Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #24

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  • #561
I get that, but whether they got the times messed up or less checks than said, it is not the crime that is being investigated
, so he could of taken her any time say from 8.30ish when km and GM left to 10ish, no matter what, and what time, mm still vanished, and CB has confessed to this

Says who? FF has already started discrediting potential witnesses. The witness statements from HB and potentially others can easily be denied in court. To confirm the denial the Tapas statements which were taken three times would prove powerful.
 
  • #562
No but he may have said that he waited until the parents went for dinner and then went immediately into 5A ... so all the Tapas Group are telling porky pies!

I get that, but whether they got the times messed up or less checks than said, it is not the crime that is being investigated
, so he could of taken her any time say from 8.30ish when km and GM left to 10ish, no matter what, and what time, mm still vanished, and CB has confessed to this
Says who? FF has already started discrediting potential witnesses. The witness statements from HB and potentially others can easily be denied in court. To confirm the denial the Tapas statements which were taken three times would prove powerful.

Well there's no smoke without fire, so to speak, CB's name has been brought up by several different people, if what's been reported is correct, and if not correct, then why investigate him?
And as far as I know what knowledge we have of him, that's been made public is on our threads
 
  • #563
This is the point of my original thought experiment.

To try to explain why HCWs media campaign seems like it is not aligned with the group. I would have expected alignment, because he can finally vindicate them.

And this makes me query why there is a chasm between the German investigation and MM's family. Ostensibly they're on the same team. But at what cost, truth?
 
  • #564
  • #565
What seems clear is that communication between all parties is needed to move this case forward , very little is solved in our world without dialogue and cooperation of some sort..
Otherwise what’s left is a never ending unresolved stand-off.
 
  • #566
HCW is taking his time. The quietness before the storm?
 
  • #567
HCW is taking his time. The quietness before the storm?

Hopefully the one getting hit by any storm is the person who took MM out of 5A.
 
  • #568
Let’s say CB’s confession the HB or others states that he took MM at 8:40pm. FF would certainly argue that this is impossible because the child’s own father saw her in bed at 9:05-9:10pm.

Again, JMO, but, based on everything HCW has shared to date, my impression (and it is just my impression) is that the manner (time, 'methodology', etc) in which CB allegedly abducted MM is not crucial to his investigation. Which suggests that what he has (which he can't reveal) is concrete evidence of CB's guilt further down the line.

The reason I think this is because of eg. HCW placing such importance (that phone call appeal) on CB being in the PdL vicinity on that evening. Just the vicinity. Not an appeal to place him outside 5A or skulking about in the bushes, just confirmation that he was in the vicinity. That to me suggests that whatever HCW has, it relates to evidence unrelated to 5A, if you see what I mean.
 
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  • #569
I feel like we are missing the point here. A young girl disappeared and has been possibly murdered. Who and why should care about the PJ being ridiculed. They did not act as fast as they should have had and they turned their suspicions to the parents. The parents have been punished in the worst possible way. I really do not care about the PJ. Calling this unforgivable? Why focus on that now?

I'm not missing any point.

I have a problem with what I believe (from the rogatories) was a false timeline that in turn resulted in a very messy and confused investigation, with the PJ bearing the ongoing brunt of that. I'm not asking anyone else to have a problem with it, merely responding to @Denis R Tandib and his perfectly reasonable musings as to how much of a negative impact that (if) false timeline might have had both on the initial investigation and now this current one.

That you personally don't care about the PJ is neither here nor there. I care about fairness.
 
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  • #570
This is the point of my original thought experiment.

To try to explain why HCWs media campaign seems like it is not aligned with the group. I would have expected alignment, because he can finally vindicate them.

There does seem to be some ongoing unresolved UK-related issue.

In thought experiment mode, all I can think of is that HCW's investigation has unearthed something contentious that doesn't tally with earlier investigative conclusions and that's posing a real stumbling block for those responsible for those earlier conclusions. 'Those' being OG.

I've never felt that the Met and the Germans were/are, in any real, cooperative sense, working together here.

Which is intriguing...
 
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  • #571
I can't see any storm coming too soon. According to actual reports, HCW seems to have admitted, that the investigation could even last on until next year. That makes me think about some reasons, why there hasn't been any charge until today.

Public inquiry has been nothing more than playing time. Why?

1.
CB could be just a part of some bigger case.

2.
CB isn't the main suspect in reality. Maybe they lock him up and keep him as the main perp, to make him talk what really happened, because he would be the main and crucial witness.

3.
The investigation brought a lot more against CB (or others) to the light, that goes beyond just one single missing child.

4.
Another key person, witness or accomplice isn't tangible right at the moment.

5.
The public inquiry has been made to
distract from something else to keep another investigation behind the curtain.

6.
A combination of two or more things between 1. - 5..

There are so many possibilities. Some kind of failure in HCW's strategy seems to be the most unlikely one to me. JMO.
 
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  • #572
I can't see any storm coming too soon. According to actual reports, HCW seems to have admitted, that the investigation could even last on until next year. That makes me think about some reasons, why there hasn't been any charge until today.

Public inquiry has been nothing more than playing time. Why?

1.
CB could be just a part of some bigger case.

2.
CB isn't the main suspect in reality.

3.
The investigation brought a lot more against CB (or others) to the light, that goes beyond just one single missing child.

4.
Another key person, witness or accomplice isn't tangible right at the moment.

5.
The public inquiry has been made to
distract from something else to keep another investigation behind the curtain.

6.
A combination of two or more things betqeen 1. - 5..

There are so many possibilities. Some kind of failure in HCW's strategy seems to be the most unlikely one to me. JMO.


I don't think his strategy has failed either.
I think the goal is to find MM's body and they're giving it their best shot in an open ended investigation. Perhaps that's why it seems to be taking so long. I know HCW said he doesn't need a body to charge, so he obviously doesn't have enough evidence to charge without a body atm!

The information gathering over the past 12 months, has been, IMO partly to help form a profile of CB, other crimes committed, places homes, his geographical footprint , familiar places etc from 1995 - 2007 in order to possibly garner GIS data to try and locate MM. (Hence the profiling summit in Lisbon)
CB speaks German and English, so I can understand the press hits in the UK to those who may have known him, friends, ex GF's, British Tourists etc who may have interacted with him, but have there been as many press hits in Germany asking for the same info?
 
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  • #573
I don't think his strategy has failed either.
I think the goal is to find MM's body and they're giving it their best shot in an open ended investigation. Perhaps that's why it seems to be taking so long. I know HCW said he doesn't need a body to charge, so he obviously doesn't have enough evidence to charge without a body atm!

The information gathering over the past 12 months, has been, IMO partly to help form a profile of CB, other crimes committed, places homes, his geographical footprint , from 1995 - 2007 in order to possibly garner GIS data to try and locate MM. (Hence the profiling summit in Lisbon)
CB speaks German and English, so I can understand the press hits in the UK to those who may have known him, friends, ex GF's, British Tourists etc who may have interacted with him, but has there been as many press hits in Germany asking for the same info?

Hard to say. Of course, the public inquiry was based on making something public and recieve more info about CB himself and his time in Portugal. But a public inquiry has also an inconvienent side. The prosecutors are likely to get overrun by informations, that are incorrect or even false. So there is always a counterproductive part into that.

Of course, finding the body as a final prove seems the most likely legit strategy and reason, to create an almost extensive motion profile of CB.

But as long as the investigation is going on, the more and more i could imagine, that he really could be some kind of scapegoat. Of course, far away from being innocent. But putting pressure to the weakest part of a chain, will make the chain to brake very likely.

We do not know the possible confessions he may have been making in the past. Obviously CB seems to know something, but it needs holy water served as a longdrink in hell, to become coorporative. That FF statement was a clear challenge made to the prosecuters, if you ask me. So why not making public, that the prosecutors are investigating him as the perp who did it and put him into solitary confinement?

As the days, months, years go by, they all break down some day. Next step could be giving the media the info, that he will be brought into normal prison conditions, because the investigation will go on for a much longer time and they do not want to break his human rights. Does he want to sit beside other inmates, whilst everybody knows him as the "infamous maddie-killer"?

Or will he tend to save his poor life, by starting to speak about that "everything" he knows, about the poor little girl?

We'll see what happens. I still got HCW's quote from june 2020 in my mind, when he told the press that they will always have an open ear for CB 24/7, if he wants to speak about something to them.
 
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  • #574
Fall "Maddie": Ermittlungen gegen Christian B. laufen weiter

"The media response to the public prosecutor's press conference on June 3, 2020 was enormous. Since then, more than 1,000 reports have been received, said Wolters spokesman.
A group of special investigators at the Federal Criminal Police Office is constantly busy checking them. Some clues really brought us further, says Wolters. But: An indictment is not yet in sight. How much longer we will find out, that cannot be foreseen. Personally, I assume that it will take a few more months. It may also be that we will get to next year. Wolters emphasizes that the investigations are open-ended, that it will not be unilaterally determined. However, no indications that exonerated Christian B. have yet been found."

Very cryptic, if the investigations should be really made against one single suspect, if you ask me.
 
  • #575
There does seem to be some ongoing unresolved UK-related issue.

In thought experiment mode, all I can think of is that HCW's investigation has unearthed something contentious that doesn't tally with earlier investigative conclusions and that's posing a real stumbling block for those responsible for those earlier conclusions. 'Those' being OG.

I feel there is a basic problem that JT saw Tannerman, and IDed RM as that man.

In a prosecution of CB, burden is the other way round - CB need only point to Tannerman/RM as a potential perp. Or any of the other perps and sightings down the years...

So like you say, HCW needs a way to sidestep all of that because of evidence he has post 5a, or he will need to defuse the obvious defence case ....
 
  • #576
But as long as the investigation is going on, the more and more i could imagine, that he really could be some kind of scapegoat. Of course, far away from being innocent. But putting pressure to the weakest part of a chain, will make the chain to brake very likely.

If the case (and it's an interesting thought), would that not then mean that the German strategy has been a smoke and mirrors one from the start? That naming CB publicly in the way they did was just a means to a different end?
 
  • #577
If the case (and it's an interesting thought), would that not then mean that the German strategy has been a smoke and mirrors one from the start? That naming CB publicly in the way they did was just a means to a different end?
I think the media named CB, not Wolters (?)
 
  • #578
If the case (and it's an interesting thought), would that not then mean that the German strategy has been a smoke and mirrors one from the start? That naming CB publicly in the way they did was just a means to a different end?

HCW knew that, specifically, UK Media would name CB, something forbidden in German Law.

Perhaps HCW's strategy was to name CB, say he murdered MM, pressurise him so that CB would tell all he knew, having NOT murdered her - (scapegoat scenario, so CB would say I didn't do it but here's what did happen)

I wish we had more info arghhh, don't really know what HCW is up to and I'm starting to doubt everything again!

They've been investigating him for what? 7 years now!?
 
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  • #579
Re. the Ibiza Airport picture in June 2007.
Could the man on the left be Christian Manfred Kruse, the German citizen recently arrested in Bélan, Paraguay with a said connection to Christian Brückner? The other picture is one of the last photos of Madeleine in Praia da Luz, taken by Neil Berry.
 

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  • #580
I think the media named CB, not Wolters (?)

They did - but once HCW put it out there, it was always a short and knowing path to CB being publicly outed (exactly as Tedtink says above).

To suggest otherwise would imply hapless naivety on the part of HCW.
 
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