GUILTY NH - AH, 14, North Conway, 9 October 2013 - #12

[Fireweed]

If a 14 yr old doesn't have the "requisite mental capacity to go willingly" what does it matter if she went willingly, why is that the biggest thing? Of course the person has pretty good reason to lie, they harbored, held, who knows what… a minor.

Sorry, I mean it points to the victim having a good reason to lie. In other words, a person can be a victim and ALSO be accused of lying about something. I think this is just a confusing concept in a case like this. Like, a 14 year-old has sex with her 19 year-old boyfriend. He gets accused of statutory rape. She is the victim, but she may still lie to protect him. That does not mean she is not a victim though.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Then perhaps threads on child victims should not exist, because by the nature of sleuthing, something might come up about a child victim that is unpleasant. It is unavoidable. Personally I have read some things about Abby on other sites that I will not post here because she is a child, but there are some things related to solving the case that will naturally involve the victim. The biggest one for me is did she go willingly or was she abducted? Now here is my take: a 14-year-old child does not have the requisite mental capacity to go "willingly" with someone if that involves being taken away from her parents for nine months, so to me, whether she went willingly or not, she is still a victim. The conundrum I am having is that a person who went "willingly" now might have a pretty good reason to lie (wants to protect self, wants to protect perp, is embarrassed, etc). So that brings up issues that, by all rights would be good to discuss when sleuthing, but which people are not comfortable bringing up when that victim is a child.

Yeah, I'll admit... The whole "went willingly" thing really rubs me the wrong way.
It makes zero difference to me, I feel it's blaming the victim. And when the victim is a child, it really gets my hackles up!

Remember Hannah Anderson?

Websleuths shut the thread down after she was found because too many people were saying vile things about the child victim. IMO




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[LookingHoping]

There's a few communes and non-traditional communities in the VT/NH/ME area, some of which have less than stellar reputations. Some are religious based and do a lot of farming. If she got sick and that's why she was returned, it could have been from something food borne that she caught.

Yes, very aware of them all and I've done some serious research on them over the past months. Their reputations are not based upon what they eat though, very different story there (stories there).

 

[margarita25]

9 months is a long time for a young girl in this age and day to be off the grid.
As far as running away, one would think the meager/challenging lifestyle might get old after a while (hunger, etc)
There's something about this I'm trying to put my finger on...
As LE said, cared for, by whom?

 

[liljim]

the difference between "went willingly" (and either then coerced/enticed or not) and "was abducted and held against her will" is huge, imo.

it does not matter in any way when considering the 14 year old victims actions, it matters in a very big way when considering public safety and the right of the community to receive information from law enforcement.

 

[margarita25]

Question, is there something specific to indicate a possibility that she was in a commune? (Sorry, so much in the threads, I haven't been able to read every post). tia

 

[liljim]

Question, is there something specific to indicate a possibility that she was in a commune? (Sorry, so much in the threads, I haven't been able to read every post). tia

no, nothing.

 

[Rivernh]

I don't know that LE's statement on Abby being in good health and the family's statement about her being thin and weak and having trouble eating are mutually exclusive. LE has stated in the Boston Globe article tonight that she was traumatized:
Hernandez, a Conway, N.H., teen, has been working with authorities to help them understand how she disappeared and where she has been, but officials say that she is traumatized and they do not yet have the full story.
Think about this: LE sees Abby, missing for nine months, and she's alive! She doesn't seem to be injured but she's obviously traumatized. They dont' know her like her family does so maybe dont' realize she is much thinner....and they also don't have the legal right to comment on her medical health anyway due to medical privacy rights we all have now.
Mom is overjoyed to see her but OMG you're so thin. Abby is traumatized and maybe not eating, maybe can't eat and the problem becomes more apparent over the passing days.
I do not for ONE second think that she has not been checked over medically and thoroughly. LE may be building a case and if mom didn't consent to a medical exam they would have CPS services over there in an instant. I would be shocked if mom wanted anything else for her anyway, she is a nurse and understands the importance of all of this. Just because no one said it, didn't mean it didn't happen

 

[LookingHoping]

the difference between "went willingly" (and either then coerced/enticed or not) and "was abducted and held against her will" is huge, imo.

it does not matter in any way when considering the 14 year old victims actions, it matters in a very big way when considering public safety and the right of the community to receive information from law enforcement.

If lured (eg went willingly). That is still public safety. That is, there are people out there that will go to great lengths to get our children. They don't have to grab them physically off the street anymore because they can use the internet, lie and pretend and befriend and make promises to kids who aren't capable brain development wise to spot a perp.

Thing is, it is a global public safety issue, not necessarily a Conway one....

 

[2Hope4]

The fair....would they be back in the area now? Or in a city/town nearby? Could that have anything to do with this? The carivan or whatever the carnival type thing is called, sometimes travel from state to state. Could they just arrived back in the area close enough to bring Abby back? Where before they were states away, doing their job, and Abby didn't have the means to get transportation back? I mean, sure she could have called parents, but maybe not. Maybe she wasn't ready to face them until they got back near home, and suddenly she realizes it's what she wants, and it's the right time to come home?

I think it goes without saying that everyone here is beyond happy that ABBY IS HOME!!! A miracle in many ways, as even if she did run away, we have read the statistics involved. The horrors that be in the real world that most young people think won't happen to them. Many run aways never get the chance to come home. So yes, Abby being able to walk back home, and wearing the same clothes she disappeared in is truly mind bogging, and wonderful at the same time!!!

 

[carbuff]

Yeah, I'll admit... The whole "went willingly" thing really rubs me the wrong way.
It makes zero difference to me, I feel it's blaming the victim. And when the victim is a child, it really gets my hackles up!

Remember Hannah Anderson?

Websleuths shut the thread down after she was found because too many people were saying vile things about the child victim. IMO

"Went willingly" could mean something as innocent as accepting a ride with someone she thought could be trusted, or going off on what she thought was going to be a brief jaunt with a friend. "Hey, wanna go to the movie with me? Don't call your mom or she'll try to stop us."

 

[Fireweed]

Has there every been a case where a large group of people conspired to keep a kid like that? I do not think so. I grew up on an insular hippie commune (which I am sure looked really weird to outsiders), and there is absolutely no way a minor would have been kept there away from parents who were looking for her. No way.

 

[margarita25]

I don't know that LE's statement on Abby being in good health and the family's statement about her being thin and weak and having trouble eating are mutually exclusive. LE has stated in the Boston Globe article tonight that she was traumatized:
Hernandez, a Conway, N.H., teen, has been working with authorities to help them understand how she disappeared and where she has been, but officials say that she is traumatized and they do not yet have the full story.
Think about this: LE sees Abby, missing for nine months, and she's alive! She doesn't seem to be injured but she's obviously traumatized. They dont' know her like her family does so maybe dont' realize she is much thinner....and they also don't have the legal right to comment on her medical health anyway due to medical privacy rights we all have now.
Mom is overjoyed to see her but OMG you're so thin. Abby is traumatized and maybe not eating, maybe can't eat and the problem becomes more apparent over the passing days.
I do not for ONE second think that she has not been checked over medically and thoroughly. LE may be building a case and if mom didn't consent to a medical exam they would have CPS services over there in an instant. I would be shocked if mom wanted anything else for her anyway, she is a nurse and understands the importance of all of this. Just because no one said it, didn't mean it didn't happen

"Traumatized" is a strong word. If "officials" said this, I think this is troubling.

 

[liljim]

If lured (eg went willingly). That is still public safety. That is, there are people out there that will go to great lengths to get our children. They don't have to grab them physically off the street anymore because they can use the internet, lie and pretend and befriend and make promises to kids who aren't capable brain development wise to spot a perp.

Thing is, it is a global public safety issue, not necessarily a Conway one....

absolutely, i certainly didnt mean to imply anything else. and it is still vastly different from abducted/imprisoned...

 

[CrystalAnn]

Does any one else remember the one creepy comment on one of Abigails photos from an older man?? A friend of the BF's father i think it was... i cant tell if he resembles the sketch or not. different angles..

 

[margarita25]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2014/07/25/new-hampshire-teen-who-vanished-for-nine-months-deteriorated-health-family-says/4EIKOIp06mdG8jw8FedtzM/story.html

 

[margarita25]

“Our biggest challenge is, we’re dealing with incomplete information,” said Kieran Ramsey, assistant special agent in charge of the Boston Division of the FBI. “The victim in this case is a 15-year-old girl. It’s not as cut and dried as people think that somebody can exactly recount what happened, when, and where.”

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2014/07/25/new-hampshire-teen-who-vanished-for-nine-months-deteriorated-health-family-says/4EIKOIp06mdG8jw8FedtzM/story.html

 

[momrids6]

outlet mall; Settlers' Green Outlet Village, Route 16 North Conway, NH

http://www.settlersgreen.com/


1 mile walking - from NS Road to Settlers Green- https://goo.gl/maps/cucCi

 

[Fireweed]

"Traumatized" is a strong word. If "officials" said this, I think this is troubling.

Trauma is such a strange thing. You can be traumatized and remember something like the color of a car from 9 months ago, but not remember where you were living 6 days ago. I guess that makes some sense, like maybe the thing that happened before all the trauma is something you would remember?

 

[LookingHoping]

Does any one else remember the one creepy comment on one of Abigails photos from an older man?? A friend of the BF's father i think it was... i cant tell if he resembles the sketch or not. different angles..

There have been so many! Which one?