Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #8

[Snowlover77]

That is my fear also. It seems to be the norm these days. Drew Peterson still walking around and so is Craig Stebic. The one difference is that they both still have their kids. I can't remember hearing of a man losing his kids to his in-laws in a case like this EVER. That is the one thing that keeps me hoping they have something on him.

I keep going back to Nancy being found, "partially clothed,"..although we don't know what she was wearing or how much clothing she was wearing..we do know however that she was not fully clothed so something on her was missing....we can speculate on that...but in my heart of hearts, I think whoever attacked her made it appear to be a rape or an attempted rape. I have heard the defense lawyers in this case say she was attacked...so it will be interesting to see what dna is on her body and clothing and the area surrounding her body...is there incriminating evidence there? What did LE seize from the house/car? And what will be Science be able to tell us about those particular items? I do believe Nancy was killed by Brad. I aslo think he beat her to death with a blunt type of object. I believe when she came home from the party that night, he was up waiting for her..probably to start an argument with her about her leaving...I think he knew she had something planned....we don't know what that plan was but I am sure that whatever it was, it was going to cost Brad Cooper alot of money...and he was not going to give up the money..jhe would rather have her head and still be able to hang onto all of his money. Many times these types of cases are more about money and the reality of having to pay out a big chunk of it for many years to come someone you don't care about...
I also wonder if Brad had learned of her plan and killed her so she could not follow through on it. With her just having returned from vacation with her parents it is reasonable to believe they had advised her what to do and she was going to do it....make him leave and pay her alimony and child support. I may be wrong but this is what I believe at this point in time. I will be a happy camper and eat happy crow if I am wrong.

 

[strach304]

I also have a possible scenario for the detergent with bleach story too. Feel free to correct me if I am off on the facts given by Mom.

LE comes in store tells manager he wants to see the video for someone that claimed to have bought bread and milk at 6:00am. Now that part being true and then whoever the manager repeats the story decides to make it interesting and tells all the other employees the detergent story. Maybe even the manager for all I know. So this is how a rumor is picked up by the media who then questions LE and they have no comment. Makes the 4am story sound more credible because that's what the media is repeating. At 6am he very well could have gone to the store before Nancy left for her jog.

 

[curiositycat]

I keep going back to Nancy being found, "partially clothed,"..although we don't know what she was wearing or how much clothing she was wearing..we do know however that she was not fully clothed so something on her was missing....we can speculate on that...but in my heart of hearts, I think whoever attacked her made it appear to be a rape or an attempted rape. I have heard the defense lawyers in this case say she was attacked...so it will be interesting to see what dna is on her body and clothing and the area surrounding her body...is there incriminating evidence there? What did LE seize from the house/car? And what will be Science be able to tell us about those particular items? I do believe Nancy was killed by Brad. I aslo think he beat her to death with a blunt type of object. I believe when she came home from the party that night, he was up waiting for her..probably to start an argument with her about her leaving...I think he knew she had something planned....we don't know what that plan was but I am sure that whatever it was, it was going to cost Brad Cooper alot of money...and he was not going to give up the money..jhe would rather have her head and still be able to hang onto all of his money. Many times these types of cases are more about money and the reality of having to pay out a big chunk of it for many years to come someone you don't care about...
I also wonder if Brad had learned of her plan and killed her so she could not follow through on it. With her just having returned from vacation with her parents it is reasonable to believe they had advised her what to do and she was going to do it....make him leave and pay her alimony and child support. I may be wrong but this is what I believe at this point in time. I will be a happy camper and eat happy crow if I am wrong.

Well, Snow I posted my theory in "theories" I really think he wanted Nancy out of his life. The reason I say so is that he was withholding food money from her. He just wanted her "gone" in my opinion.
Years ago I read this book "Women Who Run With The Wolves" I have remembered many times one of the things I read there. The book talks about how as women we try to convince ourselves that "blue beards beard is not really blue." In other words our intuition tells us all we need to know but we start thinking and talking ourselves into thinking "I must be mistaken about how I feel"
I believe that this murder is "textbook". We can talk about it and wonder about it but the logical person to have committed this murder is Brad. The second choice is the mistress. If it turns out to be anyone other then one of them I will join you for a crow dinner

 

[strach304]

It is no longer so easy to concoct a sexual assault attempt as a cover up. There is skin under the nails, every kind of dna imaginable, defense wounds, etc. If they have the results back from BC's dna and it doesn't match dna from a rape kit then there could be other reasons too such as a bf. It's not like Brad was faithful and the marriage was ending. So then there becomes two suspects. And of course the unknown neighborhood psycho.

 

[Snowlover77]

Well, Snow I posted my theory in "theories" I really think he wanted Nancy out of his life. The reason I say so is that he was withholding food money from her. He just wanted her "gone" in my opinion.
Years ago I read this book "Women Who Run With The Wolves" I have remembered many times one of the things I read there. The book talks about how as women we try to convince ourselves that "blue beards beard is not really blue." In other words our intuition tells us all we need to know but we start thinking and talking ourselves into thinking "I must be mistaken about how I feel"
I believe that this murder is "textbook". We can talk about it and wonder about it but the logical person to have committed this murder is Brad. The second choice is the mistress. If it turns out to be anyone other then one of them I will join you for a crow dinner

When you say textbook, what do you mean? I agree with you on the blue beard quotre...my daughter once dated a guy who could convince her that BLACK is WHITE. Glad she figured him out. I believe he wanted Nancy gone too but like mnay others couldn't do it the legal way and divorce her because that would cost him too much money. It's just easier for these men to kill.

 

[Snowlover77]

It is no longer so easy to concoct a sexual assault attempt as a cover up. There is skin under the nails, every kind of dna imaginable, defense wounds, etc. If they have the results back from BC's dna and it doesn't match dna from a rape kit then there could be other reasons too such as a bf. It's not like Brad was faithful and the marriage was ending. So then there becomes two suspects. And of course the unknown neighborhood psycho.

I mean like her partial clothing was torn and tattered indicating a fight of sorts...not actual sperm inside her..just an attempt( and rememebr he is not thinking rationally at this time)to make it appear to be a random type assault.

 

[SleuthyGal]

For NC to be found 'partially clothed' AND the Cary PD to state with (some) certainty that this is "an isolated incident" it points more to a known suspect/person of interest than some random attacker. I see no point in making the public believe they are safe if in fact they might not be. And Cary police chief made a very definitive statement...more than once.

That leads me to believe that whatever state of Nancy's dress was part of a staging (perhaps to make it look like she was attacked), but that it was not the work of some random/bushy-haired stranger type, but was someone known to her very well.

 

[Blink34]

I can't, but I think Just the Fax is outlining that very well.

However, clearly under North Carolina law there is no necessity for grand jury involvement to initiate an arrest. There are multiple paths for that. Particularly, if the object of LE's attention appeared to be a flight risk, they might move up the arrest to prevent the defendant's movement.

So, there are reasons for any delay, and hopefully those are just the sorts of things you might imagine, which mainly deal with doing everything by the book and lining the case up as best as possible before proceeding. However, we don't know any of that. It could be a current shortage of evidence, but I hope not.

I have an opinion on this case like many people do, but there is no telling at this point what the outcome will be. It does appear to me that the PD has moved in a very strategic manner. The only exception to that possibly is declaring that the community had nothing to fear indicating I think that this was a targeted murder. That made me feel better; however, if I were the person who might be suspected of targeting Nancy Cooper, I would have assumed they were on to me.

Still, in common with everyone visiting here, I'd like to see justice already done, and I'd like to see an arrest already made, but none of that will bring Nancy back to her daughters and family. LE and the DA need to make sure they get the right person and when they do it, do it with enough evidence to win.

I imagine one point of discussion inside the LE side is how to make this a first degree case eligible for the death penalty. If many of the rumors are true, this crime does not appear to have been planned very well and you have to wonder why it happened when it happened, as opposed, say, to the unresolved (I didn't say unsolved) Young case. In other words, this one has more of a heat of the moment feel to it than the Young case.

Also, in my limited experience with local DNA labs (including the one involved in the Duke case) the testing simply cannot be done but so quickly. This goes too for the more involved type of tests (in my case we were trying to recover DNA from a piece of paper held by someone). Consequently, there may be important evidence that simply has not been fully processed yet. Also, there are several key individuals in the case who have not made public appearances, which is interesting too.

Well, sorry for the long post, but I just hope this ends solved and with the right person paying a price for a horrible, cowardly, selfish action.

Thank you gritguy, I bolded exactly what I have been trying to establish, I did not think the jurisprudence of NC functioned differently than most..

Additionally poignant, is the time it takes for DNA testing to come back- in some states, there is priority given to cases where there is a named supect, otherwise, in the qeue it goes- do you know NC standard for that?
Thanks and welcome

 

[Snowlover77]

For NC to be found 'partially clothed' AND the Cary PD to state with (some) certainty that this is "an isolated incident" it points more to a known suspect/person of interest than some random attacker. I see no point in making the public believe they are safe if in fact they might not be. And Cary police chief made a very definitive statement...more than once.

That leads me to believe that whatever state of Nancy's dress was part of a staging (perhaps to make it look like she was attacked), but that it was not the work of some random/bushy-haired stranger type, but was someone known to her very well.

That is exactly what I was saying a couple of posts back. Brad made it appear to be an assault..wanted others to believe she was attacked..when he himself did her like that for someone to find. Anytime LE says isolated incident..they are more or less saying the victom was targeted and killed for reasons k nown only to the killer.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I am ready to see what tomorrow brings in this case. Weekends are usually slow with no news surfacing, but Mondays come and things begin to happen. I hope this case moves very swiftly and LE can make an arrest soon.

Can I ask the locals if the national news media is causing a fuss in Cary? I know when they converged on Bollingbrook, IL at Drew Peterson's house, people grew tired of the traffic congestion and the reporters everywhere. What is it like in Cary right now? Do you even notice the media's presence?

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I won't even let myself go there to think that he could have staged this to look like a sexual assault. It is bad enough that Nancy was murdered. I don't know that I want to hear such details. It is so very sad that a beautiful, young mother with her whole life ahead of her ended up like this.

I was thinking earlier of what she will be missing and what her children will be forever without. Her kiss goodbye on their first days of school. The tears in her eyes as she proudly watches them get their diplomas. The weddings she can't plan, grandchildren she will never hold, and all of the love in between these life events. She will be missed at every turn by her children and family. It is just so tragic and senseless.

 

[maconrich]

Thank you gritguy, I bolded exactly what I have been trying to establish, I did not think the jurisprudence of NC functioned differently than most..

Additionally poignant, is the time it takes for DNA testing to come back- in some states, there is priority given to cases where there is a named supect, otherwise, in the qeue it goes- do you know NC standard for that?
Thanks and welcome

And I thank you and welcome you too That is exactly what I wasn't able to get a grasp on esp since I've read about more arrests followed by GJ indictments than GJ indictments then arrests.

I've never heard anything on if there's priority (in NC) when it comes to DNA testing so am very curious about that as well...

Again, many thanks for the answer and the additional info!!

 

[maconrich]

SS I couldn't agree more...

With the memorial in Cary, does anyone have any idea why the camera zoomed in on and stayed on a man and/or woman at 29:54?? That hit me as odd and I'm wondering if anyone might recongnize them? The link for the full memorial service is http://www.wral.com/news/local/video/3237359/

Also I was looking at the media links and noticed the last article is stating her funeral will be held in Canada this week (not calling it a memorial service like the other articles). Does anyone know if this is accurate??

TYIA

 

[RoughlyCollie]

An attorney can suspect his client is guilty, but our firm has rarely had a client admit to guilt. This is true even when the government has video and wiretaps which clearly show the client committed the crime, and even if LE witnessed the crime taking place and arrested the client on the spot.

We have had 3 murder defendants who we thought were likely to be factually innocent. Two of them turned out to be factually guilty, which we found out after they had been convicted, based on additional evidence and the confessions of the clients to us after the appeals process had ended. We will never know for sure about the 3rd one because LE did a shoddy job of investigating the case and focused entirely on the ex-husband and never investigated the live-in boyfriend and had no DNA testing of the victim done.

The clients who admit to guilt do so in hopes of lowering their sentences as part of a plea bargain. Usually these guys assist LE by telling them about other crimes they know about and thus leading LE to other criminals. Once in a great while, criminal defendants become "undercover" informants for LE to assist them in gathering evidence against their cohorts. This is dangerous for the client, but some do it anyway, both to lower their eventual sentences and for the thrill of it.

When a defendant tells the court he is "not guilty" it does not mean he is claiming to be factually innocent. This is a term of art which simply means the government now has to prove every element of the crime(s) charged beyond a reasonable doubt, should the case ever go to trial.

It is unethical for a defense attorney not to zealously defend his client.

Even if a criminal defendant tells his attorney he committed the crime, the attorney has to defend him.

Can a lawyer know for a fact a client is guilty (ie. I did kill that man.) and represent him as innocent? I thought they had to ease around that whole "honesty" issue and pretend the elephant did not exist so they could do the circus of a defense strategy. Am I mistaken on this?

 

[Magister]

For NC to be found 'partially clothed' AND the Cary PD to state with (some) certainty that this is "an isolated incident" it points more to a known suspect/person of interest than some random attacker. I see no point in making the public believe they are safe if in fact they might not be. And Cary police chief made a very definitive statement...more than once.

While I don't want to be argumentative, I do feel that I should reiterate that the Chief said that she's had no reports to indicate that this was anything other than an isolated incident. She did not catagorically declare it such because until the evidence has been examined, she could have a suspicion, but she'd have no way of knowing for sure.

Yes, there may be nothing to indicate that someone has been preying specifically on the women of Cary, but nationwide, female joggers are sometimes killed in "isolated incidents" and a mobile serial killer would also leave a string of "isolated incidents", up and down the road.

(Again, this is not to say that Brad might not have done it, but the Chief expressed an opinion based on the limited information she had available and I'm sure she repeated it several times, as a way to apply pressure to the logical first suspect, the victim's husband)

The whole thing is a word game and sometimes what most people hear isn't what's actually being said.

 

[gritguy]

Thank you gritguy, I bolded exactly what I have been trying to establish, I did not think the jurisprudence of NC functioned differently than most..

Additionally poignant, is the time it takes for DNA testing to come back- in some states, there is priority given to cases where there is a named supect, otherwise, in the qeue it goes- do you know NC standard for that?
Thanks and welcome

I don't know. The instance I hired them it was a civil matter. They proceeded quickly, but the tests took some time nevertheless. Of course, we were paying whatever they wanted, so that might be why they got on it so fast. Sorry about that. It appears though that you have some posters with more experience in the criminal field than I have, so maybe they'll chime in.

 

[Blink34]

Brought this over from the last thread, as I did not get the reference and was hoping someone can fill me in, from imnottheonlyone:





some reading on SRT for you night owls ...I'm off to bed, night.
http://www.supernaturalresponse.com/aboutsrt.html

 

[Blink34]

I don't know. The instance I hired them it was a civil matter. They proceeded quickly, but the tests took some time nevertheless. Of course, we were paying whatever they wanted, so that might be why they got on it so fast. Sorry about that. It appears though that you have some posters with more experience in the criminal field than I have, so maybe they'll chime in.

Thanks Grit, I have more experience in the criminal field than I would like, I was more asking a local if LE has the protocal used in many jurisdictions like my neck of the woods: No named suspect, back of the line. Named suspect or other scenarios deemed as priority, front of the line.

Also- does anyone know if BC has presented for his collection?

 

[maconrich]

Brought this over from the last thread, as I did not get the reference and was hoping someone can fill me in, from imnottheonlyone:





some reading on SRT for you night owls ...I'm off to bed, night.
http://www.supernaturalresponse.com/aboutsrt.html

I think this is for Caylee's thread???

 

[Just the Fax]

And I thank you and welcome you too That is exactly what I wasn't able to get a grasp on esp since I've read about more arrests followed by GJ indictments than GJ indictments then arrests.

I've never heard anything on if there's priority (in NC) when it comes to DNA testing so am very curious about that as well...

Again, many thanks for the answer and the additional info!!

The SBI crime lab is backed up for months on DNA testing. However, CPD has the option of paying a private lab a few thousand for priority results.
Because this is a very high profile case, I bet the samples are being tested at a private lab.