Just jumping in here quickly about the bruises on leonor Cipriano's face, if she received such a beating to cause those black eyes, wouldnt there be more trauma markings to her nose. I agree with Tony in that those black eyes could be made by a great makeup artiste, I dont know much about that case, were there any witnesses to her assault. I think if the LE officer did this to Leonors then his involvement in Madelaines disappearance could be subject to an inquiry. JMO.
Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread No. 23
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Tony Bennett
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Here is more on the case against Leonor Cipriano, written by a young Portuguese woman, Joana Morais, who has for no personal gain but for reasons of strong conviction, maintained an informative blog on the Madeleine McCann case, bringing to light many Portuguese sources of information.
Here's her 'take' on Amaral and the Cipriano case.
I've lightly edited it for three reasons:
1) to reduce the length
2) to remove the most sensitive and frankly depraved, stomach-churning and wicked parts of the evidence, and
3) in places, to slightly improve still further Joana's already excellent English:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
QUOTE FROM JOANA MORAIS' BLOGSPOT:
Introduction
As some of you are aware, Gonçalo Amaral keeps being smeared in the British Media over Joana Ciprano's Mother- Leonor Cipriano, who is in jail after killing her 8 year old daughter. On the other day I tried to explain to a poster in a Forum, my views on the Joana Cipriano case and why did the British media keep misinforming the public not telling the full story, and used Leonor Cipriano, a monstrous infanticider, to attack and undermine the PJ's credibility.
Here is that story, not suitable for sensitive readers, for a better understanding of the PJ in the Madeleine McCann and Joana Cipriano cases, and regarding the smears against Gonçalo Amaral - in effect, my answer to the poster who said she didn't trust Amaral:
Questions
"Do you know Mr. Amaral personally? Or are you judging him from what you read the British tabloids- a.k.a. gutter press a.k.a. McCanns’ media? What do you know about him, the Judiciary Police or the system of justice in Portugal?
Amaral's Book
I’ll give you my opinion regarding the book ‘The Truth about the Lie’ – ‘Verdade da Mentira’.
It is going to explain the whole lie that was created and to put in question the institutions that investigated and that are connected to the case.
Changes to the Portuguese Judicial Sytem
The fact is that the Judiciary Police Organic (Structural) Law took almost 2 years to be promulgated, after it was approved at the “Concelho de Ministros” - ‘Council of Ministers’. That huge delay undermined and affected greatly the work of the PJ. It was passed on 10th April 2008 with the votes of the PS (Socialist Party) only.
The law in itself would and will close some of the Police departments, like the DIC in Faro, and others in Portugal.
Some elements like Paulo Rebelo, Gonçalo Amaral even asked for their resignations as PJ Chief inspectors and coordinators of Portimão’s DIC as a way to express that they were not pleased.
The Judiciary Police, though it has a union - ASFIC, the Criminal Investigation Officers' Union - led by Carlos Anjos, is severely paralysed by the lack of means and the lack of payment of overtimes: there are investigations that are doing the minimum services.
Another fact that Mr.Gonçalo Amaral is going to probably explore in his book is why Alípio Ribeiro, national PJ’s director, who talked to the medi, was supported by Alberto Costa, the Minister of Justice, and not sacked like Gonçalo Amaral, who was removed from the Madeleine McCann investigation, and like Olegário de Sousa, the PJ’s PR, who was taken off the case for speaking “too much to the media”. There are more internal situations which would be hard to explain to foreigners but now maybe you understand a bit better the reason for the book. Freedom of speech, democracy, dignity, morals are not empty words in Portugal.
About the Cipriano case, and for those who defend neglectful parents
Why do you defend child-killers and paedophiles like Leonor and João Cipriano?
Did you know that Joana’s blood was found inside the freezer of the Cipriano’s house, on a T-shirt, on another shirt, and on the sofa?
Did you know that it was confirmed by laboratory analyses that some of Joana’s clothes (like her knickers) had traces of sperm and blood, that her bed had traces of sperm?
That Leonor and João Cipriano were brothers and had sex with each other?
That João Cipriano explained step by step how he carved up Joana’s body and how they gave her body parts to the pigs (who eat everything). Did you know that? Or are you defending something which cannot be defended? Where are your morals, do you have ANY left? Can you imagine the suffering of a little girl being raped and buggered?
Did you know that there was a line up of all the Police Officers that Leonor Cipriano accused allegedly of torture, and she failed to recognize any one of those officers?
Did you know that Leonor gave several contradictory statements to the Portuguese Media in a similar way to the McCanns, crying and everything?
Did you know that only after a year in jail, she stated that Joana wasn’t dead, but had been sold by a uncle who had drug problems.
Did you know that in court she never showed any remorse while the video of the carving of Joana’s body, re-enacted by her brother, João Cipriano, was displayed?
Did you know that Leonor Cipriano only reported to the Police the disappearance of her 8-year-old daughter, Joana, after 2 days, and she then gave several interviews to the media and newspapers?
Did you know that the chief prosecutor, Pinheiro, described João Cipriano as “a man who has contempt for human life, psychopathic tendencies and difficulty in controlling impulses”. And referred to Joana’s mother’s “emotional instability, insensitivity and disregard for other people’s needs”.
Leonor showed no emotion when gruesome summary of the case was read out. She only reacted when Pinheiro announced that he was pressing for a 24-year jail term for both defendants. The she sobbed uncontrollably.
Pinheiro explained why his team was pressing for such a long sentence: “The defendants’ guilt is heightened by their cold and calculating behaviour after their child’s death, as well as the devious manoeuvres they adopted to conceal the crime,” he said.
The trial included key testimony from Joana’s stepfather, António Leandro, who related that Leonor had confided to him that she had had a sexual relationship with her brother. He also told the court that during this conversation, which took place a few days after Joana’s disappearance, at judicial police headquarters, Leonor had confided to him that she and her brother had killed the little girl.
A key element of the prosecution’s case rests on the fact that the couple dismembered the girl’s corpse. António Leandro, confronted with photographs of tools allegedly used by the couple, said he recognised a saw he had kept at home. In the video-taped confession, João Cipriano admitted that the body of the girl was dismembered and placed in a refrigerated trunk. A doctor involved in the case, Albino Santana dos Santos, conceded that body parts, matching the size of a girl of Joana’s height, could have been stuffed inside the trunk.
The disgraceful conduct of the British press - and the hidden truth of Portuguese/British cover-up of the case
The British press have hidden the truth and defamed Gonçalo Amaral, spinning only parts of the Cipriano case. And the reasons that caused the British Press to take that stance and maintain a racist editorial policy is relevant to an understanding of the development of the Madeleine McCann case in the media. The abuse of the press calling a CID Inspector a ‘pig’, ‘fat’, ‘lazy’, ‘drunk’ was without a doubt an attempt to undermine Amaral’s reputation and an attack on the Judiciary Portuguese Police. It’s not even ethical - in any journalist’s code - to express systematically such biased opinions and sometimes even lies, manipulating the general British public and setting off a war of words between two countries.
Speaking personally, I myself felt desperate at times, not understanding the reasons behind the support given to the McCanns by the British press and the British authorities. I even felt disgusted and embarrassed with Alípio Ribeiro's attack in the media on the PJ officers handling the case and then the Minister of Justice, Alberto Costa, supporting Alípio after Olegário de Sousa and Gonçalo Amaral were removed from the case, for apparently the same exact reasons.
Worst of all was when we knew that our Prime Minister José Socrates and Gordon Brown talked about this case, and it was obvious then, for most of the Portuguese citizens, that Gordon Brown's involvement and pressure in this case could almost undoubtedly mean the McCanns would never be considered guilty.
Sometimes I felt like dropping everything and closing my eyes to all the injustice, racism, media attacks - but then I found out that I'm very proud of my small and beautiful country and even prouder of our people and history; and though writing a blog and putting my self at risk using my real name, I'll keep on defending my country. Unlike others who are in the government and in the right positions to do so but seem to be cowards."
ENDQUOTE
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here's her 'take' on Amaral and the Cipriano case.
I've lightly edited it for three reasons:
1) to reduce the length
2) to remove the most sensitive and frankly depraved, stomach-churning and wicked parts of the evidence, and
3) in places, to slightly improve still further Joana's already excellent English:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
QUOTE FROM JOANA MORAIS' BLOGSPOT:
Introduction
As some of you are aware, Gonçalo Amaral keeps being smeared in the British Media over Joana Ciprano's Mother- Leonor Cipriano, who is in jail after killing her 8 year old daughter. On the other day I tried to explain to a poster in a Forum, my views on the Joana Cipriano case and why did the British media keep misinforming the public not telling the full story, and used Leonor Cipriano, a monstrous infanticider, to attack and undermine the PJ's credibility.
Here is that story, not suitable for sensitive readers, for a better understanding of the PJ in the Madeleine McCann and Joana Cipriano cases, and regarding the smears against Gonçalo Amaral - in effect, my answer to the poster who said she didn't trust Amaral:
Questions
"Do you know Mr. Amaral personally? Or are you judging him from what you read the British tabloids- a.k.a. gutter press a.k.a. McCanns’ media? What do you know about him, the Judiciary Police or the system of justice in Portugal?
Amaral's Book
I’ll give you my opinion regarding the book ‘The Truth about the Lie’ – ‘Verdade da Mentira’.
It is going to explain the whole lie that was created and to put in question the institutions that investigated and that are connected to the case.
Changes to the Portuguese Judicial Sytem
The fact is that the Judiciary Police Organic (Structural) Law took almost 2 years to be promulgated, after it was approved at the “Concelho de Ministros” - ‘Council of Ministers’. That huge delay undermined and affected greatly the work of the PJ. It was passed on 10th April 2008 with the votes of the PS (Socialist Party) only.
The law in itself would and will close some of the Police departments, like the DIC in Faro, and others in Portugal.
Some elements like Paulo Rebelo, Gonçalo Amaral even asked for their resignations as PJ Chief inspectors and coordinators of Portimão’s DIC as a way to express that they were not pleased.
The Judiciary Police, though it has a union - ASFIC, the Criminal Investigation Officers' Union - led by Carlos Anjos, is severely paralysed by the lack of means and the lack of payment of overtimes: there are investigations that are doing the minimum services.
Another fact that Mr.Gonçalo Amaral is going to probably explore in his book is why Alípio Ribeiro, national PJ’s director, who talked to the medi, was supported by Alberto Costa, the Minister of Justice, and not sacked like Gonçalo Amaral, who was removed from the Madeleine McCann investigation, and like Olegário de Sousa, the PJ’s PR, who was taken off the case for speaking “too much to the media”. There are more internal situations which would be hard to explain to foreigners but now maybe you understand a bit better the reason for the book. Freedom of speech, democracy, dignity, morals are not empty words in Portugal.
About the Cipriano case, and for those who defend neglectful parents
Why do you defend child-killers and paedophiles like Leonor and João Cipriano?
Did you know that Joana’s blood was found inside the freezer of the Cipriano’s house, on a T-shirt, on another shirt, and on the sofa?
Did you know that it was confirmed by laboratory analyses that some of Joana’s clothes (like her knickers) had traces of sperm and blood, that her bed had traces of sperm?
That Leonor and João Cipriano were brothers and had sex with each other?
That João Cipriano explained step by step how he carved up Joana’s body and how they gave her body parts to the pigs (who eat everything). Did you know that? Or are you defending something which cannot be defended? Where are your morals, do you have ANY left? Can you imagine the suffering of a little girl being raped and buggered?
Did you know that there was a line up of all the Police Officers that Leonor Cipriano accused allegedly of torture, and she failed to recognize any one of those officers?
Did you know that Leonor gave several contradictory statements to the Portuguese Media in a similar way to the McCanns, crying and everything?
Did you know that only after a year in jail, she stated that Joana wasn’t dead, but had been sold by a uncle who had drug problems.
Did you know that in court she never showed any remorse while the video of the carving of Joana’s body, re-enacted by her brother, João Cipriano, was displayed?
Did you know that Leonor Cipriano only reported to the Police the disappearance of her 8-year-old daughter, Joana, after 2 days, and she then gave several interviews to the media and newspapers?
Did you know that the chief prosecutor, Pinheiro, described João Cipriano as “a man who has contempt for human life, psychopathic tendencies and difficulty in controlling impulses”. And referred to Joana’s mother’s “emotional instability, insensitivity and disregard for other people’s needs”.
Leonor showed no emotion when gruesome summary of the case was read out. She only reacted when Pinheiro announced that he was pressing for a 24-year jail term for both defendants. The she sobbed uncontrollably.
Pinheiro explained why his team was pressing for such a long sentence: “The defendants’ guilt is heightened by their cold and calculating behaviour after their child’s death, as well as the devious manoeuvres they adopted to conceal the crime,” he said.
The trial included key testimony from Joana’s stepfather, António Leandro, who related that Leonor had confided to him that she had had a sexual relationship with her brother. He also told the court that during this conversation, which took place a few days after Joana’s disappearance, at judicial police headquarters, Leonor had confided to him that she and her brother had killed the little girl.
A key element of the prosecution’s case rests on the fact that the couple dismembered the girl’s corpse. António Leandro, confronted with photographs of tools allegedly used by the couple, said he recognised a saw he had kept at home. In the video-taped confession, João Cipriano admitted that the body of the girl was dismembered and placed in a refrigerated trunk. A doctor involved in the case, Albino Santana dos Santos, conceded that body parts, matching the size of a girl of Joana’s height, could have been stuffed inside the trunk.
The disgraceful conduct of the British press - and the hidden truth of Portuguese/British cover-up of the case
The British press have hidden the truth and defamed Gonçalo Amaral, spinning only parts of the Cipriano case. And the reasons that caused the British Press to take that stance and maintain a racist editorial policy is relevant to an understanding of the development of the Madeleine McCann case in the media. The abuse of the press calling a CID Inspector a ‘pig’, ‘fat’, ‘lazy’, ‘drunk’ was without a doubt an attempt to undermine Amaral’s reputation and an attack on the Judiciary Portuguese Police. It’s not even ethical - in any journalist’s code - to express systematically such biased opinions and sometimes even lies, manipulating the general British public and setting off a war of words between two countries.
Speaking personally, I myself felt desperate at times, not understanding the reasons behind the support given to the McCanns by the British press and the British authorities. I even felt disgusted and embarrassed with Alípio Ribeiro's attack in the media on the PJ officers handling the case and then the Minister of Justice, Alberto Costa, supporting Alípio after Olegário de Sousa and Gonçalo Amaral were removed from the case, for apparently the same exact reasons.
Worst of all was when we knew that our Prime Minister José Socrates and Gordon Brown talked about this case, and it was obvious then, for most of the Portuguese citizens, that Gordon Brown's involvement and pressure in this case could almost undoubtedly mean the McCanns would never be considered guilty.
Sometimes I felt like dropping everything and closing my eyes to all the injustice, racism, media attacks - but then I found out that I'm very proud of my small and beautiful country and even prouder of our people and history; and though writing a blog and putting my self at risk using my real name, I'll keep on defending my country. Unlike others who are in the government and in the right positions to do so but seem to be cowards."
ENDQUOTE
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
april4sky
It is not who is right, but what is right, that is
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2005
- Messages
- 1,227
- Reaction score
- 9
Then why do the PJ feel the need to claim her injuries were sustained when she fell down the stairs.
By the way I think you did!! And no it's no exaggeration. IMO
It's immaterial to me what you think of others simply because you don't agree with them.
And I don't buy your claim about the "diminishing band of supporters."
No lets not!!
Facts from a blog:waitasec:...I don't think so...nor do I believe the truth will be found there.
I don't pretend to know all of the details of Joanna's case and I suspect you don't either.
http://www.portugalholidaydestinations.co.uk/villas/2007/06/police_accused_of_torture_of_m.shtmlThe truth about Leonor Cipriano (mother of "another missing girl"…"beaten" and "tortured" by Chief-Inspector Gonçalo Amaral
4 – The body of Joana Cipriano was never found, but samples of her blood were found in her mother refrigerator;
laboratories were unable to prove the blood was that of Joana.
*****
We do seem to have a contradiction here don't we. :waitasec: Interesting.:waitasec:
Tony Bennett
Former Member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2008
- Messages
- 217
- Reaction score
- 11
Still more from the pen of Joana Morais on the Cipriano case, though in this case it is a summary of the contents of a book on the case written by someone else:
WARNING:-
THIS SUMMARY CONTAINS SOME GRAPHIC DETAILS
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The story is about a team of three investigators from the PJ in Lisbon, who are called in to the Joana case almost a month after the child went missing. Joana was last seen at a small cafe in the village where she lived, Figueira, on the early evening of September 12, 2004. She was sent by her mother to buy some cans of tuna and a package of milk. She was reported missing by her mother and her partner the next day, at the GNR station in Portimão.
When the three PJ members from Lisbon are called in, Joana's mother Leonor Cipriano and her uncle João Cipriano (Leonor's brother) are in preventive custody, suspected of killing Joana and of concealing her body. The three inspectors from Lisbon - Cristóvão, Marques Bom and Leonel - are brought in to help with their interrogations, as João Cipriano has confessed to killing his niece, and then has led the Faro inspectors on several wild goose chases, claiming to show them where the body is, but the PJ always return empty-handed.
The triad arrives in Faro and immediately meets Guilhermino da Encarnação, the director of PJ in the Algarve, and Gonçalo Amaral, who is leading the investigation into the Joana case. They are visibly exhausted, and they welcome the help from Lisbon, as their personnel has hit a dead end, and have exhausted all their resources.
The interrogations begin almost immediately, and Cristóvão soon notices that João Cipriano, who seems to be a rather primitive character, is actually very smart in an uneducated way. He has developed defences over the many hours of tentative interrogations that were performed by PJ investigators before. So Cristóvão tries a different path, by apparently befriending João, and deliberately ignoring his attempts to lead him in yet another outing to supposedly show him where Joana's body has been hidden.
Leonor is also interrogated by Cristóvão. The picture of the Cipriano family starts to draw itself. The siblings - João has a twin sister - admit to having sexual intercourse with each other as if this was absolutely normal. Leonor has an array of children from different partners which include a teenage daughter who cannot even bear to hear her mother's name. They have never experienced a stable family environment, being utterly incapable of thinking about anyone else except themselves.
Leonor lives with a man, Leandro, in a house in Figueira. There is one bedroom that is used by Leonor, Leandro and their 2 small children.
The other room was shared by Joana and a male adult friend of Leandro, Carlos. Joana adored her mother, in spite of all the abuse she suffers at her mother's hands. Leonor often sent Joana at 3 or 4 a.m. to walk to a nearby cake factory, because Leonor likes to eat warm cakes. Joana draws cardboard hearts where she writes that she loves her mother.
Gradually, an even more sinister picture starts to emerge. The detectives soon discover that João has several different sex partners apart from his sisters. A more or less regular partner confides that she has to have sex with him even [withheld], because she is terrified of what he would do to her if she refused. Leonor is also visibly afraid of João's temper, and she obeys him blindly. Once left alone in an interrogation room with João, the detectives overhear a conversation where João tells Leonor that they must now tell everyone that a mysterious Spanish man took Joana away.
During one of the interrogations, João, who has mood shifts, ends up confessing voluntarily to having beaten Joana, who hit a wall with her head and collapsed dead on the floor. He says he was having sex with Leonor while the girl had been out on her errand, but Joana returned and saw them. She said she would tell Leandro about what she saw. The child tried to run out of the house, but was dragged back in by João and Leonor.
Leonor slapped her, and then João also slapped the girl. The child flew against a wall, bumped her head and dropped dead on the floor. He then cut up her body and stored it in plastic bags in the family's freezer. Cristóvão, the detective who is interrogating him, asked some specific questions about the process of cutting.
João's answers chillingly detail the process, including correct information about the difficulty in separating certain joints. He also tells Cristóvão that all 4 adults - João, Leonor, Leandro and Carlos - ended up knowing that Joana was dead, as he and Leonor showed the bags in the freezer to Leandro and Carlos when they arrived home, later that evening. João later repeats his confession in the presence of his lawyer, and duly signs it.
The detectives return to Figueira, now with a forensics team, to check whether the information that João has given them yields some traces of evidence. Their discoveries turn out to be much more than they bargained for. They discover the orange flip-flops that Joana was supposedly wearing the evening she vanished. Then they turn the uv light to the wall where João told them the child had hit her head before collapsing dead on the floor.
Her face is clearly 'drawn' on the wall, also two small hands that left a trace that goes down the wall, showing Joana's last movement.
They also discover the prints of her hands on the frame of the house's outer door, that were left there at the moment when she tried to escape. João had told Cristóvão how Joana had tried to cling to the door frame, and they had to pull her back in by her legs. Everything is photographed.
On the sofa where allegedly João was having sex with his sister, no traces of bodily fluids were found. But the forensics team detects blood residues on one of the sofa's feet. They also discover several traces of sperm on a bedcover that is on Joana's bed, as well as on the pillows and on the wall next to the bed. Everything is taken by the forensics team, to be tested in their lab.
Meanwhile, the investigators watch a video capture that was made by an amateur videographer who was filming a local festivity on the evening of September 12, the evening that Joana disappeared. Leandro, Leonor's partner, is coincidentally captured on tape. At that time, he is supposedly searching the area for Joana, as all four adults had stated earlier. But the camera films Leandro at the bar, having a beer. He is not searching for anyone. He has hid head hanging, his eyes focused on the ground, with a deeply sad demeanour about him.
Back in Faro, at the PJ's offices, detective Cristóvão confronts Leonor with what João has told them about the child's death. He omits the part of the body being dismembered. Leonor thinks her partner, Leandro, has denounced her to the police. She finally starts to cry and tells the detective that João cut the body up, and put the pieces inside bags, and into the freezer. Marques Bom takes Leonor away into another room, while Cristóvão writes down what happened.
Leonor will have to repeat everything later, in the presence of a lawyer, to validate her confession.
As Cristóvão is finishing his report, he hears a commotion outside. He finds Marques Bom and another detective, Antonio, on the floor of the staircase, with Leonor. Gonçalo Amaral also arrives to see what the noise is about. Marques Bom says Leonor asked to go to the toilet, so they stood outside the toilet's door and waited for her to come out. But she opened the door, raced past the detectives towards the stairwell and tried to jump off the railing. They managed to prevent her from jumping, but she then threw herself off the stairs.
Leonor is brought back to the prison. During the night, Cristóvão receives a phone call informing that Leonor has a bump on her head that is swelling up, so two other detectives take her to a local medical centre. The doctor who examines her says the bump is not serious, but there is an internal blood spill and the woman should rest lying down, to prevent the blood from descending into the eye area. They take the woman back to prison. Later on, Leonor will be counselled by someone at the prison to press charges against the detectives, saying they beat her in order to extract a confession.
The picture that is later published in several newspapers shows blood around her eyes, but absolutely no trauma to the eye area. Leonor will also later fail to identify Marques Bom and Leonel at a line-up. She will identify Cristóvão, who was the element that spent most time interrogating her, but she will state formally that Cristóvão never hit her.
A few days later, Cristóvão receives a phone call from Teresa, the forensics team leader that went with the detectives to the house in Figueira. She has results from the tests: the blood that was found on the foot of the sofa, is from one of Leonor's children. But it is not from Joana, nor from the 2 small children that live in the house, and not from her teenage daughter, either. The blood comes from a descendant of Leonor, but none of the known children matches the DNA profile. The residues that were collected from Joana's bed and from the wall next to her bed don't give conclusive results. The blood sample that was detected in the freezer is human, but it is impossible to extract DNA from the sample.
Meanwhile, the detectives talk to a convict in another prison, who shared a cell with João when he was imprisoned years earlier for violence. The convict had spoken to João about the crime that he had committed, the homicide of a man, and he had told him that his biggest mistake had been to tell the police where they could find the body of the man he had killed. This convict had taught João that nobody could be convicted without a corpse, and he had also taught João about the art of 'The Triangle.
To kill in one location; to dump the body at another location; and finally to move into another location. On a map, these 3 locations form a triangle.
The investigators remember that João had confessed to killing in Figueira. He had then gone to the junk yard that Leonor's partner Leonel operates. And finally, he had gone to his twin sister's house. This constituted a triangle.
The detectives bring João into the PJ's offices once again. Cristóvão sits in front of him, and draws a triangle on a sheet of paper. João smiles and completes the drawing with three names, one at each vertex of the triangle: Figueira, Junk yard and Casa Alta, the location where his twin sister lives. The investigators know they must go to the junkyard. They drive there with João. He tells them he placed the bags inside a red car that was going to be pressed and destroyed, but the car is not there anymore.
Later, an informant that wanted to remain anonymous tells the investigators that he saw Leandro and Carlos, on the day after Joana disappeared, driving their truck with an old red car on top of it. They went into the direction of Spain, and the informant thought it was odd because a Spanish foundry came to the junk yard regularly every month to pick up the cars for disposal. They had no apparent need to drive an old car into the Spanish foundry, as they could wait for the regular pick-up. The detectives go into Spain and visit the foundry. The place is huge, and the detectives decide they need to go back to Faro and formally ask the Spanish authorities for help.
But when they arrive back in Faro, they are summoned to return to Lisbon immediately. They were taken off the case because Leonor has filed a complaint against them for assault.
On November 11, 2005, the Portimão court condemned Leonor Cipriano to a sentence of 20 years and 4 months in prison, and João Cipriano to 19 years and 2 months in prison, for qualified homicide and concealment of the body of Joana Cipriano.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
WARNING:-
THIS SUMMARY CONTAINS SOME GRAPHIC DETAILS
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The story is about a team of three investigators from the PJ in Lisbon, who are called in to the Joana case almost a month after the child went missing. Joana was last seen at a small cafe in the village where she lived, Figueira, on the early evening of September 12, 2004. She was sent by her mother to buy some cans of tuna and a package of milk. She was reported missing by her mother and her partner the next day, at the GNR station in Portimão.
When the three PJ members from Lisbon are called in, Joana's mother Leonor Cipriano and her uncle João Cipriano (Leonor's brother) are in preventive custody, suspected of killing Joana and of concealing her body. The three inspectors from Lisbon - Cristóvão, Marques Bom and Leonel - are brought in to help with their interrogations, as João Cipriano has confessed to killing his niece, and then has led the Faro inspectors on several wild goose chases, claiming to show them where the body is, but the PJ always return empty-handed.
The triad arrives in Faro and immediately meets Guilhermino da Encarnação, the director of PJ in the Algarve, and Gonçalo Amaral, who is leading the investigation into the Joana case. They are visibly exhausted, and they welcome the help from Lisbon, as their personnel has hit a dead end, and have exhausted all their resources.
The interrogations begin almost immediately, and Cristóvão soon notices that João Cipriano, who seems to be a rather primitive character, is actually very smart in an uneducated way. He has developed defences over the many hours of tentative interrogations that were performed by PJ investigators before. So Cristóvão tries a different path, by apparently befriending João, and deliberately ignoring his attempts to lead him in yet another outing to supposedly show him where Joana's body has been hidden.
Leonor is also interrogated by Cristóvão. The picture of the Cipriano family starts to draw itself. The siblings - João has a twin sister - admit to having sexual intercourse with each other as if this was absolutely normal. Leonor has an array of children from different partners which include a teenage daughter who cannot even bear to hear her mother's name. They have never experienced a stable family environment, being utterly incapable of thinking about anyone else except themselves.
Leonor lives with a man, Leandro, in a house in Figueira. There is one bedroom that is used by Leonor, Leandro and their 2 small children.
The other room was shared by Joana and a male adult friend of Leandro, Carlos. Joana adored her mother, in spite of all the abuse she suffers at her mother's hands. Leonor often sent Joana at 3 or 4 a.m. to walk to a nearby cake factory, because Leonor likes to eat warm cakes. Joana draws cardboard hearts where she writes that she loves her mother.
Gradually, an even more sinister picture starts to emerge. The detectives soon discover that João has several different sex partners apart from his sisters. A more or less regular partner confides that she has to have sex with him even [withheld], because she is terrified of what he would do to her if she refused. Leonor is also visibly afraid of João's temper, and she obeys him blindly. Once left alone in an interrogation room with João, the detectives overhear a conversation where João tells Leonor that they must now tell everyone that a mysterious Spanish man took Joana away.
During one of the interrogations, João, who has mood shifts, ends up confessing voluntarily to having beaten Joana, who hit a wall with her head and collapsed dead on the floor. He says he was having sex with Leonor while the girl had been out on her errand, but Joana returned and saw them. She said she would tell Leandro about what she saw. The child tried to run out of the house, but was dragged back in by João and Leonor.
Leonor slapped her, and then João also slapped the girl. The child flew against a wall, bumped her head and dropped dead on the floor. He then cut up her body and stored it in plastic bags in the family's freezer. Cristóvão, the detective who is interrogating him, asked some specific questions about the process of cutting.
João's answers chillingly detail the process, including correct information about the difficulty in separating certain joints. He also tells Cristóvão that all 4 adults - João, Leonor, Leandro and Carlos - ended up knowing that Joana was dead, as he and Leonor showed the bags in the freezer to Leandro and Carlos when they arrived home, later that evening. João later repeats his confession in the presence of his lawyer, and duly signs it.
The detectives return to Figueira, now with a forensics team, to check whether the information that João has given them yields some traces of evidence. Their discoveries turn out to be much more than they bargained for. They discover the orange flip-flops that Joana was supposedly wearing the evening she vanished. Then they turn the uv light to the wall where João told them the child had hit her head before collapsing dead on the floor.
Her face is clearly 'drawn' on the wall, also two small hands that left a trace that goes down the wall, showing Joana's last movement.
They also discover the prints of her hands on the frame of the house's outer door, that were left there at the moment when she tried to escape. João had told Cristóvão how Joana had tried to cling to the door frame, and they had to pull her back in by her legs. Everything is photographed.
On the sofa where allegedly João was having sex with his sister, no traces of bodily fluids were found. But the forensics team detects blood residues on one of the sofa's feet. They also discover several traces of sperm on a bedcover that is on Joana's bed, as well as on the pillows and on the wall next to the bed. Everything is taken by the forensics team, to be tested in their lab.
Meanwhile, the investigators watch a video capture that was made by an amateur videographer who was filming a local festivity on the evening of September 12, the evening that Joana disappeared. Leandro, Leonor's partner, is coincidentally captured on tape. At that time, he is supposedly searching the area for Joana, as all four adults had stated earlier. But the camera films Leandro at the bar, having a beer. He is not searching for anyone. He has hid head hanging, his eyes focused on the ground, with a deeply sad demeanour about him.
Back in Faro, at the PJ's offices, detective Cristóvão confronts Leonor with what João has told them about the child's death. He omits the part of the body being dismembered. Leonor thinks her partner, Leandro, has denounced her to the police. She finally starts to cry and tells the detective that João cut the body up, and put the pieces inside bags, and into the freezer. Marques Bom takes Leonor away into another room, while Cristóvão writes down what happened.
Leonor will have to repeat everything later, in the presence of a lawyer, to validate her confession.
As Cristóvão is finishing his report, he hears a commotion outside. He finds Marques Bom and another detective, Antonio, on the floor of the staircase, with Leonor. Gonçalo Amaral also arrives to see what the noise is about. Marques Bom says Leonor asked to go to the toilet, so they stood outside the toilet's door and waited for her to come out. But she opened the door, raced past the detectives towards the stairwell and tried to jump off the railing. They managed to prevent her from jumping, but she then threw herself off the stairs.
Leonor is brought back to the prison. During the night, Cristóvão receives a phone call informing that Leonor has a bump on her head that is swelling up, so two other detectives take her to a local medical centre. The doctor who examines her says the bump is not serious, but there is an internal blood spill and the woman should rest lying down, to prevent the blood from descending into the eye area. They take the woman back to prison. Later on, Leonor will be counselled by someone at the prison to press charges against the detectives, saying they beat her in order to extract a confession.
The picture that is later published in several newspapers shows blood around her eyes, but absolutely no trauma to the eye area. Leonor will also later fail to identify Marques Bom and Leonel at a line-up. She will identify Cristóvão, who was the element that spent most time interrogating her, but she will state formally that Cristóvão never hit her.
A few days later, Cristóvão receives a phone call from Teresa, the forensics team leader that went with the detectives to the house in Figueira. She has results from the tests: the blood that was found on the foot of the sofa, is from one of Leonor's children. But it is not from Joana, nor from the 2 small children that live in the house, and not from her teenage daughter, either. The blood comes from a descendant of Leonor, but none of the known children matches the DNA profile. The residues that were collected from Joana's bed and from the wall next to her bed don't give conclusive results. The blood sample that was detected in the freezer is human, but it is impossible to extract DNA from the sample.
Meanwhile, the detectives talk to a convict in another prison, who shared a cell with João when he was imprisoned years earlier for violence. The convict had spoken to João about the crime that he had committed, the homicide of a man, and he had told him that his biggest mistake had been to tell the police where they could find the body of the man he had killed. This convict had taught João that nobody could be convicted without a corpse, and he had also taught João about the art of 'The Triangle.
To kill in one location; to dump the body at another location; and finally to move into another location. On a map, these 3 locations form a triangle.
The investigators remember that João had confessed to killing in Figueira. He had then gone to the junk yard that Leonor's partner Leonel operates. And finally, he had gone to his twin sister's house. This constituted a triangle.
The detectives bring João into the PJ's offices once again. Cristóvão sits in front of him, and draws a triangle on a sheet of paper. João smiles and completes the drawing with three names, one at each vertex of the triangle: Figueira, Junk yard and Casa Alta, the location where his twin sister lives. The investigators know they must go to the junkyard. They drive there with João. He tells them he placed the bags inside a red car that was going to be pressed and destroyed, but the car is not there anymore.
Later, an informant that wanted to remain anonymous tells the investigators that he saw Leandro and Carlos, on the day after Joana disappeared, driving their truck with an old red car on top of it. They went into the direction of Spain, and the informant thought it was odd because a Spanish foundry came to the junk yard regularly every month to pick up the cars for disposal. They had no apparent need to drive an old car into the Spanish foundry, as they could wait for the regular pick-up. The detectives go into Spain and visit the foundry. The place is huge, and the detectives decide they need to go back to Faro and formally ask the Spanish authorities for help.
But when they arrive back in Faro, they are summoned to return to Lisbon immediately. They were taken off the case because Leonor has filed a complaint against them for assault.
On November 11, 2005, the Portimão court condemned Leonor Cipriano to a sentence of 20 years and 4 months in prison, and João Cipriano to 19 years and 2 months in prison, for qualified homicide and concealment of the body of Joana Cipriano.
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april4sky
It is not who is right, but what is right, that is
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Hi Shazza, :blowkiss:
The photo was taken while she was in custody.
The PJ are not denying the bruises. They are claiming she was hurt when she fell down stairs. :waitasec: I don't buy that!!
Goncalo Amaral and four of his officers have been charged so there will be a trial. His men are charged with the beating and Amaral with covering up for them.
And the charges came while Amaral was in charge of Madeleine's case.
Nice posting with you Shazza. :blowkiss:
Tony Bennett
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april4sky,
One or two questions.
Do you think that that Jose and Leonor Cipriano killed little Joana?
Do you think - on what you have read above, or elsewhere - that Leonor Cipriano's confession (if she made one) was crucial in the conviction of these two?
Do you think Goncalo Amaral deserves credit for leading the investigation that saw these two convicted and jailed for long periods?
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One or two questions.
Do you think that that Jose and Leonor Cipriano killed little Joana?
Do you think - on what you have read above, or elsewhere - that Leonor Cipriano's confession (if she made one) was crucial in the conviction of these two?
Do you think Goncalo Amaral deserves credit for leading the investigation that saw these two convicted and jailed for long periods?
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april4sky
It is not who is right, but what is right, that is
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I honestly have no idea if they are guilty or not.
But if they are guilty I hope they throw away the key...No problem.
And I have said this before.
Blogs don't do it for me.
Not knowing the actual facts I honestly have know idea how crucial the confession was to the case.
One question leads to others though...Why would the cops have felt they needed a confession if they had enough other evidence!!
Why! while being beaten didn't she also confess to where Joana's body was?
Could it be that you can't tell something you don't know? Mmmmmm.
Not if he is guilty of what he has been charged with.
Because if guilty this may well have put the verdict in jeapardy.
Hi Shazza, :blowkiss:
The photo was taken while she was in custody.
The PJ are not denying the bruises. They are claiming she was hurt when she fell down stairs. :waitasec: I don't buy that!!
Goncalo Amaral and I think three of his officers have been charged so there will be a trial. His men are charged with the beating and Amaral with covering up for them.
And the charges came while Amaral was in charge of Madeleine's case.
Nice posting with you Shazza. :blowkiss:
Nice posting with you again April :blowkiss:
I will have to catch up on a lot of reading to familiarise myself again, have been reading the maddie threads nearly everyday, but dont post, hope to be a bit more involved. Have the files been released yet.
april4sky
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Not to the public Shazza.
The McCanns lawyers have now been given access to them.
But there is a "Final report thread" here as some of the report has been leaked...Now there's a surprise.
SleuthMom
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Personally, I will take the testimony of Mrs Cipriano with a grain of salt because:
1. Mr. Amaral was NOT present in the interrogation
2. She doesn't "know" who beat her up
3. She says the inspectors who interrogated her DID NOT beat her up, who then?
Let me not even start with her sick sexual relationships... which I know should not mean she is lying but what I can tell you, if she was involved and got that beating, I don't feel sorry for her in the least.
1. Mr. Amaral was NOT present in the interrogation
2. She doesn't "know" who beat her up
3. She says the inspectors who interrogated her DID NOT beat her up, who then?
Let me not even start with her sick sexual relationships...
which I know should not mean she is lying but what I can tell you, if she was involved and got that beating, I don't feel sorry for her in the least.The Judiciária’s 48 questions that Kate did not answer
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2448975&postcount=368
Question 41 and "the question that she answered"....poor Maddie, shame on Kate.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2448975&postcount=368
Question 41 and "the question that she answered"....poor Maddie, shame on Kate.
Tomorrow Shazza....the files will be released to "anyone with a legitimate need". The press will have access, no doubt.
Think this says it all really, if I thought that I was going to be reunited with my missing daughter the car just couldn't go fast enough! but then of course she knew that the car was on a road to nowhere didn't she? & as usual was more concerned with her own wellbeing than that of Madeleines!
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53176&page=15
The couples behaviour when faced with possible leads concerning their daughters whereabouts, after a publicity campaign that went around the world and was built by the parents themselves, arose the investigators attention, namely during one of the first days when Kate, faced with the possibility of finding her daughter, is upset about the speed that is attained by the police car.
& this:
In her notes, Kate always shows her disbelief concerning the reliability of the information, while Gerry (the situation is described in the former investigators book) arose attention from the inspectors when, in the middle of a negotiation with a possible abductor, he sucked on a lollipop in a relaxed manner, while reading banalities on internet sites and discussing rugby and football with one of the English policemen.
"negotiation with a possible abductor"........
who? when?
Texana
Overreaching
Question 41 is when Kate was asked if it was true they had considered handing over guardianship of Madeleine to another relative. She does not answer.
Why? If you are so insulted at the very question, the answer is still "no." We all have to answer questions at times we consider insulting. I have been questioned regarding incidents at my job that were extremely insulting (a student once said I said something I would never say to any child, I had to answer very seriously, "No, I never did." He later admitted making it all up.) I did not have the luxury of saying "I'm not answering that insulting question." It's part of being a grown up and understanding that in an investigation, you get asked questions that are beyond insulting.
So if Kate refuses to answer #41, it is because there is some truth in it, possibly? And the answer would be "yes but we changed our minds." She cannot have that truth revealed because it would bring the search for Madeleine to a standstill. The press world-wide would connect "leaves children alone" with "once talked seriously about having relative take over care for child."
End of search and quite possibly, goodby guardianship of the twins.
So Kate refuses to answer.
Why? If you are so insulted at the very question, the answer is still "no." We all have to answer questions at times we consider insulting. I have been questioned regarding incidents at my job that were extremely insulting (a student once said I said something I would never say to any child, I had to answer very seriously, "No, I never did." He later admitted making it all up.) I did not have the luxury of saying "I'm not answering that insulting question." It's part of being a grown up and understanding that in an investigation, you get asked questions that are beyond insulting.
So if Kate refuses to answer #41, it is because there is some truth in it, possibly? And the answer would be "yes but we changed our minds." She cannot have that truth revealed because it would bring the search for Madeleine to a standstill. The press world-wide would connect "leaves children alone" with "once talked seriously about having relative take over care for child."
End of search and quite possibly, goodby guardianship of the twins.
So Kate refuses to answer.
SleuthMom
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Texana, I am not sure if I am correct (please anyone feel free to correct me). I have the impression that both Gerry and Kate knew before hand they would be made arguidos therefore they were counseled by their lawyers to not answer ANY questions at all. Those 48 questions to me are ALL the questions they were supposed to ask her, not that she chose to answer some and these 48 ones are the ones remaining. I have the impression the ONLY question she did answer was if she was aware that by refusing answering questions it would jeopardize the investigation. That's the impression I get, maybe I am wrong. I think she did not answer ANY at all.
SleuthMom
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"negotiation with a possible abductor"........
I would like to know more about this as well. I'll try to search.
iNTERESTEDWOMAN
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Yep. I'll totally agree with you on this. Kate had to "no comment" this one. She isn't the sharpest tack in the box, but she isn't the dullest one either.
Any loving Mother would scream a "NO WAY IN H*LL" to that question if untrue. Kate is probably still fuming that one of her "friends" leaked the info to the cops.
iNTERESTEDWOMAN
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I'm not sure, but you are probably right. Still seems strange though. This question (#41) is kind of out of place with the rest of the line of questioning.
iNTERESTEDWOMAN
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The adoption thing was originally brought up in the 3A's forum *I think*. Barnaby & colomom found a link or two where it was discussed there. Supposedly a social worker leaked info to someone or something of the sort that Kate and Gerry were looking into adopting Madeleine out to another family. It was originally thought to be mostly forum rumor and speculation, but seeing it was a "no comment" question to Kate from the PJ, it makes it seems to be a little more truth than rumor...Sorry I can't help you more. Kate and Gerry did relinquish parental rights of Madeleine to the courts a few months after they lost (killed IMO) her.
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