Identified! Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - Pamela Buckley & James P Freund #8

[Canaille]

I forgot, LOL. But yeah, the question is honestly how did they have enough money to survive together? It's so strange

May he played pool for money? I believe the witness claimed that James tried to pawn his ring to him.

 

[onceuponadecember]

May he played pool for money? I believe the witness claimed that James tried to pawn his ring to him.

I honestly doubt the story about Jacques is related to James and Pam anymore. We know for sure James was American and Pam was as well.

 

[Betty P]

The problem with the race theory is that we can't even verify if James actually attended the race or he just thrifted the shirt from another unknown place.
IMO

While its more common today, people didn't shop as much at thrift stores then. At the time of his death, James was well dressed and groomed and appeared to be in a financial position to buy new clothes. The odds of them attending a race are about even, either way. We can only speculate.

I'm leaning away from nefarious theories about the victims as there's no evidence at all to support them.

The case will be solved (hopefully) by LE. They have the evidence and access to investigative tools that might help them verify whether this was a robbery, whether James was driving a vehicle of his own, etc.

 

[onceuponadecember]

Here's an updated timeline for Pam

• December 16, 1951: Pam is born in Redwood County, MN.
• June 6, 1956: Pam's sister, "Jane" is born in Redwood County, MN.
• September 13, 1959: Pam's sister, "Doe" is born in Redwood County, MN.
• c. August 1966 - May 1970: Pam is apart of the Redwood Falls High School choir.
• December 20, 1970: Pam performs with Sunlending in Chanhassen, MN.
• March 11, 1971: Pam performs with Sunlending in Morris, MN.
• April 5, 1971 @7:00 PM: Pam performs with Sunlending in Morris, MN.
• October 14, 1971: Pam performs with Sunlending in Minneapolis, MN.
• October 14, 1972: Pam marries GCK in Manitou Springs, CO.
• c. December 1975: Pam disappears from Colorado Springs, CO.
• August 8 - 9, 1976 @5:00 PM - 1:00 AM: Pam and James eat ice cream or fruit.
• August 9, 1976 @1:00 AM: Pam and James are murdered and likely carjacked.
• August 9, 1976 @6:20 AM: Pam and James are found murdered in Sumter County, SC.

 

[Satchie]

While its more common today, people didn't shop as much at thrift stores then. At the time of his death, James was well dressed and groomed and appeared to be in a financial position to buy new clothes. The odds of them attending a race are about even, either way. We can only speculate.

I'm leaning away from nefarious theories about the victims as there's no evidence at all to support them.

The case will be solved (hopefully) by LE. They have the evidence and access to investigative tools that might help them verify whether this was a robbery, whether James was driving a vehicle of his own, etc.

I agree, there were no thrift stores back then, except church sales that would sell clothes of seniors who had died (I was there at the time!)

Not to make this a history lesson, but back then clothes weren't made in mass quantities in China, they were expensive, well made in America, and in comparison to now, hard to find. People didn't fake their identity, either. If your sweatshirt said Yale, it meant you went to Yale. And most people dressed nicely wherever they went, unless they were literally alcoholics living in the street, and those were very rare, or self-declared hippies, deliberately defying social norms with their messy, dirty clothing.

People might buy a van for a trip to where it was cooler, but I can't see anyone sleeping in a van in the southern US in August, even now. Fewer vehicles had air conditioning then, too.

In the other hand, motels and diners were cheap and plentiful.

IMO, not wearing underwear could just mean they had a bag of laundry that they were planning to run through a laundromat at their next stop...another thing I recall both me and my boyfriend doing a few years later.

I believe this was a carjacking, and that very likely they did pickup one or a pair of ruthless hitch-hikers, who stole their vehicle, their id and money, and all their other stuff.

The only problem was, they weren't in sufficiently close touch with anyone as they travelled, so there was no one to know that they hadn't arrived somewhere, and had been travelling through South Carolina to get there. Again, no internet back then. When they didn't get back in touch, each individual friend or family member would assume it was by choice, rather than assume they'd been murdered.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Here's an updated timeline for Pam

• December 16, 1951: Pam is born in Redwood County, MN.
• June 6, 1956: Pam's sister, "Jane" is born in Redwood County, MN.
• September 13, 1959: Pam's sister, "Doe" is born in Redwood County, MN.
• c. August 1966 - May 1970: Pam is apart of the Redwood Falls High School choir.
• December 20, 1970: Pam performs with Sunlending in Chanhassen, MN.
• March 11, 1971: Pam performs with Sunlending in Morris, MN.
• April 5, 1971 @7:00 PM: Pam performs with Sunlending in Morris, MN.
• October 14, 1971: Pam performs with Sunlending in Minneapolis, MN.
• October 14, 1972: Pam marries GCK in Manitou Springs, CO.
• c. December 1975: Pam disappears from Colorado Springs, CO.
• August 8 - 9, 1976 @5:00 PM - 1:00 AM: Pam and James eat ice cream or fruit.
• August 9, 1976 @1:00 AM: Pam and James are murdered and likely carjacked.
• August 9, 1976 @6:20 AM: Pam and James are found murdered in Sumter County, SC.

Thank you. This is a streamlined timeline

 

[onceuponadecember]

Thank you. This is a streamlined timeline

No problem! I'm working on an updated one for James right now. Websleuths has been a good thing to keep me busy when I'm at home not grading my students' work, LOL. Gotta use my timeline knowledge somewhere.

 

[ntt1]

Here’s how Lancaster man was ID’d as victim in 44-year-old cold case

Jock Doe's (JPF) case was apparently solved in hours, as they had two second cousin matches.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

We just kind of embraced them in our community,” she explained. “You see, there are always different flowers on the grave.”

“To the families who had to struggle and endure with 44 years of not knowing where their loved ones are at, now they can at least put them to rest,” said Sumter County Coroner Robert M. Baker Jr.

You can also contact Crimestoppers in one of the following ways:

PHONE TIP — Call the toll free number at 1-888-CRIME-SC (888-274-6372).


WEB TIP — Go to www.midlandscrimestoppers.com and click “Submit a Tip”.

MOBILE TIP — Download the new P3 Tips app on your Apple or Android Device.

You can provide information anonymously through Midlands Crime Stoppers. Your tip could earn you a cash reward of up to $1,000 for information leading to the arrest of the person responsible for this crime.
Investigators identify victims of 1976 cold case out of Sumter County

 

[imstilla.grandma]

No problem! I'm working on an updated one for James right now. Websleuths has been a good thing to keep me busy when I'm at home not grading my students' work, LOL. Gotta use my timeline knowledge somewhere.

I relate. I’m a retired special investigator stroke survivor so WS has allowed me to regain hand/finger dexterity and reignite the spark in my brain. I use these cases as brain puzzles. WS has been my free rehab facility. Thank you Tricia.

 

[onceuponadecember]

Here's an updated timeline for James:
(After this, I'll make a google site to upload all my timelines so you guys can find them there.)

• September 16, 1946: James is born in Leominster, MA.
• c. May 1964: James graduates from Lancaster High School in Lancaster County, PA
• December 18, 1965 @2:00 PM: James marries "Gia" in an Evangelical United Brethren Church.
• February 7, 1966: James's maternal uncle, "Geoff" dies.
• November 17, 1966: James's father, "Mr. Freund", dies of a heart attack.
• January 11, 1970: James's daughter, "Marie", is born.
• September 16, 1971: James and "Gia" divorce on the grounds of indignities.
• July 24, 1972: James's grandfather, P.B., dies in Warren County, OH.
• October 17, 1974; Charges against James on the grounds of non-support of a child are dropped due to payment of costs (the filer is unknown).
• December 25, 1975: James calls "Marie" on Christmas Day. This is the last known contact between James and any relatives.
• August 8 - 9, 1976 @5:00 PM - 1:00 AM: James and Pam buy and/or eat ice cream or fruit.
• August 9, 1976 @1:00 AM: James and Pam are murdered and likely carjacked.
• August 9, 1976 @6:20 AM: James and Pam are found murdered in Sumter County, SC.

 

[Betty P]

We just kind of embraced them in our community,” she explained. “You see, there are always different flowers on the grave.”

“To the families who had to struggle and endure with 44 years of not knowing where their loved ones are at, now they can at least put them to rest,” said Sumter County Coroner Robert M. Baker Jr.

You can also contact Crimestoppers in one of the following ways:

PHONE TIP — Call the toll free number at 1-888-CRIME-SC (888-274-6372).


WEB TIP — Go to www.midlandscrimestoppers.com and click “Submit a Tip”.

MOBILE TIP — Download the new P3 Tips app on your Apple or Android Device.

You can provide information anonymously through Midlands Crime Stoppers. Your tip could earn you a cash reward of up to $1,000 for information leading to the arrest of the person responsible for this crime.
Investigators identify victims of 1976 cold case out of Sumter County

They really have been a wonderful community to have taken care of these young victims. It must have been a sad, traumatic experience for them. They're to be admired for their persistence in learning their identities. They set a great example of kindness for others to follow.

 

[norest4thewicked]

It’s just frustrating for me with Does sometimes that we almost seem to romanticize them. James has been charged before for not paying child support and apparently left town knowing he was leaving a young child behind. So many of our does looking back not just these two had seriously questionable past. Now that’s not saying they don’t deserve dignity and their names back. It is saying let’s not turn them into Altar Boys and girls just because they were a Jane and John Doe.

Let's also not turn them into wrongdoers or at fault for what happened to them.

 

[onceuponadecember]

This is a far-fetched theory but what if James and Pam were headed to Myrtle Beach? Oswego to Myrtle Beach is only about 2 1/4 hours away from Oswego, SC though.

 

[UnlicensedPI]

Here's an updated timeline for James:
(After this, I'll make a google site to upload all my timelines so you guys can find them there.)

• September 16, 1946: James is born in Fitchburg, MA.
• c. May 1964: James graduates from Lancaster High School in Lancaster County, PA
• December 18, 1965 @2:00 PM: James marries "Gia" in an Evangelical United Brethren Church.
• February 7, 1966: James's maternal uncle, "Geoff" dies.
• November 17, 1966: James's father, "Mr. Freund", dies of a heart attack.
• January 11, 1970: James's daughter, "Marie", is born.
• September 16, 1971: James and "Gia" divorce on the grounds of indignities.
• July 24, 1972: James's grandfather, P.B., dies in Warren County, OH.
• October 17, 1974; Charges against James on the grounds of non-support of a child are dropped due to payment of costs (the filer is unknown).
• December 25, 1975: James calls "Marie" on Christmas Day. This is the last known contact between James and any relatives.
• August 8, 1976 @5:00 PM - 1:00 AM: James and Pam buy and/or eat ice cream or fruit.
• August 9, 1976 @1:00 AM: James and Pam are murdered and likely carjacked.
• August 9, 1976 @6:20 AM: James and Pam are found murdered in Sumter County, SC.

A slight correction, he was born in Leominster, not Fitchburg.

 

[onceuponadecember]

A slight correction, he was born in Leominster, not Fitchburg.

Alright, thanks.

 

[Laughing]

I honestly doubt the story about Jacques is related to James and Pam anymore. We know for sure James was American and Pam was as well.

The KOA person may have referred to JPF as "Jock" because he played high school sports. This may have morphed into "Jacques" at some point.

We do like fancy stories.

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[Satchie]

• c. December 1975: Pam disappears from Colorado Springs, CO.

Thanks so much for the timeline.

I'm wondering whether there's enough information to state that she actually disappeared at that time? I know her case was only entered into NAMUS in 2019: does that mean there was a thorough investigation by police closer to Dec 1975, when her parents and friends could still have been found and interviewed? They may have had contact with her after Dec 1975, but IMO may never have reported her as missing.

I'm wondering whether the ex-husband is the person who was easiest to contact in 2019, and remembers precisely a date, since he could consult his divorce papers.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

This is a far-fetched theory but what if James and Pam were headed to Myrtle Beach? Oswego to Myrtle Beach is only about 2 1/4 hours away from Oswego, SC though.

I was thinking along the same lines. I hadn’t thought of an area but when the discussion about where they would sleep - I wanted to say that I was in the same generation. We would always head our vans out to lake areas and parks. Anywhere along the way where there were free water hookup, bathrooms and places to build a fire. Places close to a town Main Street off the strip for supplies. Music was everything to us back then. Pot was hot. Sitting around the campfire with guitars and singing. Free entertainment. Was there any kind of music festival going on nearby at the time?

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Dbm