MO - Six Mohler family members for child sex crimes, Bates City 2009 #2

[human]

Yes, that's the book. Secret Ceremonies is interesting in relationship to this Mohler case, because really, from reading that book, Mormon women appear not to have many rights. They can't get to heaven without their husbands, if I am remembering correctly.

 

[human]

I don't know about Tonga (the country) but I do know for an absolute 100% fact that in some places in the South Pacific, incest is a dirty little secret that has not been prosecuted. It is only starting to be recognized as a crime.

 

[jjj]

jjj--Can you post a link to the "updated" interview with Bishop Tonga, please. I checked back with the video I posted earlier and it has not been changed. Thanks.

The one I'm referring to:

http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-story-mohler-church-official-111909,0,7312538.story?track=rss

I'm referring to the same link (to the article underneath; don't know if they updated the video.) They added the LDS statement in the last 4 paragraphs, where before it said LDS hadn't returned request for comment.

Does anyone have a link to the PDF probable cause affidavits for the latest search?

While they clarify a number of things (i.e. the supposedly missing jars - the media messed up that story; there was only one jar, which the police did find,) I would recommend strongly against reading it, particularly if you are an abuse survivor. Of all the horrible things in this case, these interviews were the hardest for me to read.

http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-pdf-mohlersr-pcs-111909,0,6723513.acrobat
http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-pdf-mohlerjr-pcs-111909,0,7055785.acrobat
http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-pdf-jared-mohler-pcs-111909,0,5036862.acrobat
(Most or all of the material in the second two are subsets of what's in the first)

I don't recall if I read it @ Topix or it was discussed on the first thread here...it's stuck in my head tho, because I knew a child rapist who'd married his brother's wife after they divorced...and yes, it does make for an oddly shaped family tree.

I think maybe you're confusing MY with one of the brothers? MY's ex-wife married BMjr, and that was discussed on topix. Definitely haven't seen anything anywhere about any wives marrying multiple brothers; can say for certain none of BMjr's wives did.

 

[Missizzy]

human--That's my point exactly. This missionary or Bishop could have traveled to the US to help out with an LDS church in Independence and have been way over his head with these disclosures. He might not have been educated as to how to interview or to take disclosures. Because of cultural differences and possibly language issues, he might not have understood the seriousness of these claims. I'm really not trying to defend him but trying to make sense of how someone could respond with the term, "whatever" when speaking of the sexual abuse of small children. He obviously had not read the information in the Mormon Alliance papers.

I was quite surprised to learn that Tonga is so strongly Mormon. I don't think that's common knowledge. I also wonder if Burrell Jr. befriended this man as they had addresses very close to one another. That makes it even creepier. I've searched and searched and just can't find any other references to him other than helping out at a history center. Could there be a reason that he's a former Bishop?

I've been meaning to ask if anyone has located any Mormon or Community of Christ forums discussing this case. I've found a few but they weren't public. I know in the Garrido case, I learned a lot by reading the JW forums. I think we have to step back and realize that the vast majority of Mormons and Community of Christ members must be just reeling with this information. I know I would be.

 

[Missizzy]

I think we're going to start hearing from more and more people who suspected something wasn't right. I wish they would have been more outspoken at the time. I had a thought about the schools in strongly Mormon or Community of Christ communities. Are the children typically taught at church schools or do they go to public school? I wonder if all the teachers follow the letter of the mandatory reporting law. Hopefully, they don't call Bishops.

From Topix--"I knew all of those girls. i grew up in the same "ward" (mormon congregation) with them. Paul Tonga should be charged with "wanton endangerment of a minor" because his actions fit the requirements of that charge!

Im no longer a mormon because on a youth temple trip Paul tonga ignored the fact that youths were smoking Marijuana in the hotel rooms and having sex when they were supposedly doing the lords work. if he ignored that it isnt a stretch to imagine him ignoring the concerns of the mother.

for the record the mother was a clueless idiot, and was Paul Tonga. May Gods peace find my childhood church friends and ease their suffering. and may God Dxxn those Mohler men, the mother, and Paul Tonga, straight to HELL."

 

[PAXIMUS]

From your link;

"Some of the confiscated included magazines such as Family Taboo, Best of Family Secrets and Best of Family Touch, according to court documents. There were also numerous sex toys and videos showing girls under age 17 confiscated, investigators said."

Sounds like CHILD to me

I have to call this LE propaganda and manipulation of public opinion since there is no possible way they could know for certain the girls in the video were under the age of 17 UNLESS the girls in the videos were some of the children wo are claiming the abuse in which case the Mohlers are screwed.

 

[Missizzy]

I agree Pax, we need to see what shows up on those videos. I'm aware some can depict very young looking girls while still being legit. However, these are the most direct words yet concerning the fact that the actors are indeed, under 17. Wouldn't we be seeing the receipts of search warrants as we've seen in the last few days? I thought maybe they could shed some light on these particular videos.

We'll see.

 

[Missizzy]

I have to say that your comment "in that case the Mohlers are screwed" comes across to me as glib. Wouldn't you agree that if, in fact, true child shows up in their possession (of the alleged victims or not), LE has done their job of ferreting out some monsters. The Mohlers chose to do what they did, right or wrong. They are adult men with commitments to children and family. If they failed, stumbled, or erred and committed a crime, they didn't lose a game and get caught. They knowingly committed evil and will have to deal with the consequences of those shameful decisions.

Sorry, but I'm a bit sensitive when it comes to protecting and focusing on the alleged victims.

 

[Texas Mist]

I have to call this LE propaganda and manipulation of public opinion since there is no possible way they could know for certain the girls in the video were under the age of 17 UNLESS the girls in the videos were some of the children wo are claiming the abuse in which case the Mohlers are screwed.

I cannot agree with "no possible way they could know for certain the girls in the video were under the age of 17" -- I'd like to think a medical professional would be able to determine the difference in a 12yo & a 17yo...scary thought if there is "no way" due to the proliferation of CP & obvious need to prosecute.

 

[reen]

Southcitymom-- Justice does not come cheap. I guess the moral of this story is to watch your children and prevent the abuse from happening in the first place. Our justice system is not child or family friendly.

Well said. Bless you and your family for having endured all of that, and standing up for yourselves. I know of what you speak, firsthand.

 

[Missizzy]

Welcome Reen--Kind and much appreciated words. I'm sorry for the pain you must have suffered.

 

[mysteriew]

I cannot agree with "no possible way they could know for certain the girls in the video were under the age of 17" -- I'd like to think a medical professional would be able to determine the difference in a 12yo & a 17yo...scary thought if there is "no way" due to the proliferation of CP & obvious need to prosecute.

Actually the courts are pretty weird. Simulated child is often legal. Real child isn't. And since kids can differ, a 12 year old can sometimes look 18 or an 18 year old can sometimes look 12. I used to be one of those 18 year olds that looked 12. So LE has to prove that the images on the tape actually belong to girls who have been identified and verified to be minors. It can get really complicated.

The government actually has a database that LE can submit their suspected images against.
http://www.govtech.com/dc/articles/45905

 

[mysteriew]

Whoa...we know that she was officially pregnant? that people knew she was pregnant? Do we have a link for this? I've combed through the entire thread, but I cannot find it.

Also the alleged abortion, I thought, was for an 11-year-old girl. Is this the same victim? or another one? Truthfully, for how often they'd been abused, I was surprised we'd heard of only one pregnancy, especially given the girl in the cellar had been pregnant twice.

My heart is just breaking for these victims.

It's in the early part of the thread. There is a link to Topix and several community members and some family are commenting on an article. It seems the community was aware of the pregnancy, and they also mentioned an investigation. I posted one of the topix links and I think it might have been MizIzzy who posted another one also.

 

[IWannaKnow]

So...I'm sorry if this is upsetting to some, but I've put together details on everyone involved. If it's any consolation, I'd never share their identities and would notify the victims if any of it were things they could remove, as they clearly were careful to remove traces of themselves from the internet before this began. (In my defense I can only say that I have moderate OCD, which got a bit out of control after the story about the Independence mall victim came out.) While I still don't know what to think about the mall murder or the non-related female victim in the crawlspace, I now have no doubt that the siblings' stories of sexual abuse are true, and find it painful that some are doubting them, which I don't think they would be if LE & media had handled the story better.

Anyway…I'll use initials for the wives, but keep with the FC/MC convention to keep the victims as anonymous as possible. I take it from the previous timeline post that ages are ok, so I'm including years of birth. There were a couple Topix posts that appeared credible at first but were wrong on some details, which I think has led to the confusion about mother's identity. Please let me know if I've included too many details, & I'll remove ASAP.

BM Jr's marriages:
Wife 1: JM - c.1978 - 1998
FC1 (Female Child 1) born 1978
FC2 born 1980
FC3 born 1981
FC4 born 1983
MC1 born 1984
FC5 born 1985-88

Wife 2: PSM - 1999 or 2000 - 2001
MC2 (PSM's son from prior marriage to MY)
(no children with jr.)

Wife 3: PGM - 200? - 2007
1 or more kids with jr. (possibly 4 yr. old girl referred to by MY on a Topix thread.)

Wife 4: SM (not to be confused with Sr's 2nd wife, SLM) 2009-present


BM Sr:
Wife 1: AM, died 1991
Wife 2: SLM, 1992-present

Abuse reports:
198? - JM reports abuse to LDS officials
2000 - JM warns MY of sexual abuse to MC2
2001 - MY reports abuse and gets no response, but gets custody of MC2
8/2009 - FC4 reports abuse to Sherriff's Department. Account corroborated by FC3 & MC1.
11/2009 - More abuse charges from interviews with FC3 & FC1, some confirmed by FC2. Unrelated F6 reports being held in basement in late 80's, & burying of baby in basement.

jjj - You Rock!! This is great! Maybe my fellow posters have already gotten and recorded this information, but I couldn't put all the pieces together. You did and more. There is no emoticon to express.......:applause:

IWK>:blowkiss:<jjj

 

[newcomer]

It's in the early part of the thread. There is a link to Topix and several community members and some family are commenting on an article. It seems the community was aware of the pregnancy, and they also mentioned an investigation. I posted one of the topix links and I think it might have been MizIzzy who posted another one also.

What is topix? another web site?

 

[lajr56]

According to this report, the investigation has been going on for over a year and the suspects knew it.

http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-story-mohler-timeline-112009,0,2761614.story

 

[fran]

According to this report, the investigation has been going on for over a year and the suspects knew it.

http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-story-mohler-timeline-112009,0,2761614.story

I had seen on one of the probable cause documents that one of the victims had reported first in August of 2008. I figured they'd just dropped it, thinking it would go nowhere.

Unfortunately, these guys have been aware for a year, they were being investigated. They may have already removed some evidence. Of course, with all of the and videos LE confiscated, they must have assumed the case would just fade away. Either that or they're just plain stoooopid! :loser:

JMHO
fran

PS...........in one of the documents I read recently, it said the victim was 'very emotional.' I can't even imagine it being so many years later and it still hurting so much.....These poor victims, my heart hurts for them.

 

[human]

What kind of lawyer is PAX? Is there any proof this person is attorney?

 

[Missizzy]

I can't remember what I posted about a pregnancy. There's a lot of confusion about multiple pregnancies, possible abortions, and a possible dead baby. I think the details are too sketchy to really flesh out right now.

One issue that I find interesting, however, is how LE seems to be leaning away from discussing the mystery of the the murdered man and the abortions. They seem to be focusing much more on sexual abuse of minors and possible child . That leads me to question whether they have determined that a "real" murder and abortion did not occur but were instead staged. Remember, we are dealing with little girls--aged 5-10--who still are at the "magical thinking" developmental level. That's also why children of that age are so entranced with Barbies and Disney and anything fantasy-like and so terrified of scary movies.

In reading the site:

http://www.ritualabusetorture.org/torture.pdf

I came across these statements:


"....forced involvement in real and/or sham murder rituals; a knife forced into her hands and held there by her torturers as they plunged it into another human being."

"videotaped as trophies for future pleasures, for commercial trade on the market, and for emotional blackmailing purposes."

"hearing the torturer’s statement “if you live to tell no one will believe you."

"...laughter; humiliation

"A co-culture of trans-generational kin and/or non-kin whose like-minded needs and desires for ritual abuse-torture (RAT) can be inter-connected regionally, nationally, internationally, and transnationally."

So, my guess is that sham murders and abortions are known to happen. I wonder if LE determined already that this might be the case here. When you think about it, the effect on the victim is exactly the same as if a real murder or forced abortion occurred. It's all in what the mind believes.

This particular site along with the Mormon Alliance site detail many many facts of ritual abuse. The difference is that the ritualabusetorture site, continues to take these crimes very seriously whereas I feel (IMO) that the Mormon Alliance site appears to have seriously looked into these reports due to extreme pressure and somewhat discounted their believability. I'd be very interested in other views and insights.

Concerning the time lapse during first report and search warrant--will someone PLEASE explain that to me. When our kids disclosed their abuse, they were immediately taken to the Children's Advocacy Center, interviewed, video-taped, and physically examined. The rapist was arrested within hours. However, there wasn't a search warrant executed for 6 weeks!! We had testimony at our trial from three of our children (and I believe a neighbor IIRC) that an adult friend of the teen was seen in the exotic bird coop and the teen's house removing items the day after the arrest. Makes one wonder, huh?

The Mohler brothers must be awfully sure of themselves to not have dumped all the incriminating evidence. My guess is that this will be brought up as a factor in their defense. We saw it in our trial also. There were Penthouses and Playboys found in the teen's room but where was the photo album of "bad photos" each of our kids and the other victims described? I'll never give up on finding that.

 

[PAXIMUS]

What kind of lawyer is PAX? Is there any proof this person is attorney?

I am not here speaking as an attorney, I am here because of my interest in the case same as everyone else. I dont offer legal advice to anyone and have no intention of doing so but I will argue in favor of rights of the accused because I have an obligation to do so.