NC - 12-year-old dies at Trails Carolina wilderness therapy camp, Lake Toxaway, February 2024

[Lilibet]

[bbm]

is the last sentence 'The young boy's death is being investigated as a homicide' in the article? it's a paywall for me

No, that article does not say the boy’s death is being investigated as a homicide. However, that could be inferred from the link stating this:
“A forensic pathologist told investigators that the death did not appear to be natural, the sheriff’s office said.”

If a death does not appear to be natural, it seems likely it was caused by something (drowning, eating a poisonous mushroom, for instance) or someone (which could be accidental or negligent). A homicide is simply a death caused by another human. Incidentally, homicide is not synonymous with murder, although I’ve seen it mistakenly used that way.

JMO

 

[Mack the Knife]

Does the way back machine allow for a way around these issues?

A way around which issues?

To use the Wayback Machine, you kind of need to have URL to start with, but if, for example, you start out looking at the archived home page, you can click around and navigate as usual, and if the other linked pages have also been archived, you’ll be able to view them.

 

[ConcernedVA]

This has been tough to read about. I come from a wealthy family with ADHD and generally stubborn or defiant personalities. Some of my close family members are dead or ruined because of programs like these. I can't send my son to public school because of this mindset that any unwanted behavior can or should be trained out of a person.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

Per the PR released by the camp.

The bivy may have been position where the children couldn't see. The cabins looked big in the photos and there were only 3/4 children.

I would think one immediately started CPR, then called 911. I feel sure they had radios and call for additional staff.

I wish they would release the time EMS arrived, time EMS stoped the code and the time LE started to examine the body. This is pretty far out in the middle of nowhere, I would imagine the EMS response time would be significant.
Moo

I'm not sure why EMS response time would be significant in this case?

 

[Simply Southern]

I'm not sure why EMS response time would be significant in this case?

LE states, the body was cold to touch. If EMS didn't arrive for 40 minutes or more, assess the patient or continue CPR, before stopping the code, factors into the time, before LE can examine the victim.

The search warrant, showed 24miles/42 minutes from Brevard, where EMS is located. It's a volunteer "Rescue Squad", they do NOT have have a paid EMS. They only have 40+ volunteers serving the entire county. The camp is in the Appalachian Mountains, increasing travel time due terrain.

Volunteer Rescue Squads, do not have volunteers on hand at the Rescue Squad building, 24/7. They have to call ( tone out) them in, the volunteers. They have drive to the Squad house to get a Rescue Squad unit and then drive to the scene.

Many times, I've had volunteers, arrive in a vehicle, long before an emergency vehicle arrives.
Small towns and communities, in the south can't afford paid staff, and have volunteer EMS and Fire Depts.

EMS | Transylvania County

www.transylvaniacounty.org

Looking for the Brevard Rescue Squad? You've found us! We have reverted back to our original name of Transylvania County Rescue Squad. Founded in 1961, TCRS is a volunteer based organization with over 40 volunteers. We continue the tradition of neighbor helping neighbor and are very active in our community. In 2019, we responded to over 2,500 calls for service.

Moo

 

[Rolypolyoly]

LE states, the body was cold to touch. If EMS didn't arrive for 40 minutes or more, assess the patient or continue CPR, before stopping the code, factors into the time, before LE can examine the victim.

The search warrant, showed 24miles/42 minutes from Brevard, where EMS is located. It's a volunteer "Rescue Squad", they do NOT have have a paid EMS. They only have 40+ volunteers serving the entire county. The camp is in the Appalachian Mountains, increasing travel time due terrain.

Volunteer Rescue Squads, do not have volunteers on hand at the Rescue Squad building, 24/7. They have to call ( tone out) them in, the volunteers. They have drive to the Squad house to get a Rescue Squad unit and then drive to the scene.

Many times, I've had volunteers, arrive in a vehicle, long before an emergency vehicle arrives.
Small towns and communities, in the south can't afford paid staff, and have volunteer EMS and Fire Depts.

EMS | Transylvania County

www.transylvaniacounty.org

Looking for the Brevard Rescue Squad? You've found us! We have reverted back to our original name of Transylvania County Rescue Squad. Founded in 1961, TCRS is a volunteer based organization with over 40 volunteers. We continue the tradition of neighbor helping neighbor and are very active in our community. In 2019, we responded to over 2,500 calls for service.

Moo

The warrant states that the camp staff member JRH said the boy was stiff and cold to the touch when they found him dead.

 

[iamshadow21]

The warrant states that the camp staff member JRH said the boy was stiff and cold to the touch when they found him dead.

Yeah, EMS don't tend to do CPR in cases with signs of obvious irreversible fatality, of which rigor is one. Their assessment wouldn't have taken long.

MOO

 

[Simply Southern]

The warrant states that the camp staff member JRH said the boy was stiff and cold to the touch when they found him dead.

You are correct, should have reread. I "thought" LE., made the statement and living in a rural area, thought about response time.
Thanks for correcting.
I'll report to mod

 

[Simply Southern]

Yeah, EMS don't tend to do CPR in cases with signs of obvious irreversible fatality, of which rigor is one. Their assessment wouldn't have taken long.

MOO

I reported the post to a mod, sorry for not checking first. Need more coffee.

 

[Cartie]

The position that this poor boy was in makes me think of someone in a small space where they can't straighten out their legs

 

[Rolypolyoly]

The position that this poor boy was in makes me think of someone in a small space where they can't straighten out their legs

Yes. It's worth googling the 'burrito' in relation to trails IMO.

 

[RickshawFan]

IMO, what the police need to do is complete their investigation, determine how the boy died and if any wrongdoing occurred. I don't think the authorities needs to have a tit-for-tat response to every allegation lobbed their way. No more than they need to reply in the press to every criminal defendant who claims they're innocent and being set up by the cops.

As for slander claims (or libel since this is in writing)...I'm no lawyer, but I know it's a very high bar for a public official to win a defamation claim. Even if Trails' is not being truthful I doubt their statement meets the "actual malice" standard of NYTimes vs Sullivan. Furthermore as a practical matter, if Trails' is found to have violated the law they will almost certainly declare bankruptcy and dissolve the legal entity. There will be nothing left to sue.

I agree. It doesn’t seem to me remotely advantageous for LE to respond to Trails malarkey. Plus, let Trails howl. They’re shooting themselves in the foot.

 

[RickshawFan]

The position that this poor boy was in makes me think of someone in a small space where they can't straighten out their legs

I had a thought he might have got jammed in the sleeping bag, but there have been some great possibilities ^^^^ as well.

 

[RickshawFan]

Yes. It's worth googling the 'burrito' in relation to trails IMO.

The thing is, LE also uses that term. And it’s a restraint system. To me, it’s not far off from a bivy used as punishment.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Parents were notified and the Transylvania County Department of Social Services will temporarily take custody of campers, the release says.

Eighteen children were affected, according to Trails Carolina, which lashed out at the state’s action Friday. It called the move “reckless” and accused local law enforcement of bias.

“The children were receiving high-level clinical care for complex mental health diagnoses requiring experienced professionals with full knowledge of critical medications and specialized treatment regimens,” the statement said, adding: “This reckless move by the State denied parents the opportunity to continue to care for their children in the appropriate manner.”

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/state/north-carolina/article285563792.html

 

[Simply Southern]

Yes. It's worth googling the 'burrito' in relation to trails IMO.

I didn't find any articles on use of burrito restraint for Trails Carolina, except for reddit.

Would you share what you found on Trails?

 

[Cartie]

I didn't find any articles on use of burrito restraint for Trails Carolina, except for reddit.

Would you share what you found on Trails?

Says IMO

 

[Simply Southern]

Parents were notified and the Transylvania County Department of Social Services will temporarily take custody of campers, the release says.

Eighteen children were affected, according to Trails Carolina, which lashed out at the state’s action Friday. It called the move “reckless” and accused local law enforcement of bias.

“The children were receiving high-level clinical care for complex mental health diagnoses requiring experienced professionals with full knowledge of critical medications and specialized treatment regimens,” the statement said, adding: “This reckless move by the State denied parents the opportunity to continue to care for their children in the appropriate manner.”

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/state/north-carolina/article285563792.html

I'm wondering where the State moved the children, they removed. Placing 18 adolescence, with emotional and behavioral diagnosis, on short notice is not easy. Many of the children need meds, requiring a doctor's order, how did DSS provide the meds, on short notice? Who explained to these children, why and where they were being moved?

MOO...This was preplanned and orchestrated by the sheriff and local DSS when they found out Behavioral Health did not have enough evidence to close the facility.

Moo, they're in a state, locked down facility, scared to death. I don't see a private agency touching this with a 10 ft pole.

Moo...

 

[azure]

If you think that it's perfectly okay for children to be kidnapped from their homes by strangers and taken to facilities where they are deprived of food, clean water, bathroom breaks, proper shelter, and so on, BUT you think it's wrong and illegal for LE to take custody of these children and question them, your morality and your very humanity are sadly broken.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Interesting and relatable to topic…

Controversial tough love programs on Dr. Phil - WWASP Survivors

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