Motive

[wandering]

We must rember these are young people and very different from our generation so have to keep an open mind to what these young people may be doing now a days.

Yes, but somehow I don't think DHS would approve of your theory.

 

[Pink Panther]

That's right. She couldn't just "put Caylee down" anymore.

Interesting about RM's testimony today that ICA disciplined Caylee for not getting to sleep.

Wow. I missed that.

 

[GetSmart]

Well JB wants all that dog hits thrown out and trying to discredit the K9s and handlers ..

 

[wandering]

She knew the word mama really well because she called her doll mama not because she had a real mama.....I'd say she spent more time with that doll than she did with some type of parent figure

Yes, and if Cindy asked her where she slept, she'd say "with Mama."

OMG, Casey is truly devious.

 

[gmt]

In KC's IMs with AR she tells him how hard it is getting someone to watch Caylee, and how she is going so crazy to not be going out. Another thing is what I was reading today pg 11 of 13 was not shown, so Im wandering what was on it. Does anyone know?

 

[wandering]

-----------------

I have often wondered if Caylee ever referred to the babysitter by name.A 3 year old is also very truthful,my son spoke in small sentences at 18 mos..kids may "fantisize" (sp) but the dont usually lie.When they showed the video of Caylee at the table with the book I heard her speak quite plain.
IMO Nore

Speaking of the babysitter, I seem to recall that Caylee had a book, and the character's name in that book was "Zanny." So maybe Casey was using the familiar things in little Caylee's life to snow Cindy.

I also recall Cindy saying "Zanny" had a puppy, that Caylee talked about the puppy, and I am wondering if there was a puppy character in that book.

 

[wandering]

Well JB wants all that dog hits thrown out and trying to discredit the K9s and handlers ..

That's not to say it didn't inspire them with the pool theory. Also, maybe that won't get thrown out, and they have to cover themselves.

 

[marlap]

In KC's IMs with AR she tells him how hard it is getting someone to watch Caylee, and how she is going so crazy to not be going out. Another thing is what I was reading today pg 11 of 13 was not shown, so Im wandering what was on it. Does anyone know?

No, good question...

Speaking of the babysitter, I seem to recall that Caylee had a book, and the character's name in that book was "Zanny." So maybe Casey was using the familiar things in little Caylee's life to snow Cindy.

I also recall Cindy saying "Zanny" had a puppy, that Caylee talked about the puppy, and I am wondering if there was a puppy character in that book.

Very interesting!

 

[panthera]

That's right. She couldn't just "put Caylee down" anymore.

Interesting about RM's testimony today that ICA disciplined Caylee for not getting to sleep.

Huge point for the prosecution. MOO

 

[Phoebeb]

She was sleeping with RM at the time with Caylee in the bed and Caylee was becoming increasingly verbal.

The jealousy, inability to party, nagging from CA, Caylee starting to talk.

A verbal small child = NIGHTMARE for a pathological liar like ICA.

I think it was all those things put together...she wanted freedom at all costs.

I thought it was telling that Kaylee slept over RM's 4-5 nights a week. But never with KC at AL's place. Maybe things fell apart with RM BECAUSE he didn't want a 2 year old around all the time, and KC decided she wasn't going to risk losing AL. So mama said she wasn't caring for Kaylee properly, but she didn't want to jeopardize her relationship with AL, so she had to (can't even say it) Kaylee.

 

[marlap]

bump

I know the prosecutors don't have to prove motive but jurys always want to know why.

I really think one of the main reasons ICA killed Caylee is because Caylee was at the age where she could verbalize more and more each month that went by and for a pathological liar like ICA, a verbalizing toddler equals NIGHTMARE.

I agree that there were likely multiple reasons...jealousy, not wanting responibility CA and GA were trying to get ICA to pick up, etc.

I really think ICA had been thinking about killing her since March...maybe Caylee said something about what they REALLY did all day (i.e., no nanny and no job) that made ICA realize...

Omigah, Caylee is beginning to talk and convey significant things like the TRUTH.

But I really, really hope the prosecutors bring up ICA getting to a point where Caylee would soon be constantly, inadvertantly exposing ICA's lies to CA, GA, and BOYFRIENDS alike.

Jurors don't leave their common sense at the door after all.

 

[JenniferTx]

Yes, and if Cindy asked her where she slept, she'd say "with Mama."

OMG, Casey is truly devious.

The doll being called Mama was always a tad bit strange in my book. Casey Anthony is the true definition of the word devious.

 

[marlap]

The doll being called Mama was always a tad bit strange in my book. Casey Anthony is the true definition of the word devious.

Yes, there used to be a couple of bars in my city (Austin)...one named "The Boss's Office" and one named "The Library."

They may even still be in business.

 

[JenniferTx]

Yes, there used to be a couple of bars in my city (Austin)...one named "The Boss's Office" and one named "The Library."

They may even still be in business.

Hey I've heard of those bars before. I love Austin! I need to plan another trip there soon. You live in a great city.

 

[marlap]

The state may be wrapping up today and they have never directly presented possible motive. My personal feeling is that the motive was a combination of:

1) Caylee really beginning to talk and p[otentially blow ICA's lies in front of GA, CA, or ICA's various men

2) ICA's spite and jealousy for CA

3) ICA wanting to party.



But, I think the state has done an incredible job of showing one motive (ICA wanted to party...FREEDOM):

1) all the videos of ICA shopping during the 31 days

2) spending all day in bed with TL the day after

3) party pics that week

I think the state really showed the jury ICA's desire to be free and to party.

They also preserved the integrity of CA's testimony about CA, ICA, and Caylee watching the nursing home video the night before and having a nice moment talking about CA's dad. I'm glad the prosecution didn't bring up the fight CA had with ICA the night before because I don't think they needed it and they don't want to sully CA's testimony about that night. I personally think CA really knows the truth and wants justice for Caylee----knows ICA needs to pay for it, but wants to save her life. I think that''s why CA didn't want to bring up the fight.

But I really do think the prosecution showed the jury one of the motives (like I said, I think there were multiple motives) they may have needed:

ICA wanted to be free and party.


I think the jury got this message this loud and clear!

 

[Anais]

The state may be wrapping up today and they have never directly presented possible motive. My personal feeling is that the motive was a combination of:

1) Caylee really beginning to talk and p[otentially blow ICA's lies in front of GA, CA, or ICA's various men

2) ICA's spite and jealousy for CA

3) ICA wanting to party.



But, I think the state has done an incredible job of showing one motive (ICA wanted to party...FREEDOM):

1) all the videos of ICA shopping during the 31 days

2) spending all day in bed with TL the day after

3) party pics that week

I think the state really showed the jury ICA's desire to be free and to party.

They also preserved the integrity of CA's testimony about CA, ICA, and Caylee watching the nursing home video the night before and having a nice moment talking about CA's dad. I'm glad the prosecution didn't bring up the fight CA had with ICA the night before because I don't think they needed it and they don't want to sully CA's testimony about that night. I personally think CA really knows the truth and wants justice for Caylee----knows ICA needs to pay for it, but wants to save her life. I think that''s why CA didn't want to bring up the fight.

But I really do think the prosecution showed the jury one of the motives (like I said, I think there were multiple motives) they may have needed:

ICA wanted to be free and party.


I think the jury got this message this loud and clear!

Marlap great post! ITA.

IMO the SA has shown the jurors several different potential motives and they will figure it out for them selves.

 

[marlap]

Marlap great post! ITA.

IMO the SA has shown the jurors several different potential motives and they will figure it out for them selves.

I agree.

The prosecution knows that the jury members bring their common sense into the courtroom with them.


Oh....and also through CA and GA and LA testimonies...the prosecution showed the jury all the lies ICA was telling her family about Caylee being this place or that place or just down for a nap...

All the excuses ICA had for keeping her family away so she could party and they would leave her alone.

 

[marlap]

:bump:

Bumping the Motive thread since closing arguments are tomorrow.

People posting here have come up with a great list of credible motives that I think all apply, it'll be interesting to see how many the prosecution hits on tomorrow:

1) ICA wanted freedom and to live La Bella Vita

2) To hurt CA

3) Caylee was starting to talk


I think the prosecution will keep it simple and just hit on the fact that ICA wanted her freedom and Caylee interfered with that. As soon as she had it, she was partying with a vengence...gleeful pictures of her at hot body contests days later and TL testifying they spent the whole day the next day "in bed." Getting a tatoo to celebrate "the beautiful life" that she thought she finally got...even throwing a pizza party at the tatoo place!


But, I really think GA and CA were ICA's first intended targets:

1) telling AH that her parents were "splitting up" and she was getting the house, so ICA and AH could move in there

2) ICA's searches for "self-defense" wouldn't have been about Caylee, but could have been to get ideas for lies to tell LE after she killed her parents "in self-defense." She would want to look up stories for ideas so she could sound credible.


I have thought for a long time that ICA's main motive was that Caylee was reaching the age where her talking included being able to relate events and that was going to interfere with ICA doing whatever she wanted.

As ICA was a pathological liar and wouldn't want Caylee revealing that there was no Zanny, Annabelle, job, etc., she had to do something.

I think her first idea was to kill GA and CA and get the house and money. Deciding that plan was to complicated and risky, she decided to kill Caylee, the one person who could "pin prick" her liar baloons in front of GA, CA, LA, and various boyfriends.

I think the day she did it was an impulsive, "Okay, today is the day!" because she was mad at her mom and she couldn't find a sitter for Caylee and wanted to be at TL's.

The ironic part to me of ICA going with her "plan B" and killing Caylee instead of GA or CA is that I have zero doubt that GA and CA would both have gladly given their lives for Caylee's. In a heartbeat.

Zero doubt.

 

[marlap]

I'm so glad Jeff Ashton brought up Caylee's bneginning to talk as part of the motive.

He presented it brilliantly....the motive was ICA wanting freedom and deciding to kill Caylee because she was starting to talk and could expose her lies to CA, GA, and boyfriends.

I think the day she did it was on impulse but she had been thinking about doing it since March.

 

[concentric]

I'm so glad Jeff Ashton brought up Caylee's bneginning to talk as part of the motive.

He presented it brilliantly....the motive was ICA wanting freedom and deciding to kill Caylee because she was starting to talk and could expose her lies to CA, GA, and boyfriends.

I think the day she did it was on impulse but she had been thinking about doing it since March.

IMO: As if ICA was thinking: I'll permanently shut you up, you little snot head.