Madeleine McCann: German Prisoner Identified as Suspect, #39

[Mex]

As I recall, back in 2020 it was going to be all over by Christmas.

IMO they totally misjudged the value of their evidence, but as he's the only suspect they've got, they wish to hang onto him as long as they can.
Ultimately they'll run out of leads to investigate and they'll need to charge or accept defeat.

My recollection of events is slightly different from yours. I recall a leak in 2019 which released the press hounds from what had been up until then a closely guarded line of investigation.

Mea culpa! I originally thought the leak had emanated from the PJ as per the norm from the first months of the initial investigation.

In retrospect I realised that the BKA and SY had pulled off the near impossible feat of

• investigating a crime
• investigating a criminal
• gathering and collating evidence
• building a case
• charging the criminal
• bringing the case to trial
• which resulted in a guilty verdict and a custodial sentence

All of which was carried out with the utmost discretion by MM investigators working on her case but who found evidence of an unrelated crime and prosecuted it because constitutionally they had to.

Who had heard of DM or the invasive outrages CB carried out on her body by CB until it was made part and parcel of the MM case because the perpetrator was the same man the MM detectives had under discrete investigation.

If CB's name had not been put in the public domain when realisation dawned of who he is we would have been ambling along in total ignorance of him at this point in time and investigators would have been allowed to get on with the job in hand.

Just as they had been allowed to do with the DM aggravated rape case when no-one apparently knew about CB's association as suspect in MM's case.

My opinion

 

[Anxala]

As fate should have it, the body finally turned up in the morphew case after 3 years - totally by chance

So these things do happen

I suspect it is the only way the case is resolved.

I saw that and thought of you (you've mentioned the case a few times in relation to missing bodies). Hopefully she will now get the justice she deserves.

 

[RichardKimble]

As I recall, back in 2020 it was going to be all over by Christmas.

IMO they totally misjudged the value of their evidence, but as he's the only suspect they've got, they wish to hang onto him as long as they can.
Ultimately they'll run out of leads to investigate and they'll need to charge or accept defeat.

July 2020 talked of it being over in months.

German prosecutors 'preparing to end Madeleine McCann suspect probe'

Hans Christian Wolters, the lead prosecutor in the German police's probe into Madeleine McCann suspect Christian Brueckner today warned his team had no plans to 'drag out' the investigation.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Consider Dudley]

July 2020 talked of it being over in months.

German prosecutors 'preparing to end Madeleine McCann suspect probe'

Hans Christian Wolters, the lead prosecutor in the German police's probe into Madeleine McCann suspect Christian Brueckner today warned his team had no plans to 'drag out' the investigation.

www.dailymail.co.uk

But not by HCW, only by “unnamed sources “.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

That doesn't seem to have inhibited Wolters giving countless interviews for journalists and documentary makers.

These are my thoughts, too. HCW seems to have proactively driven appearances in the media. FF has occasionally responded to requests for comment, but generally as a contributor to articles rather than the focus of them. My opinion.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

A very good and insightful read and one that sticks to the pertinent facts of the case here now in Oct 2023. Proper reporting! Very interesting to hear from Schwenn and FF.

The more we hear from HCW and the reality of where the investigation is right now, the more I'm starting to believe that he seriously jumped the gun back in 2020 on the basis of something 'precarious'... something maybe along the lines of CB's own (Das Buch/s) writings. Just a thought (but it does appear, based on what Amaral said in his book, that they were being taken seriously). Not on its own, of course, but the combo of what he believed he had must have included something that he regarded as an icing on the cake 'gotcha' that turned out not to be the gotcha that he thought it was.

If it had been a gotcha, it would still be one. A chargeable one.

What does that leave in compelling evidence terms that failed to deliver? I'm out of ideas.

I think it's all witness statements. Mostly from ex-cons, possibly with an axe to grind. These would include NF, NM, MT and CP, possibly corroborated by the dubious bar confession to DS. All could be CB simultaneously bragging and lying.

 

[Anxala]

I think it's all witness statements. Mostly from ex-cons, possibly with an axe to grind. These would include NF, NM, MT and CP, possibly corroborated by the dubious bar confession to DS. All could be CB simultaneously bragging and lying.

I really think he'd have needed something more than witness statements, particularly considering the calibre of the witnesses, in order for him to claim for a fact that CB murdered MM. It just sounds too risky a stance to me, too open to pitfalls. And when you have HCW saying, as he recently did, that someone who until relatively recently was presented imo as a fairly key witness (HB) was not important to the MM case, then that kind of assumes the murder claim must have something more solid at its base than a bunch of dodgy ex cons and associates of CB with axes to grind.

 

[RichardKimble]

I really think he'd have needed something more than witness statements, particularly considering the calibre of the witnesses, in order for him to claim for a fact that CB murdered MM. It just sounds too risky a stance to me, too open to pitfalls. And when you have HCW saying, as he recently did, that someone who until relatively recently was presented imo as a fairly key witness (HB) was not important to the MM case, then that kind of assumes the murder claim must have something more solid at its base than a bunch of dodgy ex cons and associates of CB with axes to grind.

IMO, it all rests with remains, the recent searches of the reservoir area testify to this, we know the alleged crime scene was compromised at 5a, a simple defence is then provided where is the evidence of MM being abducted, HCW needs remains or solid evidence that CB murdered MM, he obviously hasnt.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

I really think he'd have needed something more than witness statements, particularly considering the calibre of the witnesses, in order for him to claim for a fact that CB murdered MM. It just sounds too risky a stance to me, too open to pitfalls. And when you have HCW saying, as he recently did, that someone who until relatively recently was presented imo as a fairly key witness (HB) was not important to the MM case, then that kind of assumes the murder claim must have something more solid at its base than a bunch of dodgy ex cons and associates of CB with axes to grind.

You might be right, but HCW stated that it was like a puzzle with many pieces but no forensic evidence.

Therefore, phone call, Jag, CB’s history and profile, Das Buch and multiple witness statements and I think that could be considered compelling.

Look at it from another angle, what could HCW have in addition to the above that still prevents charges being laid. If he has photos or footage, I don’t think he does, then the case is strong enough to get a conviction.

It’s important to try and work out what evidence he could have beyond the above that strengthens the case but still leaves it in its current state.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

IMO, it all rests with remains, the recent searches of the reservoir area testify to this, we know the alleged crime scene was compromised at 5a, a simple defence is then provided where is the evidence of MM being abducted, HCW needs remains or solid evidence that CB murdered MM, he obviously hasnt.

Yes, that’s what he needs, but what does he have that got this case this far?

 

[RichardKimble]

You might be right, but HCW stated that it was like a puzzle with many pieces but no forensic evidence.

Therefore, phone call, Jag, CB’s history and profile, Das Buch and multiple witness statements and I think that could be considered compelling.

Look at it from another angle, what could HCW have in addition to the above that still prevents charges being laid. If he has photos or footage, I don’t think he does, then the case is strong enough to get a conviction.

It’s important to try and work out what evidence he could have beyond the above that strengthens the case but still leaves it in its current state.

Is the case any stronger than when the appeal was made in 2020 though.

 

[RichardKimble]

Yes, that’s what he needs, but what does he have that got this case this far?

Work from what he says they don't have them it doesn't leave an awful lot.

 

[Lilly b]

You might be right, but HCW stated that it was like a puzzle with many pieces but no forensic evidence.

Therefore, phone call, Jag, CB’s history and profile, Das Buch and multiple witness statements and I think that could be considered compelling.

Look at it from another angle, what could HCW have in addition to the above that still prevents charges being laid. If he has photos or footage, I don’t think he does, then the case is strong enough to get a conviction.

It’s important to try and work out what evidence he could have beyond the above that strengthens the case but still leaves it in its current state.

Could be a bit of, ok so we've seen some of your pictures, videos, we've worked out where places are
and so they did the dam search, nothing genuinely has been reported if they have or haven't got any new evidence
More places could follow, abit like at the beginning with the room with the pole/trunk
We will start with your lesser crime and work our way up
And obviously hcw is not going release a majority of the evidence until any trials, that we'd know about
There are probably more reliable witnesses that we could only speculate upon, that don't have a criminal past

And now the jurisdiction is sorted expect to hear more soon

 

[RichardKimble]

Could be a bit of, ok so we've seen some of your pictures, videos, we've worked out where places are
and so they did the dam search, nothing genuinely has been reported if they have or haven't got any new evidence
More places could follow, abit like at the beginning with the room with the pole/trunk
We will start with your lesser crime and work our way up
And obviously hcw is not going release a majority of the evidence until any trials, that we'd know about
There are probably more reliable witnesses that we could only speculate upon, that don't have a criminal past

And now the jurisdiction is sorted expect to hear more soon

The jurisdiction issue was no impediment to the MM case, see post 607, HCW confirmed it.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

Could be a bit of, ok so we've seen some of your pictures, videos, we've worked out where places are
and so they did the dam search, nothing genuinely has been reported if they have or haven't got any new evidence
More places could follow, abit like at the beginning with the room with the pole/trunk
We will start with your lesser crime and work our way up
And obviously hcw is not going release a majority of the evidence until any trials, that we'd know about
There are probably more reliable witnesses that we could only speculate upon, that don't have a criminal past

And now the jurisdiction is sorted expect to hear more soon

We know that 100 of the 8,000 photos from the box factory featured CB. We can be certain that some of these are incriminating but I don’t think they can prove anything in relation to MM.

The issue with the dam search is that HCW confirmed they had evidence to charge CB a year before this search took place. Therefore, it’s likely the strongest evidence pre dates this search and I would hazard a guess that it pre dates the appeal - other than HaB, I don’t think any evidence of substance has come from the appeal, which is the issue.

As Jitty as said a number of times, why would a prosecutor charge unrelated public exposure crimes before a murder if he has evidence to prove guilt in the latter? It does look like he has over played his hand.

I hope you’re right and we get news soon, especially if it’s that CB has been charged re MM.

 

[RichardKimble]

We know that 100 of the 8,000 photos from the box factory featured CB. We can be certain that some of these are incriminating but I don’t think they can prove anything in relation to MM.

The issue with the dam search is that HCW confirmed they had evidence to charge CB a year before this search took place. Therefore, it’s likely the strongest evidence pre dates this search and I would hazard a guess that it pre dates the appeal - other than HaB, I don’t think any evidence of substance has come from the appeal, which is the issue.

As Jitty as said a number of times, why would a prosecutor charge unrelated public exposure crimes before a murder if he has evidence to prove guilt in the latter? It does look like he has over played his hand.

I hope you’re right and we get news soon, especially if it’s that CB has been charged re MM.

Ref the box factory pics, do they actually exist? HCW has never made mention of them , no charges have been made in relation to them.If they exist are they indecent.

 

[Davieson]

We know that 100 of the 8,000 photos from the box factory featured CB. We can be certain that some of these are incriminating but I don’t think they can prove anything in relation to MM.

The issue with the dam search is that HCW confirmed they had evidence to charge CB a year before this search took place. Therefore, it’s likely the strongest evidence pre dates this search and I would hazard a guess that it pre dates the appeal - other than HaB, I don’t think any evidence of substance has come from the appeal, which is the issue.

As Jitty as said a number of times, why would a prosecutor charge unrelated public exposure crimes before a murder if he has evidence to prove guilt in the latter? It does look like he has over played his hand.

I hope you’re right and we get news soon, especially if it’s that CB has been charged re MM.

Do these photo figures come from police or journalists ?

 

[RichardKimble]

We know that 100 of the 8,000 photos from the box factory featured CB. We can be certain that some of these are incriminating but I don’t think they can prove anything in relation to MM.

The issue with the dam search is that HCW confirmed they had evidence to charge CB a year before this search took place. Therefore, it’s likely the strongest evidence pre dates this search and I would hazard a guess that it pre dates the appeal - other than HaB, I don’t think any evidence of substance has come from the appeal, which is the issue.

As Jitty as said a number of times, why would a prosecutor charge unrelated public exposure crimes before a murder if he has evidence to prove guilt in the latter? It does look like he has over played his hand.

I hope you’re right and we get news soon, especially if it’s that CB has been charged re MM.

Ref the box factory pics, do they actually exist? HCW has never made mention of them , no charges have been made in relation to them.If they exist are they indecent.

So a Sun article says CB served time over the images found on the sticks, if so there was nothing linking them to MM, 2015 was the year the search and resulting find occurred, A Mail article says 2016 and only that he was charged over the images, a Sky article also says 2016, so to answer my own question it certainly seems as if he did possess the images and was convicted over them. 2017 the 10th anniversary appeal resulted in CB's name coming up in relation to MM, allegedly.

 

[RichardKimble]

Do these photo figures come from police or journalists ?

Well JC of Olive Press says 20,000 images.IMO it matters not, none again imo relate to MM.

 

[Davieson]

Well JC of Olive Press says 20,000 images.IMO it matters not, none again imo relate to MM.

I've never thought JC a reliable source.