Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #21

[SilkySifaka]

WOW! Thank you for posting this, I didn't know just how much he had done. This is meant seriously, after reading this and knowing the lies he started during this case, has anyone suggested Mignini for mental evaluation? He certainly sounds at the least clinically paranoid, at the most...psychotic with all these conspiracy theories he seems to see.

I was going to throw the overused term psychopath at him until I realized its hard to be a psychotic psychopath. Or at least i think it is.

Well from everything I know of Magnini, how he handled Spezzi, Preston, AK and RS as well as the things he has been convicted of...only one word fits. Evil.

IMO

eta and I see another conviction coming down the pike for him as well once the motivations of the ruling today are posted by the courts.

 

[Nova]

People handle thing that are catastrophic differently, but doing cartwheels is very odd! When my husband was shot in the head, I wouldn't even go close to his bed the first hour, his head was so big it didn't look like him anymore! I never asked who shot him or how it happened. I saw it on the news 4 hours later while he was in brain surgery, my 14 year old son made all decisions, the only thing I told the surgeon was I wanted life support and surgrey at all cost! I am one of the last people to judge anyone's behavior while in shock, but Amanda was as odd as CA!

"Cartwheels" is just a word. There is no video of the incident and nobody knows what AK was doing. She (or her lawyer) has said she was stretching.

But "cartwheels" stuck in the media and on message boards because in English, we use "doing cartwheels" as a metaphor for expressing joy. So AK "doing cartwheels" sounds very revealing of an inappropriate state of mind.

In fact, it means nothing. We don't even know what she actually did.

Most of the so-called "evidence" against AK is like this.

 

[Allusonz]

Sorry Gitana, it took me a while because I wanted Amanda's own testimony on how and when she meet Rudy.

Here’s the actual court transcript:

Carlo Pacelli (CP), Patrick Lumumba’s lawyer: In what circumstances did you meet him (Rudy)?

Amanda Knox (AK): I was in the center, near the church. It was during an evening when I met the guys that lived underneath in the apartment underneath us, and while I was mingling with them, they introduced me to Rudy.

CP: So it was on the occasion of a party at the house of the neighbors downstairs?

AK: Yes. What we did is, they introduced me to him downtown just to say “This is Rudy, this is Amanda”, and then I spent most of my time with Meredith, but we all went back to the house together.

CP: Did you also know him, or at least see him, in the pub “Le Chic”, Rudy?

AK: I think I saw him there once.

CP: Listen, this party at the neighbors, it took place in the second half of October? What period, end of October? 2007?

AK: I think it was more in the middle of October.

I don't believe you can equate being introduced to someone as "knowing" them. I am introduced to many people whom I know nothing about and may never see again or may see periodically at a function

 

[lonetraveler]

I happen to think that the Knox family missed some of those red flags in their <modsnip> daughter before she left for Italy!:twocents:

I think you have hit the nail right on its head, Linask.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

Does anyone know if the other 2 young ladies who lived in the flat with Meredith and Amanda [ sorry -- I can't remember their names right now ] have made any statements ?

I am curious ... and I sure would like to know what they have to say about today's decision.

TIA !

 

[wasnt_me]

"Cartwheels" is just a word. There is no video of the incident and nobody knows what AK was doing. She (or her lawyer) has said she was stretching.

But "cartwheels" stuck in the media and on message boards because in English, we use "doing cartwheels" as a metaphor for expressing joy. So AK "doing cartwheels" sounds very revealing of an inappropriate state of mind.

In fact, it means nothing. We don't even know what she actually did.

Most of the so-called "evidence" against AK is like this.

Nova!

I was just looking for you! :seeya: Now, the celebration is complete!

 

[marlame]

So AK got convicted and sentenced to 3 years in jail (already served) for accusing Patrick of the murder? No coercion, no pressure, no implanted imaginations, but also not because she had anything to do with the murder. Yeah right. There are remarkable contradictions with the previous trial and Rudy's trials where it was concluded that the evidence proved that multiple people were involved. We have to wait till this court explains why they think those people were not AK and RS. I doubt they will reopen the case though to find these people. The result is very disappointing and openly cheering seems a bit inappropriate especially considering the pain and suffering of the Kercher family. My thoughts are with them.

If multiple people were involved then maybe what a few of Rudy's former cellmate's have said is true...They claim Rudy admitted to them that AK & RS had nothing to do with the crime against Meredith. Per what Rudy told them it was either his brother or one of his friends.

Sadly, because the Prosecutor was so hell bent on AK & RS as the "co-conspirator's"...Rudy, the actual killer, has a reduced sentence of 16 years vs 30 years for his "cooperation" in testifying against AK & RS. I fear there is no way Meredith's family will ever find out if there were others involved. My heart goes out to the Kercher's...they are the ones who have suffered the greatest loss. :hug:

 

[alwayslooking]

Thank your sons so much for their service. They are not forgotten.

With all due respect, however, I'm not sure how your experience relates to Ziggy's post. She was saying (I think) that Knox doing cartwheels and back arches could have been stretching exercises during a break in the long interviewing process regarding the death of her flatmate while casey's partying seemed like a celebration after casey either died or went missing. Two totally different things and different, I think, from showing emotion in front of your wounded child, which I agree, you were 100% right not to do.

I hope your sweet sons recover and I'm so sorry about your husband. God bless em' and you. That is a lot for one family to have to handle.

I am sorry but I disagree, seeing a bloody dead body will throw you into shock, and I have also seen many victim's of crimes and noone does cartwheels....never, I know everyone reacts different, some friend and families fall to the ground and scream, others get mad, some say nothing, but I have yet to see one like Amanda!

 

[wasnt_me]

Okay, so are they appealing the slander up to the supreme court? I wish they wouldn't. PL is a jerk, but I'd just let it go if I were AK.

What about her parents trials?

 

[Monzoo]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am looking forward to reading Hellmann's motivation document for this acquital. I'd especially like to see the reasoning behind the one charge he upheld -- the calunnia against Patrick Lamumba.

Did anyone else notice that on that one charge against Amanda, both the time and fine for the sentenced was changed? IIRC, Amanda's jail sentence was increased from one to three years, but the fine was decreased from 40,000 to 20,000 euros.

I wonder if she will appeal that one conviction to the Supreme Court.

 

[lonetraveler]

With respect, I don't think culture has anything to do with it. Odd behaviour after a crime especially a murder is what criminal profilers and psychiatrists look at all the time. CA's behaviour after knowing her daughter was dead was considered odd regardless what nationality or country you're from (as an example). AK's behaviour was just as odd.

AK's behavior was more than just odd. I have followed the first trial and this last one. I have always thought that she and her boyfriend guilty. I actually think that she is worse than Casey Anthony. Casey Anthony killed her daughter out of selfishness, jealously and out of spite for her mother. IMO, Amanda Knox killed for fun.

 

[gitana1]

Here's a still taken around the moment Sollecito kissed Knox:

On a lighter note, RS really did kinda look like Harry Potter back then.

I thought the same thing! Harry Potter. I also thought they both looked very somber, upset.

No one is cheering here. There are no winners in the end

Well, true. I did tear up when it was announced, though. And I am happy for the two. But Meredith died for nothing. Such a beautiful girl.

I don't believe you can equate being introduced to someone as "knowing" them. I am introduced to many people whom I know nothing about and may never see again or may see periodically at a function

I agree, but I had said there was no evidence they knew each other and she was finding a link that showed they did at least meet which is more than I thought.

Also, there was debate as to whether our government ever got involved. Many of use felt the answer was no. Seems we were wrong:

In Washington, State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland said, "The United States appreciates the careful consideration of this matter within the Italian judicial system." The U.S. Embassy in Rome will continue to provide consular assistance to Knox and her family, she said.
"I am glad that the appeals court gave Amanda the fair hearing that she deserves," said U.S. Sen. Maria Cantwell, D-Washington, who had helped push for the appeal, in a statement. "All countries must live up to their international commitments to provide a fair trial by an impartial tribunal to those accused of crimes.
"Amanda's parents, family and friends have been through an incredible ordeal," Cantwell said. "We are all thankful that she will be free to return to Seattle as soon as possible." http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/03/world/europe/italy-knox-appeal/index.html


This does not indicate to me that the Italian government was pressured or the court paid off by us, and neither Knox's interaction with Guede nor the government involvement changes my mind about her and Sollecito's innocence. But I want to be fair about the facts. Just because it comes from someone whose opinion differs from me does not mean it's not true!

 

[GreenTeam]

Just wanted to share a thought: When I saw the video of Amanda after the verdict today, crying and being carried out, I thought about how different that response was from CA and also OJ, both of whom smiled (along with a few tears perhaps?) when their verdicts were read. One says to me someone's nightmare is ending, the other says "hey, I just got away with murder." IMHO.

 

[Allusonz]

"Cartwheels" is just a word. There is no video of the incident and nobody knows what AK was doing. She (or her lawyer) has said she was stretching.

But "cartwheels" stuck in the media and on message boards because in English, we use "doing cartwheels" as a metaphor for expressing joy. So AK "doing cartwheels" sounds very revealing of an inappropriate state of mind.

In fact, it means nothing. We don't even know what she actually did.

Most of the so-called "evidence" against AK is like this.

Good to see you Nova!!! Have been wondering how you have been navigating those slippery slopes of late and have missed your posts

 

[mdana]

:waitasec: I have been wondering if the Italian Judicial System will "cave in" because of the "pressure" from the US Media and the Knox's "PR Spin Team" ?

I hope they do not "cave in" to the US Press and the FOA PR campaign ...

If you are INNOCENT ... then WHY does one HIRE a PR firm ? :banghead:

MOO ...

Malone: Isn't that just like a cadet? Brings a knife to a gun fight. <modsnip>


Which is what happened to the Knox family in the first days of their ordeal. %3

 

[Allusonz]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am looking forward to reading Hellmann's motivation document for this acquital. I'd especially like to see the reasoning behind the one charge he upheld -- the calunnia against Patrick Lamumba.

Did anyone else notice that on that one charge against Amanda, both the time and fine for the sentenced was changed? IIRC, Amanda's jail sentence was increased from one to three years, but the fine was decreased from 40,000 to 20,000 euros.

I wonder if she will appeal that one conviction to the Supreme Court.

This is one aspect of the Italian Judicial system that I have appreciated. I as well am looking forward to reading this. Too often I have been left wondering the how/why et al a decision was reached

 

[kalekona]

I think you have hit the nail right on its head, Linask.

So if the family missed red flags so did her entire community - her school, her soccer coaches, her University, her friends- everyone who ever met Amanda prior to these murders missed the red flags.. and none have come forward to say "you know I knew she was crazy"

There were no red flags because Amanda isn't Casey Anthony.

Just a reminder- AK & RS were not acquitted on bad evidence collection, contamination the were acquitted because they did not commit the crime- that was the Jury's verdict.

Can someone explain to me why she is guilty because she lied about he boss in her "confession" but the "confession" is to be believed 100% ?

 

[wasnt_me]

Umm, she met him at the house and was introduced to him then subsequently saw him at the bar - in other words, she knows him, period, by her own words.


LOL - see this is what I mean about not being able to have a serious debate about this case because no matter what evidence anyone brings to the debate against Amanda it is ALWAYS contradicted.

Even when you have Amanda's own words.

Seriously annoying! I guess we could always have an arguement on the definition of 'knowing' but personally I could not be bothered.

I was asked to provide the information and I did.

Seriously though, "Knowing" is kinda like "see you later."

Someone can say to me, "you know that guy who always comes and looks in the green bin on 5th street?" and I'll say, "Yeah, I know him!"

That is NOT the same as me saying, "I know my mom, and she wouldn't say that."

I can also say i "know" my co-workers. I have worked with them 6 months now. NOT ONE of them has been to my house and I haven't been to theirs. We do not hang out, but if the police asked me if I know them, I'd say "yeah, I know so-in-so." I guess the confusion is maybe it ought to be "know of" so-in-so. Or am "aware of" so-in-so.

But, this is where I think the debate does go awry, because we should all "know" what people mean when they say "know" somebody. This debate is getting like when Clinton said, "Depends on what the definition of is is."

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Have you seen the ACTUAL pictures of the bathroom? Not the picture with PINK luminol? The bathroom pics leaked to the press were the pics of the bathroom AFTER the police doused it with luminol. This has been a BIG misconception. The visible blood was darn near microscopic.

Here is a link...
http://knoxarchives.blogspot.com/2009/12/bloody-bathroom-fallacy-what-amanda.html

mariame,

I am not sure what the substance was, but the pink color may have been caused by the Kastle-Meyer reagent reacting with oxygen. I dicussed this on my blog a few months ago. The Kastle-Meyer reagent, like luminol, is a presumptive test for blood.

 

[Steft50]

So if the family missed red flags so did her entire community - her school, her soccer coaches, her University, her friends- everyone who ever met Amanda prior to these murders missed the red flags.. and none have come forward to say "you know I knew she was crazy"

There were no red flags because Amanda isn't Casey Anthony.

Just a reminder- AK & RS were not acquitted on bad evidence collection, contamination the were acquitted because they did not commit the crime- that was the Jury's verdict.

Can someone explain to me why she is guilty because she lied about he boss in her "confession" but the "confession" is to be believed 100% ?

BBM
I'm still waiting for someone to explain why it's ok for the police, the convicted criminal prosecutor, the head of the forensic team, the civil lawyers to lie in court, but Amanda is guilty of murder because she lied during a statement.