MI, Grand Blanc - Mass Shooting at Mormon Church, fire, 28 Sept 2025

[layer]

Wish I could learn more about this guy, no one lives to 72 without having awesome stories. I'll keep my eye out for obits.

Craig Douglas Hayden
Pilot, GM toolmaker, scoutmaster, husband 51 years, 4 kids, 10 grandkids. A life well lived.

 

[ReadySet]

The News Literacy Project

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[Inthedetails]

The News Literacy Project

👕 On a day when people are talking about Sora, AI slop and deepfakes, it's important to remember that misinformation is still spread in simple forms - such as altered images of shirts. However,...

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Why do people do things like that and lie about the truth? Drives me nuts. Be honest!

jmopinion

 

[Izzylizzy]

Mormon church raise $200,000 for shooter's family. Not sure if this has been posted yet.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2025/10/01/lds-mormon-church-shooting-fundraiser-sanford/

Lauren @ HTC

Shooter’s Family Gets MORE $$ Than Victims | Grand Blanc LDS Church Shooting Updates​

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[Izzylizzy]

Mormon church raise $200,000 for shooter's family. Not sure if this has been posted yet.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2025/10/01/lds-mormon-church-shooting-fundraiser-sanford/

Today It's close to $350,000
imo

LDS church member raises $300K for Grand Blanc Twp. shooter's family, citing Christian teachings

As the community continues to support victims of the attack on the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Grand Blanc Township, one man has launched a campaign to help the suspect's family.

www.wxyz.com

 

[TMich6811]

Today It's close to $350,000
imo

LDS church member raises $300K for Grand Blanc Twp. shooter's family, citing Christian teachings

As the community continues to support victims of the attack on the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Grand Blanc Township, one man has launched a campaign to help the suspect's family.

www.wxyz.com

Truly amazing and imo - point proven.
Love and kindness wins.

 

[layer]

Reminds me of the reaction to the Amish schoolhouse in West Nickel Mines. Yesterday was the 19th anniversary.
Amish community members visited and comforted Roberts' widow, parents and parents-in-law. One Amish man held Roberts' sobbing father in his arms, reportedly for as long as an hour, to comfort him. The Amish also established a charitable fund for the family of the shooter.

 

[Charlot123]

Today It's close to $350,000
imo

LDS church member raises $300K for Grand Blanc Twp. shooter's family, citing Christian teachings

As the community continues to support victims of the attack on the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Grand Blanc Township, one man has launched a campaign to help the suspect's family.

www.wxyz.com

It is amazing but they have to stop somewhere. Otherwise people will be interpreting it in a wrong way.

Also, it is not his parents' fault that the shooter inherited their genes but for sure they had access to VA for his drug issues. So they were in denial.

 

[OneLove]

It is amazing but they have to stop somewhere. Otherwise people will be interpreting it in a wrong way.

Also, it is not his parents' fault that the shooter inherited their genes but for sure they had access to VA for his drug issues. So they were in denial.

I wasn't aware the VA could legally force treatment on an unwilling vet based on his parents' request. Or does it provide treatment/therapy for the parents? I apologize; I'm not understanding your meaning. Could you clarify this what you mean by his parents having access to the VA?

Also, they reported to the police that he stole $15 from them, resulting in his being charged with burglary and receiving a conviction that included mandated treatment. It seems unlikely they were in denial.

 

[angelainwi]

I wasn't aware the VA could legally force treatment on an unwilling vet based on his parents' request. Or does it provide treatment/therapy for the parents? I apologize; I'm not understanding your meaning. Could you clarify this what you mean by his parents having access to the VA?

Also, they reported to the police that he stole $15 from them, resulting in his being charged with burglary and receiving a conviction that included mandated treatment. It seems unlikely they were in denial.

Do we know that he was unwilling?

 

[OneLove]

Do we know that he was unwilling?

No, we sure don't. I was responding tp the comment I quoted above that "THEY (his parents) had access to the VA for HIS drug issues".

I wasn't aware that parents of vets have access to VA benefits if their adult offspring have drug addictions. I've never seen that in any of the situations I've personally seen or any cases I have followed, nor in my social work jobs nor in my justice court work. That would be a very usefu benefit to know about and publicize more broadly.

 

[Charlot123]

I wasn't aware the VA could legally force treatment on an unwilling vet based on his parents' request. Or does it provide treatment/therapy for the parents? I apologize; I'm not understanding your meaning. Could you clarify this what you mean by his parents having access to the VA?

Also, they reported to the police that he stole $15 from them, resulting in his being charged with burglary and receiving a conviction that included mandated treatment. It seems unlikely they were in denial.

Rehab, substance abuse treatment or dual diagnosis treatment are costly. But VA has all such facilities. Having been honorably discharged, Tom Sanford had access to such VA services. His parents should have been aware of it.

Indeed, it is impossible to make an adult grown up man sign himself into treatment, but his parents had a certain leverage there IMHO. First, when he stole items from them, them not pressing charges could have been made contingent on TS agreeing to seek treatment via VA rehab (as opposed to faith-based counseling). Second, if indeed TS was recently working for the family business, that provided additional leverage to make him seek help in a VA facility.

Why do I think that places like VA rehabs are potentially better than faith-based ones? Simply, the therapists and ministers in faith-based facilities are compassionate, earnest but many have been clean - or if abused, did not slide that deep down. The best drug and alcohol counselors come from the people who were serious ex-alcohol or ex-substance users. They ...understand and know. Nothing matches this personal experience. They may be very spiritual too, they highly rely on AA, for example, but mostly, if they managed to drag themselves out of own serious mess, they are of incredible help to others.

But, of course, the parents are behaving stoically and honestly and one can only empathize with their situation. Maybe it is more of a conclusion for the future. It seems that whatever pushed TS over the edge this time, worked very quickly.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/09/28/us/thomas-sanford-michigan-shooting-suspect

"In recent weeks, locals said, Sanford began behaving oddly – nearly running over a longtime friend with his truck in a seeming joke, asking a local political candidate questions about his positions on guns and then openly declaring his hatred for the LDS church."

So if you think of it, if the friend's reaction time were worse, Sanford's odyssey could have ended sooner, and he'd be jailed for vehicular homicide. The friend must be horribly shocked now.

 

[Inthedetails]

No, we sure don't. I was responding tp the comment I quoted above that "THEY (his parents) had access to the VA for HIS drug issues".

I wasn't aware that parents of vets have access to VA benefits if their adult offspring have drug addictions. I've never seen that in any of the situations I've personally seen or any cases I have followed, nor in my social work jobs nor in my justice court work. That would be a very usefu benefit to know about and publicize more broadly.

No, the parents couldn't force the VA to force therapy on their fully-grown son.

A 40yo man committed a heinous crime and nobody is at fault except him. imo

jmopinion

 

[Lilibet]

Indeed, it is impossible to make an adult grown up man sign himself into treatment, but his parents had a certain leverage there IMHO. First, when he stole items from them, them not pressing charges could have been made contingent on TS agreeing to seek treatment via VA rehab (as opposed to faith-based counseling). Second, if indeed TS was recently working for the family business, that provided additional leverage to make him seek help in a VA facility.

I think it’s quite unfair to criticize his parents for not forcing him to go to rehab. Forced rehab would not be effective. TS knew he had access to rehab. He is solely responsible for his heinous actions. His family are also victims, at least emotionally.

JMO

 

[Ontario Mom]

No, the parents couldn't force the VA to force therapy on their fully-grown son.

A 40yo man committed a heinous crime and nobody is at fault except him. imo

jmopinion

Agreed completely. The shooter's parents are also victims.

 

[Knox]

I think it’s quite unfair to criticize his parents for not forcing him to go to rehab. Forced rehab would not be effective. TS knew he had access to rehab. He is solely responsible for his heinous actions. His family are also victims, at least emotionally.

JMO

Agree 100%, let’s leave the parents of this 40 year old man out of the blame game.

 

[nao]

Moo...war veterans often return to their home country with an altered mind state. There are a number of stories on WS recently that have deaths caused by war veterans and I am sure there a many that don't make it to WS. So in my opinion this issue is something the government could be more responsible for. When veterans return they should go thru de-sensitizing program instead of been thrown back into the regular population. There was the same problems at end of WW2......moo

 

[angelainwi]

I think it’s quite unfair to criticize his parents for not forcing him to go to rehab. Forced rehab would not be effective. TS knew he had access to rehab. He is solely responsible for his heinous actions. His family are also victims, at least emotionally.

JMO

I worked as an interventionist for 15 years. There are studies that show that it doesn't matter how you enter treatment. In some studies forced clients/patients did better than voluntary ones. I of course was hired because in most cases you cannot force someone into treatment. And then the treatment has to be GOOD to work. The VA programs leave A LOT to be desired. I stopped using them after bad experiences.