Found Deceased Malaysia - Nora Quoirin, 15, from UK, special needs, missing on vacation, Seremban, 4 Aug 2019 #5

[MsBetsy]

I totally understand the various descriptions/ categorisation of mild learning difficulties in all the glorbious detail. But it transpired 5 days later that she has something more severe!

They didn't reveal her diagnosis right away? Maybe since there are so many different levels of severity they felt they needed a more detailed description, especially since the media had not reported it accurately.

I thought from the beginning they said she was not independent, had limited communication skills, and had balance and coordination issues.
Is that not what they said?

I just don't remember the descriptions as going mild to severe. I thought they just got more detailed. Imo

 

[HongKongPhooey]

I tend to agree. It didn’t sit right with me starting a crowd funding page. The have the means so why didn’t they offer a reward , it didn’t have to be thousands of pounds. I really hope they don’t walk away with that £100,000 mirroring another infamous couple. JMO

They wont be walking away anywhere. Not emotionally anyway. They'll be locked in the desperate hell of having lost a child. I'd be happy for them to spend it on counselling and the long journey to try and rebuild their broken lives. Whatever it takes.

MO

 

[Skigh]

But this is what the mom was quoted to have said.... reported in English by western media sources. There isn’t a language barrier there.

I have been following this case since the first news reports of her disappearance.
At no time did her mother state mild learning difficulties.As HKP wrote it was her French grandfather and that could have been a translation confusion.
I think her parents would be totally honest when describing Nora's abilities to the Malaysian police and rescue team.

 

[Eve71]

Possibly Nóra was abducted. Once the person realized that she was handicapped they might have decided that it was best to release her, and left her near the water fall thinking that she would be found quickly. How bad were her feet?

I’m sure this elusive abductor would have realised that before he even got to the front door.

 

[MsBetsy]

Oh I assumed it was a private school she went to.

In terms of the mom’s statement when she first went missing she said, “She isn’t like other 15 year olds. She looks younger, she can’t take care of herself, and won’t understand what is going on.”

You have to admit that is a far cry from how she was described several days later. Given the context of being missing in a foreign country, in the jungle no less, I think not being able to care for herself or understand what is going on would be most teens. Looking younger is the least relevant thing and was the first descriptor.

Ultimately, she sounds no different than other teens in that description, so the urgency just didn’t come across. That is why when she later was described far worse, people were surprised and questioned why the description changed so drastically.

Not sure if it would have changed the outcome at all to have had that info from the start. I assume the outcome might be the same regardless. It’s so unfortunate.

Well, it sounds like that is just the statement to the media.

We have no idea what they told police.
I'm sure the parents gave a lot of the important details to investigators, and likely provided with documents describing her medical problems as well.

If they could not do that then I'm guessing it would have taken time to communicate. Did they use an interpreter?

At any rate, we don't know what went on behind the scenes so it's impossible to say whether they gave an accurate description or not. It sounds to me like they did. Why does it matter if people were surprised? Did the police say an innacurate description hindered the search? That because if this it made it more difficult to find Nora? So it's the parents fault?

The people who would know best are her family, so I just read would I could and based it on my own experiences with similar children.
And even then it's hard to get a clear picture without observing that particular child. Everyone is unique.
Imo

 

[will75]

For what it's worth, the most simple explanation for what happened to poor Nora is probably correct - that she woke early, left the house at dawn and followed whatever paths she came to. I believe there are plenty to follow around the resort, and other resorts close by, as jungle trekking is very popular. Regarding the time Nora had to get from A to B, the answer is plenty. She was missing for 10 days and was alive for 6 or 7 of them so an awful lot of ground could be covered. Looked at as simply as possible gives an answer which is probably right. JMO but I am happy to be shot down.

 

[MsBetsy]

I have been following this case since the first news reports of her disappearance.
At no time did her mother state mild learning difficulties.As HKP wrote it was her French grandfather and that could have been a translation confusion.
I think her parents would be totally honest when describing Nora's abilities to the Malaysian police and rescue team.

Yes, I searched as well and have not seen any description by the parents using the words mild learning disability.
And we could not possibly know what they said to police.

I don't know why so many assume they would intentionally give such an inaccurate description. They seem fairly intelligent and would know what would be important in helping them find their daughter. Imo

 

[HongKongPhooey]

For what it's worth, the most simple explanation for what happened to poor Nora is probably correct - that she woke early, left the house at dawn and followed whatever paths she came to. I believe there are plenty to follow around the resort, and other resorts close by, as jungle trekking is very popular. Regarding the time Nora had to get from A to B, the answer is plenty. She was missing for 10 days and was alive for 6 or 7 of them so an awful lot of ground could be covered. Looked at as simply as possible gives an answer which is probably right. JMO but I am happy to be shot down.

Hello Will. Your theory is as strong as anyone's at the moment based on what facts are known, if you ask me!

I'm hoping more may come out if the parents have questions unanswered tho

 

[imstilla.grandma]

In the beginning, I was under the impression she suffered from a learning disability. It wasn’t until later I found out about the physical impairments.


Aisling Agnew, the girl's aunt, was quoted by LBT as saying: "Nora's parents and relatives in Ireland and France are distraught by her disappearance. Nora is a child with special needs and has learning and developmental disabilities which make her especially vulnerable and we fear for her safety."
London teen missing from Malaysia resort

It is understood that Quoirin, who has a learning disability, arrived in Negri Sembilan with her family on Aug 3, for a two-week holiday.
https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-c...e-rule-out-abduction-disappearance-irish-teen

According to the family, the teenager has learning disabilities. — Bernama
Search for missing Irish teen enters third day in Negri Sembilan | Malay Mail

We're working with all departments of police and the fire service to locate the teenager," a police spokesman said, adding the girl, who is of Irish nationality, had a learning disability.
Malaysian police search for London teenager, 15, missing from jungle resort

A 15-year-old girl with a learning disability has gone missing while on holiday in Malaysia, in what police are treating as a possible abduction.
London schoolgirl Nora Quoirin disappears from Malaysia resort in possible abduction - CNN

 

[slowpoke]

I’m thinking maybe Nora’s parents kept thinking they would get a ransom demand, since they strongly believed she was kidnapped, and that the crowd funding donations could be used towards that?

 

[Owlpellet]

Does anyone know if the road the motorcyclist was on leads up to the top of the waterfall? If the motorcyclist was close enough to see that Nora was white, I would expect he was close enough for Nora to hear the bike and know she was near a road and to make her way there. And maybe head off in the wrong direction hoping the road took her to the lodge. I’m wondering if she actually walked along paths/roads and found herself above the waterfall where there is an easier route down. And was unlucky that none of the searchers saw her as they were all ploughing through the forest. And she may have hidden from big groups of men dressed like soldiers.

After reaching the waterfall, she might have tried to find her way down the river back to the lodge as I think she did know that the waterfall was above the lodge. And that’s when she got so lost.

I also wouldn’t be surprised if some local people did see her but were too frightened to approach her. Or waited to find a woman, but by then she had run off. If I saw a distressed naked girl, I think I’d assume she had been sexually assaulted. Reading the article about the lost children in 2015 it would seem that indigenous people are oppressed in Malaysia. So if someone did see her they might be scared to get involved for fear of being blamed. Particularly if the parents had been saying they thought she had been abducted.

Whatever happened, it is just so sad. I can’t stop imagining her as darkness fell each evening and her terror at being alone in such an unfamiliar place. And then the pain she endured. I hope she also experienced something beautiful from time to time that gave her a short reprieve from her fear and confusion.

 

[will75]

Thank you HongKongPhooey - will just keep reading and listening!

 

[Chiatos]

Nora Quoirin's family hit out at 'distressing and unhelpful' comments by other relatives
17 Aug 2019
Tragic teen's family hit out at 'distressing, unhelpful' comments by relatives
To which specific comments are they referring?

 

[adelinesky]

The posted articles are not from respected medical journals,

NHS Scotland
Stomach ulcer (Gastric ulcer)

Mayo Clinic
Peptic ulcer - Symptoms and causes

Johns Hopkins
FAQs about Peptic Ulcer Disease | Johns Hopkins Department of Gastroenterology and Hepatology

UCLA Medical Center
https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/10350-peptic-ulcer-diseasettp://healthinfo.uclahealth.org/Search/85,P00394

Cleveland Clinic
Peptic Ulcer Disease | Cleveland Clinic

I am sorry but the links I posted are from respected medical journals. You just posted general information from medical centers. I can find actual medical journals from those exact same medical centers that talk about stress ulcers. They may have a lot of information about the subject but the link is there

Here is a link from the Cleveland Clinic journals that talks about stress ulcers.
Do all hospitalized patients need stress ulcer prophylaxis?

And heres another link from UCLA division of gastroenterology department of pediatrics
https://www.gastrojournal.org/article/0016-5085(80)90797-0/abstract

Here's a study done with john hopkins that was in journal of asthma
https://www.researchgate.net/public...ng_Frequency_of_Clinically_Important_Bleeding

 

[littlegreen]

I did a lot of research this morning on Nóra’s condition, holoprosencephaly. There is a large community of parents with children who were born with this condition that post daily on Instagram, sharing their children’s milestones. It seems that Nóra was blessed that she could walk without assistance — I couldn’t find a single other child in these communities who could walk without a walker or a mechanism to stabilize their hips. I would love to see a video of Nóra walking. I think it would be incredibly informative as to what her life was like for all of those days that she survived in the jungle.

I recommend taking a look at the holoprosencephaly tag on Instagram.

 

[MsFacetious]

Nora Quoirin's family hit out at 'distressing and unhelpful' comments by other relatives
17 Aug 2019
Tragic teen's family hit out at 'distressing, unhelpful' comments by relatives
To which specific comments are they referring?

I believe the ones from the Grandpa.

Yeah; plus grandpa said that her disability was mild. I think the parents portrayed her as much worse off than she was, which IMO was a disservice to her.

My daughter has a grandparent who describes her as having “a little bit of Down syndrome.”

If you want an accurate picture of a child with special needs you go to their parent or caregiver that interacts with them daily.

 

[Skigh]

Nora Quoirin's family hit out at 'distressing and unhelpful' comments by other relatives
17 Aug 2019
Tragic teen's family hit out at 'distressing, unhelpful' comments by relatives
To which specific comments are they referring?

I think it could be referring to a comment made by the grandfather referring to dark happenings and she did not get to the waterfall alone.
In my opinion the Quorians have been very dignified and respectful towards the Malaysians and would not want to destroy any good feeling.
It could also be in case other family make comments either online or to journalists.

 

[MsBetsy]

Nora Quoirin's family hit out at 'distressing and unhelpful' comments by other relatives
17 Aug 2019
Tragic teen's family hit out at 'distressing, unhelpful' comments by relatives
To which specific comments are they referring?

Maybe the ones that described her as having mild disabilities.
Holoprosencephaly is not normally a mild condition. Imo

 

[momrids6]

Yes, the description was explained in more detail and clarified later.
I guess it depends on how you look at it. To me ADHD, Dyslexia, language Disorders, and other LD's are mild disabilities. Many behavior disorders are mild disabilities.
Anyway, I was referring to how she would be classified in terms of SpecialEd. Imo

The school she attended states it is a school for moderate disabilities

 

[MsBetsy]

I think it could be referring to a comment made by the grandfather referring to dark happenings and she did not get to the waterfall alone.
In my opinion the Quorians have been very dignified and respectful towards the Malaysians and would not want to destroy any good feeling.
It could also be in case other family make comments either online or to journalists.

And that too. (in addition to the mild disability comment)