MD - Freddie Gray dies in police custody #2

[bettybaby00]

Not sure if posted, but wow. When Sonny Hostin describes the prosecutor's investigation as "sloppy, sloppy.', regardingthe knife, and then goes on to state "something happened to FG, but I just don't think these charges are appropriate" then the case has serious problems.

[video=youtu;dIogFGC_wZY]http://youtu.be/dIogFGC_wZY[/video]

 

[jjenny]

Well, she charged people with false imprisonment because of the knife that might actually be illegal.
And then two people with the same names as cops, but not cops.
What if actual cops didn't show up, and they arrested two completely unrelated people?
Wouldn't that be something?

 

[DebinGA]

I don't see how the charges are justified. If Porter left because there was a request made, and another officer was in charge, how is Porter responsible?

Porter seems the most clearly innocent of the 6 imo. He obviously tried to help FG by moving him from the floor to the seat in response to FG's complaint that he was having trouble breathing. That would seem to have required Porter to get inside the van with FG, so his failure to seatbelt FG was not due to laziness or being uncaring, but probably to enable FG to make himself as comfortable as possible. Porter also took the initiative to ask FG if he needed a medic before FG asked him for one. The charges against Porter are morally wrong imo.

 

[rob]

Not sure if posted, but wow. When Sonny Hostin describes the prosecutor's investigation as "sloppy, sloppy.', regardingthe knife, and then goes on to state "something happened to FG, but I just don't think these charges are appropriate" then the case has serious problems.

[video=youtu;dIogFGC_wZY]http://youtu.be/dIogFGC_wZY[/video]

You are right about that, Sonny NEVER goes the other way, NEVER.
My biggest concern about the charging so quickly is, it appears to satisify the mob. But if they end up getting the charges dropped for lack of evidence or go to trial and walk, here we go again, most likely bigger and better than the first time. I want justice for FG, but I also want justice for the LE. If only one or two is guilty, then I don't think all 6 should go down.
all MOO

 

[jjenny]

Porter seems the most clearly innocent of the 6 imo. He obviously tried to help FG by moving him from the floor to the seat in response to FG's complaint that he was having trouble breathing. That would seem to have required Porter to get inside the van with FG, so his failure to seatbelt FG was not due to laziness or being uncaring, but probably to enable FG to make himself as comfortable as possible. Porter also took the initiative to ask FG if he needed a medic before FG asked him for one. The charges against Porter are morally wrong imo.

What about the two charged with false imprisonment for a knife that could very well be illegal under city code?

 

[DebinGA]

What about the two charged with false imprisonment for a knife that could very well be illegal under city code?

All three bike cops were charged with false imprisonment because of the knife. That charge has already been debunked imo. Not only that, the Supreme Court test is whether an officer "could reasonably believe" the knife was illegal at the time. The only bike cop charged with involuntary manslaughter like Ofc. Porter was Lt. Rice. I'm not ready to exonerate Rice completely until I learn if leg shackling FG was his idea and whether it was the bike cops job to belt in FG. In so, as senior officer there, Rice should have made sure it was done.

 

[Tawny]

All three bike cops were charged with false imprisonment because of the knife. That charge has already been debunked imo. Not only that, the Supreme Court test is whether an officer "could reasonably believe" the knife was illegal at the time. The only bike cop charged with involuntary manslaughter like Ofc. Porter was Lt. Rice. I'm not ready to exonerate Rice completely until I learn if leg shackling FG was his idea and whether it was the bike cops job to belt in FG. In so, as senior officer there, Rice should have made sure it was done.

That charge as been debunked according to rumor.

 

[DebinGA]

That charge as been debunked according to rumor.

Do you agree that the Supreme Court standard is whether an officer "could reasonably believe in that situation at that moment" that the knife was illegal? Is my SC interpretation incorrect? Because what seems highly unreasonable to me is expecting officers to discuss/debate/discern the difference between "switchblade" - "spring assisted" - "other device" in a volatile, potentially life-threatening situation, then be held criminally responsible later on for being wrong.

 

[Tawny]

Do you agree that the Supreme Court standard is whether an officer "could reasonably believe in that situation at that moment" that the knife was illegal? Is my SC interpretation incorrect? Because what seems highly unreasonable to me is expecting officers to discuss/debate/discern the difference between "switchblade" - "spring assisted" - "other device" in a volatile, potentially life-threatening situation, then be held criminally responsible later on for being wrong.

I think distinguishing between 2 knives of the same size and shape is dumb, IMO, to be honest. It can either stick people and cause bleeding or it can't, and that is either legal or it isn't.

 

[Ausgirl]

Re suspicious lack of information:

Baltimore Police have admitted the van transporting Freddie Gray made a previously unreported stop.

The mysterious development, announced on Thursday, emerged after the department surveyed a privately-owned security camera during their investigation into Gray’s death, which has been completed and handed to the state prosecutor.

It is not known why the van stopped at the corner of North Fremont Ave and Mosher Street before it made another two stops then finally transported Gray to the hospital. He died of a severe spinal injury a week later.

Police Commissioner Anthony Batts refused to elaborate on the new information.

http://www.ijreview.com/2015/04/310...of-police-van-that-was-carrying-freddie-gray/

I suspect, since NONE of the police involved chose to include thiis "mystery" stop on their initial reports, it likely would have remained a mystery were it not for investigators turning up a copy of the CCTV recording. The original of which went missing.

But why is it a mystery at all? WHY would these officers decide to leave this stop off the record?

Another strange detail that's emerged: Lt Brian Rice seems to have been the one directing the van's so far inexplicable, circuitous 40+ minute route to the station - which was actually just a couple of minutes drive from arrest location.

"Told Officer Caesar Goodson where to drive and stop the van."

Why would he need to do that? Was Goodson unable to find the police station on his own?

How was Rice "telling" Goodson where to go and stop, and for how long?

Very curious stuff.

 

[Tawny]

It's a straight shot from where he was put in shackles to where the station is... Why the detour? Why were they going east when the second subject was picked up well north of that stop and the station?

Very interesting...

 

[DebinGA]

I don't see any explanation in Mosby's charging transcript for why Goodson went to Stop 4, where Ofc. Porter responded, much less the new Stop 3 instead of to the nearby police station. Goodson's voluntarily heading off way-northwest to Stop 5 near FG's arrest makes zero sense to me.

ETA: Mosby charging transcript contains info about Goodson's various stops

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/cri...eddie-gray-death-transcript-article-1.2206744

 

[dandy]

Do you agree that the Supreme Court standard is whether an officer "could reasonably believe in that situation at that moment" that the knife was illegal? Is my SC interpretation incorrect? Because what seems highly unreasonable to me is expecting officers to discuss/debate/discern the difference between "switchblade" - "spring assisted" - "other device" in a volatile, potentially life-threatening situation, then be held criminally responsible later on for being wrong.

ummmm - hopefully a/cooper is not televising his show from nyc - if he was = hopefully he had l/e bring that knife to him . . . cause it's illegal in nyc.

 

[Ausgirl]

I agree in general, but there may be a history between the two men that would make Rice's behavior not excusable, but more understandable. Rice had a child with the woman who "was then" the wife of the complainant. Maybe visitation issues were involved, which often make normally sane people crazy.

Incident in 2008. Another one in 2013. And then he had his guns taken off him after threatening suicide.

It seems this man went off the deep end on a fairly regular basis. And there's NOTHING "understandable" about anything he did! Nothing. Brutal, chronic domestic violence... and his victim somehow "pushed" him to it? How else are we meant to "understand" his pulling a gun on them? He should be in prison.

I really don't see any evidence the police department tried to shield him. It seems it was thoroughly investigated and that is the reason we know the specifics on what occurred.

It seems more about a DA who didn't seek charges against him.

IMO

Investigated -- by whom? I wonder. I have not seen any mention of any investigation, let alone a thorough one.

After pulling a gun and trying to kidnap his ex and child, and having a stand-off with police for one and a half hours... he was let go, to walk home. Then the attending cops lost the paperwork!!!!

 

[DebinGA]

It's a straight shot from where he was put in shackles to where the station is... Why the detour? Why were they going east when the second subject was picked up well north of that stop and the station?

Very interesting...

Why were "they" who going east? Ofc. Goodson and FG? Even Mosby claims Lt. Rice, after shackling FG's feet at Stop 2, "then directed Officer Goodson to transport Mr. Gray to the Central Booking & Intake Facility." Is that "Facility" another name for "the station" ... which is straight south? Just trying to separate the players in this saga.

 

[MissSunshine]

Why were "they" who going east? Ofc. Goodson and FG? Even Mosby claims Lt. Rice, after shackling FG's feet at Stop 2, "then directed Officer Goodson to transport Mr. Gray to the Central Booking & Intake Facility." Is that "Facility" another name for "the station" ... which is straight south? Just trying to separate the players in this saga.

Central Bookings is not the police station. Central Bookings is on E. Madison St and the route the van was taking was the way to Central Bookings.

 

[DebinGA]

After pulling a gun and trying to kidnap his ex and child, and having a stand-off with police for one and a half hours

~rsbm

Yikes! I did not know that. That's very troubling, if true.

 

[DebinGA]

Central Bookings is not the police station. Central Bookings is on E. Madison St and the route the van was taking was the way to Central Bookings.

TY. Has a good map been posted that I've missed?

Map of events, not necessarily the most recent:

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/150501100046-freddie-gray-timeline-map-exlarge-169.jpg

 

[bettybaby00]

ummmm - hopefully a/cooper is not televising his show from nyc - if he was = hopefully he had l/e bring that knife to him . . . cause it's illegal in nyc.

Lol. Anderson trying to be bad Axx!

 

[CoolJ]

Well, one thing everyone here seems to agree on is that there is corruption by authorities in B'more.
Police, politicians or both? Whatever the answer is, it needs to change. Hence the justified protests.