GUILTY New Zealand - Dr. Lauren Dickason, 40, charged w/killing her 3 young daughters, Timaru, 16 Sep 2021

[investikater]

Something we haven't discussed so far: Both she and her husband appear to be religious.
Some kind of Christianity. I haven't seen any information so far about specifics like denominations, churches or beliefs.

Tragic end to Pretoria medical family’s new life New Zealand - Medical Brief :

Shortly before they left for New Zealand Lauren had shared a Facebook message that read: “I am bent, but not broken. I’m sad, but not hopeless. I’m tired but not lifeless. I’m scared, but not powerless. I have wanted to give up, but did not. How do you get it right, many people ask. My answer remains the same – because the Lord gives me strength to stand up.”

She has been described by the Daily Mail as "church-going":
New Zealand mother accused of murder had 'the prettiest house' | Daily Mail Online

Lauren Dickason's Husband Forgives Her After Murder of Their 3 Beloved Children :

Graham’s statement on the tragedy read: “My words are few at the moment. On Thursday the 16th of September 2021 my life and Lauren’s were turned upside down when our three precious angels were ripped away from us. “It is a loss that I will carry with me for the rest of my life. In this time of terrible tragedy and adversity, I can only ask for prayer for myself, my family, and my friends – prayer for strength, and for healing. “Please also pray for my lovely Lauren, as I honestly believe that she is a victim of this tragedy as well. People that know her well will testify to that – I have no doubt. “I’ve already forgiven her, and I urge you, in your own time, to do the same. It is the key to healing from this loss we have all experienced. “For the people touched and affected by this – look after yourself. Look after your wives, your husbands, your partners. Look after your children. “For those with faith in Jesus Christ – hold on to that. For the parents with young kids – remember them. “Remember to let them run free, remember to let them play wild, allow them to laugh as much as they can. “And they are never too young to be introduced to Jesus. I thank you for your love and support.” Graham also thanked “the people of Timaru, New Zealanders, South Africans and many people from all over the world”.

 

[investikater]

Like most professions, sometimes doctors diagnose their own family last. Carpenters have unfinished homes, electricians don’t fix their lights, and doctors don’t catch the signs.[...]

I'm aware of this phenomenon.

First of all it is by no means universal; health care professionals commonly do notice and act on symptoms in themselves and their loved ones. Tradies commonly do have homes they renovated very cheaply.

Secondly I do not understand these people who don't.
Why would you be so unobservant of your own family?! Or own home?
Why would you be so selfish as to let your own family be endangered from electrical problems you can fix? Or health problems you can fix?

[...]My sister-in-law is a pediatric PA. Her daughter was diagnosed at the age of 8 with juvenile diabetes. Where was she diagnosed? In the hospital. Did mom see the signs? Yes, she acknowledges the symptoms were there and missed - hindsight 20/20. She works all day with patients with the same problem, but didn’t see the signs in her own daughter until they ended up in the hospital. Does that make her a bad doctor or a bad mom?? No! It makes her human.

In similar stories I've heard, the parent / health-professional has decided the child is faking, malingering, a hypochondriac, greedy, naughty, misbehaving, other unflattering dismissive judgements, etc.
<modsnip>

 

[kiwi50]

Timaru tragedy: Murder-accused mum Lauren Dickason back in court this morning - NZ Herald

 

[dotr]

Timaru tragedy: Murder-accused mum Lauren Dickason back in court this morning - NZ Herald

First time that i can recall, to learn this specific information.
''Lauren Dickason was unresponsive and in a critical condition when her husband arrived home.''

 

[alexwood]

First time that i can recall, to learn this specific information.
''Lauren Dickason was unresponsive and in a critical condition when her husband arrived home.''

And from that same article:

"She was taken to Timaru Hospital for treatment and was stable enough by Friday night to speak with police. She was charged with murder soon after."

So, it happened on a Friday night, just before her husband arrived home from a work function. I was just wondering what that work function was -- going out with colleagues after work? Interesting that the children were likely killed shortly before the husband arrived home. She was apparently home with them for the entire day, yet she didn't take action until later -- perhaps while they slept.

When he arrived home, she was unresponsive. But I do remember reading in an earlier article that she was assisted in walking to the emergency vehicle, or whatever the conveyance was that she was led to. By later that same evening, she was able to communicate -- apparently.

 

[gsleuth]

yeah...that took longer than it would take to call her husband, the concierge, anyone...is hotel quarantine syndrome even a thing. sorry-- but being a physician she knew very well strangulation is a long death. she killed her children manually and slowly . i am sure she is not able to live with herself at this point.

How does a mom do this to ALL 3 of her children? I understand in a state of psychosis taking the life of one of your children..but ALL 3 CHILDREN?? It is so difficult to comprehend..the process of strangulation with cable ties. How long would they have suffered? Would they have been unconscious within minutes?

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

I think in ‘protective’ mode one may view ‘family’ as an entity, so individual actions become part of the whole.

 

[gsleuth]

It was manually, she tightened it and walked away.
Why murder three children and not herself?
View attachment 313247

In a state of psychosis..how does one do this to ALL 3 children? Do we have a psychiatry expert on this forum that could explain this?

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

I was under the impression that she had tried to harm herself

 

[ChatteringBirds]

The articles linked earlier in the thread say she did.

This isn't the first time this has happened. But I wonder if the first time in a family where both parents are doctors?

 

[Sarahlou]

In a state of psychosis..how does one do this to ALL 3 children? Do we have a psychiatry expert on this forum that could explain this?

Andrea Yates killed all 5 of her kids in a state of psychosis
Andrea Yates - Wikipedia

 

[gsleuth]

Parents, mainly fathers will murder the children to hurt the mother but not many mothers kill their children only.

Yes..this. The cases i have read about..they usually kill themselves.

 

[gsleuth]

Also if the cable tie method is true;






Why would a doctor who wanted to kill her children not use medication?!

And if she did why finish them off with strangulation?

With her knowledge of pharmaceuticals she would know inumerate methods of overdosing and poisoning.

She would know methods that are used for euthanasia in various places for humans, and animals more widely, and designed supposedly to be as pain and fear free as possible.

Doctors have unparalleled access a variety of dangerous prescription drugs.

Even if she was temporarily unable to write prescriptions because of just arriving in a new country, she would know how to do it with drugs available without prescription.

I'd be surprised if they didn't have drugs in their home she could have done it with.

Wanting to make sure they couldn't be saved when the husband came home is a disgusting possibility. But doctors work long hours. and they were very small children who would have succumbed quickly surely?

Highlighted..You make very good points here. If this goes to trial..a jury may very well consider your points. I have immense empathy for her..yet also angry. <modsnip: Not victim friendly> I understand what it is like living in another country with little children..without family support. It is incredibly difficult..add to that..she had a nanny to help her in South Africa. A huge change for her. Just tragic on so many levels.

 

[gsleuth]

I can’t see this case ever going to trial.
Even though it is extremely difficult in NZ to fit the legal definition of insanity as a defence to a murder charge. I think Lauren ticks all the boxes.

insanity as a defence to a murder charge.
Off medication leading to psychosis? Could you explain this further please.

What if there is no history of previous hospitalization for severe depression? or a patient with mental health services?

 

[investikater]

We do not know the mental health history of LD. I can't imagine she would have coped without any anti-depressants for the last year or 2 ( their application for NZ residency application started 2 years ago) if she had a history of severe depression.

Could she have been taking the medication all through the 2 year application process and just have been lying and concealing it? - Up until it was time to actually move when she new she would have to get the medication through the border? And eventually get a new prescription in New Zealand?

We don't know if the mediciation she stopped was an antidepressant - it is the most obvious possibility but it could have been a number of things.

We also don't know for sure if taking an antidepressant will fail you on a New Zealand immigration application. Doctors hand them out like candy so that would be a problem for an awful lot of people. Is anyone familiar with NZ's medical immigration rules in great detail?

We also don't know if she;
Stopped taking it knowing it was a definite fail in a deliberate attempt to immigrate via fraud and deception.
Or if she was just worried it might cause an issue and stopped taking it out of anxiety, that was possibly even misplaced.

Also i still don't understand how someone could be that ill and a practicing doctor.

And the whole medication rumor could just be her south african family, friends and collegues trying to make sense, trying to find a reason, trying to find an excuse.

 

[gsleuth]

So moving to new zealand meant losing her home, family, friends, colleagues, nanny, cleaner, gardener, routine, some kind of medication, job, and her career?

Why did they do it?
I know South Africa is a dangerous hole at the moment, but they lived in a secured, gated estate - life doesn't sound that bad there.
They were planning and organising this move for years.

nothing makes sense.

Generally South Africans move to New Zealand for a better life for their children.

When you have a nanny and cleaner and then move to another country with no family support..it would help for the migrant to organize home help before arriving in NZ. They could connect with a SA/NZ migrant support group.
When you have been working..the change is HUGE.

 

[gsleuth]

Could she have been taking the medication all through the 2 year application process and just have been lying and concealing it? - Up until it was time to actually move when she new she would have to get the medication through the border? And eventually get a new prescription in New Zealand?

We don't know if the mediciation she stopped was an antidepressant - it is the most obvious possibility but it could have been a number of things.

We also don't know for sure if taking an antidepressant will fail you on a New Zealand immigration application. Doctors hand them out like candy so that would be a problem for an awful lot of people. Is anyone familiar with NZ's medical immigration rules in great detail?

We also don't know if she;
Stopped taking it knowing it was a definite fail in a deliberate attempt to immigrate via fraud and deception.
Or if she was just worried it might cause an issue and stopped taking it out of anxiety, that was possibly even misplaced.

Also i still don't understand how someone could be that ill and a practicing doctor.

And the whole medication rumor could just be her south african family, friends and collegues trying to make sense, trying to find a reason, trying to find an excuse.

Yeah..i suppose it's quite possible she was taking her medication until fairly recently. Many people worldwide have depression..i don't see why it would prevent her obtaining NZ residency..unless she had a history of requiring psychiatric help..or hospitalization.That might have been an issue.

This is really complicated..with NZ Immigration issues connected to the situation. I don't know how that will fit into the final result in this tragedy.

I have never considered that the medication talk by family and friends could be incorrect. I read that LD worked with her husband.

(websleuths seems to be really slow..was trying to reply to you after liking your post.)

 

[ChatteringBirds]

How can anyone not understand taking the chance to move to New Zealand for awhile, especially with one great job lined-up? They probably figured she was capable of restarting her career, too, once the kids had good care or were somewhat older...
I don't understand judging this on any level. Nor do I understand harboring some anger toward her poor husband, who has lost everything.

 

[gsleuth]

How can anyone not understand taking the chance to move to New Zealand for awhile, especially with one great job lined-up? They probably figured she was capable of restarting her career, too, once the kids had good care or were somewhat older...
I don't understand judging this on any level. Nor do I understand harboring some anger toward her poor husband, who has lost everything.

I don't understand this..a few days after arriving in Timaru..hubby goes to a work function while his wife is alone with 3 little children..in a new country..with no family or friends. That makes me angry.
''The girls' father, an orthopaedic surgeon, had been at a work function and arrived home about 9.40pm last Thursday to find the little girls dead.''
Timaru tragedy: Father of dead girls says he'll carry loss 'for the rest of my life' - NZ Herald

 

[cocomod]

How does a mom do this to ALL 3 of her children? I understand in a state of psychosis taking the life of one of your children..but ALL 3 CHILDREN?? It is so difficult to comprehend..the process of strangulation with cable ties. How long would they have suffered? Would they have been unconscious within minutes?

I don't know if anyone can truly understand this unless they have experienced it on a personal level. Watching someone you love change is incredibly difficult to help people understand. Watching psychosis hit someone within a day is incredibly difficult. Watching their brain literally change their behavior and their personality is incredibly difficult. I saw my step-son go from a very confident "normal" young adult to an almost toddler like person - confused and crying. His talking changed, his behavior was strange, and he didn't even understand basic things. Once we were able to get to the bottom of the issue at that time, he didn't remember the last week. Zero. Nada. Nothing. Psychosis takes over the mind and there can be NO memory of that time frame.