Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #13

[Dlk79]

Regarding the mast(s) and the possibility of pinpointing a phone in the PDL area, there have been others who have already done some good research on this if you are interested.

Espacio Exterior: THE MADELEINE MCCANN'S ABDUCTION: ANALYSIS OF THE PHONE COMMUNICATIONS

Madeleine – Luz pie

Espacio Exterior: The abduction of Madeleine McCann: this is the antenna activated by the alleged mobile phone of Christian B.

 

[Tim N]

I agree. I think this was CB’s MO. Also the night MM was abducted, when GM did his first check at 9:05PM and noticed the children’s door was open further than they had left it. This suggests the intruder could have already been in the apartment that night.

i think that he hid in his ex GF's room because he knew her and wasnt planning anything unless she came home with a man. He could be busted and walk away without penalty.

I think that scenario IS NOT an indicator of his MO because it was so contextual. He couldnt afford to be busted elsewhere, so IMO he was not under the bed or hiding in the room..

 

[justdesserts29]

Climbing out of a window carrying a child doesn’t seem like the quickest route IMO

I agree with you. The window wasn’t that big. Also, the children’s window and the front door were almost next to each other facing the same direction. He could have walked out of the bedroom and out the front door. If CB, I think he worked alone. Also because of CB’s MO, he would have had everything carefully planned - he would have already been in the apartment and would have unlocked the window so he could get in that way, he would have been familiar with the layout of the apartment and all of the exits.

 

[justdesserts29]

Climbing out of a window carrying a child doesn’t seem like the quickest route IMO

I agree with you. The window wasn’t that big. Also, the children’s window and the front door were almost next to each other facing the same direction. He could have walked out of the bedroom and out the front door. If CB, I think he worked alone. Also because of CB’s MO, he would have had everything carefully planned - he would have already been in the apartment and would have unlocked the window so he could get in that way, he would have been familiar with the layout of the apartment and all of the exits.

 

[peanutJelly]

GM checks at 21.05 roughly. Says he's seen all three children. That's the last definite sighting of MM.

MO only see twins, sees light and hears noise like someone turning over but doesn't check. Which is bizarre.

So there is an hour in which she could have been taken? If the noise wasn't loud enough to warrant MO looking it could have been anything. Shutters rattling in breeze. Anything really missing.

It might be useful to have a timeline of that actual night. Especially to see how relevant the Smithman sighting might be

I’m still not 100% convinced he saw all 3 at this time. He had been chatting, was in a rush by the time he checked, and his statement of this final sighting has been analysed as being potentially fabricated. Some forums have taken that as evidence of his involvement, but could it be that he made this up because he didn’t want to admit that he didn’t properly check? And once you’ve told that lie, how do you take it back? How do you tell your distraught wife that you didn’t see MM?

It hadn’t crossed their minds that the children could be abducted, the main worry seemed to be that they woke up. So if the apartment was quiet, would you physically check every time at every check during a 7 night holiday? Or by the final night after checking so many times do you nip in, have a wee and all being quiet rush back for your food?

By the time KM raised the alarm at 10, any abductor could have an advantage of hours...

IMO

 

[Tim N]

I wonder if LE are working to trace CB’s incoming/outgoing money from that time? I expect they must be. If he was involved in DW transactions through making videos to order, there had to be a way of receiving the money. I know very little about such things but feels safe to assume that options would have been more limited and less sophisticated than they are now?

these days they trade in bitcoin only. the way to get around financial transactions is to offer other things of worth..which i had thought was drugs, but not so sure now.

 

[Tim N]

We haven't seen evidence linking him to even one murder and now he is a serial killer?

edit: deleted a rant about the convenience of the 'absence of data' argument analogous to the 'are we alone' question and Homer Simpson's 'Tiger Rock'

 

[Dlk79]

I’m still not 100% convinced he saw all 3 at this time. He had been chatting, was in a rush by the time he checked, and his statement of this final sighting has been analysed as being potentially fabricated. Some forums have taken that as evidence of his involvement, but could it be that he made this up because he didn’t want to admit that he didn’t properly check? And once you’ve told that lie, how do you take it back? How do you tell your distraught wife that you didn’t see MM?

It hadn’t crossed their minds that the children could be abducted, the main worry seemed to be that they woke up. So if the apartment was quiet, would you physically check every time at every check during a 7 night holiday? Or by the final night after checking so many times do you nip in, have a wee and all being quiet rush back for your food?

By the time KM raised the alarm at 10, any abductor could have an advantage of hours...

IMO

I did consider that option, that GM didn't actually set eyes on MM but didn't want to admit it, but a few things has put me off that.

First, although he would not want to admit it, would he prefer to potentially jeopardise his daughter being found by restricting the abduction window the police would investigate? What happens if the culprit is found and it gets confirmed that MM was taken before GM's check?

The other thing that puts me off it is that the last of the Tapas 7 didn't arrive at the table until around 9 o'clock, just before GM's chceck and he and Kate had already been at the Tapas for 30 mins at this point. If the abduction was planned, and someone was watching the movements, you'd think they'd wait until all of the group were at the restaraunt before making a move. Otherwise there'd be every chance of bumping into one of the other group with MM. As the last of the group arrived (DP, FP and DW), they crossed paths with MO doing his first check. So again, if someone was watching the group, they would not act quite yet either. When MO returned he tells GM he listened by MM's shutter and all was quiet (shutters obviously closed at this point). GM decides he will still go and check inside the apartment anyway and leaves as MO settles back down at the table.

It "might" be possible that the intruder entered 5A just after MO returned from his chceck and before GM. And then got stuck in the apartment as GM entered and so hid somewhere (maybe behind the door). But I do think MM was still there when GM checked. JMO.

 

[peanutJelly]

edit: deleted a rant about the convenience of the 'absence of data' argument analogous to the 'are we alone' question and Homer Simpson's 'Tiger Rock'

I enjoyed reading that!

 

[Apr2020]

i think its not just a possibility or plausible, its unlikely that they didnt know each other.

and RM knew both too. its quite the web isnt it?.

IIRC Didn't their uncovered computer records indicate they both had an interest in bestiality??

 

[Chiatos]

Regarding the mast(s) and the possibility of pinpointing a phone in the PDL area, there have been others who have already done some good research on this if you are interested.

Espacio Exterior: THE MADELEINE MCCANN'S ABDUCTION: ANALYSIS OF THE PHONE COMMUNICATIONS

Madeleine – Luz pie

Espacio Exterior: The abduction of Madeleine McCann: this is the antenna activated by the alleged mobile phone of Christian B.

Thanks for this valuable info. I'll have to study it better later on.
The first question though that pops up in my head: where is "the" Vodafone antenna if we would have to draw it in these maps?
Would it be the purple one, slightly under 5A? The one that is named "b"?
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-8AycMWdTzJo/VW9pSU_NtyI/AAAAAAAAB-A/xkcsMq2Vun4/s1600/antenna_ee.png

 

[Tim N]

IIRC Didn't their uncovered computer records indicate they both had an interest in bestiality??

i dont know about that but i thought the story as that he was fixing a computer that had paedo on it and he claimed it wasnt his. i could be mistaken. if he did then in a town of 3500 people, you'd be naive if you think they didnt know each other. IMO.

 

[Tim N]

Thanks for this valuable info. I'll have to study it better later on.
The first question though that pops up in my head: where is "the" Vodafone antenna if we would have draw it in these maps?
Would it be the purple one, slightly under 5A? The one that is named "b"?
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-8AycMWdTzJo/VW9pSU_NtyI/AAAAAAAAB-A/xkcsMq2Vun4/s1600/antenna_ee.png

Is there debate on where the location of the call was made from?.

 

[Chiatos]

i dont know about that but i thought the story as that he was fixing a computer that had paedo on it and he claimed it wasnt his. i could be mistaken. if he did then in a town of 3500 people, you'd be naive if you think they didnt know each other. IMO.

They found 27 optical disks containing , one of which containing bestiality.

 

[william tell]

I agree with you. The window wasn’t that big. Also, the children’s window and the front door were almost next to each other facing the same direction. He could have walked out of the bedroom and out the front door. If CB, I think he worked alone. Also because of CB’s MO, he would have had everything carefully planned - he would have already been in the apartment and would have unlocked the window so he could get in that way, he would have been familiar with the layout of the apartment and all of the exits.

It is more likely that CB did the Dirty work by himself just like a rapist would do.

 

[MENDEL]

Maybe I finally found a clue from mystery Westfalia's pic.

Red square: a house? (on top of some hill or something high).

Black square: top of an aqueduct or water spring?

 

[Newthoughts]

I’m still not 100% convinced he saw all 3 at this time. He had been chatting, was in a rush by the time he checked, and his statement of this final sighting has been analysed as being potentially fabricated. Some forums have taken that as evidence of his involvement, but could it be that he made this up because he didn’t want to admit that he didn’t properly check? And once you’ve told that lie, how do you take it back? How do you tell your distraught wife that you didn’t see MM?

It hadn’t crossed their minds that the children could be abducted, the main worry seemed to be that they woke up. So if the apartment was quiet, would you physically check every time at every check during a 7 night holiday? Or by the final night after checking so many times do you nip in, have a wee and all being quiet rush back for your food?

By the time KM raised the alarm at 10, any abductor could have an advantage of hours...

IMO

I have to admit that thought had crossed my mind that in a panic and with an element of keeping up appearances they may have been economical with details of how thoroughly they checked. As you say they were not expecting abduction they were just checking kids were ok. And it was towards the end of an uneventful holiday they might have been becoming more relaxed and complacent.


MO says they left their appt at 8.45 and the McCanns were already at the Tapas bar. After only 20 minutes at 9.05 he walks round the appts listening for sounds and notes the window to MMs room is shut. GM goes in to check and says he sees MM.

The window is only relevant if the abductor entered that way.

MO says he checked again at 9.25 thru an unlocked door. Didn't see MM but noted and external light source but didn't think this odd enough to look further.

If MO could get in thru that door so could the abductor especially if he'd been watching.

If the McCanns had been checking via the front door - could that be seen from the window? Could a visual check of who was around be the reason the window was opened?

 

[Newthoughts]

I did consider that option, that GM didn't actually set eyes on MM but didn't want to admit it, but a few things has put me off that.

First, although he would not want to admit it, would he prefer to potentially jeopardise his daughter being found by restricting the abduction window the police would investigate? What happens if the culprit is found and it gets confirmed that MM was taken before GM's check?

The other thing that puts me off it is that the last of the Tapas 7 didn't arrive at the table until around 9 o'clock, just before GM's chceck and he and Kate had already been at the Tapas for 30 mins at this point. If the abduction was planned, and someone was watching the movements, you'd think they'd wait until all of the group were at the restaraunt before making a move. Otherwise there'd be every chance of bumping into one of the other group with MM. As the last of the group arrived (DP, FP and DW), they crossed paths with MO doing his first check. So again, if someone was watching the group, they would not act quite yet either. When MO returned he tells GM he listened by MM's shutter and all was quiet (shutters obviously closed at this point). GM decides he will still go and check inside the apartment anyway and leaves as MO settles back down at the table.

It "might" be possible that the intruder entered 5A just after MO returned from his chceck and before GM. And then got stuck in the apartment as GM entered and so hid somewhere (maybe behind the door). But I do think MM was still there when GM checked. JMO.

MO would be walking from the Tapas to the appts when he passed DP, FP and DW. That is not necessarily near where whoever abducted her would get into the appts. But I agree it would be risky to enter the appts until they'd all gone.

Against that him abducting before GMs check is if he'd been observing the group for a couple of days he'd know what sort of window of opportunity he had.

If I were a betting person I'd bet checks became less thorough and less frequent as the night progressed. Parents relaxing, feeling less chance the kids would wake. Plus less people around

 

[NCanning]

How were the Tapas 9 able to come up with the times they were doing things, if they didnt have any phones or watches at the table?

 

[william tell]

How were the Tapas 9 able to come up with the times they were doing things, if they didnt have any phones or watches at the table?

maybe that's the reason all their times were so uncertain.