MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #12

[IAM]

It is always wise for LE to recognize statistics of a crime. To not recognize them would be imcompetence. That beng said, they should also keep a very clear mind open for any clues that would go against statistics. I think this is what they are doing. Checking out different leads as they try to clear the parents. The parents should not be bothered be this. This is necessary. The only thing that is important is finding baby Lisa. A parent in this situation should be too traumatized to worry at what the public thinks. They should only be focused on helping to bring their baby back home. This is why although I do recognize other scenarios. I am still trying to make some sense of the information that is given. And I know LE has way more info then they are tellling the media. So, we are only getting bits and pieces, so to slueth we must do alot of reading btween the lines. This is no science. Only speculation. Only our attempt to help in some way. Help find this precious little baby.

 

[iluvmua]

I'm not buying the whole intruder thing.......

first, who would take 3 cell phones? (unless they were there to rob the place and they just happened upon baby Lisa's room and decided to take her too, that's always a possibility).

How did the intruder know where baby Lisa's room was located? (unless he walked through the front door first).

surely, this child was crying when someone picked her up out of her crib....... Why was the mother not alerted to her cries?

everything just seems so odd to me......

 

[Paige SC]

Did he just say BURG-U-LERS?

 

[Miziree]

Christopher Abeyta was also kidnapped from his crib in the middle of the night. He was 7 months old. There have only been a handful of non-family abductions of infants taken from their cribs. Christopher is my brother and I slept in the next room over from him the night he was kidnapped. We did not hear a thing. My family always cooperated with LE, although I remember my Parents getting upset because they didn't think LE were doing enough. My mom failed the polygraph and once she did LE formed a myopic view and did not thoroughly investigate leads. I know firsthand when my Mom was being interrorgated they told her things like "your baby is at the bottom of the lake being eaten by vernom, just tell us what you did with him" They questioned her for hours upon hours. Ironically they didn't suspect my Dad, yet my Parents slept in the same bed and it was a waterbed! The kidnapper did not turn on any lights in our home and when she left but she did leave the front door open. We didn't have anything else missing, except we had been missing a garage door opener previously. No doubt my family was under suspicion because of the "how could you not hear anything?". "why didn't the baby wake up?" Watching Lisa's disappearance unfold brings back raw emotions and memories, and no family should ever have to endure waking up to an empty crib and the torment of "not knowing". My Parents have never given up searching for their son. We do have a suspect. Her name had been given to LE the day after my brothers disappearance and she was not investigated! It is really unbelievable. My Mom did all of the investigating on her own. Finally a review is being done of my brothers case because of my families persistance. Go to www.findchristopher.com to compare cases.

So sorry you and your family have had to endure this It is almost the same as this case! I've never heard of this case before, I did find we have a link here on WS for him: [ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40177"]CO CO - Christopher Enoch Abeyta, 7 months, Colorado Springs, 15 July 1986 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]
I wonder if they had any hang up's like this also..

 

[cluciano63]

LE is in a tough place...after a week they apparently have not been able to clear the immediate family or determine for sure that an abduction has taken place. As we know, if they can't clear the family, if not officially but to their own satisfaction, it does make things difficult. But I believe they are looking at all possibilities at the same time.

 

[passionflower]

I am wondering why the LE used sirens and lights yesterday to the house.......to scare a perp?
I also was thinking, 2 boys in house.....I know mine were rough when playing, Could
baby Lisa have gotten hurt? Everyone thought she was ok, but she died?
Why was her son sleeping with her and a HIS ( not OUR kitty?) kitty that night?
Who was comforting who?
Would father blame her son and not his?
or
was mom about to leave dad?
and gave Lisa to someone for safe keeping til she left?
That way dad couln't get her and all back fired?
My brain is in overtime, sorry if I am o/t.
IMO, something happened to Lisa and it looks like a cover up to me.
I pray she is safe.
Now with looking at the handyman, this reminds me of the A/C guy in Haleigh Cummings case.JMOO

 

[Duke Fan4]

The baby bottle and diapers a great thought.

Perhaps the teen mows their lawn the reason he has access to the garage.

 

[matou]

Hi everyone. Handyman??? Can someone explain? I haven't heard of this yet.

 

[SarahW]

It is always wise for LE to recognize statistics of a crime. To not recognize them would be imcompetence. That beng said, they should also keep a very clear mind open for any clues that would go against statistics. I think this is what they are doing. Checking out different leads as they try to clear the parents. The parents should not be bothered be this. This is necessary. The only thing that is important is finding baby Lisa. A parent in this situation should be too traumatized to worry at what the public thinks. They should only be focused on helping to bring their baby back home. This is why although I do recognize other scenarios. I am still trying to make some sense of the information that is given. And I know LE has way more info then they are tellling the media. So, we are only getting bits and pieces, so to slueth we must do alot of reading btween the lines. This is no science. Only speculation. Only our attempt to help in some way. Help find this precious little baby.

I'm not sure how fruitful it would be to go into a discussion of an academic discussion of what statistics are useful for - but they NEVER determine the facts of an individual case. They may help quide procedure but they don't determine the truth.

 

[justbeachy]

UGH!!! If this ends up being another case with no answers, I might lose my mind!!! Where are you, sweet Lisa??? Talk to us, baby girl!

 

[krimekat]

Christopher Abeyta was also kidnapped from his crib in the middle of the night. He was 7 months old. There have only been a handful of non-family abductions of infants taken from their cribs. Christopher is my brother and I slept in the next room over from him the night he was kidnapped. We did not hear a thing. My family always cooperated with LE, although I remember my Parents getting upset because they didn't think LE were doing enough. My mom failed the polygraph and once she did LE formed a myopic view and did not thoroughly investigate leads. I know firsthand when my Mom was being interrorgated they told her things like "your baby is at the bottom of the lake being eaten by vernom, just tell us what you did with him" They questioned her for hours upon hours. Ironically they didn't suspect my Dad, yet my Parents slept in the same bed and it was a waterbed! The kidnapper did not turn on any lights in our home and when she left but she did leave the front door open. We didn't have anything else missing, except we had been missing a garage door opener previously. No doubt my family was under suspicion because of the "how could you not hear anything?". "why didn't the baby wake up?" Watching Lisa's disappearance unfold brings back raw emotions and memories, and no family should ever have to endure waking up to an empty crib and the torment of "not knowing". My Parents have never given up searching for their son. We do have a suspect. Her name had been given to LE the day after my brothers disappearance and she was not investigated! It is really unbelievable. My Mom did all of the investigating on her own. Finally a review is being done of my brothers case because of my families persistance. Go to www.findchristopher.com to compare cases.

OMG - sorry for your & your family's loss! Going to your site . . .

 

[jadejazzkayla]

Well, statistics will always lean to who has most access to the baby. Parents are statistically the culprits. But, there are always exceptions to everything.

agree.

If I were playing the odds and betting who is responsible for lisa's disappearance, i would take the 9 to 1 odds (or whatever they are) and bet on the 9 to win. but, I am not here to gamble on if i can guess who is responsible. I am here to look at FACTS as I see them. I have no time or desire to look at the odds and guess whodunit.

 

[cluciano63]

Hi everyone. Handyman??? Can someone explain? I haven't heard of this yet.

Apparently on one of the morning shows, they talked about a man who LE was asking about, who had not been seen around since before Lisa went missing...

 

[AlexLouise44]

But how would this person obtain paperwork to show that the child is legally theirs if they were to claim the child was adopted?

I've never done this before, but I know there is a "black market" for fake passports, social security and even birth certificates. It could be possible that the perp had this all set up. I don't know how they do it. We have a friend who insists his passport was bought on the black market because he is an illegal - not sure how true it is because it's look VERY realistic.

 

[elepher50]

Judge Jeanie video now in siggy line below - seems to answer some of the questions that have been bandied about. Well, may answer some of the questions - depends on interpretation of course.

 

[GourmetSoy]

FYI, the Aisenberg case is on the ID channel right now

 

[Wishbone]

I'm not buying the whole intruder thing.......

first, who would take 3 cell phones? (unless they were there to rob the place and they just happened upon baby Lisa's room and decided to take her too, that's always a possibility).

How did the intruder know where baby Lisa's room was located? (unless he walked through the front door first).

surely, this child was crying when someone picked her up out of her crib....... Why was the mother not alerted to her cries?

everything just seems so odd to me......

In the JJ interview video the mother says they almost never leave windows open then goes on to say she left the computer room window open and when JI saw it he knew something was wrong? Why did she leave the window open, she didn't say she forgot to close it....None of what she says makes the least bit sense........

 

[Paige SC]

UGH!!! If this ends up being another case with no answers, I might lose my mind!!! Where are you, sweet Lisa??? Talk to us, baby girl!

I know. Something about this case reminds me of Sabrina Aisenberg. I hope this isn't the path we are headed down...

 

[BeanE]

Heycameraman HC
Not alot of activity at #LisaIrwin home. bit.ly/oMWTh3
25 seconds ago

 

[jacy]

I hope that it is affiliated with the family and not someone capitalizing on little Lisa. Her family does not appear to be rich and I see no problem with trying to raise money for a reward. I'm just surprised that no organization has come forward with a reward. Lamar Signs has put up billboards along highways when there is a missing person. I just want to see that sweet baby face with those blue eyes all over the place. If this means individuals donating money/goods/services then so be it.

My first impression of the page was that I was being yelled at before I said anything. It's immature to stir the pot (i.e., You don't want to donate? DON'T!) and a little offputting. My second impression was that the page gives me no idea where my money would actually land.