MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #2

[crimecurious]

crimecurious; is Elizabeth's father the only one that went to prison for the drug charges?

Here is the father:
https://web.mo.gov/doc/offSearchWeb/searchOffender.do?docId=502689&method=getOffender

Here is the son:
https://web.mo.gov/doc/offSearchWeb/searchOffender.do?docId=1160141&method=getOffender

Supposedly these drug charges are not the same ones that Jasmine was going to testify about. He got out of that one due to lack of evidence (lack of Jasmine). Rumor was it was a huge Meth ring and there were a lot of scary people involved.

 

[Angleena]

I remember reading earlier that LE thought she had just come into contact with this person around the time she was reported missing.
Wonder where she was during those 15-20 minutes....and now it sounds like maybe she didn't ever leave.
I still feel this is a girl....like was posted, so many are just mean nowadays, and this imo, doesn't seem like a sex crime.

ETA: This wouldn't be first degree murder unless LE thinks it is premeditated...hence maybe threatening letters to Elizabeth (although why she would walk home alone after that leads me to believe maybe she didn't). That and the fact that the body was so well hidden searchers were right on top of her and didn't find her makes me think this kid knew EXACTLY what she/he was doing and did not want to get caught.

IMO

I think it was premeditated to the point that this juvenile had planned it all out ahead of time. Befriending Elizabeth and being nice to her, leading her to a place in the woods that was already mapped out and a hiding place already figured out.

At 9 years old, all you want is to be liked and accepted. So the bully that is picking on you suddenly befriends you and wants to show you their secret hiding place in the woods (that is only for his/her cool friends). To a 9 year old, that's a big deal to finally feel like they are being accepted and befriended (and the bullying will finally stop), a 9 year old could easily be influenced to go under those circumstances. This isn't an adult or a stranger doing this, it's another kid which makes it easier for a child to trust.

 

[crimecurious]

Jasmine disappeared days before this hearing. She was turning evidence on him and others (unknown to me).

https://www.courts.mo.gov/casenet/cases/parties.do

Hmm, link doesn't work.... case # 07ML-CC00060

 

[Deleted member 718]

It seems it would be someone very familiar with the woods to conceal a body that well, especially when it would have been dark. Maybe they used headlights of a four-wheeler.

Were there were threatening notes in her backpack?

 

[mommya]

Hi, this is my first post. I haven't been on here in years.

Anyway, I've been following this case closely. And I'd like to pass info that is only RUMORS at this time, I live about 3 miles from the scene.

1) I was reading the local newspaper's forums yesterday and a poster said that it was an older sister of one of Elizabeth's friends who said she "wanted to see what it was like to see someone die". The post was quickly removed. It was about the same time yesterday that the person on here sent the message "15yo girl"

2) It was a girl known for being the school bully who was several grades behind.

3) It was a former teenage babysitter of Elizabeth. Not stated as M or F.

So maybe some psychopath young girl wrote about her evil thoughts and someone turned those over to LE?

Maybe Elizabeth was just in the wrong place at the wrong time?

This person fantasized about killing someone - thought it out - but maybe she did not have a specific target?

If this turns out to be the case - a young girl killer - have you all ever heard of anything like it?

Not me - that I can recall right now anyway.

 

[crimecurious]

It seems it would be someone very familiar with the woods to conceal a body that well, especially when it would have been dark. Maybe they used headlights of a four-wheeler.

Were there were threatening notes in her backpack?

Yes, a 4 wheeler or dirt bike sounds likely. This is VERY rugged land however. Gullies, hills, valleys, downed trees, briars...

 

[Coldpizza]

deleted

 

[everyoneneedsavoice]

Thanks everyone for all of the updated articles. I am just getting a chance to check in today.

I am leaning towards male also---I read TexasMist's post and follow up where they redacted the "male" but...I found another article from yesterday that also listed the person arrested as male. Article can be found here: http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/k...1569657/KCUR.News/Hunt.Ends.Child.Found.Dead#

more info from article:
JEFFERSON CITY, MO (kcur) - A little girl from St. Martins,Mo., missing nearly two days has been found dead in a deep stand of woods. And an older boy has been arrested. Asked to clarify the relationship between the child and the boy who was arrested, Sheriff White would only say---"they are acquainted."

 

[kikid]

I've been thinking male as well, as I don't think they'd push trying a female as an adult so much as they would a male/sex crime.

 

[everyoneneedsavoice]

I'm going to bump in here without looking back at the threads.Does anyone know if they are looking for a white Van? Thought I read that yesterday? Please correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm right did they mention if the van has oval like windows on the sides towards the back?

I haven't heard that in this case...I think I read that in Somer's thread??? Not sure...these terrible, useless killings of both of these beautiful babies has my mind going crazy and everything seems to be running together.

 

[crimecurious]

So maybe some psychopath young girl wrote about her evil thoughts and someone turned those over to LE?

Maybe Elizabeth was just in the wrong place at the wrong time?

This person fantasized about killing someone - thought it out - but maybe she did not have a specific target?

If this turns out to be the case - a young girl killer - have you all ever heard of anything like it?

Not me - that I can recall right now anyway.

If it turns out to be a 15yo girl... several grades behind... there's something very wrong there and I hope it doesn't keep them from charging her as an adult.

 

[Elley Mae]

I've been thinking male as well, as I don't think they'd push trying a female as an adult so much as they would a male/sex crime.

I don't see the difference, murder is murder. The push is probably the fact that the POI is 15

 

[Deleted member 718]

I think it was premeditated to the point that this juvenile had planned it all out ahead of time. Befriending Elizabeth and being nice to her, leading her to a place in the woods that was already mapped out and a hiding place already figured out.

At 9 years old, all you want is to be liked and accepted. So the bully that is picking on you suddenly befriends you and wants to show you their secret hiding place in the woods (that is only for his/her cool friends). To a 9 year old, that's a big deal to finally feel like they are being accepted and befriended (and the bullying will finally stop), a 9 year old could easily be influenced to go under those circumstances. This isn't an adult or a stranger doing this, it's another kid which makes it easier for a child to trust.

So that would rule out a mental disability, if s/he were able to premeditate and execute this so thoroughly.

If they are charged as a juvie, then they get out when they are 21. What if a juvie is tried as an adult? Missouri has the death penalty. Obviously I'm not a lawyer. :waitasec:

 

[crimecurious]

I was thinking if this is a male and charged as an adult, if found guilty would they be in the same pen as brother and dad?

They absolutely would not put them in the same prison. They don't put known "enemies" in the same place. That still doesn't stop "someone" from getting to them though.

 

[kikid]

I don't see the difference, murder is murder. The push is probably the fact that the POI is 15

that is true, murder is murder, I was just stating my opinion that they'd maybe be more inclined to push for trying a male as an adult if it was a sex crime against a little girl, that's all.

 

[kikid]

They absolutely would not put them in the same prison. They don't put known "enemies" in the same place. That still doesn't stop "someone" from getting to them though.

I was curious about that scenario - surely he (uming its a he) wouldn't last long if they did.

 

[Elley Mae]

565.020. 1. A person commits the crime of murder in the first degree if he knowingly causes the death of another person after deliberation upon the matter. 2. Murder in the first degree is a classA felony, and the punishment shall be either death or imprisonment for life without eligibility for probation or parole, or release except by act of the governor; except that, if a person has not reached his sixteenth birthday at the time of the commission of the crime,the punishment shall be imprisonment for life without eligibility for probation or parole, or release except by act of the governor.

 

[Deleted member 718]

Yes, a 4 wheeler or dirt bike sounds likely. This is VERY rugged land however. Gullies, hills, valleys, downed trees, briars...

I wonder if s/he had a hidey place back in the woods. And what LE found there besides little Elizabeth.

 

[TravelingBug]

Seems like nearly everything that's been rumored has said "female/girl" except the one source last night saying it was a "boy" - which since has changed and not specified, which would seem to possibly be another indicator that it really is a girl. Maybe?

 

[crimecurious]

Hurt, or especially kill a child and you're marked in prison. As bad as prisoners are, they have a serious problem with those types of people. And think if it's a girl and she went to a woman's prison. All those other women with children of their own...