See, I did not know that it was. I believed it was a simple fact. It is not so much the key, but a door which you cannot get OUT of without using a key, which is the crux of the matter.
Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #15
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Right, what WERE they thinking????????:maddening:
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That is exactly what everyone was asking a week ago when it happened. I think it should be noted that many people that want Knox and Sollecito to be innocent are already finding ways to rewrite history to suggest that it was the prosecution that introduced the 5 lying prisoners ... but it was in fact the defense that introduced the prisoners, with Sollecito choosing one prisoner lie, Knox choosing a different prisoner lie, and the whole thing falling apart because the lies contradicted each other. Because of the contradiction, and because the prisoners claimed that Guede was the source of the lies, the Judge decided to bring Guede in to testify.
Guede had written a letter to a news outlet in 2010 accusing the pair of being present at the time of the murder, but Sollecito's lawyer claimed that she had never heard of the letter. That is why she strenuously argued to keep it out of evidence. It was a complete fumble on behalf of the defense, and now they are looking to the DNA review and hoping for the best. In fact, I think the five lying prisoners seriously detracted from the strength of their legal positions. Furthermore, with the letter from Guede entered into evidence, and the Supreme Court ruling that Guede did not act alone, it does not look good for the pair.
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It may be a double key lock ... I've never looked into it, but I do recall some discussion about it. It was clarified in several places in the summary report that there were only four sets of keys. Furthermore, with four strangers living in a cottage together, I think it would be unusual for a main door key to be left lying around, or sitting in the lock, as it would be too easy for a visitor to steal the key (recall that Knox was reported to have brought several new friends to he cottage and that made Meredith uncomfortable).
:sigh:
AK didn't "invent" the story of PL's participation, she merely acquiesced to ILE's insistence on it. After being told she'd go to jail for 30 years if she did not. She should not have done so, but she is hardly the first to cave under that sort of pressure.
By the "gift statement" of the morning of Nov. 6, AK was already recanting, saying the memory she'd been pressured into recounting seemed more "unreal than real" to her. That alone should have been a red flag that caused Perugia LE to act with restraint and caution.
As for Knox' mother, she was half-a-planet away. She had no way of knowing whether PL was being held solely based on her daughter's statement or whether ILE had other evidence of his involvement (something LE surely had told AK on the night of the statements, given the way interrogations work).
Neither woman spoke fluent Italian, yet you insist they should have engaged fully and candidly with Italian-speaking LE!
This insistence that AK and her mother are solely to blame for the bumbling of Perugia cops has been repeated here so often it comes perilously close to deliberate misrepresentation.
You are reading a secondhand account. You don't know for sure what AK actually said and what is a transliteration. Even the claims that AK had met RG before the murder are based on what evidence?
And again I remind you that not everyone who misspeaks is lying.
But some people are just as careless with the truth as AK is accused of being.
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When Edda testified that she did not inform investigators about her daughter's lies because she did not speak Italian, I think most of the world was left picking their jaws up off the ground. Really? She didn't speak Italian so she decided to not say anything? How did she manage to book a hotel room without speaking Italian, communicate with lawyers, order a meal? Surely she discovered that many Italians spoke English. Surely she had learned that some investigators spoke English after talking with her daughter. Surely she was aware of the interpreter that was provided to Knox when she first told her lies. Surely there was one student somewhere in Perugia that spoke English and Italian that could have assisted. Yet, she chose to keep the secret that Patrick was not involved because she "didn't speak Italian" ... never mind all the Italians she interacted with that spoke English. Ridiculous!
What ARE you talking about? If a key had been left in the front door, then RG could have let himself out without confronting MK.
I don't doubt that somebody somewhere suggested a key was in the door, but it isn't central to any theory of the case. So why go on and on about it?
Probably that they had an ethical obligation to present testimony that exonerates their client.
We don't know that yet another lie from RG had any effect on the proceeding.
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We do know what Knox said in court because the video is available online and reporters that are fluent in English and Italian attended the hearing. Knox said that the first time that she, Sollecito and Guede were in the same room together was in the courtroom in Perugia. ABC news sanitized that statement to paint Knox with a cleaner paintbrush and announced that Knox claimed the only time she had ever been in a room together with Guede in her life was in the courtroom. By omitting Sollecito from the statement, they inadvertently transformed her statement into a lie.
Have a look at Knox's court testimony for information regarding the times they met prior to the murder (at her place of work, in the square, at a party in the downstairs flat in the cottage).
It seems to me that we had discussion in the last couple of months regarding whether the US media was sanitizing trial facts; whether the information provided to the public omitted information regarding evidence. The ABC clip is a good example of misleading US media information about the case.
Right, they did not do her any favors, but she herself told the truth: She said "the only time Rudy Guede, Raffaele Sollecito, and myself were in a room together is in court. He knows we were not there. "
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I read a few posts back that Hendry relies on an imaginery key in the main door to frame Guede as the lonewolf in the murder. We can imagine that keys to the front door were left lying all over the cottage, but the facts are that there were four sets of keys and no more.
If Guede climbed in through the window in Filomina's bedroom, then he could just as easily have climbed out the window. At no time would he have been trapped if he acted alone.
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How can it be perceived as an ethical obligation to parade lying child murderers through the court, particularly murderers with a prior history of giving false testimony in other cases?
Your response completely ignores what I posted and reverts to a song you've been singing for years. Surely you're tired of it by now!
AK didn't bring PL into the investigation originally, ILE did. AK merely caved to pressure and agreed to a statement pushed on her by police. AK had no way of knowing there was no other evidence against PL.
AK's mother also had no way of knowing there was no other evidence against PL. Why would she call police?
If some people would set aside their need to demonize the Knox family and try to look at things based on the little people knew in the confusing first weeks after the murder, some of this would be much clearer.
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Ok, if you are working under the assumption that Amanda was involved in the murder, that could be construed as a valid criticism if you ignore LE's role in holding PL for two weeks on an extremely weak identification. Forgetting the fact he had at least two (I think it ended up being many more in the end) people vouch for his alibi for the time in question, and there was not a single piece of evidence that tied him to the murder scene. Forgetting the fact you are equating two weeks with over 3 and 1/2 years, then yes they are the exact same thing.
Since you believe AK is guilty what would you have done to free PL if you were her mother? Would you have known she was telling the truth that PL was not involved, since she is always lying? So, you would have come forward knowing (how exactly would you know at that point) she lied about PL's involvement to cover up for someone else?
However, in the case of Ms. Mellas (if she believed her daughter was involved in the murder or not), how did she know for certain PL was not involved ? RG knows for sure if AK and RS were involved or not, and he is either lying or not. Ms. Mellas if her daughter was involved or not had no idea if PL was involved or not at the time. She certainly was not as informed as Perugia LE. So that accusation is utterly unfounded and at best disingenuous.
right, and it is actually the door being as it is that is central. Most doors you can let yourself out from the inside, but not in from the outside. This locked both ways. I had a door like that in California; the lock was up above the doorknob and needed a key to get out and to lock it. I think this was pretty much established by all in the cottage, so do not know why Otto is pondering it. It may indeed have made all the difference in this case.
Nor does Rudy Guede's. :razz:
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Indeed, I do not buy the story that after 2 hours of questioning Knox was forced to implicate an innocent man, and then forced to keep it a secret for two weeks. You do accept the claim that after 2 hours Knox was forced to implicate an innocent man. There we are, and there we will remain. I'm not ignoring your position, I'm simply pointing out how I and the courts view the evidence. As long as it is stated that Knox was coerced to implicate an innocent man after 2 hours, I will continue to state that it is farfetched and unbelievable. She was found guilty for her decision to implicate Patrick and keep it a secret.
That he murdered a child may make one question his ethos, but it doesn't automatically mean he is lying about this matter. Alessi is no more and no less a killer than Rudy Guede.
Your use of the word "parade" is propaganda. Alessi testified to what he says he heard from RG. His testimony was corroborated by others and denied by RG. The court may now decide what value to give each testimony.
(If history is any guide, the court will throw out anything exculpatory to AK and RS and eat up anything inculpatory as if it were candy.)
Of course a defense lawyer has an obligation to present testimony that a principal in the case made statements that exonerate the lawyer's client.
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