NC NC - Asha Degree, 9, Shelby, 14 Feb 2000

[Nadal]

I agree that Obryant wouldve indeed said something IF he saw something. And they shared a bedroom and were close. I think he wouldve known. Maybe someone close to the family not living in the home. Just keeping all theories open, since none of us know what happened that night/morning. My theory is that she was still very upset with her game and left. What I can't get is where was she headed and so many other questions.....MOO

Absolutely, anything is possible was just giving the reasons i don't personally believe she was being abused by anyone in her immediate family. My theory is she was groomed by a coach, teacher, neighbour, family friend, extended family member or someone at her church. This person enticed her with money (the few dollars she had) and promises of a better life (monetary wise), he got her to trust him with the picture of the little girl he claimed was his daughter and convinced her to leave in the middle of the night so they could get a head start then sadly he harmed her.

 

[SAMS]

Macedonia Missonairy Baptist Church in Waco, North Carolina. No clue who the pastor was, it wasn't the one who lived next to the family who found the stuff in the shed, he was the pastor of Buffalo Baptist Church.

Thank you...only an 8 mile trip by vehicle.Well, she certainly wasnt headed to church, opposite direction, not to mention a far walk.

 

[Nadal]

Thank you...only an 8 mile trip by vehicle.Well, she certainly wasnt headed to church, opposite direction, not to mention a far walk.

Most of her family was from Waco that's why she went to a church there, there's a Baptist Church on the same street as her house where i imagine most of her friends went and she was probably also connected to just through proximity and sharing the same faith.

 

[SAMS]

Absolutely, anything is possible was just giving the reasons i don't personally believe she was being abused by anyone in her immediate family. My theory is she was groomed by a coach, teacher, neighbour, family friend, extended family member or someone at her church. This person enticed her with money (the few dollars she had) and promises of a better life (monetary wise), he got her to trust him with the picture of the little girl he claimed was his daughter and convinced her to leave in the middle of the night so they could get a head start then sadly he harmed her.

This is my second theory. That picture. Makes sense. What bothers me is why so early in the morning? Maybe they had a specific time to meet and bc her dad was up she couldn't get away? That's what I cant wrap my head around is the planning to meet. MOO

 

[T rex]

I've been thinking about the Dr. Seuss book for several days now. I don't think it was found in her book bag that was buried--if it was, and LE can't find records of the library book being checked out as they've said, wouldn't they just assume it WAS checked out by Asha? That thought, and the FBI saying this book was a "critical clue" to finding Asha, makes me 99% sure it was not found with Asha's things but somewhere suspicious. And that they are trying to tie a perp.

I don't have a clue where they could have found this book but as you probably know, kids love to write in books. So maybe the book has writing in it believed to be Asha's. It could be anywhere from a message from her to simply her name and that along with the Fallston Middle School stamp could be why LE is so interested in it. I believe the shirt was probably just found along with the book and that's what makes it of interest. JMO

 

[Nadal]

This is my second theory. That picture. Makes sense. What bothers me is why so early in the morning? Maybe they had a specific time to meet and bc her dad was up she couldn't get away? That's what I cant wrap my head around is the planning to meet. MOO

It's said that Asha didn't do much except go to school, basketball and church so if during the day she didn't turn up to one of those or she wasn't at home with her parents they'd become concerned and report her missing. If the abductor knew this about her which he likely would if it's one of the people i mentioned then he'd know night would get him a better headstart and less chances of being sighted with her.

 

[T rex]

In an earlier post I referred to grooming and chance encounter as the two major theories in this case but their are some others so I thought that I would list some of them such as: hit by a car, died of exposure, mauled by dogs, somehow harmed by a suspicious homeowner, ran away, etc.
I don't know if these would be lesser theories or not. I guess it would depend on who you asked.

 

[Nadal]

In an earlier post I referred to grooming and chance encounter as the two major theories in this case but their are some others so I thought that I would list some of them such as: hit by a car, died of exposure, mauled by dogs, somehow harmed by a suspicious homeowner, ran away, etc.
I don't know if these would be lesser theories or not. I guess it would depend on who you asked.

Accidental hit and run is a pretty popular theory, probably the most after grooming and chance encounter. Sadly most including myself don't think she is still alive, hope we're wrong somehow of course.

 

[SAMS]

I have said before, the old schoolmate of Asha's mothers, that claimed to have hit and hid Asha on the hwy that night with a friend, is still one of my theories. I know, he allegedly passed a lie detector, he was trying to get off of another charge,(which makes no sense to me...say you killed and hid a body of a child to get off of a robbery charge?) they presumably looked and never found the body.....etc; but....the hiding of the bag, her items in the shed, her being seen by two witnesses, then just gone. It's all possible IMO. Probable? LE doesn't think so. I also have said that I would love to hear what this guy says today, along with the "friend" he was said to be with.
Died of exposure. Did they search the woods in that area to no avail? How far do those woods stretch back? I can see this as a plausible theory IMO MOO

 

[SAMS]

Accidental hit and run is a pretty popular theory, probably the most after grooming and chance encounter. Sadly most including myself don't think she is still alive, hope we're wrong somehow of course.

Sadly, I agree Nadal....I don't think she is with us any longer....MOO

 

[Nadal]

I have said before, the old schoolmate of Asha's mothers, that claimed to have hit and hid Asha on the hwy that night with a friend, is still one of my theories. I know, he allegedly passed a lie detector, he was trying to get off of another charge,(which makes no sense to me...say you killed and hid a body of a child to get off of a robbery charge?) they presumably looked and never found the body.....etc; but....the hiding of the bag, her items in the shed, her being seen by two witnesses, then just gone. It's all possible IMO. Probable? LE doesn't think so. I also have said that I would love to hear what this guy says today, along with the "friend" he was said to be with.
Died of exposure. Did they search the woods in that area to no avail? How far do those woods stretch back? I can see this as a plausible theory IMO MOO

They searched several areas.

Harold called the police at 6:39AM. By 6:45, Sheriff Dan Crawford and officers from the Cleveland County Sheriff’s Office had converged on the Degree home and were scouring the neighborhood. Over the next few hours, dozens of volunteers, search and rescue personnel, bloodhounds, and investigators from the Sheriff’s Office and State Bureau of Investigation (SBI) poured in to comb the surrounding area.

The SBI and FBI have always believed these sightings to be legitimate. Armed with this new information, they began combing a five-mile radius around the intersection of Highways 18 and 180. An air search by Highway Patrol and the SBI turned up empty. There were no signs of a struggle or hit-and-run. Driver checkpoints set up on February 15 and 21 failed to turn up any leads. Bloodhounds began to scour the area within 1 ½ hours of Harold’s 911 call but never caught her scent, likely due to the inclement weather.

32-year-old Barron Ramsey, a former classmate of Iquilla’s, confessed to being involved in Asha’s disappearance in summer 2000. He claimed that he and another man had just made a drug deal and were driving home when they accidentally struck her with their car. Realizing she was dead, they pulled her body into the bed of their pickup, then took a fishing trip to Moss Lake a few days later and dumped her in the water. Authorities dragged the lake twice and searched Highway 18 for any evidence of a hit-and-run, but found nothing. They believe he made up the story in hopes of getting a better deal in a bank robbery case in Bessemer City.

"Unlike the original search in Cleveland County — which took place in February in a fairly flat area — those in Burke County would face serious difficulties due to the rough terrain, dense vegetation, and sweltering heat. Variously described as an “atrocious” search area and a “honeycomb of pig trials”, it was deemed so hazardous that Sheriff Crawford would only allow trained professionals to participate. Search coordinator Randy McKinney, surprised that the bag was even found at all, called the discovery a “fluke”.

When asked how optimistic he was about finding anything, McKinney put it this way: “If there are ten oranges out there, and we ask [the searchers] how many they think they’re going to find, they’d say two.”

Starting on August 15, authorities scoured a 3-mile-long, 400-foot-wide area around the book bag. Cadaver dogs alerted to three spot close to the bag, but turned up nothing. Searchers also discovered animal bones and a pair of men’s khaki pants; it is unclear if they have any relation to Asha’s case."

"In November 2004, authorities searched an empty lot on Rube Spangle Road in Lawndale, about three miles from the Degree home, but found nothing but animal bones. In April 2005, they dug up part of a 30-acre lot just south of Shelby, walking away with nothing but two bags full of dirt."

 

[Nadal]

I have said before, the old schoolmate of Asha's mothers, that claimed to have hit and hid Asha on the hwy that night with a friend, is still one of my theories. I know, he allegedly passed a lie detector, he was trying to get off of another charge,(which makes no sense to me...say you killed and hid a body of a child to get off of a robbery charge?) they presumably looked and never found the body.....etc; but....the hiding of the bag, her items in the shed, her being seen by two witnesses, then just gone. It's all possible IMO. Probable? LE doesn't think so. I also have said that I would love to hear what this guy says today, along with the "friend" he was said to be with.

I agree with LE here. They searched the highway and dragged the lake twice and found nothing, surely he'd know where she was roughly. I imagine there's information LE has that they haven't released publicly to corroborate a confession which he couldn't answer as well, that's the entire reason they hold certain things back from the public. Think it was just a stupid ploy to get a deal for a reduced sentence, hoping LE would believe him and close the case despite not finding the body.

 

[SAMS]

They searched several areas.

Harold called the police at 6:39AM. By 6:45, Sheriff Dan Crawford and officers from the Cleveland County Sheriff’s Office had converged on the Degree home and were scouring the neighborhood. Over the next few hours, dozens of volunteers, search and rescue personnel, bloodhounds, and investigators from the Sheriff’s Office and State Bureau of Investigation (SBI) poured in to comb the surrounding area.

The SBI and FBI have always believed these sightings to be legitimate. Armed with this new information, they began combing a five-mile radius around the intersection of Highways 18 and 180. An air search by Highway Patrol and the SBI turned up empty. There were no signs of a struggle or hit-and-run. Driver checkpoints set up on February 15 and 21 failed to turn up any leads. Bloodhounds began to scour the area within 1 ½ hours of Harold’s 911 call but never caught her scent, likely due to the inclement weather.

32-year-old Barron Ramsey, a former classmate of Iquilla’s, confessed to being involved in Asha’s disappearance in summer 2000. He claimed that he and another man had just made a drug deal and were driving home when they accidentally struck her with their car. Realizing she was dead, they pulled her body into the bed of their pickup, then took a fishing trip to Moss Lake a few days later and dumped her in the water. Authorities dragged the lake twice and searched Highway 18 for any evidence of a hit-and-run, but found nothing. They believe he made up the story in hopes of getting a better deal in a bank robbery case in Bessemer City.

"Unlike the original search in Cleveland County — which took place in February in a fairly flat area — those in Burke County would face serious difficulties due to the rough terrain, dense vegetation, and sweltering heat. Variously described as an “atrocious” search area and a “honeycomb of pig trials”, it was deemed so hazardous that Sheriff Crawford would only allow trained professionals to participate. Search coordinator Randy McKinney, surprised that the bag was even found at all, called the discovery a “fluke”.

When asked how optimistic he was about finding anything, McKinney put it this way: “If there are ten oranges out there, and we ask [the searchers] how many they think they’re going to find, they’d say two.”

Starting on August 15, authorities scoured a 3-mile-long, 400-foot-wide area around the book bag. Cadaver dogs alerted to three spot close to the bag, but turned up nothing. Searchers also discovered animal bones and a pair of men’s khaki pants; it is unclear if they have any relation to Asha’s case."

"In November 2004, authorities searched an empty lot on Rube Spangle Road in Lawndale, about three miles from the Degree home, but found nothing but animal bones. In April 2005, they dug up part of a 30-acre lot just south of Shelby, walking away with nothing but two bags full of dirt."

Thanks. This shows a thorough search IMO. But, did they miss something? Also, wondering if the hits from the dogs close to the bag could have been from her body..hidden there then removed and taken elsewhere later...we all know this has been done before for many reasons. MOO

 

[SAMS]

I agree with LE here. They searched the highway and dragged the lake twice and found nothing, surely he'd know where she was roughly. I imagine there's information LE has that they haven't released publicly to corroborate a confession which he couldn't answer as well, that's the entire reason they hold certain things back from the public. Think it was just a stupid ploy to get a deal for a reduced sentence, hoping LE would believe him and close the case despite not finding the body.

Now plea deal does make sense. Well, yes, there are obviously things they keep close to the vest, especially in a case like this. Wonder when the green car came into the picture? Was it from a new tip or something they felt they shouldn't release until later, when they did. Same with the NKOTB shirt & Dr. Suess book. MOO

 

[Nadal]

Now plea deal does make sense. Well, yes, there are obviously things they keep close to the vest, especially in a case like this. Wonder when the green car came into the picture? Was it from a new tip or something they felt they shouldn't release until later, when they did. Same with the NKOTB shirt & Dr. Suess book. MOO

Think those were all new tips as they came out after they reopened (or "reexamined") the case in 2015. Could have been things they were holding back though, who knows.

 

[Nadal]

Thanks. This shows a thorough search IMO. But, did they miss something? Also, wondering if the hits from the dogs close to the bag could have been from her body..hidden there then removed and taken elsewhere later...we all know this has been done before for many reasons. MOO

Definitely possible, all i'd point out is those dogs are very fallible even the best trained ones. Especially so long after the person has been there which would have been the case with the bag search if you think the body had been moved, they are better at getting the scent immediately after the incident.

 

[dotr]

Now plea deal does make sense. Well, yes, there are obviously things they keep close to the vest, especially in a case like this. Wonder when the green car came into the picture? Was it from a new tip or something they felt they shouldn't release until later, when they did. Same with the NKOTB shirt & Dr. Suess book. MOO

Where is Asha Degree? • Morbidology
"One of the many leads in the case came when Barron Ramsey, a Mecklenburg County Jail inmate who went to school with Asha’s mother, made a detailed confession. He claimed that he and another Cleveland County man were heading back to Shelby on rural N.C. 18 in the early morning hours of Asha’s disappearance. He said that the other man, who was driving, accidentally ran Asha over. He said the girl was still alive when the driver put her in the back of the pickup. Ramsey said the driver dropped him home and left with the girl. A couple of days later, Ramsey said he and the driver went to Moss Lake near Kings Mountain where they dumped the now-deceased girl’s body. Ramsey was in jail on charges he robbed a Bessemer City bank. He said that he was looking for a deal in return for his confession in the death of Asha"

A 1973 Lincoln Mark IV, similar to the one Asha was seen climbing into.

 

[JenNJ]

Has the other man ever been named? What became of Mr. Ramsey?

 

[SAMS]

FBI: Asha Degree may have gotten into a dark green car on night of disappearance


I will add....MSM Article...

"The 9-year-old may have gotten into a dark green vehicle on the morning of her disappearance. Someone matching Asha's description was seen getting into a car on Highway 18 around the area where she was last seen. The vehicle is being described as an early 1970s Lincoln Mark IV or a Ford Thunderbird with rust around the wheel wells.

"This vehicle is right now considered a vehicle of interest, and it was occupied two times on the day of her disappearance," Cleveland County Sheriff Alan Norman said. "It had been discovered by leg work with by the sheriff office investigators along with the federal government."
"So why has the new lead come after all this time?

Sheriff Norman said the new information was generated after a meeting of the joint task force that meets regularly regarding the girl's disappearance.

"It goes to show that this case is actively worked and will be worked until there is closure for the family and the community," Norman said.

The FBI is offering a reward of up to $25,000 for information leading to the arrest and conviction of the person responsible for Asha's disappearance

 

[SAMS]

So, seems that this info was known by one of the agencies and never was shared. This could have been a game changer back when she was taken.. Still can be. Any locals remember this car? I bet someone does. MOO