Found Deceased MO - John Forsyth, 49, doctor, Mercy ER Clinic, Cassville, 21 May 2023 *car found*

[Charlot123]

IMO, the one thing that doesn't seem to align with suicide is getting engaged three days prior. We haven't been told of any prior history of depression or previous suicide attempts, so what changed in those three days?

This actually makes sense. Either three days before, he did not yet feel depressed (happens), or felt depressed but thought he'd pull through. Another way to look at it, if he plans to leave this world and there is one more child to come, he probably wants to leave a will and announce the engagement, to minimize the chance of any inheritance issues when he's gone. He also has no time to get married, but probably wants to leave a name to the new baby.

(Only, it would have been easier to elope and get married in Las Vegas.)

 

[Gobstopper]

A beneficiary can't collect life insurance when death is by suicide correct? MOO

 

[kccorona]

A beneficiary can't collect life insurance when death is by suicide correct? MOO

I believe that is mostly untrue nowadays, at least not from what I’ve heard from acquaintances who’ve unfortunately gone through that situation.

According to below Forbes article, sounds like most policies have a “suicide clause” to where they won’t pay beneficiaries if death by suicide occurs within the first two years after policy is purchased.

Does Life Insurance Cover Suicide?

Life insurance companies need to protect themselves from the possibility that someone could buy a policy with the intention of committing suicide shortly after so that their families receive a life insurance payment. Does Life Insurance Cover Suicide? Suicide is not generally covered in the fi

www.forbes.com

 

[Belly]

I don't know if this man died from suicide or not, but just wanted to say that people who die by suicide don't always have a prior history of depression or previous suicide attempts. This is especially true for physicians and people in similarly scrutinized fields because such diagnoses can affect licensure. My heart breaks for my fellow physicians who suffer in silence due to fears about the impact on their license, but it's a reality within the field and we all know it (it's also been talked about in the MSM). I'm pretty sure there are other fields that are similar.

Pilots suffer in silence as well

 

[Charlot123]

I wonder how sure we can be that it was from the hospital to the lake in one day. Disappeared on May 21, found on May 30. Depending on the circumstances, he could have ended up in the lake the same day, which is more likely. Alternatively33 E, he could have been alive for a day or two. I am not sure that LE yet has a tight timeline, or has it been published, and I have missed it?

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Looking at another current case, it appears it took over a year before LE declared Eric Richins' death a homicide. It's not mentioned in the current coverage, but I don't believe his cause of death was declared as fentanyl overdose, or the manner of death as homicide, until they arrested his wife. Otherwise, I think the case would have attracted attention. So IMO, LE don't always release these things if they there's an advantage to the investigation to keep it quiet

JM

I only started following that case, when KR was arrested. But I did wonder....were people, here on WS, following the case early on WONDERING when LE was going to speak out? Or, was this case just really low profile. It just seems that there are so many red flags in the wife's behavior.

When wife was arrested, I kept wondering how a fentynal death was not identified early.

 

[?!?]

I wonder how sure we can be that it was from the hospital to the lake in one day. Disappeared on May 21, found on May 30. Depending on the circumstances, he could have ended up in the lake the same day, which is more likely. Alternatively33 E, he could have been alive for a day or two. I am not sure that LE yet has a tight timeline, or has it been published, and I have missed it?

Not published -- crickets....

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I dunno. I don't interpret "no danger" meaning self-harm. To me, that just means that there isn't a serial killer out there, someone may already be in custody, or that this was a "hit" or JF was specifically targeted (which kind of links back to my first point, not a serial killer).

The only reason why I am not thinking self-harm is due to the distances involved, something like 30 miles away from the lake. But I also don't consider things like personal beliefs, religion, no suicide note, or no change in routine, as reasons against self-harm.

All IMO.

I think your post reflects what many of us are sensing.... we all have one little specific detail or another that moves the needle on the suicide-homicide spinner.

For me, it is the phone call with the fiance when he left his 7am shift. IF he was planning suicide, I believe he wouldn't have told fiance, that he would be calling back or seeing her "soon". He would have given some message or indication of more time away.

So--for this moment in time---my needle is pointing to homicide.

 

[acutename]

This actually makes sense. Either three days before, he did not yet feel depressed (happens), or felt depressed but thought he'd pull through. Another way to look at it, if he plans to leave this world and there is one more child to come, he probably wants to leave a will and announce the engagement, to minimize the chance of any inheritance issues when he's gone. He also has no time to get married, but probably wants to leave a name to the new baby.

(Only, it would have been easier to elope and get married in Las Vegas.)

the married to the first wife twice and the other one yr old and this recent engagement and the bitcoin company all sounds a littke larger than life to me- IMO, I'm not a professional, but he was juggling a lot of things...sounds a bit unstable IMO

 

[GraceVPrice]

A beneficiary can't collect life insurance when death is by suicide correct? MOO

in the case of my nephew, his parents only had to have the policy for longer than a year and insurance did pay out.

 

[Wallendo]

Unless actual evidence of how he reached the lake is revealed, I lean towards homocide.

 

[al66pine]

A beneficiary can't collect life insurance when death is by suicide correct? MOO

@Gobstopper From my post made a couple days ago.

Suicide. Life Ins Policy's Death Benefits Payable? If policy was issued in Missouri?

MO.'s statute*
1. If suicide exclusion provision is stated in policy, life ins co may exclude liability for death as a result of suicide IF suicide occurs within ONE YEAR of policy issuance.
IOW, if suicide occurs within one yr after policy is issued, ins. co is not obligated to pay the death benefit (sometimes called "face value" but not technically accurate).
2. If life ins policy contains ^exclusion^ (if death occurs within one year of issue, co. does not pay death benefits), then ins co. must promptly REFUND all premiums paid.
imo

Welcoming correction or clarification, esp’ly from our ins. or legal professionals.

@Gobstopper Hope this helps.
________________________________
* "376.620. Suicide, effect on liability — refund of premiums, when. — 1. Any life insurance policy... issued or delivered in this state may exclude or restrict liability ... for death as the result of suicide in the event the insured, while sane or insane, dies as a result of suicide within one year from the date of the issue... Any such exclusion or restriction shall be clearly stated in such policy,..." sbm
"2. Any life insurance policy... which contains any exclusion or restriction under subsection 1 of this section shall also provide that in the event the insured dies as a result of suicide within one year from the date of issue of such policy,... that the insurer shall promptly refund all premiums paid for the excluded or restricted coverage on such insured." sbm
^ 376.620

Link to my earlier post.

Found Deceased - MO - John Forsyth, 49, doctor, Mercy ER Clinic, Cassville, 21 May 2023 *car found*

He had a baby under a year old with his previous girlfriend . I don’t know how he had time for all his activities and his family too. Easily. I once, over 25 years ago, briefly knew a doctor who had a very bad judgment to “consensually” misuse his patient. (Lost his practice for many years...

www.websleuths.com

 

[al66pine]

post by @Gobstopper: "A beneficiary can't collect life insurance when death is by suicide correct? MOO"

I believe that is mostly untrue nowadays, at least not from what I’ve heard from acquaintances who’ve unfortunately gone through that situation.
According to below Forbes article, sounds like most policies have a “suicide clause” to where they won’t pay beneficiaries if death by suicide occurs within the first two years after policy is purchased.

Does Life Insurance Cover Suicide?

Life insurance companies need to protect themselves from the possibility that someone could buy a policy with the intention of committing suicide shortly after so that their families receive a life insurance payment. Does Life Insurance Cover Suicide? Suicide is not generally covered in the fi

www.forbes.com

@kccorona
You might take a look at my response (a post or so upthread) to Gobstopper's question. It summarizes the MISSOURI STATUTE governing suicide clauses in life ins. policies issued in MO. and quotes that section in full.

 

[RickshawFan]

If suicide, why would he not drive his own car to the lake where he was found? What would be the reason for leaving his car and hitching a ride? Just interested in your thoughts on that. TIA

Because he didn't want family to know he'd killed himself?

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

post by @Gobstopper: "A beneficiary can't collect life insurance when death is by suicide correct? MOO"


@kccorona
You might take a look at my response (a post or so upthread) to Gobstopper's question. It summarizes the MISSOURI STATUTE governing suicide clauses in life ins. policies issued in MO. and quotes that section in full.

The statute does not direct insurance companies on when benefits are to be paid or not. A policy can be purchased that has or does not have the suicide clause. The statute allows for policies sold in that state to have exclusions BUT those policies that have the one-year suicide exclusion, are required to pay back the premiums paid if suicide does occur before the one-year mark. Each policy can be customized by the purchaser, there is no way to know the payout terms without seeing the actual policy. In this case, we don't even know if a policy exists.

 

[curiouser_]

I don't know if this man died from suicide or not, but just wanted to say that people who die by suicide don't always have a prior history of depression or previous suicide attempts. This is especially true for physicians and people in similarly scrutinized fields because such diagnoses can affect licensure. My heart breaks for my fellow physicians who suffer in silence due to fears about the impact on their license, but it's a reality within the field and we all know it (it's also been talked about in the MSM). I'm pretty sure there are other fields that are similar.

There absolutely are other fields like that, and it's so sad that this stigma still exists. I even fear posting THIS because of my occupation. Just wanted to say that I fervently agree with you...

 

[cocomod]

I don't know if this man died from suicide or not, but just wanted to say that people who die by suicide don't always have a prior history of depression or previous suicide attempts. This is especially true for physicians and people in similarly scrutinized fields because such diagnoses can affect licensure. My heart breaks for my fellow physicians who suffer in silence due to fears about the impact on their license, but it's a reality within the field and we all know it (it's also been talked about in the MSM). I'm pretty sure there are other fields that are similar.

I agree. Some people seem happier right before they commit suicide - which completely confuses their loved ones. Some make plans for the future knowing they won't be there to fulfil the plans, just because they feel "lighter" now that they have made the decision to end the pain. Also, some suicide isn't necessarily a clinical diagnosis of depression or an ongoing diagnosis of depression. Some suicides are situational, and may not be a person that normally has or shows depression. The person just gets overwhelmed and they can't see a way out.

 

[DeDee]

Do you see an overwhelmed image in Dr Forsyth? It appears to me that he was living his life in the same manner in which he had been for quite a while. He worked long hours and often spoke of math. His divorce was finalized after 2 years, although not a dime seems to be paid to the former wife since the judgement was issued. I'm unsure of his intentions in that regard. He was a self-defined Bitcoin expert.

My understanding is that the doctor's RV had been parked at the hospital off and on for years. He was at Mercy for 20yrs. He lived somewhere nearby with his large family for a while as well as other locations so it wasn't as if John lived full-time inside the RV. He wasn't confined.

Here's my thing. As a doctor, he could have ODed on something that he had easy access to in the ER and take it anywhere in the woods and never be found. Why choose a gun in the lake when he didn't even own a firearm?

 

[tarabull]

there's this FWIW
Suicide disguised as murder: a dimension of Munchausen syndrome - PubMed

 

[RickshawFan]

How does LDS view suicide? That might be a reason to make a suicide look like murder.