GUILTY NH - AH, 14, North Conway, 9 October 2013 - # 8

[Donna64]

Ok Mom, no problem. I understand assumptions. I make a lot of my own. Thanks.

 

[majikbeans]

I would call the police before calling all of my daughter's friends if she was not home as expected/ and if our "regular and frequent" contact was missing for hours before coming home and finding her absent. (You might speak when she gets home every day, or call and ask what would you like me to pick up for dinner?) It would not take a wrecked house for me to call police if contact was absent and the kid not home by 7 pm. At the same time, I believe police would go door to door asking if the child had been seen. This seems like an obvious thing to do, and an easy way to get common sense answers. Taping off the house as if it were a crime scene, however, seems a little less common--a little less standard-operating procedure. BUT--remember that in the first three days, it was reported that she arrived home (tracking dogs followed her scent) and went missing from home. That could explain the crime-scene tape in the early days. The dogs said she got home.

 

[takeitfromme412]

No it wasn't, I'm opining. in other words: I keep coming back to<insert "my aforementioned theory that I've written in many posts">...
It's never, to my knowledge, been stated in MSM or by LE the condition of the home other than a picture of the exterior in which they depict a subject from LE standing outside with yellow tape attached to trees, a picture that has been posted previously and can be found. I have previously stated, imho, that something had to be terribly wrong for ZH to have phone the police upon arrival at her home. It's my concerted opinion, further, that should a child be found not home upon the arrival of a parent that most parents would first call the child's peers to find the child rather than call the police. Again, we don't know that ZH didn't call AH's friends first but it's been stated in the timeline that ZH came home and called the police. We do know ZH worked at a nursing/rehabilitation facility nearby. The assumption is that ZH's shift ended at or around 7pm. Back to the facts: the call to police was made at 7:17pm. Back to assumption: If AH left her place of employ at 7pm it would stand to reason it took her, from the address of the rehab facility, about 10 mins to arrive home (one could get a more exact time by punching in the work address with the home address in google, I can't do it, comp can't handle graphics), so in 7 mins ZH walks in the door and calls police to report her child missing. And further assumption: something in the home must have alerted ZH to a problem. Backing up assumption with facts: the home was taped off and LE went door to door asking questions. Hence the theory that when ZH entered the home it must have been in terrible disarray for her to call the police and for them to tape off the home (crime scene) and go door to door questioning neighbors. Red is theory/assumption and opinion, blue is facts to color code to explain only the final sentence.

ZH's place of work is about 45 mins from conway, she doesn't work right in town...... maybe she was worried before she got home? Like maybe called abby but couldn't reach her via cell or home phone, maybe even made a couple calls to attempt to locate her and was unsuccessful....then reached home and she isn't there and then panicked and called the police??? Just a theory......

 

[skibaboo]

So what you are saying is she could have switched it off?

No I'm not saying she did anything, just you can't easily just pop the back and pop the battery out like on other phones. You have to use a tiny screwdriver to remove a few screws just to get to the battery, it's fussy.

See video here for what I mean
[video=youtube;sQqPm3LmwV4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQqPm3LmwV4[/video]

 

[majikbeans]

I posted an article in the last thread. An 'off' phone can still ping. The battery needs to be removed, phone submerged in water or destroyed for this not to happen. I know I signed up to track my kids' phones. It only needed to be on for the initial set up, after that even if it was powered off it could be found on the map.

Thank you, LookingHoping, and sorry. I read the last thread, but I was confused about whether this was an option or standard that you have to destroy or drop in water. I think I remember someone asked if all phones automatically had it. Your kids' phones have the option to never get turned off, but do we know about Abby's? LE would know whether she had that tracking function, right?

 

[CatFancier]

The list of facts is a short one (that is confirmed by LE and MSM):

Abby was last seen leaving school (223?), texted a friend at (252?), last ping 307.

Everything else is a mess. Walking and seen elsewhere, supposition. What she was wearing, changes. Even the last ping changed but I think LE was pretty clear it is now 307.

 

[takeitfromme412]

The timeline can be found at www.bringabbyhome.com

 

[skibaboo]

I posted an article in the last thread. An 'off' phone can still ping. The battery needs to be removed, phone submerged in water or destroyed for this not to happen. I know I signed up to track my kids' phones. It only needed to be on for the initial set up, after that even if it was powered off it could be found on the map.

I have 2 iPhones and an iPad, I was just playing around with 'Find My iPhone' tracking them switched on, and off. It showed the location of them switched on, and the location where they were the last time they were active. (location on map, 31 minutes ago) It wouldn't find my iPad at all though, saying it was offline even though my husband was in the same room using it, weird

ETA: Of course a ping is different. Plus LE probably has other resources at their disposal.

 

[majikbeans]

I'm wondering if the water searches (pudding pond, sacco river) were related to the phone not being able to be turned off unless you undo the screws and take out the battery or drop in water. Is the phone key to the thinking? Or is it the route and where she was last maybe seen on the route (Eagle's way or NS highway or possibly Wallmart?)--either by camera or by "sighting"?

We don't know about any of the "tips." We do know the route home.
If you wanted to meet up with someone who was going to pick you up after school and you wanted it to be a secret, wouldn't you head over to the NS Highway rather than going into town with the other kids? And wouldn't you do whatever you needed to do to make sure the phone wouldn't give your location away?

So, that requires a motivated and savvy runaway. It would require an assistant who wouldn't be traceable via social media. A vehicle. Some money. A lot of willpower. Motivation (most likely something more dire than following a dream? Arguable). Emotional commitment (serious depression, a lot of anger, fear--more than just experimenting with independence?).
What would the assistant need--?
To be older. To have a job that allowed flex time. Money. Privacy. An attachment to AH--to hurt her, to control her, or to "save" her, to "help" her.
How would she meet such a person? In person: Ski bums come through. Religious cults, Predators. Ex-teachers, camp counselors.
On line: Without leaving a trail? Seems dubious.

 

[Mom24]

The list of facts is a short one (that is confirmed by LE and MSM):

Abby was last seen leaving school (223?), texted a friend at (252?), last ping 307.

Everything else is a mess. Walking and seen elsewhere, supposition. What she was wearing, changes. Even the last ping changed but I think LE was pretty clear it is now 307.

Some MSM's are still reporting the last ping at 6:30 using the Fish and Game statement at one of the news conferences as a source. They thought she made it home, but then said they felt she hadn't made it home. Some places say she was wearing black boots, other say brown. Some places say she was wearing a grey sweathshirt, others a black sweater and others a striped sweater with yellow flecks. It appears all that's really sure is that she's missing and she disappeared on October 9. Can't believe we're coming up on the second month and literally all we can be sure of is that a girl named Abigail Hernandez disappeared on October 9th from North Conway, NH. Period. I know it's common to find things out and the facts can change as case in investigated, but this one is such a mess that it's hard to even make a good guess about what happened. We can't even decide amongst ourselves whether we feel she was abducted or ran away. Big heaving heavy sigh.

 

[LittleRose]

I posted an article in the last thread. An 'off' phone can still ping. The battery needs to be removed, phone submerged in water or destroyed for this not to happen. I know I signed up to track my kids' phones. It only needed to be on for the initial set up, after that even if it was powered off it could be found on the map.

This makes me sick to my stomach. All I can think is abduction. I think it was planned and LE was searching the ponds for the phone. Whomever took her knew he needed to get rid of her phone quickly, most likely he pitched it into water.

I don't think a 14 year old girl with an iPhone 5 would do any of the above three things to her phone. Kids that age are addicted to texting, etc. I bet a 14 year old runaway would think turning it off was good enough to avoid detection.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Steleheart]

No it wasn't, I'm opining. in other words: I keep coming back to<insert "my aforementioned theory that I've written in many posts">...
It's never, to my knowledge, been stated in MSM or by LE the condition of the home other than a picture of the exterior in which they depict a subject from LE standing outside with yellow tape attached to trees, a picture that has been posted previously and can be found. I have previously stated, imho, that something had to be terribly wrong for ZH to have phone the police upon arrival at her home. It's my concerted opinion, further, that should a child be found not home upon the arrival of a parent that most parents would first call the child's peers to find the child rather than call the police. Again, we don't know that ZH didn't call AH's friends first but it's been stated in the timeline that ZH came home and called the police. We do know ZH worked at a nursing/rehabilitation facility nearby. The assumption is that ZH's shift ended at or around 7pm. Back to the facts: the call to police was made at 7:17pm. Back to assumption: If AH left her place of employ at 7pm it would stand to reason it took her, from the address of the rehab facility, about 10 mins to arrive home (one could get a more exact time by punching in the work address with the home address in google, I can't do it, comp can't handle graphics), so in 7 mins ZH walks in the door and calls police to report her child missing. And further assumption: something in the home must have alerted ZH to a problem. Backing up assumption with facts: the home was taped off and LE went door to door asking questions. Hence the theory that when ZH entered the home it must have been in terrible disarray for her to call the police and for them to tape off the home (crime scene) and go door to door questioning neighbors. Red is theory/assumption and opinion, blue is facts to color code to explain only the final sentence.

There is no information that I have found that states when ZH arrived home, that she called police right away, or that she even went to work that day. If there is that information then many people have missed a huge piece of the puzzle.

BBM: It is absolutely NOT Stated in the timeline that ZH came home and called police. Here is the timeline issued by LE:
http://www.wcsh6.com/assetpool/documents/131016071002_Picture Timeline.pdf

BBM: If ZH left her place of emplot at 7 PM she would not have been home untill 7:47 PM. ZH does NOT work at a nursing home nearby, she works at Mountain View community in Ossipee. Here is where it says where she worked;
http://www.conwaydailysun.com/index...20-mountain-view-rallies-for-hernandez-family
Here is where it says what the address is;
http://www.carrollcountynh.net/pages/CarrollcountyNH_Nursing/index
Here is where it shows the driving time:
https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=...ReAI0uqCzTDFKE7ooUSMOkA&gl=us&mra=ls&t=m&z=10
With a theory, if it is not at least based on accurate fact and available evidence it only creates confusion. theories based on a series of assumptions are worthless IMO., and is muddying the water as far as distinguishing between rumors, conjecture and facts.

For all we know ZH may have arrived home in plenty of time to make phone calls or even take a ride looking for her - we just don't know.
If I have missed some reports on ZH's arrival time please someone let me know. This idea that she came home late and panicked has been around from the beginning and seems to be accepted as fact. Why?

 

[LookingHoping]

I have 2 iPhones and an iPad, I was just playing around with 'Find My iPhone' tracking them switched on, and off. It showed the location of them switched on, and the location where they were the last time they were active. (location on map, 31 minutes ago) It wouldn't find my iPad at all though, saying it was offline even though my husband was in the same room using it, weird

ETA: Of course a ping is different. Plus LE probably has other resources at their disposal.

Neat test of the system! Sure a ping is different. I do know pings require very little signal in that even if you cannot make a call nor a text, the tower can still make contact enough to 'ping'. It is neat to see it found it when it was last turned on, but not while powered off. The more articles I read, the more I realize there may not be a solid nor backed up answer online!

The ipad isn't using the cell signal, it would be using 4g which is a different ballgame altogether. This is where my brain stops, the difference between the signals. They are very different signals though, which is why you have to pay for data plans separately from basic phone/text plans.

 

[Eileen730]

ZH's place of work is about 45 mins from conway, she doesn't work right in town...... maybe she was worried before she got home? Like maybe called abby but couldn't reach her via cell or home phone, maybe even made a couple calls to attempt to locate her and was unsuccessful....then reached home and she isn't there and then panicked and called the police??? Just a theory......

I believe there are things going on here we are not privy to.
There is a reason she was taken. Jmo

 

[cluciano63]

Someone or some source said that her mom worked until 7pm from the start. It was never confirmed if she did so that day, or even that this was a fact, as far as I know.

 

[Eileen730]

There is no information that I have found that states when ZH arrived home, that she called police right away, or that she even went to work that day. If there is that information then many people have missed a huge piece of the puzzle.

BBM: It is absolutely NOT Stated in the timeline that ZH came home and called police. Here is the timeline issued by LE:
http://www.wcsh6.com/assetpool/documents/131016071002_Picture Timeline.pdf

BBM: If ZH left her place of emplot at 7 PM she would not have been home untill 7:47 PM. ZH does NOT work at a nursing home nearby, she works at Mountain View community in Ossipee. Here is where it says where she worked;
http://www.conwaydailysun.com/index...20-mountain-view-rallies-for-hernandez-family
Here is where it says what the address is;
http://www.carrollcountynh.net/pages/CarrollcountyNH_Nursing/index
Here is where it shows the driving time:
https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=...ReAI0uqCzTDFKE7ooUSMOkA&gl=us&mra=ls&t=m&z=10
With a theory, if it is not at least based on accurate fact and available evidence it only creates confusion. theories based on a series of assumptions are worthless IMO., and is muddying the water as far as distinguishing between rumors, conjecture and facts.

For all we know ZH may have arrived home in plenty of time to make phone calls or even take a ride looking for her - we just don't know.
If I have missed some reports on ZH's arrival time please someone let me know. This idea that she came home late and panicked has been around from the beginning and seems to be accepted as fact. Why?

Sad is t it that after all this time we are still guessing we have no facts.
Fact......she is missing

 

[Eileen730]

This makes me sick to my stomach. All I can think is abduction. I think it was planned and LE was searching the ponds for the phone. Whomever took her knew he needed to get rid of her phone quickly, most likely he pitched it into water.

I don't think a 14 year old girl with an iPhone 5 would do any of the above three things to her phone. Kids that age are addicted to texting, etc. I bet a 14 year old runaway would think turning it off was good enough to avoid detection.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think kids are very smart when it comes to their phones and ipads

 

[Steleheart]

I'm seriously getting confused about what is "fact" and what is "theory" here. Argh! We need a "just the facts" post, please. Anyone?

:banghead:

 

[LookingHoping]

FACT: Abby is still missing.

 

[Mom24]

I'm wondering if the water searches (pudding pond, sacco river) were related to the phone not being able to be turned off unless you undo the screws and take out the battery or drop in water. Is the phone key to the thinking? Or is it the route and where she was last maybe seen on the route (Eagle's way or NS highway or possibly Wallmart?)--either by camera or by "sighting"?

We don't know about any of the "tips." We do know the route home.
If you wanted to meet up with someone who was going to pick you up after school and you wanted it to be a secret, wouldn't you head over to the NS Highway rather than going into town with the other kids? And wouldn't you do whatever you needed to do to make sure the phone wouldn't give your location away?

So, that requires a motivated and savvy runaway. It would require an assistant who wouldn't be traceable via social media. A vehicle. Some money. A lot of willpower. Motivation (most likely something more dire than following a dream? Arguable). Emotional commitment (serious depression, a lot of anger, fear--more than just experimenting with independence?).
What would the assistant need--?
To be older. To have a job that allowed flex time. Money. Privacy. An attachment to AH--to hurt her, to control her, or to "save" her, to "help" her.
How would she meet such a person? In person: Ski bums come through. Religious cults, Predators. Ex-teachers, camp counselors.
On line: Without leaving a trail? Seems dubious.

I'm going to put something out there I've been wondering so please allow for an opinion, not a statement of fact. I'll highlight facts in blue for those who might get confused. I posted yesterday a side by side of the map of the area the FBI focused on for their search and a map of one of the routes shaded in the Green Hills Preserve. I posted it because I found it interesting that the area the search was focused on was the same as one of the running/biking/snowmobile routes in the preserve. I also believe, if AH was abducted, it was by someone she knew enough to trust and get into a car with. I don't know if she was intending on running away and secured passage with someone she knew, or if someone she knew came upon her in a vehicle and offered her a ride for some agreed upon purpose (getting a coffee and chat, a ride to a store, a bite to eat, etc) and it doesn't matter. ZH says she feels AH got into a car and "things went bad" (paraphrasing) and I tend to side with a mother's intuition, she knows her child better than anyone. She carried that child in her body, tended her all her life and although she didn't know AH was walking home, she has an attachment to her daughter that only a mother can have and we mothers are intuitive when it comes to our children. I have thought for some time that the someone she trusted may have been someone she met through running. At these running events you meet people, but you don't really "know" them. It's like when you go to the same grocery store day after day, and you have the same cashier. You "know" the cashier, but you don't really "know" them. It's my opinion that whoever grabbed her, if she was grabbed, was someone she knew but didn't know well. I think they used the trail to either subdue her or lure her to a place where she could be subdued. It's also my opinion that the person who may have taken her, if she was taken, knew those trails well. I believe she somehow either planned to meet or ran into this person behind Walmart and then somehow ended up on that bike/running/snowmobile trail, and may have even been heading in the direction of her home. I think this person lured her to a place she could be subdued or suggested they get a coffee and got her into his car, disabled her phone and took off. I just don't think it was coincidence that the trail and the search area were one in the same. The only part that doesn't fit my supposition is the Saco River search. At any rate, if she was abducted I think it was someone who knew the trails and someone she met through the running events. JMO. I think what the running group has done for AH's family is incredible, but it's always worried me that one of them could have had something to do with AH's disappearance. I could be way off track, since we don't know if she was abducted or has run away, but I think it's worth putting the opinion out there since we're lucky enough to have someone posting here who is part of that group and would be in the unique position of being able to recognize anything suspicious.
Excuse the choppiness of the post, interruptions abound. Let me know if you need footnoted MSM of any of the blue highlighted facts. It may take me time, but I think can produce them. The rest is opinion, supported I feel from the aforementioned facts. I don't have any opinion on who that person who may have abducted AH is, nor am I of the opinion that abduction is the only answer, this opinion is one of many I have regarding AH's disappearance. It may well be she was abducted by a stranger, she may have gone for a walkabout and slipped off a rock, she may be sitting in someone's living room reading this post and shaking her head (preferred outcome), but this is one of my opinions on what happened, with all due respect to any family or friends that may be perusing the boards.