National List Of Problem Teachers Is Now Public

[Dark Knight]

Oh, please...........financial "misconduct?" I am a teacher and am severly underpaid. I did not pay my student loan payment last month. Should that be public knowledge? Without due process this information should not be made public. Lack of privacy for me is just one step away from lack of privacy for you....and you wonder why the average teacher stays in the field only 5 years??
Get over yourselves....you have no right to my financial information..I teach kids you'd never go near....we are going down a very dangerous road with the mob mentality and lack of privacy.....
The information in the files consists of teachers behind on student loans..not teachers "skimming." And by the way, how would we skim? We have no access to district funds...we don't handle money... As usual, the actual culprits, the district beauracrats who waste money left and right are not your target...its always the people with the least power you go after......

"Holding a license is a privilege?" I worked for that license and paid college tuition for that license. It is not a privilege, I earned it..............the next time you speed I think your license should be revoked...after all, you easily could have killed someone........

As long as my tax dollars are paying your salary, no matter how small it unfortunately may be, I will have a right to know everything about your job.

 

[Pandora]

I have to admit that I can see both sides of this issue. I am concerned, as a teacher, that some of my friends will be unfairly targeted. In the Bible belt, teachers are occasionally let go for "moral turpitude." I think when people see this in a file, they will assume the worst. The fact is that they are gay in the South. Most of them will not sue, even though they are within their rights to do so. I've also seen stuff "trumped up" when a teacher won't sleep with the principal or do other things that are questionable. Let's call it insubordination today.

I have a reprimand in my file for insubordination because I stayed with a student who was upset and crying in my classroom instead of going to a required faculty meeting. I have another reprimand in my file because I keep my door locked during class to limit disruptions including potential dangerous situations. (That one may have been removed after a "parent" attempted to assault one of my students. I pushed her through my door and closed it--crazy woman beat on it for a few minutes then realized she couldn't get in and ran off. Security arrived after 10 minutes. Oh yeah, she had been in prison for 7 years for shooting someone!!!!) Without details and/or explanations, I look like a teacher with problems; however, I think most of you would love to have me teach your children.

I am also in the process of getting a teaching certificate in PA. In GA, where I previously taught, the computers were linked--they "talked to each other"--therefore, there was only one background check needed. Here, they do not communicate, so three background checks are needed (and that just went into effect 4/2007). That really scares me. I think a better solution is for states to use the same computer programs to conduct background checks.

Okay, enough rambling for now. I WANT students to be safe and away from dangerous teachers--I'm just not sure that this particular concept is a solution.

 

[MagicRose99]

Interestingly I was listening to the radio today and they were talking about bad surgeries and doctors that abuse drugs and alcohol. This particular doctor was a plastic surgeon and he had been convicted of DUI on HIS WAY TO SURGERY.
As long as he entered into a drug diversion type program he was free to practice without having to notify patients. This poor lady pretty much got butchered only to find out her doctor was in his third round of rehab that he had already flunked 3 times. She only found out later that he was in rehab for his DUI and they had smelled alcohol on him at one of her post op visits.
I'll see if i can find the link. It was pretty shocking the stories of people who had been operated on by substance abusing docs and the fact that they were free to practice within the law.


ETA:

Addicted Doctors Allowed to Treat Patients by Many State Medical Boards

Date Published: Wednesday, December 19th, 2007
Drug and alcohol addicted doctors are not barred from practicing medicine, even when state medical boards have confirmed their substance abuse problems. Most states have confidential substance abuse rehab programs allowing physicians to continue practicing medicine as long as they continue treatment; as many as 8,000 doctors may be in such programs. These arrangements remained under the public radar until California’s medical board ended its program when a review concluded the system failed to protect patients for medical malpractice or help addicted doctors. Opponents say the medical establishment uses confidential treatment to protect dangerous physicians
Doctors accused of botching operations while in treatment have led to criticism of programs that allow physicians to keep their addictions confidential. Most addiction specialists favor allowing doctors to continue practicing while in confidential treatment, as does the American Medical Association. Supporters say patients harmed by doctors in treatment are rare and would pale next to leaving physicians no such option. “If you don’t have confidential participation, you don’t get people into the program,” said Sandra Bressler, the California Medical Association’s senior director for medical board affairs.

California’s program ends June 30. If an alternate is not adopted, rules could revert back to the zero-tolerance policy in place when doctors with substance abuse problems were stripped of their licenses. Between 10-15% of physicians nationwide will have a substance abuse problem at some point in their lives, similar to that of the general population.
http://www.newsinferno.com/archives/2236

I know all about the Diversion program. It is a program not even the employee's of MBC were comfortable with, but when a legislative session sets up the program, there's nothing to do but try to work with it. I'm surprised it lasted as long as it did. Right now, we're watching it slowly be dismantled and good people scrambling to find new jobs.

But, if you look at an offending doctor's record, you will find disciplinary action on it. Take a look at Dr. West's record:
http://www2.dca.ca.gov/pls/wllpub/WLLQRYNA$LCEV2.QueryView?P_LICENSE_NUMBER=65175&P_LTE_ID=790

The main problem is is that most people do not know that you CAN check out licensee information BEFORE you use that person.

My point was, that someone made a comment about there not being lists where you can check out doctors, lawyers, etc. and I pointed out that there is... Just go to any State Medical Board site for Dr's. If you have a Consumer Affairs Agency, they'll have any licensee record list.

 

[JBean]

I know all about the Diversion program. It is a program not even the employee's of MBC were comfortable with, but when a legislative session sets up the program, there's nothing to do but try to work with it. I'm surprised it lasted as long as it did. Right now, we're watching it slowly be dismantled and good people scrambling to find new jobs.

But, if you look at an offending doctor's record, you will find disciplinary action on it. Take a look at Dr. West's record:
http://www2.dca.ca.gov/pls/wllpub/WLLQRYNA$LCEV2.QueryView?P_LICENSE_NUMBER=65175&P_LTE_ID=790

The main problem is is that most people do not know that you CAN check out licensee information BEFORE you use that person.

My point was, that someone made a comment about there not being lists where you can check out doctors, lawyers, etc. and I pointed out that there is... Just go to any State Medical Board site for Dr's. If you have a Consumer Affairs Agency, they'll have any licensee record list.

I was just respondng to your comment that in CA doctors lose their licenses automatically if they are convicted of a crime. It is apparently not the cae in this regard.
I completely understand about the lists to check on doctors.

 

[southcitymom]

Oh, please...........financial "misconduct?" I am a teacher and am severly underpaid. I did not pay my student loan payment last month. Should that be public knowledge? Without due process this information should not be made public. Lack of privacy for me is just one step away from lack of privacy for you....and you wonder why the average teacher stays in the field only 5 years??
Get over yourselves....you have no right to my financial information..I teach kids you'd never go near....we are going down a very dangerous road with the mob mentality and lack of privacy.....
The information in the files consists of teachers behind on student loans..not teachers "skimming." And by the way, how would we skim? We have no access to district funds...we don't handle money... As usual, the actual culprits, the district beauracrats who waste money left and right are not your target...its always the people with the least power you go after......

"Holding a license is a privilege?" I worked for that license and paid college tuition for that license. It is not a privilege, I earned it..............the next time you speed I think your license should be revoked...after all, you easily could have killed someone........

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[southcitymom]

I have to admit that I can see both sides of this issue. I am concerned, as a teacher, that some of my friends will be unfairly targeted. In the Bible belt, teachers are occasionally let go for "moral turpitude." I think when people see this in a file, they will assume the worst. The fact is that they are gay in the South. Most of them will not sue, even though they are within their rights to do so. I've also seen stuff "trumped up" when a teacher won't sleep with the principal or do other things that are questionable. Let's call it insubordination today.

I have a reprimand in my file for insubordination because I stayed with a student who was upset and crying in my classroom instead of going to a required faculty meeting. I have another reprimand in my file because I keep my door locked during class to limit disruptions including potential dangerous situations. (That one may have been removed after a "parent" attempted to assault one of my students. I pushed her through my door and closed it--crazy woman beat on it for a few minutes then realized she couldn't get in and ran off. Security arrived after 10 minutes. Oh yeah, she had been in prison for 7 years for shooting someone!!!!) Without details and/or explanations, I look like a teacher with problems; however, I think most of you would love to have me teach your children.

I am also in the process of getting a teaching certificate in PA. In GA, where I previously taught, the computers were linked--they "talked to each other"--therefore, there was only one background check needed. Here, they do not communicate, so three background checks are needed (and that just went into effect 4/2007). That really scares me. I think a better solution is for states to use the same computer programs to conduct background checks.

Okay, enough rambling for now. I WANT students to be safe and away from dangerous teachers--I'm just not sure that this particular concept is a solution.

Excellent post.

 

[absinthe]

Thanks, Kylie and Pandora! And DK, my tax dollars pay the salaries of soldiers, Marines, sailors, Department of Defense civilian employees, mail carriers, border patrol, and the freaking guy who mows the lawn of the White House. There seem to be no public lists of their criminal and financial misconduct (thank God!)

 

[pixies]

This is one of the many reasons why we homeschool!

 

[southcitymom]

This is one of the many reasons why we homeschool!

You homeschool because they keep tabs of public school teachers on a list?

 

[pixies]

You homeschool because they keep tabs of public school teachers on a list?

Being snarky is so cool.

Who would leave their children alone 8-10 hours a day with a complete stranger? And lets see, in TN where I live, how many crazy teachers have been arrested for sex with minors or other crazy crap? Lots!

A few years ago my daughter went into 3rd grade and her teacher was a girl who I went to high school with. A meth addict! Seriously. And this was no inner city school. This was a very good neighborhood school. She was later fired but if she can get through drug screenings and a background check, anyone can. She had been arrested 4 times for meth and still was hired.

I am 32 and still remember my art teacher in middle school rubbing the girls butts in class. He was moved from school to school district to district because he was a problem no one wanted to deal with. How many other pervs are out there working with our kids? How many meth addicts are teaching our kids? What about crack or cocaine or even potheads? Just sitting here I know of another teacher who smokes pot all the time.
GAH!
I am not perfect but my kids are getting a good education at home. (Plus we leave the country 4 times a year so "regular schooling" is out of the question)

SO, before you go insane and say something else off the wall, I am not against public schools but the teachers SHOULD be held to a higher standard. THEY ARE WITH YOUR KIDS MORE THAN YOU ARE! Don't trust someone only because they have a teaching degree!

BTW, all I was trying to say is the list is a great idea!

 

[southcitymom]

Being snarky is so cool.

Who would leave their children alone 8-10 hours a day with a complete stranger? And lets see, in TN where I live, how many crazy teachers have been arrested for sex with minors or other crazy crap? Lots!

A few years ago my daughter went into 3rd grade and her teacher was a girl who I went to high school with. A meth addict! Seriously. And this was no inner city school. This was a very good neighborhood school. She was later fired but if she can get through drug screenings and a background check, anyone can. She had been arrested 4 times for meth and still was hired.

I am 32 and still remember my art teacher in middle school rubbing the girls butts in class. He was moved from school to school district to district because he was a problem no one wanted to deal with. How many other pervs are out there working with our kids? How many meth addicts are teaching our kids? What about crack or cocaine or even potheads? Just sitting here I know of another teacher who smokes pot all the time.
GAH!
I am not perfect but my kids are getting a good education at home. (Plus we leave the country 4 times a year so "regular schooling" is out of the question)

SO, before you go insane and say something else off the wall, I am not against public schools but the teachers SHOULD be held to a higher standard. THEY ARE WITH YOUR KIDS MORE THAN YOU ARE! Don't trust someone only because they have a teaching degree!

BTW, all I was trying to say is the list is a great idea!

I wasn't being snarky. I didn't understand your post.

I am a huge fan of homeschooling, so there's no need to assume I might "go insane or say something else off the wall."

ETA: No one is with my kids more than I am.

 

[Texana]

As a teacher, I also had mixed feelings about the list. However, after thinking it over for a few days, I have to say this:

1) Bad teachers--and by this I mean both the incompetent and the truly criminal--have always been able to work the system by quitting one school district and going to another. Sadly, they often pick schools that are desperate for teachers, thus punishing those students even more. (The solution, btw, is to pay teachers in those schools double the salary of other schools. That would make it worthwhile for the good teachers to go there--because good teachers do not *have* to take those jobs, and most choose not to--it's hard to justify working in a high-risk, high-stress position for the same salary you make at another school. It's just market economics, as the best realtor we ever had said years ago: "Price overcomes all objections.")

2) There have been reports in Texas of the "good ol' boy" network for coaches who have had improper relationships with students or other serious problems, going to other districts and getting hired. A serious list and more communication between the districts officially would stop some of this enabling.

3) The list shouldn't be needed if districts did their jobs in screening applicants. Some do. Some don't.

4) It's really hard to fire a teacher. Is that fair to the children? Probably not. But sometimes, it's one of those gray areas in life. I knew a teacher who taught a "specials" subject like music/art/p.e. Her husband left her for the nanny--and left her with three children, one special needs, one borderline. She was not very effective (to put it mildly) for that year--the children watched a LOT of videos. But she did not teach an essential subject like reading or math, so the Year of Videos did not affect the kids permanently. And when she came back to being herself the next year, she was again, an awesome teacher.

 

[MagicRose99]

I was just respondng to your comment that in CA doctors lose their licenses automatically if they are convicted of a crime. It is apparently not the cae in this regard.
I completely understand about the lists to check on doctors.

Unfortunately, people have addictions and are never arrested, charged and/or convicted of a crime... doctor's are no different. A doctor has to be convicted of a crime before losing his/her license... that has nothing to do with the Diversion program. The point of the Diversion program was so that doctor's could get help without risking their license. They were monitored, tested, etc., but some fell thru the cracks. Now, those entities like the AMA, CMA, etc. are yelling because without this option, "bad" doctors won't seek help and more "mistakes" will happen. We'll have to see...

It's always the best to check on any physician, even your long-standing one, before making any decisions regarding your health.

 

[deanws]

Oh, please...........financial "misconduct?" I am a teacher and am severly underpaid. I did not pay my student loan payment last month. Should that be public knowledge? Without due process this information should not be made public. Lack of privacy for me is just one step away from lack of privacy for you....and you wonder why the average teacher stays in the field only 5 years??
Get over yourselves....you have no right to my financial information..I teach kids you'd never go near....we are going down a very dangerous road with the mob mentality and lack of privacy.....
The information in the files consists of teachers behind on student loans..not teachers "skimming." And by the way, how would we skim? We have no access to district funds...we don't handle money... As usual, the actual culprits, the district beauracrats who waste money left and right are not your target...its always the people with the least power you go after......

"Holding a license is a privilege?" I worked for that license and paid college tuition for that license. It is not a privilege, I earned it..............the next time you speed I think your license should be revoked...after all, you easily could have killed someone........

GREAT post!
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[JBean]

Unfortunately, people have addictions and are never arrested, charged and/or convicted of a crime... doctor's are no different. A doctor has to be convicted of a crime before losing his/her license... that has nothing to do with the Diversion program. The point of the Diversion program was so that doctor's could get help without risking their license. They were monitored, tested, etc., but some fell thru the cracks. Now, those entities like the AMA, CMA, etc. are yelling because without this option, "bad" doctors won't seek help and more "mistakes" will happen. We'll have to see...

It's always the best to check on any physician, even your long-standing one, before making any decisions regarding your health.

Well some were convicted of DUI's which is what I was talking about. That would defintiely be a crime.
I guess Iam just not being very clear. Sorry. Here is what I was thinking of:

This is the doctor they were talking about on the radio. They were interviewing this lady on the radio:

Opponents of California's program have focused on the case of Dr. Brian West, a Long Beach plastic surgeon who has been accused of negligence by the state medical board and is fighting to keep his license.
In 1999, West performed a double mastectomy and breast reconstruction surgery on Becky Anderson. The procedure left her with gaping, infected wounds that wouldn't close and, ultimately, a grotesque lump the size of a melon caused by organs spilling through an unhealed hole in her abdomen.
Weeks before performing his final, futile procedure on her, West was arrested for a drunken-driving accident.
After his conviction, West entered the diversion program for alcoholism. A year later he performed a tummy tuck on a 37-year-old woman that also healed poorly.
West ultimately flunked out of the treatment program after investigators uncovered a pattern of relapses, binge drinking and doctored urine tests that "demonstrate that he is a physician who has been long and chronically impaired by alcohol," according to a 2005 medical board complaint.
West's supporters say he has been made a scapegoat, asserting that he is not to blame for his patients' complications and that the severity of his drinking problem has been exaggerated by investigators. "I have no information from any of my investigations that Dr. West has ever cared for patients while under the influence of alcohol," said his attorney, Dominique Pollara.http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g...RItZgD8TK1IN00

IOW, he was convicted of a crime but went into the diversion program so he wouldn;t lose his license. This is what I was trying to say when you said that dr's autmoatically lose their licenses if they are convicted of a crime. In this regard that doesn't seem to be the case.

ETA: According to the woman that was operated on by West, he was IN the diversion program for the DUI when he operated on her.

 

[absinthe]

Oh, please...........financial "misconduct?" I am a teacher and am severly underpaid. I did not pay my student loan payment last month. Should that be public knowledge? Without due process this information should not be made public. Lack of privacy for me is just one step away from lack of privacy for you....and you wonder why the average teacher stays in the field only 5 years??
Get over yourselves....you have no right to my financial information..I teach kids you'd never go near....we are going down a very dangerous road with the mob mentality and lack of privacy.....
The information in the files consists of teachers behind on student loans..not teachers "skimming." And by the way, how would we skim? We have no access to district funds...we don't handle money... As usual, the actual culprits, the district beauracrats who waste money left and right are not your target...its always the people with the least power you go after......

"Holding a license is a privilege?" I worked for that license and paid college tuition for that license. It is not a privilege, I earned it..............the next time you speed I think your license should be revoked...after all, you easily could have killed someone........

Aaaaaand I really didn't want to go into this, but I have had 6 years of schooling thus far, and I make, well, considerably less money than a doctor. For the amount of money they are paid, our country is lucky to have any teachers at all!..let alone the paragons of virtue and sainthood that some people seem to demand.

 

[JBean]

I mentioned this before but did not get any feedback. As I hold a CA state license to sell real estate, you can look up any and all disciplinary action on the DRE website. If I don't pay my dues on time my license can be suspended and that will show up as disciplinary action. What do I care? It is the same for many professions. Why would this be so bad with teaching? I am trying to read the posts and understand where the outrage is coming from but I don't get it.
Regarding the financial misconduct that was in refernce to teachers that failed to pay back their student loans.

 

[Dark Knight]

Aaaaaand I really didn't want to go into this, but I have had 6 years of schooling thus far, and I make, well, considerably less money than a doctor. For the amount of money they are paid, our country is lucky to have any teachers at all!..let alone the paragons of virtue and sainthood that some people seem to demand.

Does your school board know you post on websites under the name of an illegal strongly alcoholic drink? :crazy:

 

[southcitymom]

Aaaaaand I really didn't want to go into this, but I have had 6 years of schooling thus far, and I make, well, considerably less money than a doctor. For the amount of money they are paid, our country is lucky to have any teachers at all!..let alone the paragons of virtue and sainthood that some people seem to demand.

I could not agree more. I have always wondered why our teachers aren't paid six figures+. We say our children and the next generation are our most important assets. I guess our country really doesn't believe that because we absolutely do not put our money where our mouth is. Just one more example of our backwards priorities.

 

[absinthe]

Does your school board know you post on websites under the name of an illegal strongly alcoholic drink? :crazy:

It's legal again! I swear, google it!