MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #11

[Tawny]

I think his claim was that MB was shot. What bothers me is that I have thought that maybe that shot explains the thumb graze wound, but Baden said that as far as he could tell, there were no short-range shots. It seems that if the hand graze wound happened with the first shot, it would have been at close range. ???? JMO

I would think so but maybe if MB's hand was raised in a fist ready to strike again, the bullet could have grazed it then? Just throwing that out there, nothing to back it up.

 

[bettybaby00]

As I was scanning video's, I saw something that may or may not be anything relevant...

Pause this video at 0:07, note the bald man over DJ's left shoulder

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQeni0qt8Vo

Pause this video at 0:56, note same bald man behind white bald man, who is leading off Piaget and Tiffany to most likely get their statement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7tTsEYE3Ms

The reason I find this relevant is that this is the same general area in both videos. I've said that I thought neither Piaget or Tiffany saw anything. That they all saw the exact same thing, described exactly the same from different angles, seemed odd to me. Now we have video of these three witnesses congregating in the same spot with the same folks (including Mike's mom) at nearly the same time. I think this is where Piaget and Tiffany picked up this story and ran with it.

Good catch!

 

[aa9511]

I don't think any of us know what type of weapon he had. His mag may have only held 12-14 rounds.

I really don't think OW wanted to kill MB and only wanted to stop the suspect but he had no other option but to fire more shots when MB kept advancing toward him. JMO.

I am glad they have this tape. I believe it is going to line up with the AR and ballistic tests and OWs statements to all police agencies that have interviewed him.

It shows he stopped firing (IMO thinking he had stopped the suspect) but then the suspect was still mobile from only being struck in the arm by the first round of bullets and continues to advance making OW have to take further shots in order to stop him.

IMO

bbm

So he advanced, and then he retreated, and then he advanced again?

Because his body was laying 35 ft. away from the vehicle. That means that he would have to retreat at some point.

So I don't know what you mean when you say he "kept advancing."

 

[Sonya610]

The pause is like two seconds long. I am not sure how that qualifies as some sort of "bombshell." And that is assuming that this recording is real to begin with.

I personally believe the audio IS real, the fact the guy sounds so ridiculous as he says "You look so pretty" makes it legit to me.

 

[bettybaby00]

I don't think any of us know what type of weapon he had. His mag may have only held 12-14 rounds.

I really don't think OW wanted to kill MB and only wanted to stop the suspect but he had no other option but to fire more shots when MB kept advancing toward him. JMO.

I am glad they have this tape. I believe it is going to line up with the AR and ballistic tests and OWs statements to all police agencies that have interviewed him.

It shows he stopped firing (IMO thinking he had stopped the suspect) but then the suspect was still mobile from only being struck in the arm by the first round of bullets and continues to advance making OW have to take further shots in order to stop him.

IMO

BBM

IA. I think the "wound pattern" supports this IMO

 

[jjenny]

bbm

So he advanced, and then he retreated, and then he advanced again?

Because his body was laying 35 ft. away from the vehicle. That means that he would have to retreat at some point.

So I don't know what you mean when you say he "kept advancing."

My understanding is first he run away then turned around. And then either bum rushed the police officer, or put his hands up surrendering (depending on which version you believe).

 

[aa9511]

It's unlikely that the 9 "white" grand jurors are all white-white imo.

From YouTube video of DJ above:

Just after DW failed to pull MB into the cruiser: "He pulled out his weapon. His weapon was drawn. He said, 'I'll shoot you. I'm going to shoot.' And in the same moment the first shot went off. And we looked down, and he was shot. Blood coming from him. And we took off running."

Who was shot? MB?

Yes, he meant MB.

 

[Trident]

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-28929087

NYT under fire for describing MB as "no angel" in its mostly MB-favorable piece.

It's sad that our expectations (black/white/whatever) for our teens are set so low. Today it seems to be fine that they do a little drugs, steal a little stuff, and act a little anti-social. The higher the bar is set, the better the people. In my opinion, the expectations are so low that certain parts of this country are DEvolving into chaos, third world countries, becoming cities like Camden, Detroit, etc, ad nauseum. Maybe if parents, and society, as a whole, expected better, we would get that? Raise the bar, get better kids.

 

[Sonya610]

Because his body was laying 35 ft. away from the vehicle. That means that he would have to retreat at some point.

Or perhaps MB believed he was fleeing the scene of a crime if, as others have pontificated, he believed he had knocked OW unconscious or otherwise incapacitated OW.

Upon realizing that OW was NOT unconscious/incapacitated and was actually yelling at MB, he then turned around to settle the matter.

 

[SStarr33]

I am confused. How did this audio get released if it was turned over to the FBI? Nothing official has been released yet.

CNNers are desperate to keep their jobs with at least 2000 job cuts coming:

http://radiotvtalk.blog.ajc.com/2014/08/24/turner-networks-including-cnn-facing-job-cuts/

Wondering if some of them will do anything to stay.

 

[TexanMom]

It's sad that our expectations (black/white/whatever) for our teens are set so low. Today it seems to be fine that they do a little drugs, steal a little stuff, and act a little anti-social. The higher the bar is set, the better the people. In my opinion, the expectations are so low that certain parts of this country are DEvolving into chaos, third world countries, becoming cities like Camden, Detroit, etc, ad nauseum. Maybe if parents, and society, as a whole, expected better, we would get that? Raise the bar, get better kids.

I feel like I'm living in a country that is between "Dumb and Dumber" and "Idiocracy."

 

[LambChop]

Police also trained in the signs of body language:

http://www.policeone.com/interview/...kly-read-analyze-and-interpret-body-language/

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/fulfillment-any-age/201206/the-ultimate-guide-body-language

 

[aa9511]

I am confused. How did this audio get released if it was turned over to the FBI? Nothing official has been released yet.

Last night with Don Lemon, the guy's lawyer said something like (paraphrasing) "yeah earlier today the FBI met with my client at my office." And then she said something like, they retrieved whatever they needed to from the recording.

I got the impression that the FBI had taken a copy of the recording, or something like that, IDK. I'm sure they have very sophisticated tools that.

 

[Trident]

I think his claim was that MB was shot. What bothers me is that I have thought that maybe that shot explains the thumb graze wound, but Baden said that as far as he could tell, there were no short-range shots. It seems that if the hand graze wound happened with the first shot, it would have been at close range. ???? JMO

As far as I'm concerned, Baden needs to retire while he still has some respect and credibility left. He seemed so shaky, confused, and maybe embarassed in that autopsy briefing with his "assistant", that he made me wonder what was going on. And I do wonder what was/is going on with this gratis autopsy.

:cow:

 

[Frydaddy]

So just because he says it, it's automatically the truth?

How would they be blocking his path? That would mean he told them to move off the street while his vehicle was still behind them. This could have happened, but that would put in yet another version of the story. He could have come up behind them and put his head out the window and told them to move. That would be the only way they could have "blocked his path."

So now we have two versions of the very first moment: One that he pulled up to the side, one that he came up behind them.

I'm getting very confused!

I think the more salient point is this...if you use the tools on Google Maps and look how far down Canfield the officer would have been coming from and you see two people walking down the middle of the road for say a tenth of a mile or more and they make no real attempt to move toward the curb or sidewalk, not for a car, not for the fact it's a police car, what would go through your mind if you were the cop? I think this would push just about anyone's button, if for no other reason than you are going out of your way to mess with someone. One thing I have always questioned about this is why someone who just stole cigars would call attention to themselves immediately after. Not a psychologist, but I'd think the normal human brain would say or do whatever it takes to get the cop to keep on going. I certainly wouldn't try to negotiate or incite a further interaction.

 

[cady]

I have completely stopped watching CNN when it comes to the MB case. I want news and they have turned into Comedy Central on this particular case in their desperation to twist facts.

IMO MSM are all ratings and money-mongers with different slants to garner constituencies. Its too bad that we have to cite them, but I understand from a legal standpoint. Just flip around channels, and maybe the truth is somewhere in the middle! JMO

 

[UdbCrzy2]

As I was scanning video's, I saw something that may or may not be anything relevant...

Pause this video at 0:07, note the bald man over DJ's left shoulder

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQeni0qt8Vo

Pause this video at 0:56, note same bald man behind white bald man, who is leading off Piaget and Tiffany to most likely get their statement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7tTsEYE3Ms

The reason I find this relevant is that this is the same general area in both videos. I've said that I thought neither Piaget or Tiffany saw anything. That they all saw the exact same thing, described exactly the same from different angles, seemed odd to me. Now we have video of these three witnesses congregating in the same spot with the same folks (including Mike's mom) at nearly the same time. I think this is where Piaget and Tiffany picked up this story and ran with it.

That man is Anthony Shahid. He is a local activist/instigator.

Video of him standing next to NBPP Hashim Nzinga when they took over the press conference of the Ferguson Chief of Police.
Starts at 4:05 mark
http://fox2now.com/2014/08/14/video-protesters-take-over-ferguson-police-chiefs-news-conference/


Here is another photo of the Clayton PD with him
http://www.stltoday.com/news/multim...age_3383dd67-70d5-54c2-9d0a-d97e54fa2c79.html

Additional photos taken locally of him
http://www.stltoday.com/search/?k="...&s=start_time&sd=desc&sHeading=Anthony Shahid


FYI NBPP is the New Black Panther Party

 

[reedus23]

I may think that also if the GJ was sequestered and had seen none of the threats that have been lobbed even by political figures about what is going to happen if they don't indict. These GJs go home each and every night.

They live there and they have already seen the violence happening. They aren't stupid and they know if they don't indict it is going to be one hot raging violent mess in Ferguson and they also will worry about their own safety and the safety of the families.

While GJ proceeding are confidential it is very easy to find out who is on the panel. They have to come to the courthouse every morning and leave. So others are going to know who these people are.

I have never felt sorrier for a GJ as I do this one.

I hope that all of them have the strength my husband had when he had GJ duty just a couple of weeks ago and will have the courage to no bill if that is really what they believe the evidence shows.

I worry that they will indict and just hand it off to jurors to decide. If they do that... it is the cowardly way out. If they believe the shooting was justifiable it is their duty to stop the criminal proceedings right there in the GJ room by 'no billing' the case.

Will they have the courage to do this knowing what they know including the terroristic threats that have already been made? That remains to be seen.

I agree and I hope they also have the courage to issue an indictment if that is what is supported by the evidence. Handing down an indictment against LE can be a scary thought anytime. Add to it the attention this case has received and it could be even more difficult as I suspect there is going to be backlash from either side depending on the result.

Regarding the bolded portion, I don't know if I've seen an answer to my question yet. Justification is a legal defense and it is to be injected into a case by a defendant. It certainly seems that the prosecuting attorney's office has decided it will put on the dual hat of prosecuting attorney and defense attorney by presenting all of the evidence, including evidence that supports a defense and is usually put on by a defense attorney. Is this typical? Is the concern that I have for my prosecuting attorney also playing the role of defense attorney unwarranted? If I were the defendant instead of a police officer, I just don't see a prosecuting attorney going to any lengths to provide a grand jury with evidence supporting my defense. Also, does a grand jury even get the opportunity to consider justification? It would seem to me that their responsibility is only to consider if there is sufficient evidence to indict (the "Brown" witnesses) and any evidence of justification (the Wilson "witnesses") is considered at a later date after the defense of justification has actually been injected by the defendant. The statute clearly says it is the burden of the defendant to inject justification into a case and at this point there is no defendant, so how does justification even get injected into the case at the GJ stage?

 

[Trident]

Last night with Don Lemon, the guy's lawyer said something like (paraphrasing) "yeah earlier today the FBI met with my client at my office." And then she said something like, they retrieved whatever they needed to from the recording.

I got the impression that the FBI had taken a copy of the recording, or something like that, IDK. I'm sure they have very sophisticated tools that.

I'll just betcha they did, LOL

 

[TheDuchess]

I agree and I hope they also have the courage to issue an indictment if that is what is supported by the evidence. Handing down an indictment against LE can be a scary thought anytime. Add to it the attention this case has received and it could be even more difficult as I suspect there is going to be backlash from either side depending on the result.

Regarding the bolded portion, I don't know if I've seen an answer to my question yet. Justification is a legal defense and it is to be injected into a case by a defendant. It certainly seems that the prosecuting attorney's office has decided it will put on the dual hat of prosecuting attorney and defense attorney by presenting all of the evidence, including evidence that supports a defense and is usually put on by a defense attorney. Is this typical? Is the concern that I have for my prosecuting attorney also playing the role of defense attorney unwarranted? If I were the defendant instead of a police officer, I just don't see a prosecuting attorney going to any lengths to provide a grand jury with evidence supporting my defense. Also, does a grand jury even get the opportunity to consider justification? It would seem to me that their responsibility is only to consider if there is sufficient evidence to indict (the "Brown" witnesses) and any evidence of justification (the Wilson "witnesses") is considered at a later date after the defense of justification has actually been injected by the defendant. The statute clearly says it is the burden of the defendant to inject justification into a case and at this point there is no defendant, so how does justification even get injected into the case at the GJ stage?

What do you want to bet that if a no bill is returned that it won't be the end of the story...Eric Holder is still waiting in the wings....