MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #2

[Dani_md]

Wonder how she feels now that she has possibly gone from two weeks to life without a cellphone. She must be going nuts....

 

[Elley Mae]

I have done a little looking around, seems AB is into the same music(horrorcore) as McCroskey, the accused killer in Farmville Va. Don't know how much that played into it just found it coincidental.

 

[amysmom]

Trying to catch up... who is AB?

It's believed by many here she's 15 yr old female perp

 

[Robyn623]

I have been search Myspace looking for her friends that I see listed on Facebook. I found one who's mood says "ugh scary". She last logged on yesterday. I know it isn't much but it feels like I have been searching Myspace forever & I need to have at least something to show for it!

 

[Cuddlyrunner]

I just found her picture by putting twitter into google with one of the quoted twitter messages.

What a waste of two lives if this is the girl :-(

 

[Salem]

If my subtraction is correct then MB was 16 when she had AB? Wonder if there was drug use during the pregnancy.

Question for the legal eagles.....how much of AB's past (if it is indeed AB) is taken into consideration re being charged as an adult?

Or is that irrelevant at this time? Does the minor's lawyer argue against being charged as an adult?

TIA

Hey capoly - I'm not a legal beagle, but my understanding is that the teens' background will not come into play until it is decided she is guilty. Then her attorney should use her background to mitigate her sentence. Say the sentence is 25 to life - if the attorney can put enough mitigating factors in the mix, her sentence could be 25 years with time off for good behavior. This is a VERY SIMPLISTIC example. All states use their own version of the Model Penal Code and sentencing guidelines, so everything varies.

Hope it helps,

Salem

 

[Elley Mae]

My question is what evidence did LE have before Elizabeth was found,they were handed a note by someone at/after the press conference on Fri, at/or about 10:30. Who gave them that note and what did it say? And from the accounts I have read LE showed up at the school and then the perp led them to her. I am wondering if it was one of her Grandparents.

 

[Robyn623]

Not sure if this has been posted or not. I didnt find this myself, I saw it over at SM. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/23/elizabeth-olten-dead-body_n_332180.html Read the comment by Jeff on page 2. If it is true then I can see how they would be able to prove murder 1.

 

[amysmom]

--------------snipped...

Having been grounded from her cell phone is exactly what my theory was. I didn't see that post on her MySpace.

How sad is it that Elizabeth died over such a stupid thing? And the Murder 1 charge? It could me as simple as AB saying "Let me use your cell phone or I'll kill you".

bbm

It's on Twitter.

"Let me use your cell phone or I'll kill you" & when she refused chased her deep into the woods where she went thru with her threat..But why no screams from E?

I do believe she used her cell & those calls (but mostly texts) is some of the strong evidence le has.

 

[Robyn623]

BBL. Gonna go clean my house, take & shower & do something fun with my kids. I dont know what yet but this whole situation makes me want to hug them and be grateful for them. (Well, more grateful then I already am) See ya later!

 

[Angleena]

--------------

snipped...

Having been grounded from her cell phone is exactly what my theory was. I didn't see that post on her MySpace.

It's not really a post on MySpace, it's her status message. If you are logged into MySpace when you look at her page, you will not see the status message. You have to log out of MySpace, search for her page while logged off and go back to it. (note: you can't just log out and hit the back button on your browser, you won't be able to see it that way). You will see the status message next to her picture right under the bolded name.

 

[amysmom]

My question is what evidence did LE have before Elizabeth was found,they were handed a note by someone at/after the press conference on Fri, at/or about 10:30. Who gave them that note and what did it say? And from the accounts I have read LE showed up at the school and then the perp led them to her. I am wondering if it was one of her Grandparents.

Was note possibly from phone co (att) with cell records vs family/friend with info? I am convinced killer used her cell..Also that le was onto killer (day 1) from interview with ppl where she was last seen.

 

[Elley Mae]

Was note possibly from phone co (att) with cell records vs family/friend with info? I am convinced killer used her cell..Also that le was onto killer (day 1) from interview with ppl where she was last seen.

LE said that the phone died Thursday morning,up until then they had a fix on it.They said they had looked in that area 2 separate times and did not see anything, IDK much about them being able to get info from phone without having it in their hands. Also thinking about the statement from LE that Elizabeth was "very well hidden" and now reading that the grave may have been dug ahead of time. Sounds like they have a very good case of Premeditation.

 

[lajr56]

I have to wonder if the grandparents of the suspect (if indeed it is AB) knew something was up. If you kill someone, drag them into the woods that are wet and cold, and conceal the body, what kind of condition are you going to be in when you arrive home? Exhausted, dirty, excitable, upset.

The timing of Elizabeth being at their house, being reported missing, and the condition of AB directly afterward would have to send up red flags. Perhaps they passed a note to LE?

 

[Deleted member 718]

Was note possibly from phone co (att) with cell records vs family/friend with info? I am convinced killer used her cell..Also that le was onto killer (day 1) from interview with ppl where she was last seen.[/QUOTE

Yes, I agree. I think we also read that Elizabeth called her mom before she left for home. Maybe she told her mom that the perp was using her phone and annoying her. LE was so quick to get the phone records that there must have been some suspicion and indication. From there LE can contact those that the perp texted and ask many questions.

You know this is all so sad. It seems Elizabeth's mom was really trying to make a good life for herself and her daughter despite her husband/son's crime career. They lived in a nice home, Elizabeth was taken care of after school, and seemed to be a delightful child.

Same with the grandparents taking in their grandchildren and trying to make a better life for them. They must be terribly heartbroken.


Can I link to boards.insessiontrials.com? There is a vivid post from a local on page 5. Edit if necessary. Thanks.

 

[capoly]

Hey capoly - I'm not a legal beagle, but my understanding is that the teens' background will not come into play until it is decided she is guilty. Then her attorney should use her background to mitigate her sentence. Say the sentence is 25 to life - if the attorney can put enough mitigating factors in the mix, her sentence could be 25 years with time off for good behavior. This is a VERY SIMPLISTIC example. All states use their own version of the Model Penal Code and sentencing guidelines, so everything varies.

Hope it helps,

Salem

Yes, your "simplistic" explanation does help and is appreciated. It is near impossible for me to interpret the language of legalese.....:banghead:

 

[Patty G]

Hey capoly - I'm not a legal beagle, but my understanding is that the teens' background will not come into play until it is decided she is guilty. Then her attorney should use her background to mitigate her sentence. Say the sentence is 25 to life - if the attorney can put enough mitigating factors in the mix, her sentence could be 25 years with time off for good behavior. This is a VERY SIMPLISTIC example. All states use their own version of the Model Penal Code and sentencing guidelines, so everything varies.

Hope it helps,

Salem

Has it been confirmed it is a "she"?

 

[MDATCA]

I am sorry this turned out so long. I have lurked on this site a couple of times I think originally around the Jon Benet time. When I saw this missing child on NG I googled and this place came up so I started reading. I am just so sad for this whole situation and everyone involved. I am sad for the lives Elizabeth and AB have lived so far. Many of the adults around them have not made good choices in their lives and I am sure that those choices have affected the children involved. Drugs are an evil that our society is not dealing well with. They are destroying so many lives and families everyday.

The whole premeditated idea really bothers me. I would hope that someone would have picked up on the emotional problems of the teen who planned it out. Unless like some of you have theorized AB was angry because Elizabeth told on her, resulting on the loss of AB's phone. Then I could see she would fantasize a plan for the next day or two than as her anger grew she acted on.
I could see the scenario that AB was using Elizabeth's phone to text while she was there. When she had to leave AB wanted Elizabeth to *forget it* there so she could use it or she refused to give it back which caused E to grab for it and a fight ensued which ended tragically. Then AB tried to cover things up. Maybe E left and AB came out after her to ask for the phone and a fight started. I so desperately want this to be something less sinister than some of the theories.

Do we know if E was killed in the spot she was found? I am curious because I have read that there was a pre-dug grave and that she was hidden well. LE claims that area was searched two times. Why didn't the dogs pick it up right away. Wouldn't the dogs have picked up E's scent from leaving the house to where she stopped touching the ground? I think they knew what they were going on right from the start and that is why they turned away searchers. Maybe they knew E never walked out of that house that evening. Perhaps she was carried out? The only thing with that is that E looks like and from her description she was a big girl. From the pics of AB she looks petite. I don't think she could have carried E for any distance. I know there are ways around that.

Things just aren't adding up very well. I think LE was holding back quite a bit. As far as the media goes I know they get a lot wrong so I don't count what they say as fact. I hope we get the whole story Monday or at least who, how and motive. The whole story will take a long time if we ever get it since we are talking about minors here

 

[Elley Mae]

Was note possibly from phone co (att) with cell records vs family/friend with info? I am convinced killer used her cell..Also that le was onto killer (day 1) from interview with ppl where she was last seen.[/QUOTE

Yes, I agree. I think we also read that Elizabeth called her mom before she left for home. Maybe she told her mom that the perp was using her phone and annoying her. LE was so quick to get the phone records that there must have been some suspicion and indication. From there LE can contact those that the perp texted and ask many questions.

You know this is all so sad. It seems Elizabeth's mom was really trying to make a good life for herself and her daughter despite her husband/son's crime career. They lived in a nice home, Elizabeth was taken care of after school, and seemed to be a delightful child.

Same with the grandparents taking in their grandchildren and trying to make a better life for them. They must be terribly heartbroken.


Can I link to boards.insessiontrials.com? There is a vivid post from a local on page 5. Edit if necessary. Thanks.

I went and looked, same poster that was here Friday saying "15 girl..." will be interesting to see what the reason was.

 

[lajr56]

I have to say this. Although I appreciate the links that you all found and the information gleaned from it, I am a bit surprised that casenet publishes the full names of minors on the internet for all to see. That seems odd to me.