MO MO - St Louis, BlkFem 8-11, 54UFMO, in abandoned bldg, Feb'83 #2

[Laughing]

most likely a child that was being kept off the grid; no SSN, no doctors visits, no schooling or access to people outside the family.
even if someone does notice the child's absence there's not much they can't do about it if the kid doesn't technically "exist" legally

The process of the hospital/doctor/midwife initiating the application for a Social Security Number started in 1987:

The Story of the Social Security Number

Social Security Administration Research, Statistics, and Policy Analysis

www.ssa.gov

In August 1987, SSA began a three-state pilot of the "Enumeration at Birth" (EAB) process in which the parent of a newborn can request an SSN as part of the state's birth registration process. Additional states began to participate in EAB in July 1988. By the end of 1991, 45 states, the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, and New York City had signed agreements (Long 1993, 83). Today, over 90 percent of parents use the EAB process offered in all 50 states plus Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia. SSA receives nearly three-quarters of original SSN applications through the EAB process and issues over 4 million SSNs via EAB each year (SSA 2006). No microfilm SS-5 exists for a record created through the EAB process.

No SSN for a child before that did not necessarily mean any sort of off-grid.

And, we don't know if theis child had an SSN or not -- if she was in a household receiving Food Stamps (now SNAP benefits) & was listed on the case, she did have an SSN.

 

[CCJD]

The process of the hospital/doctor/midwife initiating the application for a Social Security Number started in 1987:

The Story of the Social Security Number

Social Security Administration Research, Statistics, and Policy Analysis

www.ssa.gov

In August 1987, SSA began a three-state pilot of the "Enumeration at Birth" (EAB) process in which the parent of a newborn can request an SSN as part of the state's birth registration process. Additional states began to participate in EAB in July 1988. By the end of 1991, 45 states, the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, and New York City had signed agreements (Long 1993, 83). Today, over 90 percent of parents use the EAB process offered in all 50 states plus Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia. SSA receives nearly three-quarters of original SSN applications through the EAB process and issues over 4 million SSNs via EAB each year (SSA 2006). No microfilm SS-5 exists for a record created through the EAB process.

No SSN for a child before that did not necessarily mean any sort of off-grid.

And, we don't know if theis child had an SSN or not -- if she was in a household receiving Food Stamps (now SNAP benefits) & was listed on the case, she did have an SSN.

And in the year before, was this (which did not include infants):

October 22, 1986 President Reagan signed into law the Tax Reform Act of 1986. Among its provisions, the law required that every dependent age 5 or older listed on a tax return had to have their own Social Security number. This new requirement doubled SSA's enumeration workload in the following year.

Social Security History

 

[Aurora90]

But if the mother gave birth at home and kept the child off the grid, still no SSN correct?

 

[DS2021]

But if the mother gave birth at home and kept the child off the grid, still no SSN correct?

Yeah, if the government didn't know about the birth then they wouldn't assign an SSN.

 

[taramarie]

most likely a child that was being kept off the grid; no SSN, no doctors visits, no schooling or access to people outside the family.
even if someone does notice the child's absence there's not much they can't do about it if the kid doesn't technically "exist" legally

She was well nourished with no signs of previous abuse so I’m doubtful this is the case. I think someone loved her

 

[Triss]

She was well nourished with no signs of previous abuse so I’m doubtful this is the case. I think someone loved her

I sure hope she is loved and missed by someone. Even if she wasn't reported missing (and I don't believe she was), I do hope someone is looking for her.

 

[Laughing]

I sure hope she is loved and missed by someone. Even if she wasn't reported missing (and I don't believe she was), I do hope someone is looking for her.

We have a thread about a little girl who was loved & missed by her Mom, and likely killed by her father.

Mom trusted that the courts, the father, and the step-mother would care for her child.

Identified! - AL - Opelika, 'Juvenile Jane Doe', BlkFem, UP9834, 4-7, in woods, abused, Jan'12 *reward* - Amore Joveah Wiggins

Do you think that someone who was at VBS has told police the name they little girl gave? Or did she not speak so clearly that no one bothered to learn her name. SOMEONE has to know something!!!!

www.websleuths.com

Unfortunately, we may have a similar situation here.

jmho

 

[funkychicken]

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

A young female was found in the basement of a vacant building. The unidentified female had been deceased for under a week prior to being found. Her head was not recovered. Advanced forensic testing of her bones has also suggested that the female was not originally from the St Louis area but possibly spent most of her childhood in the following states: PA, OH, MI, MN, WI, IN, and WV.

 

[hafom8840]

It still is possible very well so that SLJD had a name. I thought that Joseph Zarelli didn't legally have a name and my expectations were subverted. I hope that's the case with SLJD too.

 

[Vern]

@othram ... I would love to see this little one get her name back. She deserves so much better.

 

[DS2021]

@othram ... I would love to see this little one get her name back. She deserves so much better.

CeCe Moore has been working on this case for a while now. I dont think theres anything for Othram to do

 

[Springrain]

I know it sounds far-fetched, but it is possible that CeCe has already identified St. Louis Jane Doe and has to sit on an announcement. That's what happened with Joseph Zarelli, and many other Does. We have seen cases of Does that were just recently announced as being identified but who had actually been identified years before and the announcement was being sat on for various different reasons. You never know. I have faith she'll get her name back, hopefully very soon!

 

[Tahlia Woodson]

I know it sounds far-fetched, but it is possible that CeCe has already identified St. Louis Jane Doe and has to sit on an announcement. That's what happened with Joseph Zarelli, and many other Does. We have seen cases of Does that were just recently announced as being identified but who had actually been identified years before and the announcement was being sat on for various different reasons. You never know. I have faith she'll get her name back, hopefully very soon!

As wonderful as that would be, I don't think CeCe would have openly talked about trying to identify her on the documentary if she already did identify her. Unless she did so between the release of the documentary and now

 

[Springrain]

As wonderful as that would be, I don't think CeCe would have openly talked about trying to identify her on the documentary if she already did identify her. Unless she did so between the release of the documentary and now

Very true but I think it's possible she's been identified since the filming of the documentary. Anyone know when it was?

 

[DS2021]

Here is an Interview by CeCe Moore confirming that the St Louis Little Jane Doe’s Linage if from Freestine, Tx & Calvert, Alabama through Memphis, TN. Please if you have Darin these areas upload your DNA to GED Match. <iframe src="https://omny.fm/shows/the-show/cece-moore-investigating-a-st-louis-unsolved-murde/embed" width="100%" height="180" allow="autoplay; clipboard-write" frameborder="0" title="CeCe Moore: investigating a St. Louis unsolved murder from 1983"></iframe>

As of January she was still unidentified

 

[Melt71]

Here is an Interview by CeCe Moore confirming that the St Louis Little Jane Doe’s Linage if from Freestine, Tx & Calvert, Alabama through Memphis, TN. Please if you have Darin these areas upload your DNA to GED Match. <iframe src="https://omny.fm/shows/the-show/cece-moore-investigating-a-st-louis-unsolved-murde/embed" width="100%" height="180" allow="autoplay; clipboard-write" frameborder="0" title="CeCe Moore: investigating a St. Louis unsolved murder from 1983"></iframe>

Just wanted to post a better link as the original took me all sorts of sideways
www.audacy.com/podcast/the-show-on-kmox-1da3d/episodes/cece-moore-investigating-a-st-louis-unsolved-murder-from-1983-508ff

Also interesting to note @CeCeMoore notes in the interview that she's been working this case on almost 3 years.

 

[priv8eye]

Just wanted to post a better link as the original took me all sorts of sideways
www.audacy.com/podcast/the-show-on-kmox-1da3d/episodes/cece-moore-investigating-a-st-louis-unsolved-murder-from-1983-508ff

Also interesting to note @CeCeMoore notes in the interview that she's been working this case on almost 3 years.

They said that in the documentary

 

[Moonwalker9]

The documentary is now available on youtube for anyone interested. Towards the end CeCe Moore explained the difficulties identifying her. One thing she's a minority and in GEDmatch, which she primarily works with there is considerably less representation from blacks and its much smaller then other geneology databases like ancestry, 23 and Me and Myheritage but their terms of service don't allow LE to use them, not even for cases like these.

She mentiones that around 40 million Americans or 2/10 have run a test in one of these databases and if they would have been accessible she would have been identified already But she can only use GEDmatch and Family tree DN and she only got public access so she only sees what others can see.

Like you may know, they have to create a family tree from scratch with alot of diffrent Dna samples and its's time consuming and complicated at times depending on how close of far away the matches are. Sometimes the narrowest hit can be a distant third cousin

However, they had 2 very promising matches but she learned that unfortunately both were around 100 years ago and unfortunately when you work with blacks in america that old, slavery is a factor and with slavery comes bad public records that comlicated things considerably. Building a family tree from a common ancestor born into slavery is hard. She reached out to the granddaughter to one of the matches but she refused to collaborate and didnt want anyone to ever call her again, even removing the record from GEDmatch, while the second lady she contacted ghosted her and never got back despite promising to help when they first spoke.

Another issue shes probably dealing with is family situations like adoptions where someone family tree on paper may not be accuratetley representing their genetic descent. Same thing happened with Grundy County Jane Doe I think. Because she's working with more distant matches she need assistance from the familiesb before she can make a real break in the case.

Her family tree goes back to Texas, Tennessee and Alabama mostly BUT it doesnt necessarily means she's from there beacuse of the great migration. CeCe doesn't even want to rule out that she could have been from St Louis.


I don't think she has been identified yet but hopefuly she will be soon or later

 

[Laughing]

However, they had 2 very promising matches but she learned that unfortunately both were around 100 years ago and unfortunately when you work with blacks in america that old, slavery is a factor and with slavery comes bad public records that comlicated things considerably. Building a family tree from a common ancestor born into slavery is hard. She reached out to the granddaughter to one of the matches but she refused to collaborate and didnt want anyone to ever call her again, even removing the record from GEDmatch, while the second lady she contacted ghosted her and never got back despite promising to help when they first spoke.

Another issue shes probably dealing with is family situations like adoptions where someone family tree on paper may not be accuratetley representing their genetic descent. Same thing happened with Grundy County Jane Doe I think. Because she's working with more distant matches she need assistance from the familiesb before she can make a real break in the case.

Her family tree goes back to Texas, Tennessee and Alabama mostly BUT it doesnt necessarily means she's from there beacuse of the great migration. CeCe doesn't even want to rule out that she could have been from St Louis.


I don't think she has been identified yet but hopefuly she will be soon or later

bbm rsbm

100 years ago was 1923. The 1920 & 1930 federal census scans are a great resource. 1890 was mostly lost in a fire, sadly.

Record keeping problems are just part of genealogy. A shame that the identified relatives reacted as they did.

To me, suggests that those relatives may know something(s) we don't know.

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[DS2021]

The documentary is now available on youtube for anyone interested

Is this the our precious hope one? If so I want to give a huge warning that her body is shown multiple times. The photo is much more graphic than the one that is widely circulated