Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #14

[wasnt_me]

Looking forward to the Sun article. I really love that the PR tide has turned. At the onset of this whole thing the papers were sopping wet with bad press, lies, etc. Now, let it be soaked with the truth.

 

[SkewedView]

Wow! THANKS FOR THIS. I had forgotten all about this case, but now I remember, I saw a long documentary about it on a cable station. Yes, they were SURE the brother did it, and he even confessed to it. (Knox) But in the end, it was the transient. (Guede) The murder weapon did not match, just as in the Kercher murder. And the inappropriateness of the brothers, the Dungeons and Dragons game, same said of Knox and Sollectio. The refusal of police and prosecution to recant. Yes, it is an echo of this case, the two are one and the same.

And this is echoes Bruce Fisher, Hendry, Dr. Hampakian words:

Note also that Eskendido LE prematurely eliminated the possibility of B&E in the case (due to sloppy scene documentation and faulty assumptions)...thus leading them to focus exclusively on members of the household...sound familiar?

 

[wasnt_me]

Right, isn't this the case that I put a link to the video of is actual interrogation in here a few threads back when we were once again trying to explain false confessions?

I'd also put the link in about Ryan furgeson, and his friend chuck.

For me, while I do want to believe in innocent until proven guilty, I can't ignore obvious guilt. I also cannot ignore when confessions or forced or the evidience seems biased or the conclusions seem misleading. Sometimes, they might have done it, but the prosecution has not proved its case. I can't stand for that, because if I do, then who will stand up for me if it happens to me when I'm innocent?

 

[Nova]

I thought that it had been asserted many times from Otto that if he wanted to read other messageboards, he'd go there. So why are you having to reply to a post he made where he quoted other messageboards? If you or any of us wanted to read other messageboards, we'd go there, right? Isn't that what he said? Just wondering.

Apparently, I function under different rules than some. And I don't mind that, but let's be honest about the rules we are using.

 

[Nova]

I still believe that this case and the way that it has been handled closely resembles the mess surrounding the Stephanie Crowe murder....

I know the case and I agree: best comparison. Someone will be here shortly to say that AK and RS were older than the boys in the Crowe case, and that is true.

AK was all of three years older than one of Crowe's friends. But she was in a foreign country, functioning at least partly in a language in which she was less than fluent.

 

[ziggy]

Here here and bravo! I've referenced the false confession of Michael Crowe also in the WM3 case - another situation where I believe LE made everything "fit" their ideas instead of following the evidence. But I digress...

the Crowe case is a classic example. Did everyone have a meeting and conspire to wrongfully blame the brother and friends? No, but the group think takes on a life of its own somehow and while not consciously planned it is still wrong and subjects innocent people to a horrible injustice.

 

[SMK]

If we can't find one, then maybe we are allowed to make one? I wasnt sure because it's not really "in the news."

The problem is, Noura was already convicted, so I am not sure. There is no ongoing appeal as with Knox. http://thenewspk1.blogspot.com/2010/04/noura-jackson-updates.html

 

[SMK]

Note also that Eskendido LE prematurely eliminated the possibility of B&E in the case (due to sloppy scene documentation and faulty assumptions)...thus leading them to focus exclusively on members of the household...sound familiar?

This is where it all went wrong in BOTH cases, IMO. From that point on, to quote Nietzsche, "it was a psychological self-misunderstanding which grew cruder with each step."

 

[SMK]

Another thought I have always had about the staged break-in, and may have mentioned this some months ago:
Even if the break-in were definitely staged, it still by no means points necessarily to Knox and Sollecito:
1. Guede had expressed an interest in Kercher
2. Guede knew no one would be home other than Kercher (talk at Le Chic)
3. Guede may have tried for a romantic evening with Kercher, was surprised by a violent rebuff, and it escalated to an unplanned rape/homicide.
4. Guede knows he has left his DNA on Kercher, so he can only say that they had consensual sex and then she was killed by another.
5. He stages the break-in to point to a later intruder.
6. He flees to Germany, leaving AK and RS to discover the crime scene. They get blamed for the staging.
7. In fact, Rudy did maintain all of this.

 

[SMK]

An interesting perspective/commentary just published, written by a friend of Doug Preston and Joseph Bishop. It of course presupposes things about Mignini and Guede. I give an excerpt. The lengthy piece continues at the link::waitasec:


Then Zanobini read a document in which Mignini had interviewed an associate of Gabriela Carlizzi; the woman wove a bizarre tale that included many of the principals in the Monster investigation, the first of many lunacies Zanobini presented at trial. On May 21, 2008 Mr. Calamandrei was found innocent and “acquitted for the reason that the Allegation is Nonexistent.” That means, in Italian Law, that the crime had never occurred and Mignini failed to prove Satanism in court. Six and a half months later he would try again when he prosecuted Amanda and Raffaele for murder and accused them of being Satanists.

But on Oct 31, 2007 Mignini had been indicted for Abuse of Office and was awaiting trial. Calamandrei’s trail had just started. He was dealing with Carlizzi by himself. Giuttari was gone, sent back to Rome in shame. And a few powerful locals were not happy about the ORR/wealthy Old Italian family theory he had floated. Mignini’s career was on shaky ground and he needed a distraction, a sleight of hand, to shift attention away from himself for a while.

November 2, 2007 the distraction arrived in the form of Amanda Knox.

The night before, All Saint’s Day, Rudy Guede killed Meredith Kercher in a botched robbery/rape. Meredith’s murder is thirteen years to the day when Pietro Pacciani was convicted of being the Monster of Florence. Pacciani was the only person ever convicted of the crime, he was exonerated on appeal and all charges dropped in 1997.

Mignini and Scientific Police Chief Edgardo Giobbi (Giuttari’s replacement?) colluded to charge Amanda and Raffaele with Meredith’s murder, along with another innocent man, Patrick Lumumba. Mignini theorized Satanist involvement because of the proximity to Halloween and Carlizzi predicted that both girls belonged to the Order of the Red Rose. “One came to murder and one came to be the victim, neither knowing who would fulfill what role,” she mysteriously proclaimed.

November 2nd, All Soul’s Day, would begin an unending nightmare for three innocent families as their children gave up their lives to murder, vanity and avarice. Meredith dead, Amanda and Raffaele trapped in prison by corruption.

Amanda would bear the brunt of the international hate created by the PM and his henchmen while the official slight of hand deftly scooped up and imprisoned Rudy Guede, conveniently shutting him up with only a rare comment from his lawyer. Guede is the young man who’s DNA, fingerprints and shoeprints were all over the crime scene. All over Meredith. In 2010 his 30-year sentence for Meredith’s murder was cut to 16-years when he was ‘encouraged’ by his lawyers to write a letter of apology to the Kercher family for sexually brutalizing their daughter and then slashing her throat when she fought back.

http://www.vashonloop.com/article/monster-florence-claims-new-victims

 

[SkewedView]

I am reserving judgment with regards to Mignini's corruption or lack thereof until such time as his trial has gone through its appeals process (remember, just like AK & RS, he is not considered convicted until then, and has a good chance of having the original decision tossed out, due to the lousy first trials and robust appeals people get in Italy).

 

[dgfred]

I know. These all were shot down by Fisher and Hendry, and now they just do not ring true for me anymore.

That's weird to me because those two helped to seal my belief in the guilty verdicts.

Especially BF :crazy:

 

[SMK]

That's weird to me because those two helped to seal my belief in the guilty verdicts.

Especially BF :crazy:

I actually can understand why this would be, from your perspective of them as PR people and zealots. Believe me, I ain't blind to the "spin doctoring". It's just that once doubts are planted in my mind......it's "reasonable doubt" time.

 

[dgfred]

Another thought I have always had about the staged break-in, and may have mentioned this some months ago:
Even if the break-in were definitely staged, it still by no means points necessarily to Knox and Sollecito:
1. Guede had expressed an interest in Kercher
2. Guede knew no one would be home other than Kercher (talk at Le Chic)
3. Guede may have tried for a romantic evening with Kercher, was surprised by a violent rebuff, and it escalated to an unplanned rape/homicide.
4. Guede knows he has left his DNA on Kercher, so he can only say that they had consensual sex and then she was killed by another.
5. He stages the break-in to point to a later intruder.
6. He flees to Germany, leaving AK and RS to discover the crime scene. They get blamed for the staging.
7. In fact, Rudy did maintain all of this.

#1 kind of leads us (and maybe you) astray, RG had 'fancied' (shown interest) in AK... not Meredith.

#2 isn't quite right either, what 'talk'. He could have never 'known' who was home or who could possibly come home. But he could have just 'chanced it'.

**This (staged by RG) was the only theory that AK and RS supporters should have tried to 'float' to the public/judges/jury.

***So NOW are you saying there WAS or WAS NOT a staged break-in (in your opinion)??? Just want to be clear.

 

[SMK]

Newest Mignini article:

«Nessuna traccia di Amanda nella stanza del delitto». Mignini smentisce l’articolo di «Oggi»: «Mai rilasciate interviste»
Il pm: «E' stato un colloquio informale, se qualcuno ha registrato ed estrapolato affermazioni si assumerà responsabilità»

No trace of Amanda in the scene of the crime. "Mignini belies the article "Today": "Never give interviews'
The prosecutor: 'It was an informal interview, if someone has recorded and extrapolated statements will assume responsibility "

L’audio di un’intervista concessa a un giornalista inglese dal sostituto procuratore di Perugia Giuliano Mignini, è stato consegnato lunedì da uno dei difensori di Raffaele Sollecito, l’avvocato Luca Maori, al procuratore generale Giancarlo Costagliola che insieme allo stesso magistrato e a Manuela Comodi rappresenta l’accusa nel processo d’appello al giovane pugliese e ad Amanda Knox per l’omicidio di Meredith Kercher.

Articolo in edicola su Oggi Lo sostiene il settimanale ‘Oggì in un articolo in edicola da mercoledì del quale è stata fornita un’anticipazione. «Gli ho consegnato il dischetto senza fare commenti» ha rivelato a Oggi l’avvocato Maori. Nel cd – sostiene il settimanale in una nota – le dichiarazioni rese da Mignini in un lungo colloquio con Bob Graham, giornalista inglese che collabora con il tabloid The Sun.


The audio of an interview with a British journalist from Giuliano Mignini deputy prosecutor of Perugia, was delivered Monday by one of the defenders of Raffaele Sollecito, the lawyer Luca Maori, the public prosecutor Giancarlo Costagliola together at the same magistrate and Manuela Convenient to present the prosecution in the appeal to the young man from Puglia and Amanda Knox for the murder of Meredith Kercher.

Article on sale on Today The Weekly claims the 'Today in an article in the newsstands on Wednesday which was given a preview. 'I handed the disk without comment, "he revealed today at the Maori lawyer. In the CD - the weekly says in a note - the statements made ​​by Mignini in a long interview with Bob Graham, a British journalist working with the tabloid The Sun
http://www.umbria24.it/%C2%ABnessuna-traccia-di-amanda-nella-stanza-del-delitto%C2%BB-mignini-smentisce-larticolo-di-%C2%ABoggi%C2%BB-%C2%ABmai-rilasciate-interviste%C2%BB/44712.html

 

[SMK]

#1 kind of leads us (and maybe you) astray, RG had 'fancied' (shown interest) in AK... not Meredith.

#2 isn't quite right either, what 'talk'. He could have never 'known' who was home or who could possibly come home. But he could have just 'chanced it'.

**This (staged by RG) was the only theory that AK and RS supporters should have tried to 'float' to the public/judges/jury.

***So NOW are you saying there WAS or WAS NOT a staged break-in (in your opinion)??? Just want to be clear.

I go round in circles on it. I believe it MAY have been staged, but also may have not. Rudy himself claims he spoke with Kercher a couple days before she died at a club, and went to wait for her on the night of Nov.1 --I do think the defense ought to have asserted Guede staged it to cover sex turned rape/murder, YES, absolutely.

 

[Nova]

The problem is, Noura was already convicted, so I am not sure. There is no ongoing appeal as with Knox. http://thenewspk1.blogspot.com/2010/04/noura-jackson-updates.html

Do you happen to know whether the hand of Noura's that was cut was her dominant hand or not? Because I can't remember a case where a knife wielder was cut on the back of his or her hand; usually the knife slips and slices his or her fingers (as in the case of RG). But if the cut wasn't on her dominant hand, it's easier for me to understand that she may have accidentally stabbed herself while stabbing her mother 50 times.

(In any event, of course, there's the question of why Noura was out buying bandages at 4 a.m. while her mother lay dead in a blood-covered bedroom at home.)

 

[Nova]

Another thought I have always had about the staged break-in, and may have mentioned this some months ago:
Even if the break-in were definitely staged, it still by no means points necessarily to Knox and Sollecito:
1. Guede had expressed an interest in Kercher
2. Guede knew no one would be home other than Kercher (talk at Le Chic)
3. Guede may have tried for a romantic evening with Kercher, was surprised by a violent rebuff, and it escalated to an unplanned rape/homicide.
4. Guede knows he has left his DNA on Kercher, so he can only say that they had consensual sex and then she was killed by another.
5. He stages the break-in to point to a later intruder.
6. He flees to Germany, leaving AK and RS to discover the crime scene. They get blamed for the staging.
7. In fact, Rudy did maintain all of this.

I agree and have always thought this. A staged break-in might well be intended to benefit RG.

 

[dgfred]

I agree and have always thought this. A staged break-in might well be intended to benefit RG.

So is 'your' opinion now that there was a staged break-in? :waitasec:

 

[Nova]

I go round in circles on it. I believe it MAY have been staged, but also may have not. Rudy himself claims he spoke with Kercher a couple days before she died at a club, and went to wait for her on the night of Nov.1 --I do think the defense ought to have asserted Guede staged it to cover sex turned rape/murder, YES, absolutely.

How will we ever know whether the break-in was staged? That room was never properly investigated.