MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #7

[IrishMist]

And doesn't it make sense that this would be because they have some evidence that strongly points to mom?

Not necessarily. They could be frustrated at having no leads, and trying to be sure that she's telling all that she knows.

 

[iamnotagolem]

I agree. My daughter is 18 months old, but she is the size of a much younger child. She's only in 12 month clothes. (we're all tiny, but she was born early too on top of it.) Even she has her crib on the lowest setting.

I don't know that it means anything though because we don't know how it got to its current position. We don't know if someone raised it up to look around under it when they were searching, or what. I do know mom said she sleeps with her Gloworm at night and I don't see a Gloworm, so I assume a lot of things in the room aren't as they were before. MOO.

BBM I'm not familiar with all cribs, but the ones I have seen/used all had to be unscrewed in 4 places to be moved to a new position. I just can't see the LE going through all the effort to remove the bed slat and then put it back. I guess it's possible they took it apart and whoever came in and cleaned and remade the bed didn't realize that Lisa was 10 months old and put the bed at the higher position.

My kids are small and their mattress was moved down when they could pull up. 5 months or less

 

[katydid23]

IF she did fall out of her crib, or get hurt accidentally at home, I cannot see it being kept secret from the older brothers if they were at home. That is a very small house. Boys that age are very nosy and are into everything, hear everything and see everything. Is it true that LE interviewed the brothers?

 

[wfgodot]

And doesn't it make sense that this would be because they have some evidence that strongly points to mom?

Well....maybe. It also could be perhaps because of a natural inclination on their part to direct attention away from the fact that they haven't any.

 

[saba]

Anybody know what happened to the vigil? I thought it was tonight.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

So the family has a media deal with Fox News, the same network that has been leaking information that makes them look very suspicious? I know that agreeing to an exclusive with a media outlet doesn't mean that they will be unbiased and supportive towards you, but of all the ones to pick....Did they offer the highest price?

 

[Lera213]

In the beginning of the video, the reporter states that Mom did tell him if LE calls them at this moment, they'll come in. :shutup:

To me it is word semantics. Let me try to explain and MOO:

Parents tell LE We will not longer be cooperating with LE if you want to talk to us you must contact us with through our Attorney:

Parents stated, If Le calls us we will come in, knowing full well that LE cannot call them directly but instead through their attorney.

BIG MOO

 

[yllek]

Point me my dears...... to the best link! Thanks.

So many details and links grams. Here's my best shot at bulleted highlights without searching out every link. Recap only to best of my ability.

- Debbie admits to being told she failed LDT, but says she can't remember what questions she was told she failed. She also admits that LE was questioning her about gaps in her timeline that she couldn't fill in. From ABC morning interview.

- Debbie says LE was not so nice and accusatory at first, but nicer later. From ABC morning interview.

- Fox reports that a "source close to LE" confirms Debbie failed LDT miserably. Afternoon Fox report. (They never claimed that it was LE who made this statement)

- Jeremy claims that he told LE after 11 hours of questioning that he needed a break for the day (yesterday). Then, LE announced an hour later in presser that the parents had stopped cooperating. He also claims he has been "cleared" because of work alibi, so didn't need to take LDT. When asked, said he would take one if that's what it takes. ABC morning interview.

- Debbie and the aunt spokesperson both claim the parents never stopped cooperating. LE claims they would love to keep talking with parents and their door is open. So far, no official announcement that the parents have talked to LE today. From many interviews/sources today - both stances repeated by both parties.

- LE searched the landfill today, for the second time. Don't know if they found anything. From several MSM sources.

- LE searched the backyard of the home using metal detectors. From MSM sources.

- Jeremey's father claims Debbie failed the LDT because of "itty bitty" inconsistencies and LE would ask Debbie first about something, then Jeremy, and pounce on the slightest variation. From MSM sources.

-Fox announces the parents will be on Judge Jeannine on Saturday night.

- Unconfirmed report of a 2:30 a.m. communication on one of the "stolen" cell phones (by Debbie) swirling; LE doesn not confirm or deny.

- Confirmed reports of a dumpster fire less than a mile from Lisa's home at 2:37 a.m. the same morning Lisa disappeared. LE checked this trash for third time today for possible connection. From MSM sources.

- It is announced in MSM that this was Jeremy's first night shift. It is announed in MSM that Debbie says it was her first time to leave the door unlocked (we don't know if she did it or the gma when she left the house). It is announced in MSM that the couple says lights were on in the house and the front door was unlocked when Jeremy arrived home. He checked on boys first, found Debbie's 5 year old in bed with her, then discovered Lisa missing and no phones in house. (We still don't know how 911 was dispatched).

- We don't know if Lisa was wearing pj shorts or regular shorts and that topic has been CLOSED. We do know that no cable box was stolen from this house, only from an unrelated 70 year old victim of robbery in another case. We do know that the dad in this case is named Jeremy, not Jeffrey. We do know that a dog was reported missing in the neighborhood around the time of Lisa's disappearance, but the pooch returned home safely. From the WS forum! :crazy:

 

[Dr.Fessel]

I agree, and I never said it was suspicious. I just said that I thought that the police must know more than they are reporting and that it made me think that because the FBI was there so quickly.

They were there fast in Alayiah Lunsford case too. I believe they come in if asked to by local LE.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

On the big baby thing....

My oldest technically didn't exist! She was off the charts tall and heavy. She is now almost 6ft tall. Younger one not quite as much but still top of the charts. They were both sitting unassisted at 4 months and walking at 9 months! Got teeth late though. One was walking before the teeth erupted! Funny sight to be had - here's Gumby comming at ya!

DD didn't walk until 15 months and had no hair until she was nearly two years old. Talked in full sentences at 8 months. Mensa IQ (Stanford-Binet and WISC age 6).

 

[Cappuccino]

In a lot of cases I have followed, it's a tactical move by LE to place increased pressure on suspects. I don't think it has anything to do with ethics but that is JMO. Just as we've seen here, I have heard a lot of persons of interest come forward and admit to it. They admit to it b/c of the controversy regarding polygraphs. If they were 100% full-proof and admissable I doubt so many would be admitting they failed. JMO, of course.

It certainly is a tactic to put pressure on suspects, and its an extremely dirty one. Its considered unethical to leak info to the media that LE knows to be inadmissable in court, for the obvious reason that if the person ever does end up on trial every juror who watches Fox News is now prejudiced.

It doesn't speak well of the local police that they did that. I also suspect from Deborah's statement on the subject that she doesn't have a lawyer, or not a very good one, anyways. Any lawyer worth their salt would tell their client not to mention a failed poly to the media.

 

[Valleyboy]

It says it can, but that doesn't mean to me that they automatically go on every case. Do you get what I'm saying?

I get what you are saying but I am a Canadian and do not really know what they do or when they do it.

Just going by what is posted on their website.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Oh that is a good point. She said she didn't lock the door? Do they always leave the door unlocked? Don't they live in a city?

I lock everything up very tight when I'm alone at night. Interesting observation, Katydid,.

Its funny but after I read this post I checked the front door and it was unlocked. I usually have it locked but I guess I missed it.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

So the family has a media deal with Fox News, the same network that has been leaking information that makes them look very suspicious? I know that agreeing to an exclusive with a media outlet doesn't mean that they will be unbiased and supportive towards you, but of all the ones to pick....Did they offer the highest price?

Nah, it is not Fox news. They have never been on it.

 

[christee]

I don't recall ever having seen that info.

Thanks wfgodot!

 

[vasportsmom]

Maybe the fact that he wasn't home to help with dinner, homework, baths, etc. led to her forgetting to lock the door. She may have just forgotten to check it because she was very busy and probably not used to having to run the household routine alone at night.

I have forgotten to lock my front door more than once due to various reasons when I was a single parent to 3 young kids. I'm not proud of it, and I do consider it carelessness on my part. But it does not make me a criminal. I was tired and overworked, and maybe she was the same.

My husband and I split up for a few weeks over the summer and there were several (many) nights that I forgot to lock/check the doors simply because he had always been the one to do it so it wasn't part of my normal routine. By the second week or so I had started remembering to do it but it took me a while to really get in the habit. If this was dad's first night working 3rd shift and he had always been in charge of locking up at night I can see mom forgetting.

 

[grandmaj]

So many details and links grams. Here's my best shot at bulleted highlights without searching out every link. Recap only to best of my ability.

- Debbie admits to being told she failed LDT, but says she can't remember what questions she was told she failed. She also admits that LE was questioning her about gaps in her timeline that she couldn't fill in. From ABC morning interview.

- Debbie says LE was not so nice and accusatory at first, but nicer later. From ABC morning interview.

- Fox reports that a "source close to LE" confirms Debbie failed LDT miserably. Afternoon Fox report. (They never claimed that it was LE who made this statement)

- Jeremy claims that he told LE after 11 hours of questioning that he needed a break for the day (yesterday). Then, LE announced an hour later in presser that the parents had stopped cooperating. He also claims he has been "cleared" because of work alibi, so didn't need to take LDT. When asked, said he would take one if that's what it takes. ABC morning interview.

- Debbie and the aunt spokesperson both claim the parents never stopped cooperating. LE claims they would love to keep talking with parents and their door is open. So, far, no official announcement that the parents have talked to LE today. From many interviews today - both stances repeated by both parties.

- LE searched the landfill today, for the second time. Don't know if they found anything. From several MSM sources.

- LE searched the backyard of the home using metal detectors. From MSM sources.

- Jeremey's father claims Debbie failed the LDT because of "itty bitty" inconsistencies and LE would ask Debbie first about something, then Jeremy, and pounce on the slightest variation. From MSM sources.

-Fox announces the parents will be on Judge Jeannine on Saturday night.

- Unconfirmed report of a 2:30 a.m. communication on one of the "stolen" cell phones (by Debbie) swirling; LE doesn not confirm or deny.

- Confirmed reports of a dumpster fire less than a mile from Lisa's home at 2:37 a.m. the same morning Lisa disappeared. LE checked this trash for third time today for possible connection. From MSM sources.

- It is announced in MSM that this was Jeremy's first night shift. It is announed in MSM that Debbie says it was her first time to leave the door unlocked (we don't know if she did it or the gma when she left the house). It is announced in MSM that the couple says lights were on in the house and the front door was unlocked when Jeremy arrived home. He checked on boys first, found Debbie's 5 year old in bed with her, then discovered Lisa missing and no phones in house. (We still don't know how 911 was dispatched).

- We don't know if Lisa was wearing pj shorts or regular shorts and that topic has been CLOSED. We do know that no cable box was stolen from this house, only from an unrelated 70 year old victim of robbery in another case. We do know that the dad in this case is named Jeremy, not Jeffrey. We do know that a dog was reported missing in the neighborhood around the time of Lisa's disappearance, but the pooch returned home safely. From the WS forum! :crazy:

Thanks! I was just reading back trying to catch up but this helps me. xoxoxoxo

 

[sorrell skye]

There is probably too much being made of this issue. LE took a number of items out when cameras were present, they probably took more items out the first morning before media was encamped. The scene has been released by LE and its likely that a neighbor, friend, church member etc has probably volunteered to clean up the finger print dust and mess left after LE finished with the house. I used to lift items such as those up off of the floor to vacuum under the crib, etc. Likewise it is possible someone else remade the bed so that it would not be so heartbreaking for the family to re-enter the home. The bedding could be borrowed, donated or even new.....I would willingly do that for a friend or neighbor in hopes that the child would be coming home to a clean room ready and waiting for her. If LE left the bed taken apart as is quite likely, someone else could have put it back at the wrong height or simply at the easiest level to reach for that person.

jmo

Totally possible, Raeann. I would do that for a friend, as well.

Has it been reported that a friend, family member, or whomever, went into the house to tidy up & to reassemble a disassembled crib after LE left?

ETA: Has it been reported that LE took apart the crib? If a friend or neighbor tidied up, why did they not return the dresser drawers to the dresser?

 

[SuziQ]

TY for finding that!

So there it is: recent footage of the crib - complete with storage bins & baby bathtub.

IIRC, the family has been staying elsewhere since baby Lisa disappeared - correct?

Why, then, is her crib filled with storage bins, etc., if she slept in her crib the night of her disappearance?

Could it be the way that LE left it? The Mcstay's house was called messy and disorganize and bare of sheets, shoes, clothes and stuff. Who would live like that type of thing. Turns out it was the way LE left the house after searching and removing items for testing.

 

[norest4thewicked]

Oh geez! I guess I mis-read your posts. I'm sorry, Norest. My only defense is that I'm getting tired. I hope I didn't come across as snarky.

Not at all! I've been here ALL day too! It's understandable...