Mark Sievers Trial General Discussion Thread

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

But wasn't Ms. Ross's point/line of questioning that Mark Sievers could "contest" the rules of the trust and have it changed to basically anything he wants since he's still living? This is the question that Ms. Lyons did NOT want to answer......her voice was getting softer and softer toward the end.....I hope hearing aid man could hear.

I kinda wish the State would have asked Ms. Lyons, "Did you ever personally advice Mark Sievers that in the event his wife passes away he could change the conditions of the trust?"

It's not that Mark could change or contest the terms of the trust, that would be extremely difficult to do. The point was that it was written into the trust that distributions were to be flexible and generous to the point of distributing the entire principal to Mark. So, by its very terms, Mark could pretty much do whatever he wanted with the trust funds.

 

[mom2chloe]

It's not that Mark could change or contest the terms of the trust, that would be extremely difficult to do. The point was that it was written into the trust that distributions were to be flexible and generous to the point of distributing the entire principal to Mark. So, by its very terms, Mark could pretty much do whatever he wanted with the trust funds.

In other words, Mark could have had the responsibility of determining how the trust was distributed more specifically how it was spent particularly in regards to providing for the girls. Continued overspending with zero regard for the girl’s future education and wellbeing. Much the same management as he always provided. He had zero work ethic but spent beyond their means always. Free money that he needed more of always!

 

[katydid23]

I guess it would've helped if we had sent our questions and concerns to the prosecutors, a few months ago. I still have Hope, though.

We shouldn't have to send them our concerns and questions. But you are right, we should have asked Beach to send them a tutorial on this case.

 

[Bobbywoo]

Hard to imagine he had no character witnesses lol
Who wants to get in bed with him literally or figuratively?

He reminds me of someone I worked with. We had three shifts with about 250 employees in the same building. There was this goofy married guy that would proposition most of the women there. I made a comment about how in the world does he get women to "bite". They said that I would be surprised, out of every approx 25 women he propositions he'll get two or three. (It was long ago and I'm paraphrasing here) And when you chase EVERY skirt that can add up. And he landed some pretty attractive women. Persistent apparently paid off.

 

[Recidivist]

Not one "character witness" for the defendant?

A character witness might be used during the penalty phase of the trial. His character or lack thereof is not relevant to the question of guilt or innocence. imo

 

[kaen]

But wasn't Ms. Ross's point/line of questioning that Mark Sievers could "contest" the rules of the trust and have it changed to basically anything he wants since he's still living? This is the question that Ms. Lyons did NOT want to answer......her voice was getting softer and softer toward the end.....I hope hearing aid man could hear.

I kinda wish the State would have asked Ms. Lyons, "Did you ever personally advice Mark Sievers that in the event his wife passes away he could change the conditions of the trust?"

I think it is important to recognize that both TS and MS knew that the trust was really a tax shield more than a trust. The attorney basically had to admit that. To be able to draw monies at an accustomed lifestyle level meant that MS could continue to be home with the girls and use the funds for maintaining their life style. It is not over seen by anyone and as the spouse and trustee there are no checks and balances on the trust except that they have to file accounting statements that would be used for tax purposes and the IRS if audited. I know people who have wreaked havoc with a trust by using monies for "important things" that were within their lifestyle. However, I think we should be clear that TS wanted this kind of trust as well as MS because they set it up this way.

I think the biggest question to have asked if we had more evidence that the marriage was falling apart revolves around what would have happened if the marriage ended. Would TS have been able to change the trustee? The answer is yes and MS would have been out that lifestyle money.

 

[Webjunkie]

Still no answer about 17 hammer blows. How did MS know if CWW or JRR didn't? Hidden camera? Skype? Who would actually keep count, and who could keep going that many strikes WITHOUT being on some kind of drugs or personal rage???

 

[TTF14]

I think the biggest question to have asked if we had more evidence that the marriage was falling apart revolves around what would have happened if the marriage ended. Would TS have been able to change the trustee? The answer is yes and MS would have been out that lifestyle money.

rsbm

I hope the State includes this in their closing argument. They finally just talked about this on CourtTV and one of the commentators said simply that Mark is the trustee and the beneficiary, so he can manage the trust how he sees fit (now that Teresa is dead and can't name someone else as trustee to her policy).

 

[TrueCrimeAddict55]

In other words, Mark could have had the responsibility of determining how the trust was distributed more specifically how it was spent particularly in regards to providing for the girls. Continued overspending with zero regard for the girl’s future education and wellbeing. Much the same management as he always provided. He had zero work ethic but spent beyond their means always. Free money that he needed more of always!

Bouncing off your MS and "overspending and free money" - it's always amazed me that they were in extreme debt yet MS (Mr. House husband and office manager) had the following hired WEEKLY help: housekeeper - lawn maintenance - pool maintenance - food delivery and tutors for the girls (daily). Imagine how much less their weekly (and monthly and yearly) expenses would be if he did all that himself - but NO - Mr. Show Off had to have hired help while he didn't pay the bills on time so he could squander away 50g's to live off of after he hired someone to kill his wife. In the meantime, he doesn't answer his phone from the office, his home office is a wreck and he spends his days taking baths and playing with himself (puke). Btw - The tutor money was well spent because I can't imagine what he would teach them.

 

[iddy143]

IMO, I think that the $50 thousand was a "what if" fund in case he had to leave the country all of a sudden and not for anything concerning the payment to the hired killers.

That makes sense, but who agrees to kill a friend of a friend’s wife on an IOU? I don’t think we’ll ever know the entire truth of what transpired and why.

 

[TTF14]

That makes sense, but who agrees to kill a friend of a friend’s wife on an IOU? I don’t think we’ll ever know the entire truth of what transpired and why.

I think there may have been some blackmail involved that we don't know about. CWW, IMO, has not been arrested for all of his misdeeds. And I'm sure Mark Sievers is privy to most, if not all, of his crimes.

 

[mom2chloe]

Bouncing off your MS and "overspending and free money" - it's always amazed me that they were in extreme debt yet MS (Mr. House husband and office manager) had the following hired WEEKLY help: housekeeper - lawn maintenance - pool maintenance - food delivery and tutors for the girls (daily). Imagine how much less their weekly (and monthly and yearly) expenses would be if he did all that himself - but NO - Mr. Show Off had to have hired help while he didn't pay the bills on time so he could squander away 50g's to live off of after he hired someone to kill his wife. In the meantime, he doesn't answer his phone from the office, his home office is a wreck and he spends his days taking baths and playing with himself (puke). Btw - The tutor money was well spent because I can't imagine what he would teach them.

What do you think he was doing all that time? One could only watch so much ! For a man who insisted he had to have the biggest house in the neighborhood yet have all the time in the world to maintain it while doing absolutely nothing joggles the mind. I still believe there were illegal prescriptions, fraud and whatever else going on. MOO

 

[Scalex]

Thanks for this gem because many of us have been wondering about this. We don’t even have corroboration that Mark met with Mrs P that day hence why an interview with her was never conducted. Mark was probably throwing back beers and shots while the only people who cared about him were left to themselves to mourn Teresa’s death. Maybe that massive sunburn will cause him future pain and suffering?

I don’t believe for one second that Mrs P wasn’t questioned. Her and mark had daily texts and phone calls for years. That is corroboration of an ongoing relationship. I just don’t think she gave them what they wanted, or it wasn’t relevant to the crime, so they chose not to submit it as evidence. If they never questioned her, then they didn’t do their due diligence. JMO

 

[scapa]

I think it is important to recognize that both TS and MS knew that the trust was really a tax shield more than a trust. The attorney basically had to admit that. To be able to draw monies at an accustomed lifestyle level meant that MS could continue to be home with the girls and use the funds for maintaining their life style. It is not over seen by anyone and as the spouse and trustee there are no checks and balances on the trust except that they have to file accounting statements that would be used for tax purposes and the IRS if audited. I know people who have wreaked havoc with a trust by using monies for "important things" that were within their lifestyle. However, I think we should be clear that TS wanted this kind of trust as well as MS because they set it up this way.

I think the biggest question to have asked if we had more evidence that the marriage was falling apart revolves around what would have happened if the marriage ended. Would TS have been able to change the trustee? The answer is yes and MS would have been out that lifestyle money.[/QUOTE]

BBM.

This question cuts to the heart of the case, IMO, and I’m surprised that it was not underscored over and over, first by witnesses able to testify to TS looking to leave her marriage and then by the costs to MS of that step.

Then the evidence of financial stress, alleged Medicare fraud, insurance policies and even MS jealousy work to mutually reinforce each other and clarify the reasons and timeline. Instead, what we mostly have is CWW and some complicated electronic evidence and the growing sense that TS was worth more to him alive than dead — a baffling conclusion for a jury surely primed to expect the opposite idea

 

[TTF14]

MM is a terrible attorney on cross-examination. He asks questions and if he's not interrupting before the answer is all the way out (to get on to his next question), he just says "OK" if the answer isn't what he wants/needs/expects, and just moves on to the next question instead of trying to clarify! As an example, he asked the detective how he came to think Angela Wright was involved in this crime. The detective says, "past experience in investigating crimes." MM said, "OK" and moves on to a question about a prepaid phone. He doesn't say, "in what way" or "what specifically...." It's like he's not even listening to the answers but only asking his pre-determined questions. In addition, he provides no context or reasoning for asking the questions he does. None!

(The prosecution did their share of this as well, although I think Ms. Ross does a decent job of continuing to dig to get what she's after.)

 

[iddy143]

I think there may have been some blackmail involved that we don't know about. CWW, IMO, has not been arrested for all of his misdeeds. And I'm sure Mark Sievers is privy to most, if not all, of his crimes.

Fore CWW, sure. But why would JRR do this with zero relationship between him and MS and a promise to pay months into the future? That just doesn’t add up for me. I absolutely believe the MS/CWW connection. That’s easy to buy into. But a friend of a friend with zero connection and zero reward? Hmmm...

 

[TTF14]

Fore CWW, sure. But why would JRR do this with zero relationship between him and MS and a promise to pay months into the future? That just doesn’t add up for me. I absolutely believe the MS/CWW connection. That’s easy to buy into. But a friend of a friend with zero connection and zero reward? Hmmm...

JRR didn't testify so who knows what BS CWW told him about getting paid. Also, I think Jimmy the Hammer just likes to kill.

 

[TTF14]

It's not that Mark could change or contest the terms of the trust, that would be extremely difficult to do. The point was that it was written into the trust that distributions were to be flexible and generous to the point of distributing the entire principal to Mark. So, by its very terms, Mark could pretty much do whatever he wanted with the trust funds.

Thank you for clarifying. I hope there some members of the jury who understand it as well as you do. This is not my cup of tea....at all....but I think I still understood correctly (?) that the money in this trust was not going to be inaccessible to him. Is this correct?

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Thank you for clarifying. I hope there some members of the jury who understand it as well as you do. This is not my cup of tea....at all....but I think I still understood correctly (?) that the money in this trust was not going to be inaccessible to him. Is this correct?

Exactly. He had full access to the money. As trustee, he was responsible for distributions to the beneficiaries, and he himself was the primary beneficiary. And the terms of the trust were extremely broad.

The estate attorney was blowing smoke about it being overseen by the court. Theoretically, when the girls come of age, if the money was gone or misused, they could sue Mark for breach of fiduciary duty. It won't fly, though, because Mark is himself a beneficiary and the terms for distribution were very broad. Plus, even if they had a case and won, the money would still be gone.

 

[TrueCrimeAddict55]

What do you think he was doing all that time? One could only watch so much ! For a man who insisted he had to have the biggest house in the neighborhood yet have all the time in the world to maintain it while doing absolutely nothing joggles the mind. I still believe there were illegal prescriptions, fraud and whatever else going on. MOO

Perhaps he was practicing perfecting his narcissism? It joggles my mind too! I'm with you- I think the king also had some illegal fraud and prescription gigs going on that TS was unaware of.