Madeleine McCann: German Prisoner Identified as Suspect, #34

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  • #321
What do you think? Does Europe need a Megan's law? You can search for convicted sex aggressors by name, location, etc. Free for all persons.
 
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  • #322
OK. So the allegedly understaffed and overworked police took time off from investigating burglars and paedophiles at the inception of a missing child case, to chase up on fine defaulters.

Yes I can see why some might think that was a matter of urgency.
Making sure fines are paid and evt. arrest of defaulters is an integral part of any law system no matter how hard worked or understaffed they might be. It would be pointless giving the fines in the 1st place if there were no consequences for non payment.
 
  • #323
Making sure fines are paid and evt. arrest of defaulters is an integral part of any law system no matter how hard worked or understaffed they might be. It would be pointless giving the fines in the 1st place if there were no consequences for non payment.
I was of the opinion that the police would have been prioritising the search for a missing child as the logical reason behind their interest in CB.

What an intriguing thought that in Luz you say the priority might have been debt collecting. Thing is though that nothing is known of why CB was on the police radar to begin with or why he was inexplicably dropped off it. To the extent that future investigators weren't passed his file.

The Porto Policia Judiciaria whose work led to the reopening of MM's case seemed to be in ignorance of CB going after a different suspect. Who to coin a phrase was perfect because he was dead.

'KIDNAP FORM OF REVENGE'

In 2013, Portuguese newspaper Correio da Manha said: "The motives that could have caused the ex-employee to kidnap the youngster are still being investigated.

“The suspect could have taken the child to commit a sex crime before killing her.

“But he could also have committed the kidnap as a form of retaliation against the Ocean Club."

Police had lost crucial time to interview Monteiro because he was missing from a list of current and former Ocean Club employees that was given to police during the first investigation.

But having been identified as a suspect following suspicious phone records, detectives were set to question Monteiro.

 
  • #324
I was of the opinion that the police would have been prioritising the search for a missing child as the logical reason behind their interest in CB.

What an intriguing thought that in Luz you say the priority might have been debt collecting. Thing is though that nothing is known of why CB was on the police radar to begin with or why he was inexplicably dropped off it. To the extent that future investigators weren't passed his file.

The Porto Policia Judiciaria whose work led to the reopening of MM's case seemed to be in ignorance of CB going after a different suspect. Who to coin a phrase was perfect because he was dead.

'KIDNAP FORM OF REVENGE'

In 2013, Portuguese newspaper Correio da Manha said: "The motives that could have caused the ex-employee to kidnap the youngster are still being investigated.

“The suspect could have taken the child to commit a sex crime before killing her.

“But he could also have committed the kidnap as a form of retaliation against the Ocean Club."

Police had lost crucial time to interview Monteiro because he was missing from a list of current and former Ocean Club employees that was given to police during the first investigation.

But having been identified as a suspect following suspicious phone records, detectives were set to question Monteiro.

RSBM

It seems likely that CB was on the list because of his extradition to Germany for his 1994 child abuse offences. He probably dropped off the suspects list because he hadn’t lived in PDL for approximately a year and relative to abduction, his past convictions were minor and happened when he was young. The PJ at the time probably felt that there were stronger suspects, which IMO is reasonable - even now, we don’t know that CB is the culprit.

In 2013, everyone was ignorant of CB as a suspect. The Braunschweig police were given his name in connection with the case but failed to identify him as a suspect. The only reason this changed is because of HB’s statement in 2017 - police, no matter what nationality, make mistakes.

EM was almost certainly identified as a suspect by OG on its analysis of the phone records and his details given to the PJ in Porto. Is OG terrible too - some would argue yes based on the 12 year investigation and £13M in expenses.

The important point here is that CB is not responsible for MM’s abduction and murder until he is convicted for these crimes. At that point, your views on the incompetence of the PJ and, in fairness, German LE and OG will be valid - they have all had access to the the same information and let him slip through their fingers.
 
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  • #325
I've been hearing a lot about the supposed photo evidence for this case but cannot find any evidence for this claim. Could somebody please send a link or tell me where I can find this information.
 
  • #326
Not sure if it has been posted before, but litte CB went on a hunger strike. He also has a new (additional?) lawyer, located in Kiel as well.


I really would like to know, if Schwenn and Fülscher may have thrown the towel or had been exchanged by CB himself. Hard to think, that all three of the known lawyers are working pro bono. The 2020 "famous case momentum" should have faded a long time ago IMO....
 
  • #327
I've been hearing a lot about the supposed photo evidence for this case but cannot find any evidence for this claim. Could somebody please send a link or tell me where I can find this information.
There's no confirmation of a video/photo. It is just a theory at the moment, based primarily on comments made by the Prosecutor, HCW. He has stated they have concrete "material" evidence of MM's death despite not knowing where her body is. The suspect is known to have recorded previous other victims as part of his MO. There's been a number of his devices and memory cards discovered hidden/buried during various raids which we are yet to find out the full content of. HCW has refused to divulge exactly what the material evidence is but has stated it "might be" videos/photos. When he's been pressed further during interviews on whether they have images of MM, he states he "cannot confirm or deny" it. He has denied the existence of other evidence when asked though such as forensic evidence of death, pyjama fibres, a photo that specifically shows MM and the suspect "together", knowing the identity of the mystery caller etc. Which is why some see it as suspicious that he won't comment on the existence of a photo/video of MM.
 
  • #328
There's no confirmation of a video/photo. It is just a theory at the moment, based primarily on comments made by the Prosecutor, HCW. He has stated they have concrete "material" evidence of MM's death despite not knowing where her body is. The suspect is known to have recorded previous other victims as part of his MO. There's been a number of his devices and memory cards discovered hidden/buried during various raids which we are yet to find out the full content of. HCW has refused to divulge exactly what the material evidence is but has stated it "might be" videos/photos. When he's been pressed further during interviews on whether they have images of MM, he states he "cannot confirm or deny" it. He has denied the existence of other evidence when asked though such as forensic evidence of death, pyjama fibres, a photo that specifically shows MM and the suspect "together", knowing the identity of the mystery caller etc. Which is why some see it as suspicious that he won't comment on the existence of a photo/video of MM.
One thing is certain. The McCanns' Christmas message this year was the first where they seemed to acknowledge, publicly, for the first time that they will never see their daughter alive again
There's no confirmation of a video/photo. It is just a theory at the moment, based primarily on comments made by the Prosecutor, HCW. He has stated they have concrete "material" evidence of MM's death despite not knowing where her body is. The suspect is known to have recorded previous other victims as part of his MO. There's been a number of his devices and memory cards discovered hidden/buried during various raids which we are yet to find out the full content of. HCW has refused to divulge exactly what the material evidence is but has stated it "might be" videos/photos. When he's been pressed further during interviews on whether they have images of MM, he states he "cannot confirm or deny" it. He has denied the existence of other evidence when asked though such as forensic evidence of death, pyjama fibres, a photo that specifically shows MM and the suspect "together", knowing the identity of the mystery caller etc. Which is why some see it as suspicious that he won't comment on the existence of a photo/video of MM.
Clouding the picture slightly is that, as I understand it, the German definition of the word 'concrete' is not quite the same as the English.

In Germany, I think, the word means something like persuasive, but not definitive.

Whereas, in England, the word means irrefutable, conclusive.
 
  • #329
Not sure if it has been posted before, but litte CB went on a hunger strike. He also has a new (additional?) lawyer, located in Kiel as well.


I really would like to know, if Schwenn and Fülscher may have thrown the towel or had been exchanged by CB himself. Hard to think, that all three of the known lawyers are working pro bono. The 2020 "famous case momentum" should have faded a long time ago IMO....
How does funding for lawyers in Germany work?

Presumably the State pays Brueckner's legal bill and appoints his lawyer?
 
  • #330
Not sure if it has been posted before, but litte CB went on a hunger strike. He also has a new (additional?) lawyer, located in Kiel as well.


I really would like to know, if Schwenn and Fülscher may have thrown the towel or had been exchanged by CB himself. Hard to think, that all three of the known lawyers are working pro bono. The 2020 "famous case momentum" should have faded a long time ago IMO....
Fulscher was still prevalent when the charges were dropped, for now at least.
 
  • #331
Not sure if it has been posted before, but litte CB went on a hunger strike. He also has a new (additional?) lawyer, located in Kiel as well.


I really would like to know, if Schwenn and Fülscher may have thrown the towel or had been exchanged by CB himself. Hard to think, that all three of the known lawyers are working pro bono. The 2020 "famous case momentum" should have faded a long time ago IMO....
Would JS and FF want to give up on the case if there was still a strong chance he was going to trial? I imagine they have invested significant time in the case and if they left before trial they wouldn’t get the publicity they would if they defended him in court.
 
  • #332
  • #333
Thank you Richard.
 
  • #334
I've been hearing a lot about the supposed photo evidence for this case but cannot find any evidence for this claim. Could somebody please send a link or tell me where I can find this information.
The important word in your question is ‘supposed’. There is no direct comment from the prosecutor stating that he has photographic evidence. Neither has he directly denied having a photo. As you can see from @Malleux’s post there is an opinion that a photo exists. I think that if it did, CB would likely have been charged.
 
  • #335
The important word in your question is ‘supposed’. There is no direct comment from the prosecutor stating that he has photographic evidence. Neither has he directly denied having a photo. As you can see from @Malleux’s post there is an opinion that a photo exists. I think that if it did, CB would likely have been charged.
I don't think there is any great rush to lay charges in the MM case.
At least not until the present delayed charges against CB have been resolved one way or the other.
 
  • #336
I don't think there is any great rush to lay charges in the MM case.
At least not until the present delayed charges against CB have been resolved one way or the other.
Clearly there isn’t, the investigation has been going for six years.

It’s important for the prosecutors to be successful with some of the charges, if they go to court, or CB will likely be paroled not too far into the future.
 
  • #337
I've been hearing a lot about the supposed photo evidence for this case but cannot find any evidence for this claim. Could somebody please send a link or tell me where I can find this information.
its possible photo evidence....nothing suposed about it. HCW has made several references to the possibility
 
  • #338
its possible photo evidence....nothing suposed about it. HCW has made several references to the possibility
Give it up, Dave. They don't have evidence like that. If they did, as Denis says, they'd have charged him long ago and we'd probably have had the trial already. The one thing prosecutors don't want to do is let circumstantial cases linger on indefinitely - when you're so reliant on witnesses you want to get them into court asap. If you don't witnesses can disappear, or change their minds about giving evidence, or change their story, or become ill and unable to give evidence, or die. Naturally prosecutors don't want to risk this, and won't - unless they have no choice.
 
  • #339
Claiming HCW can't have a photo or else they would have charged him is nonsense IMO. He may well not have a photo, but this logic only works if you know what the photo shows and you know what other evidence they have to back up the assertion that CB killed MM.

Of course, a photo of MM found in CB's possession would be extremely compelling evidence, maybe enough for a Prosecutor to make strong public claims about him. It does not however show that he murdered her, which is the crime they need to prove. As others have pointed out, photos get shared by paedophiles, so even it being in his possession doesn't necessarily prove he was the one who took it.

I'm not defending any claim that they do have a photo/video either, I'm pretty on the fence about it tbh. But given the inevitable speculation HCW's comments would incite, it is at least unusual why he hasn't ruled it out given the other types of evidence they admit that they don't have. JMO.
 
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  • #340
If evidence like that existed it would be so powerful who'd believe a word he said about where he got it from? I wouldn't, and I'm sure judges wouldn't either.
 
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