still, the couples often both worked in OC.. it came to attention when the staff lost their jobs..and they blamed Madeleine's case for it.

And I just was curious if this was the case for this guy(s) too?

But now in another new portuguese article the 'widow' is mentioned as 'girlfriend' so she wouldn't have his surname, I guess..

What couples? If he lost his job after Madeleines case then I'm confused by your post.

 

[~n/t~]

absolutely - I am certainly not saying that this guy is another Robert Black - I was just making the point that unfortunately in our society there are people like him ( rare thank God )

Hence if we are looking at a lone abductor - you don't have to look for complicated motives of disgruntled employee etc

The person (s ) unknown could just be plain evil

anyway all speculation etc

Agree. However, I believe statistics will show that there are more children murdered by someone close to them than a stranger.

 

[~n/t~]

Just a FYI. If there are ***** in the link we are not allowed to post the article.

 

[goldengirl57]

BBM. Obviously. Which is why I think he's being looked at all.

IMO his presence at the club could be due to any number of reasons. Maybe he went there to seek a job, to meet up with former colleagues, to drop off or pick up something related to his time there like paperwork or a CV. We don't really know. In a more far-flung way, maybe he could even have been there earlier and left his phone behind.

Someone suggested he could be related to the robberies taking place around that time. I don't discard that possibility and if he was, maybe he was there to scout the area but between stealing objects to kidnapping a child there's still a big difference.



Snipped. I think that yes maybe a former or even current (at the time at least) employee could have done it, not out of spite but because they could. In this scenario however, it could have been anyone who was employed by the club that year or up to a couple of years before the kidnapping.



As someone else has also pointed out already... it's a very common last name. Unless the cook and the maintenance man are also Cape Verdian I doubt they're related.



Do you have a source for the fact that he lost his job in 2006? I've asked before and I'd like to know. I'm not trying to be snarky or dismiss your posts, I really do want to know.

Thats a perfectly good request, i will go and see if i can find it again. I think it came from the brother of the widow, said he had left in 2006 nearly a year before the child went missing and had been in employment since.

I will see what I can do.

 

[haden]

What couples? If he lost his job after Madeleines case then I'm confused by your post.

I never said he lost his job after the case. I said, there was a news video on BBC I think at some point a year of something after Madeleine went missing when they interviewed people of PDL and it was said that many people lost their jobs AFTER the case, the jobs from OC, and that many couples would both work there, so they both lost their jobs.
Nothing to do with this guy, just the explanation why I am wondering whether his wife also worked there..

 

[goldengirl57]

If true I hope she does sue. What evidence besides being a disgruntled employee and aggressive personality do they have? Like Murat I think this guy is another scapegoat.

Yes i know in the article this morning they had to mention Murat didnt they lol.

This poor guy going about his business is killed by a tractor accident, and now he is a pedophlie, killer, mass burglar, so on and so forth.

He cant deny any of it can he, so an easy person to target.

I cannot for the life of me understand how come the PJ said they were doing all the secretly and yet we know more then they do.

They couldnt get Hewlett for it, now they have conveniently found another dead patsy.

Surely they would have known he had used his phone in PDL on the 3rd May etc....

ALSO it was talked about before with ex employee seeking revenge when somone emailed Prince Charles.

Everyone is just concentrating on all this now lol.

So he did a burglary years ago when he was young, he was pardoned and was allowed into Portugal and lived a life of working for his family.

Now he is a wanted killer..........because his mobile phone pinged in PDL 15 minutes away from his house.

 

[~n/t~]

I never said he lost his job after the case. I said, there was a news video on BBC I think at some point a year of something after Madeleine went missing when they interviewed people of PDL and it was said that many people lost their jobs AFTER the case, the jobs from OC, and that many couples would both work there, so they both lost their jobs.
Nothing to do with this guy, just the explanation why I am wondering whether his wife also worked there..

Well in your post you said this guy (s). So who are you referring to?

 

[Estelle]

What couples? If he lost his job after Madeleines case then I'm confused by your post.

He lost this job in 2006. One of the UK tabloids reported this so he was not on the list of Ocean Club employees at the time so the PJ have been asked to check him out.

Since when does a thief turn into a pedophile at age 36yo? It begins before that. If he was a thief he would have done it for money and left a ransom note. He did not do that so if the motive was not money, it is unlikely it was sex. Revenge does not make sense as it was up to a year ago when he lost his job probably at the end of the tourist season. I do not believe he was a disgruntled employee, or a late developer as a pedophile. At most he stole something so why didn't he steal from the apartment? Nothing was stolen. If he still steals, he steals for money not children.

IMO This man is innocent or at worst, he agreed to hide the body for the McCanns and was killed when he threatened to report them as they had failed to pay him enough hush money.

Why are the media so intent on vilifying this man and even naming him? IMO this is illegal. The McCanns have ruined so many lives already. This is disgusting and needs to stop.

 

[Estelle]

yes i know in the article this morning they had to mention murat didnt they lol.

This poor guy going about his business is killed by a tractor accident, and now he is a pedophlie, killer, mass burglar, so on and so forth.

He cant deny any of it can he, so an easy person to target.

I cannot for the life of me understand how come the pj said they were doing all the secretly and yet we know more then they do.

They couldnt get hewlett for it, now they have conveniently found another dead patsy.

Surely they would have known he had used his phone in pdl on the 3rd may etc....

Also it was talked about before with ex employee seeking revenge when somone emailed prince charles.

Everyone is just concentrating on all this now lol.

So he did a burglary years ago when he was young, he was pardoned and was allowed into portugal and lived a life of working for his family.

Now he is a wanted killer..........because his mobile phone pinged in pdl 15 minutes away from his house.

how can the media get away with this?

 

[haden]

Well in your post you said this guy (s). So who are you referring to?

The tractor guy and the maintenance guy.
I was curious if any of these two were the husband of the cook lady who was ill the day after the abduction.

Because the police has recently requestioned the maintenance guy and now there is the story about the tractor guy.

I am wondering if the police is making any connection between them due to the same surname? That's all.

 

[Estelle]

New article in the Daily Mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...suspect-revealed-violent-past-police-say.html

This bit is interesting!

A police source told weekly Portuguese newspaper 'O Crime' today that the theory of the ex-Ocean Club worker's involvement in Madeleine's disappearance was ‘worthy of note’.But insisting nothing had been discounted, he added: ‘All leads, including those the British least like, are being considered.

 

[Veidt]

I agree with what people are saying, it seems a bit of a stretch to blame this guy. Should he be looked into just like everyone else who had any connection to the OC? Why not... but to straight out blame him seems like a huge leap.

For all we know he led a completely normal life after his former crime (stealing). Even if he had gone back to his former habits even risking getting kicked out of Portugal, thieves and pedophiles are not the same. I have to agree with Estelle, people who kidnap children for money leave notes or ask for ransoms in some way. It seems like a big assumption to take someone who had one pardoned crime for stealing and turn that into someone who was a pedophile who kidnapped children.

Even the theory that someone broke in to steal and then stole Maddie to silence her makes no sense to me.

- It would have been a bigger risk to kidnap a child. Imagine Maddie briefly woke up and saw an intruder? Far easier for him (or her) to cut his losses, calm down a drowsy child, and get the hell out. A sleepy kid in a room that was presumably dark is not a very reliable witness to begin with.

- Nothing was stolen. Unless the thief was aiming for the TV or something large it sounds very unlikely he or she would take Madeleine to silence her... and then leave behind whatever else they broke in for. No expensive items out of place, either.

- Kidnapping Maddie would take more time and effort than just jumping out of the window and out of there.

- Being caught kidnapping or after kidnapping a child carries a much heavier penalty than being caught for stealing.

 

[goldengirl57]

ok CAN we discuss the pyjamas the creche mans child was supposed to be wearing on the 3rd May. We are to believe that SY have just received this information and the articles of clothing the child was wearing including what looks like an old nappy lining or thin blanket.

The items look DIRTY to me as though they had been worn.

Would you really still have these articles after SIX years?

Seems very odd the guy could go to them and have them photographed.

OR could the articlesh have been shown to the PJ at the time and photographed then and the sighting dismissed....

After all we dont know when the photo was taken.

Is it logical to have these items still, and they really look dirty to me as though they have been worn for a few days.

 

[goldengirl57]

Estelle regarding article in Daily Mail yes i read that, its all smoke and mirrors again isnt it.

 

[~n/t~]

He lost this job in 2006. One of the UK tabloids reported this so he was not on the list of Ocean Club employees at the time so the PJ have been asked to check him out.

Since when does a thief turn into a pedophile at age 36yo? It begins before that. If he was a thief he would have done it for money and left a ransom note. He did not do that so if the motive was not money, it is unlikely it was sex. Revenge does not make sense as it was up to a year ago when he lost his job probably at the end of the tourist season. I do not believe he was a disgruntled employee, or a late developer as a pedophile. At most he stole something so why didn't he steal from the apartment? Nothing was stolen. If he still steals, he steals for money not children.

IMO This man is innocent or at worst, he agreed to hide the body for the McCanns and was killed when he threatened to report them as they had failed to pay him enough hush money.

Why are the media so intent on vilifying this man and even naming him? IMO this is illegal. The McCanns have ruined so many lives already. This is disgusting and needs to stop.

I wouldn't blame the McCanns in this case. I don't think they believe this is the guy either. Anyway that is my impression from reading their statement through their spokesperson.

 

[~n/t~]

ok CAN we discuss the pyjamas the creche mans child was supposed to be wearing on the 3rd May. We are to believe that SY have just received this information and the articles of clothing the child was wearing including what looks like an old nappy lining or thin blanket.

The items look DIRTY to me as though they had been worn.

Would you really still have these articles after SIX years?

Seems very odd the guy could go to them and have them photographed.

OR could the articlesh have been shown to the PJ at the time and photographed then and the sighting dismissed....

After all we dont know when the photo was taken.

Is it logical to have these items still, and they really look dirty to me as though they have been worn for a few days.

Maybe PJ had them in evidence and did testing on them. The dark spots might be forensic analysis done on them? Just guessing.

 

[haden]

I agree with what people are saying, it seems a bit of a stretch to blame this guy. Should he be looked into just like everyone else who had any connection to the OC? Why not... but to straight out blame him seems like a huge leap.

For all we know he led a completely normal life after his former crime (stealing). Even if he had gone back to his former habits even risking getting kicked out of Portugal, thieves and pedophiles are not the same. I have to agree with Estelle, people who kidnap children for money leave notes or ask for ransoms in some way. It seems like a big assumption to take someone who had one pardoned crime for stealing and turn that into someone who was a pedophile who kidnapped children.

Even the theory that someone broke in to steal and then stole Maddie to silence her makes no sense to me.

- It would have been a bigger risk to kidnap a child. Imagine Maddie briefly woke up and saw an intruder? Far easier for him (or her) to cut his losses, calm down a drowsy child, and get the hell out. A sleepy kid in a room that was presumably dark is not a very reliable witness to begin with.

- Nothing was stolen. Unless the thief was aiming for the TV or something large it sounds very unlikely he or she would take Madeleine to silence her... and then leave behind whatever else they broke in for. No expensive items out of place, either.

- Kidnapping Maddie would take more time and effort than just jumping out of the window and out of there.

- Being caught kidnapping or after kidnapping a child carries a much heavier penalty than being caught for stealing.

I agree with you.. you cannot really accuse anyone this way, especially if they are dead and cannot speak for themselves.

But since his phone was in the area at critical times, he should be investigated. Fully.
I wonder if the police can get his other phone records after 6 years has passed, not sure what the phone companies are obliged to do with the data in EU and for how long.