MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #14

[Sonya610]

Also from the link:

"When asked for his views on the footage that shows the teenager and his friend Dorian Johnson (a key witness to the shooting, now revealed to have a history of making a false police report) robbing a nearby convenience store, Pastor Ewing denied that the grainy images show Michael at all."

If MB's Uncle doesn't believe it's MB in the convenience store after seeing the video, what are the chances he's going to believe anything negative about MB that the investigation uncovers or the GJ has to say.

Yeah I guess he believes the REAL robber planted the cigars on MB's body???

Honestly, this is the mindset of many of the protestors. Facts simply DO NOT MATTER to them at all!

Many folks keep trying to understand their logic, or keep thinking "if they only knew all of the facts" etc...without understanding that it wouldn't change their mind at all!

 

[EvilSoup]

to take this 1 step further - can a witness in federal pc be allowed to testify in front of a county grand jury? i'm just trying to figure out if there's gonna be a turf war between them.

Good question, but it seems as though (IMO) the feds and county are working together. So hopefully no turf war.

My only concern about the investigative side is that OW's LEA is part of the investigation. Maybe that is SOP, but common sense would dictate, IMO, that investigations into possible criminal activity on the part of an LEO should be handled by an outside agency and not internally. This eliminates any suggestion of impropriety on the part of that specific agency.

It seems prudent, especially in racially charged situations like these, and in light of 3 LEOs being canned for
offenses related to this case, to hand over the investigating to the feds, and, if possible, an investigative GJ.

 

[EvilSoup]

Yeah I guess he believes the REAL robber planted the cigars on MB's body???

Honestly, this is the mindset of many of the protestors. Facts simply DO NOT MATTER to them at all!

Many folks keep trying to understand their logic, or keep thinking "if they only knew all of the facts" etc...without understanding that it wouldn't change their mind at all!

BBM

We certainly agree there! :happydance:

 

[human]

Yeah I guess he believes the REAL robber planted the cigars on MB's body???

Honestly, this is the mindset of many of the protestors. Facts simply DO NOT MATTER to them at all!

Many folks keep trying to understand their logic, or keep thinking "if they only knew all of the facts" etc...without understanding that it wouldn't change their mind at all!

Stealing a few dollars worth of cigars would hardly get anyone a slap on the wrist. The jails,are full,to the brim and criminals that have all kinds of terrible crimes are being let out early all over the country because there is no money or place to house them.

I seriously doubt that MB thought his stealing was going to get him into any trouble.

 

[LambChop]

Good question, but it seems as though (IMO) the feds and county are working together. So hopefully no turf war.

My only concern about the investigative side is that OW's LEA is part of the investigation. Maybe that is SOP, but common sense would dictate, IMO, that investigations into possible criminal activity on the part of an LEO should be handled by an outside agency and not internally. This eliminates any suggestion of impropriety on the part of that specific agency.

It seems prudent, especially in racially charged situations like these, and in light of 3 LEOs being canned for
offenses related to this case, to hand over the investigating to the feds, and, if possible, an investigative GJ.

BBM: What LE criminal activity investigation is going on in this case? There is an investigation by LE and the prosecutor's office into the death of MB, which is SOP. The FBI is investigating a civil rights violation regarding MB's death. Have we heard there are charges of department criminal activity in Ferguson?

 

[jjenny]

Stealing a few dollars worth of cigars would hardly get anyone a slap on the wrist. The jails,are full,to the brim and criminals that have all kinds of terrible crimes are being let out early all over the country because there is no money or place to house them.

I seriously doubt that MB thought his stealing was going to get him into any trouble.

This would be classified as robbery, not theft, because of interactions with a clerk.

 

[JudyBolton]

Stealing a few dollars worth of cigars would hardly get anyone a slap on the wrist. The jails,are full,to the brim and criminals that have all kinds of terrible crimes are being let out early all over the country because there is no money or place to house them.

I seriously doubt that MB thought his stealing was going to get him into any trouble.

In other news today - QT announces it will not re-open it's Ferguson location (permanently closed) ...... If your quote above is true - I guess we can figure out why! BBM

 

[DebinGA]

I don't think MB had faced intransigent authority figures much in his life, i.e. people who insisted he mind them. He bounced around between his mom's, his dad's, his grandma's, and who knows where else. He went his own way and did his own thing imo, using his size to intimidate (see store clerk) or, in DW's case, to make forcing him out of the middle of the street to seem either impossible or not worth the effort. But diligent Ofc. Wilson wasn't cowed and pursued DJ/MB as they continued their mid-street stroll. I imagine MB puffing himself up and putting on his "frowny" face as usual, and Ofc. Wilson, still uncowed, opened his door to get out of his vehicle. MB had a choice then that his prior experience probably hadn't prepared him for. He could have obeyed DW and moved toward the sidewalk, but he didn't. The reason for that was related to the reason MB changed high schools 4 times, resistance to following rules and obeying authority figures imo.

 

[human]

Who was the real Michael Brown? The kid from a broken home who beat the odds to get into college, the rapper who sang about 'Feds' and smoking weed, or the robbery suspect caught on video minutes before cop shot him dead...


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-shocking-video-just-real-Michael-Brown.html

Not sure if this has been posted. The article describes how Michael Brown grew up, includes many photos and his lyrics.

My children went to the same high school as I did. Affluent and middle class attend the high school.

Drinking parties and sex were the norm for the "popular" kids. Nothing changed from when I went except drugs became part of the scene when my kids went to school.

My one daughter who was an honors student and went to college as a high school student shocked me one day when we were talking. She was an adult at the time.

I was talking about how horrible the drug situation is now in schools (thus was before heroin became an issue in high schools in the white world),

She told me, "Mother, don't be so naive. All kids experiment." Apparently even my perfect daughter did as well.

I heard of affluent kids who shoplifted from stores as a lark.

I heard of affluent kids who did all kinds of things that their parents bought them out of trouble with their fancy lawyers.

Affluent parents who were drunks, cheating on their spouses, and used drugs such as cocaine.

The white world is not any different.

 

[Sonya610]

In other news today - QT announces it will not re-open it's Ferguson location (permanently closed) ...... If your quote above is true - I guess we can figure out why! BBM

Yeah I figured they wouldn't rebuild. QT opens stores in middle to upper middle class areas, they even advertise their stores are "safe, clean, well lit" etc... No doubt when that store opened years ago the neighborhood was much different than it is today.

 

[bettybaby00]

Good question, but it seems as though (IMO) the feds and county are working together. So hopefully no turf war.

My only concern about the investigative side is that OW's LEA is part of the investigation. Maybe that is SOP, but common sense would dictate, IMO, that investigations into possible criminal activity on the part of an LEO should be handled by an outside agency and not internally. This eliminates any suggestion of impropriety on the part of that specific agency.

It seems prudent, especially in racially charged situations like these, and in light of 3 LEOs being canned for
offenses related to this case, to hand over the investigating to the feds, and, if possible, an investigative GJ.

I would think that internal affairs is also investigating ?! Or is that only on TV

 

[Sonya610]

I heard of affluent kids who did all kinds of things that their parents bought them out of trouble with their fancy lawyers.

Affluent parents who were drunks, cheating on their spouses, and used drugs such as cocaine.

The white world is not any different.

Uhhh...I beg to differ. If this is about stereotyping those "white world/neighborhoods" do not have bars and bullet proof glass protecting the convenience stores, they do not have high crime rates, folks are not afraid to walk down their streets at night in those "white neighborhoods".

Recreational drug use and violent crime are two VERY VERY different things!

 

[LambChop]

Ray Downs ‏@RayDowns 2m
The St. Louis County Police Department's hockey team is fully behind Darren Wilson. pic.twitter.com/l53azmyRPx

So wait. Are they saying St. Louis County PD is doing this investigation and not Ferguson? How did I miss that?

 

[deoneta]

I think all eyewitnesses share certain liabilities. People tend to view events through the prism of their experiences, through their existing expectations. People are also susceptible to the accounts of others and incorporate details into their own recollections. There need be no malice attached, simply human nature.

DJ's statements have certainly "evolved", and that in and of itself isn't unusual. What calls DJ's version of events into question is simpler for me and goes beyond his previous charges of lying to LE. DJ places himself ducked behind a car and reveals that he left the scene, and that makes me wonder if he was actually in a position to see what transpired.

I hope the GJ will be able to make its determination based on autopsy, forensics, OW's medical records and any possible surveillance footage. If it's proved genuine, how well the slow jam/gunfire audio matches up with OW's initial statements could be crucial. All MOO

 

[bettybaby00]

My children went to the same high school as I did. Affluent and middle class attend the high school.

Drinking parties and sex were the norm for the "popular" kids. Nothing changed from when I went except drugs became part of the scene when my kids went to school.

My one daughter who was an honors student and went to college as a high school student shocked me one day when we were talking. She was an adult at the time.

I was talking about how horrible the drug situation is now in schools (thus was before heroin became an issue in high schools in the white world),

She told me, "Mother, don't be so naive. All kids experiment." Apparently even my perfect daughter did as well.

I heard of affluent kids who shoplifted from stores as a lark.

I heard of affluent kids who did all kinds of things that their parents bought them out of trouble with their fancy lawyers.

Affluent parents who were drunks, cheating on their spouses, and used drugs such as cocaine.

The white world is not any different.

This may be true, but they get "fancy lawyers" too. Only difference is the lawyers in these cases opt for pro bono toward future bucks, giving little concern IMO for the family.

Holder for instance, could be educating MBs parents, instead of what he seems to be doing.

 

[Kentucky Gal]

Lamb Chop,

Ferguson PD turned the investigation over Saturday afternoon on the 9th.Pay attention. LOL

So wait. Are they saying St. Louis County PD is doing this investigation and not Ferguson? How did I miss that?

 

[DebinGA]

The great thing about body cams is that witness claims can be checked against the video/audio, at least regarding the officer's actions. .... DJ's public statements place him right beside MB when the first shot was fired in/from the cruiser. He describes seeing MB bleeding there beside him before they then ran off.

 

[Footwarrior]

My children went to the same high school as I did. Affluent and middle class attend the high school.

Drinking parties and sex were the norm for the "popular" kids. Nothing changed from when I went except drugs became part of the scene when my kids went to school.

My one daughter who was an honors student and went to college as a high school student shocked me one day when we were talking. She was an adult at the time.

I was talking about how horrible the drug situation is now in schools (thus was before heroin became an issue in high schools in the white world),

She told me, "Mother, don't be so naive. All kids experiment." Apparently even my perfect daughter did as well.

I heard of affluent kids who shoplifted from stores as a lark.

I heard of affluent kids who did all kinds of things that their parents bought them out of trouble with their fancy lawyers.

Affluent parents who were drunks, cheating on their spouses, and used drugs such as cocaine.

The white world is not any different.

Here is what a nationally known expert on adolescent drug abuse once told me:

If your kid drinks or smokes marijuana at a weekend party, your kid is normal.

You should be really concerned if your kid uses injectable drugs or is a heavy user that is taking different types of drugs at the same time. A small percentage of kids in almost any high school fall into this category. Most of them will have showed signs of mental or emotional problems before they started taking drugs. The drugs are often an attempt to self medicate, but they will not improve the situation.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Does the GJ handle the investigating or do they just review the evidence as presented by investigators?

Grand jurors actually have a lot of power. They can also be used for an investigative tool or to seek an indictment or both.

Evidence is presented to the through testimony of witnesses.

The ADAs in cases like this usually ask questions of the witnesses. Then all of the jurors individually are able to ask as many questions as they want of each and every witnesses. When I was a grand juror the grand jury asked way more questions that the DA. The DAs are really a small part in the GJ. When my hubby had grand jury he also said the grand jurors asked many more questions than the DA did and they also have subpoena power and during his duty they summoned additional witnesses in a couple of the cases that the DA hadn't call.

They have all the power they need before rendering an indictment or no bill. Jurors who sit in judgment on criminal cases usually doesn't have such power. Some states do allow questions to be asked of jurors but they are limited and of course they have no subpoena power to call further witnesses either.

They are actually very thorough in their duties before they decided to no bill a case or true bill it.

When 12 people are given the power to ask questions believe me they can think of a lot of questions to ask.

 

[reedus23]

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/ferguson-missouri-cops-start-wearing-body-cameras-report/

Not only will the widespread use of body cams revolutionize policing, it will also revolutionize protesting if every taunt and threat at officers is memorialized.

This is such an important point, I didn't think a thanks was enough. For me, the entire point of the body cams isn't just police accountability. It serves to paint a more complete picture of any incident. It will eliminate the bogus claims of police brutality. As much as I think they are important for police accountability because of the position they hold within a community and the authority they are granted by the citizenship, I do think that the number of bogus claims outnumber the number of legitimate claims.