MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #14

[deoneta]

What is treepers?


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At the not to be linked Treehouse.

 

[momrids6]

Ferguson Crime Free Multi-Housing Program
Citizen & Neighborhood Watch
D.A.R.E.
School Resource Officers
Community Emergency Response Team
Community Oriented Policing Services
VIPS
Community Relations Officer
Guided Tours

Plus all the legal avenues, public meetings, and letters to the editor!

All available in a city of only 21,000.


Many opportunities for citizens to voice their opinions and get involved in their community.

 

[LambChop]

Snipped.

I wouldn't mind some sort of special committee that investigates all officer involved shootings that includes citizens of the community.

Isn't that what the Grand Jury is for???

 

[reedus23]

Anyone feeling sympathy for DJ after today's WaPo lovefest should visit the Treepers for an updated dose of reality.

Do you mean that place that we can't post here? Good lord, just went and visited. Their as bad or worse than the national tv programs. Anyways, not sure what bombs they're dropping unless I'm reading the wrong thing. Guy likes his dope and got evicted at some point. I kind of get the feeling that the aim is to set the person up on a pedestal so he can be knocked down. Not sure who in their right mind ever thought DJ was a saint either. Besides maybe his mom.

 

[TorisMom003]

Now I am confused. Do we even know that the officer cursed at DJ and MB to move to the sidewalk?

As far as I know, the only one saying that is the one (DJ) that is also wanted in another county for lying to police.

 

[SStarr33]

Retweeted by Craig Cheatham
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Antonio French ‏@AntonioFrench 13m
Michael Brown, Sr. met with Capt. Johnson and MO Public Safety Director Dan Isom. Agreed to postpone highway action. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwfmiJ0IEAAp0GH.jpg
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What a joke.

 

[LambChop]

Retweeted by Craig Cheatham
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Antonio French ‏@AntonioFrench 13m
Michael Brown, Sr. met with Capt. Johnson and MO Public Safety Director Dan Isom. Agreed to postpone highway action. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwfmiJ0IEAAp0GH.jpg
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Thank you, Mr. Brown. There are families traveling on those highways with small children. No one wants to put their lives in danger.

 

[EvilSoup]

Isn't that what the Grand Jury is for???

Does the GJ handle the investigating or do they just review the evidence as presented by investigators?

 

[tlcya]

I think such a review of the department is more important than a single case, regardless of the outcome of this case. I will leave the railroaded portion alone. I think the legal process is playing itself out and I'm sure that's what you would want as well, or else the argument is no different than those who want him arrested and convicted without a trial.

I see your point and do not disagree that a federal review of what appears to be a department that MAY have issues is bigger than this case. You worry that McCullough may influence the grand jury results to affect the decision in THIS case. I worry that THIS case will be decided based on a general mistrust of the department and police in general rather than THIS case's merits.

I get your POV. I hope you likewise get mine.

I think we agree that abuse or misuse of police power or any possible corruption in the justice system is a bad thing and warrants investigation. We also seem to agree that we have concerns about justice being done in this specific case. Where we seem to part ways is in our specific concerns about what injustice or justice could look like in this specific case.

I appreciate us being able to discuss those finer points where we do not see eye to eye in a civilized way here at WS. I wish more people could do so in general. I think it might pave the road to a better understanding and resolution for all.

ETA caps for emphasis not yelling.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

First paragraph...I will again use my hypothetical. If I walk up to a cop, punch him in the face and lay down in the street with my arms spread wide, hands open, showing I have no weapon and surrendering to arrest, that cop has no right to shoot me under the law. I completely understand that this is an extreme example but I don't know how else to get my point across that MB could have been a sole instigator and and felon and sucker punched DW, but if he had surrendered himself to arrest prior to those fatal shots, there is no justification because the use of deadly force was not immediately necessary to effect the arrest. That is not condoning MB's actions at all. I hardly believe MB is a saint. But if an arrest was able to be effectuated without the use of deadly force, it doesn't matter how gross or how wrong MB's actions were previously, he should have been arrested.

Please tell me where I said anything that remotely said the cop deserved to be assaulted? If I said that, I will apologize. Do I think the cop was rude? Probably by my definition of rude, but maybe he needed to be or maybe that isn't considered rude by others. But that doesn't come anywhere near saying it warrants someone assaulting an officer.

I think either I haven't been clear in my position or you are misunderstanding or misstating my position.

With all due respect, I think that what I've boldened in your above post is incorrect. If it was reasonable for the officer to fear for his life then he can shoot.
Citizens have Stand Your Ground Laws in some states that allows for the use of force (and it doesn't have to be on your own premises/property) equal to or greater than the force used against you. Like it or not, that is the law in some states.
If someone choses to go up to an officer and punch them and then lays down to surrender, why wouldn't the officer think that this crazy person is just playing "possum" and is highly erratic & unpredictable?
It is reasonable to assume that anyone attacked will react back with force.

 

[reedus23]

Isn't that what the Grand Jury is for???

I'm talking about who is actually investigating. I don't know the answers lambchop, I'll be the first to admit so much or else I'd run for office. My point is, how can Belmar be in charge of the investigation and at the same time have his department saying they are fully behind Wilson? I don't know how you do it, but it has to be removed from the County PD IMO. My thought on a committee is that they would have subpoena power, maybe employee private investigators or retired investigators along with citizens with some training. They would go and find the facts. They would go and get the evidence that is ultimately provided to a grand jury. Just a thought and I'm sure one that doesn't work or it would have been done. I just don't know how you can essentially have the department that is supposed to be doing a fair and impartial investigation of the facts that will be presented to the grand jury, at the same time saying they are fully behind the accused. How is that fair and impartial?

 

[DebinGA]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/02/u...a-few-in-missouri-try-to-disrupt-traffic.html

Apparently the close-down-the-interstate schtick worked in St. Louis in 1999, so it's been rescheduled for Sept. 10 in order to bring all grievance resources to bear.

"In an interview on Sunday, the Rev. Al Sharpton, who was among those arrested in St. Louis in 1999, said he was not against participating in a similar action, but only if it were organized properly. “We were very successful in 1999,” Mr. Sharpton said. “I will not call for something we cannot achieve. You’ve got to be very careful that your enthusiasm does not overstep the bounds of where it’s capable.”

 

[reedus23]

Now I am confused. Do we even know that the officer cursed at DJ and MB to move to the sidewalk?

According to eye witness testimony he told them to get the F off the street or get the F on the sidewalk.

 

[human]

If MB bumrushed the cop, and punched him in the face, then it is ALL on MB. There is nothing that would condone that, short of OW pulling up and threatening MB's life.

And i know that you are convinced that OW was rude and disrespectful and said something to anger MB from the start. But I don't see any evidence that OW ever was written up or reported for being rude or disrespectful. Whereas we have video evidence of MB being aggressive and intimidating in his assault of the store owner just 10 minutes prior. So I think it is kind of unfair for you to keep assuming that OW did anything to warrant him being assaulted in his patrol car. jmo

The only person who has said that OW said something disrespectful is DJ. And even then, all he supposedly said was get out of the effin street. Considering they were blocking traffic on a crowded road, I dont see that as that offensive a remark. jmo He didnt call him the n-word or anything, or DJ would have already reported that.

As a middle class white woman, i have had unpleasant experiences with the police where i live. I,wanted to report an incident once


My hubby told me that under no circumstances should I report an LE.

He said they will have my license plate and everyone will be watching to see if they can get me for anything.

I am not impressed with LE having no complaints.

 

[SStarr33]

Thank you, Mr. Brown. There are families traveling on those highways with small children. No one wants to put their lives in danger.

It says postpone.

 

[noZme]

Ummmm no. How would that even work? Through a window no cop is gonna grab onto a guy twice his weight and 6'4" to stop him from going anywhere.

There is simply no way. None.

IMO


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I agree. Regardless of "witness" reports, I find the officer grabbing a suspect through the window totally unbelievable. It seems that even a small person standing outside an automobile would have an advantage over a much larger person seated inside. The seated person would possess little more than the strength in his arm (perhaps both arms) to "wrestle" but, the individual standing outside the window could use his whole body for leverage. Wouldn't that be a sure way to get a broken arm?

Even if I had never seen the store video of MB yanking the clerk around, I would be inclined to think that he, a hefty man, instigated that scuffle from outside the vehicle.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Do you mean that place that we can't post here? Good lord, just went and visited. Their as bad or worse than the national tv programs. Anyways, not sure what bombs they're dropping unless I'm reading the wrong thing. Guy likes his dope and got evicted at some point. I kind of get the feeling that the aim is to set the person up on a pedestal so he can be knocked down. Not sure who in their right mind ever thought DJ was a saint either. Besides maybe his mom.

I found the location of and the vanishing bracelet fascinating.


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[Apollo]

According to eye witness testimony he told them to get the F off the street or get the F on the sidewalk.

Eyewitness testimony from DJ.

 

[TorisMom003]

According to eye witness testimony he told them to get the F off the street or get the F on the sidewalk.

Isn't that "eye witness" DJ? Is there another eye witness that heard Wilson say this to them?

 

[LambChop]

Does the GJ handle the investigating or do they just review the evidence as presented by investigators?

No, they don't do any investigating. LE does the initial investigation and the prosecutor's office also has investigators, ME, the labs and in this case the FBI is involved. The FBI would be reviewing all the evidence. It really is hard to hide things today with the media breathing down your neck...which is a good thing as long as their reports are responsibly written. jmo