NC - Boys 8, 9, & 11 rape 9 yr old girl

[Indy Gal]

Actually, studies have shown that even adults who are subjected to vast amounts of "" DO CHANGE how they view women and sex. So, of course we need to keep our kids away from it as much as possible, its pretty much everywhere. Adults are the No. 1 filter for this sort of thing, but kids cannot go anywhere without seeing at least some things that they shouldn't.

Thank you, I never knew that but it does make sense.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I know what you mean about the movie industry - our 11 year old girl begged to go see "Good Luck Chuck". Her Dad said OK. He saw previews and thought it was just going to be a funny movie about a clutsy girl. I AM THE ONE who had to kill the fun by telling him it was Rated R and that there were sexual positions and nudity. I only know that from seeing an interview with the actor who had to go through all those nude women in all those takes for sexual positions and they were talking about it on The View or something!

How would an 11-year old even get into the theater?

 

[Wudge]

I agree that if the boys were viewing on computers in their homes that the parents were neglectful; however, you can't blame the parents that the boys sexually assaulted a woman.

Someone is responsible for the boys behavior. And it's not a village.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Someone is responsible for the boys behavior. And it's not a village.

Agreed. I think there is enough blame to go around on this one!

 

[Wudge]

Agreed. I think there is enough blame to go around on this one!

I previously made my point on the parent's being responsible in both directions; i.e., when things go right and when things go wrong.

It really, really bothers me when I hear attempts to explain away youthful crimes in courtrooms or in forums. It goes to parenting success or failure, and a good amount of failure in this regard stems from a decay in the family.

It's no secret that roughly 7 of 8 black children are raised in a fatherless family, and those figures have been getting worse all across all society households for a long time and stem from the Persian bazaar, instant gratfication, feel good, God is dead, no one is to blame, liberal approach to values and society.

We are seeing the consequences (unintended surely) in both truly heinous crimes such as this one and the more everyday ones. And things are going to get a lot worse unless values are revised backwards.

 

[Hopeful One]

Politics and politcians influence behavior dramatically, but I can't change societal norms nor directions. However, I can point out what should be intuitively obvious. Liberalism has significantly eroded traditional values, which continue to decay at an alarming rate.

And this kind of crime is the end result of a drastic change in family and societal values over the last 40 to 50 years. We are moving ever closer to an anything goes society.

When heinous crimes occur, people ask: Why. And that's why my answer belongs here and not in a politics-based forum. You are witnessing societal crossover.

Exactly.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I previously made my point on the parent's being responsible in both directions; i.e., when things go right and when things go wrong.

It really, really bothers me when I hear attempts to explain away youthful crimes in courtrooms or in forums. It goes to parenting success or failure, and a good amount of failure in this regard stems from a decay in the family.

It's no secret that roughly 7 of 8 black children are raised in a fatherless family, and those figures have been getting worse all across all society households for a long time and stem from the Persian bazaar, instant gratfication, feel good, God is dead, no one is to blame, liberal approach to values and society.

We are seeing the consequences (unintended surely) in both truly heinous crimes such as this one and the more everyday ones. And things are going to get a lot worse unless values are revised backwards.

Absolutely! Not only that, but over 60% of black babies are born to single mothers. Mothers in these families must be mother, father and breadwinner. There is ZERO supervision because mom is working more than one job in order to try and make ends meet.

 

[Nova]

Absolutely! Not only that, but over 60% of black babies are born to single mothers. Mothers in these families must be mother, father and breadwinner. There is ZERO supervision because mom is working more than one job in order to try and make ends meet.

Exactly. And that's primarily a problem of economics, not "liberal values." (I'm referring to a post above yours. )

 

[GlitchWizard]

See I think that can work both ways. My kids know about Emo culture and it opened up a dialogue with me, which was fantastic. We discussed other ways in which they could express their feelings without resorting to cutting, drugs, etc.

True. We had our first sexuality discussion at four when she saw two guys holding hands. Donna is obsessed with emo guys, and we did discuss things, like you did. The problem wasn't just expressing feelings with her, though, she has a chemical imbalance. The females of our family mostly do - thought she might be spared. Nope.

 

[Wudge]

Exactly. And that's primarily a problem of economics, not "liberal values." (I'm referring to a post above yours. )

Economics is the root cause of single Mothers holding down more than one job. Economics is not the root cause of Fathers abandoning their children en masse; that's value based. This particular value has become ingrained (accepted) in the black culture, and it is speading ever wider.

 

[GlitchWizard]

Economics is the root cause of single Mothers holding down more than one job. Economics is not the root cause of Fathers abandoning their children en masse; that's value based. This particular value has become ingrained (accepted) in the black culture, and it is speading ever wider.

Definitely wider. I have been single since 1997, and more than once have had a date tell me they had a son/daughter that they did not see, or didn't see because they didn't pay child support, or that they thought they had a kid out there "somewhere". Those don't get a second date. There was one I was engaged to, and he said his father told him it would be easier to "let the girls go" than to keep fighting over the visits. He actually considered it! I was all over him about it and he kept fighting - but the pressure is there, not just in black families.

It's very limiting to only date guys who see their kids regularly, or have custody - but it's worth it for a quality man.

 

[missacorah]

This is unbelieveable, it really is. I would have never have even believed that their 'equipment' could even have been able to do that! And for 3 of them together to somehow reach the conclusion that this is what they were going to do to the poor girl - terrifying!

I would imagine 1 of these boys was a strong leader and made the initial 'suggestion' whether that was backed up with pressure or not.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

True. We had our first sexuality discussion at four when she saw two guys holding hands. Donna is obsessed with emo guys, and we did discuss things, like you did. The problem wasn't just expressing feelings with her, though, she has a chemical imbalance. The females of our family mostly do - thought she might be spared. Nope.

It sounds as if you've got the situation well in hand!!!! You're a terrific mom and she's lucky to have you!!!

 

[Nova]

Economics is the root cause of single Mothers holding down more than one job. Economics is not the root cause of Fathers abandoning their children en masse; that's value based. This particular value has become ingrained (accepted) in the black culture, and it is speading ever wider.

Actually, no. Fathers among the lower classes (and those are the black people we're discussing here) are encouraged to be absentee by any number of economic factors, including lack of jobs and denial of welfare to "intact" nuclear families. Much of the economic dislocation stems from our devotion to a "free market," which is hardly a "liberal" value, but which has transported jobs abroad, discouraged unionization and effectively destroyed the American middle class (whose values you hold dear).

But if you want to look at values, I suggest you consider a consumer culture in which sex is treated as one more "magical" commodity to be obtained at any cost. That isn't a "liberal" value either.

 

[Wudge]

Definitely wider. I have been single since 1997, and more than once have had a date tell me they had a son/daughter that they did not see, or didn't see because they didn't pay child support, or that they thought they had a kid out there "somewhere". Those don't get a second date. There was one I was engaged to, and he said his father told him it would be easier to "let the girls go" than to keep fighting over the visits. He actually considered it! I was all over him about it and he kept fighting - but the pressure is there, not just in black families.

It's very limiting to only date guys who see their kids regularly, or have custody - but it's worth it for a quality man.

Oh man, it's too much trouble. So he "let the girls go". He cares more about himself than his family. That's the opposite of a good parent. You're smart to filter out those who are caring chalenged or, much worse, simply do not care.

Caring is a key trait that differentiates mankind from beasts.

 

[pedinurse]

Back to the boys who allegedly raped this little girl... I could only find one or two articles on this, but they sure don't say much. I can't imagine any 8, 9 or 11 year old knowing HOW to do this! I mean.. literally. I have two boys- one is 8 (almost 9) years old and the other is 7 (almost 8) years old. They are close to these kids' age. What the heck? My kids couldn't even comprehend what had happened to this girl- let alone be able to perpetrate this crime. They know the basics about their "parts" but they wouldn't know how to "use" them in that way! Holy COW!

These poor kids- all of them. I can't imagine what this little girl is going through, and the boys- well- I echo the sentiment that something was going on at home with at least one of them- and that one introduced the other two to the sexual abuse. How awful for all of them. I would like to hear more about this incident, so if anyone hears any news, keep us posted.

you'd be surprised. kids perp on kids all the time. not usually quite this young though. or this full out violently. or in a group. ugh!

 

[GlitchWizard]

It sounds as if you've got the situation well in hand!!!! You're a terrific mom and she's lucky to have you!!!

Thanks. That's one thing we have in common. Kids are definitely worth the extra effort!

 

[Wudge]

Actually, no. Fathers among the lower classes (and those are the black people we're discussing here) are encouraged to be absentee by any number of economic factors, including lack of jobs and denial of welfare to "intact" nuclear families. Much of the economic dislocation stems from our devotion to a "free market," which is hardly a "liberal" value, but which has transported jobs abroad, discouraged unionization and effectively destroyed the American middle class (whose values you hold dear).

But if you want to look at values, I suggest you consider a consumer culture in which sex is treated as one more "magical" commodity to be obtained at any cost. That isn't a "liberal" value either.

Economics are not the underpinning to behavior. You think crimes such as this one are rooted in economics. To me, these are the consequences (unintended) of now long rooted societal and personal values.

Permissive parenting is not rooted in economics. Removing God is not rooted in economics. The belief that criminals are victims is not rooted in economics. A sex above all else attitude is not driven by economics. Etc., etc., ad infinatum.

Society pushes some bum ideas. People sell themselves bum ideas. Choices have consequences. We've chosen to become far, far more liberal, uncaring and permissive. Many of today's heinous/horrid crimes that leave us gasping and shaking our head are the consequences.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Permissive parenting is not rooted in economics. Removing God is not rooted in economics. The belief that criminals are victims is not rooted in economics. A sex above all else attitude is not driven by economics. Etc., etc., ad infinatum.

I wish it were just "permissive parenting." From what I see, its NO parenting.

 

[Nova]

Economics are not the underpinning to behavior. You think crimes such as this one are rooted in economics. To me, these are the consequences (unintended) of now long rooted societal and personal values.

Permissive parenting is not rooted in economics. Removing God is not rooted in economics. The belief that criminals are victims is not rooted in economics. A sex above all else attitude is not driven by economics. Etc., etc., ad infinatum.

Society pushes some bum ideas. People sell themselves bum ideas. Choices have consequences. We've chosen to become far, far more liberal, uncaring and permissive. Many of today's heinous/horrid crimes that leave us gasping and shaking our head are the consequences.

Starving people behave differently than well-fed people, regardless of their religious training. As is demonstrated by every economic, sociological or psychological study ever done, not to mention common sense. As Maslow's work clearly showed, people whose basic needs aren't met have no time for the "higher values" you extol.

I agree that beliefs have consequences, but many if not most of our beliefs are based on economic considerations. Today's "heinous/horrid crimes" were not unknown during more repressed decades such as the 1950s; it isn't even clear they were less common, not when one accounts for population growth and greater media coverage. Blaming everything on vague concepts like "permissiveness" or "Godlessness" is nonsense.