Found Deceased NH - Celina Cass, 11, Stewartstown, 25 July 2011 #10 *Arrest*

[Chris_Texas]

Do you see a reason to think this child was found completely nude? Please share your thoughts if you do.

No. And amazingly it had never even crossed my mind until today. There has been so much talk about her being wrapped in a blanket and what not, and this being the suspicious thing about how she was discovered, and it suddenly occured to me that maybe she wasn't wrapped in anything at all, including clothes. I would say that was pretty damn suspicious.

Which just goes to show how new to the whole web sleuthing thing I am -- I'm sure most people here thought of that possibility immediately.

And please remember, the "official's" are under no obligation whatsoever to release information concerning this investigation to the public. It could possibly effect the integrity of the case, why should they take the risk?

At some point, when they have failed in their efforts, it seems appropriate to me to release the information they have on the chance that it might kindle a memory that someone might have forgotten or not realized the significance of. For example, lets say she was found tangled in a tuna net (yes, I am deliberately being silly to make a point). That might be a dead end to police until someone remembers loaning their tuna net to so-and-so just last year and the son-of-a-gun never gave it back.

If you don't mind me asking, are you by chance a social worker?

No. I am a makeup artist as my primary profession.

EDIT: To elaborate, while we originally worked pretty much exclusively doing theatrical and 3D special effects (mostly horror) makeup, or main focus these days is high-end fantasy and performance makeup -- and our main customer base is girls, from little kids through college age. Obviously we will do anything that pays the bills but this is our main thing. In this role I often get to see a side of kids that their parents and teachers rarely see, I have to work closely with them but I am not really an authority figure to them -- we are working together and I treat them the way I would any adult, and they respond accordingly -- and it is from this experience and one other that I draw the conclusions that I have.

The second is a bit more complicated perhaps, so I will skip to the high points. There was a three or four year period of time, about seven years ago, in which I was somewhat well known for an acting role. It was a role that resonated with kids (teens and pre-teens) and as a result I got a surprising amount of mails every day (usually at least 40 or 50 a day). Most were just basic love or hate letters, others were just questions, a few were extraordinarily disturbing letters from some seriously crazy people... and some, usually no more than a half-dozen a day, letters from kids who had problems and had somehow come to the conclusion that I was someone that they could safely talk to.

I got letters from suicidal kids at the rate of maybe one or two a week -- so many that I actually had a suicide prevention form letter pre-written, and I would just personalize it from there. It was seriously heartbreaking at times. All of it really. A thousand kids so desperate for someone to talk to that they are writing to a stranger.

Though it took me usually about an hour a day (until I got smart and created copy and paste replies to the most common questions, which cut the time in half) I tried to answer every letter and email (except the insane ones). If I missed a day or two it piled up to ludicrous levels. The importance of actually responding became clear the first time I got a letter back from a girl saying that she had decided to kill herself but had waited to see if I would answer her. In any case, I learned a great deal.

 

[Chris_Texas]

That's okay Chris, I don't mind or take offense one bit with you disagreeing w/me over possible wrapping. I liked your reply and gotta admit you did get me to thinking and smilin! You make many fantastic points and I understand and respect and I gotta say, you could be absolutely correct. IMO I do not feel that the tox will reveal anything. I believe Celina will be clean. I am speaking the Tox only. Not any other tests performed at this point. I don't believe the possible perp(s) had time, took the time, nor even the decency to medicate her prior to. I wish in my heart that maybe she might not have had to suffer! but It makes me shudder. again, thx!

Thanks. I really don't have a theory or suspect I am leaning towards (not enough data), but I will say that I think it is entirely possible that the tox results will NOT come back clean, and might even play an important role in discovering what happened.

Or maybe not :crazy:

 

[iamnotagolem]

Chris_Texas,
I just want to say, I thoroughly enjoy your posts, you always make me think and you say what I'm thinking, but much more eloquently and tactfully, so thank you!

 

[MsFacetious]

I can't remember exactly when it was that AAG was doing a presser, but she choked up. I'm thinking it was after Celina was found and she knew the details. I know others have said they may doubt the wrapping because AAG nor LE has confirmed, but I firmly believe with the volume of news articles and media reports, if there was no truth, then AAG or LE would have come forth to set that info straight.

As someone else also pointed out. Ms. Jane didn't elaborate or give any detail of how the other young lady was found to be and it didn't come out until much later.

I see more and more of these cases where LE does not speak anymore. They now seem to always have a spokesperson or someone else representing them. Never hear from the actual investigators anymore.

It was at the very end of the press conference where they announced her body had been found.

"We have brought Celina home, not the way we wanted to bring her home."

I noticed a couple of other times where she might have been getting emotional. But that was the only time she actually did.

I don't know if it was because it was personal because maybe she has a child/niece that age... or if it was because of what she saw at the river.

But something caused her to be emotional... and Jane Young doesn't do that at a press conference. It was really hard to watch. :cry:

Did we not hear something pertaining to H2O in the lungs or not to determine whether she was alive or placed there after death? I thought I did. I may be assuming, but I am sure I read, (and I did a lot of reading everywhere) shortly after the discovery, that divers or LE said she was placed there? Do you have any info or thoughts on this?

Yes, Jane Young said that Celina's body was "put in" the water/river.
Even after it was asked by a reporter, pointed out that she had said it that way... she said it again.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased NH - Celina Cass, 11, Stewartstown, 25 July 2011 - #6


Jane Young - "We have made no determination on where her body was eventually put in the river we are trying to do that, now that we have located her body we are able to hone the investigation to make the determination.

So you will see searches conducted in different areas, but now we have a much more specific and generalized area to work in."

Reporter: But you believe then that her body was PUT in the water?

Jane Young - "She was located in the water so we are trying to determine how her body was put in the water."

 

[Joe Friday]

A month later, kids gather to remember Celina Cass

A month to the day when Celina Cass vanished from her rural New Hampshire home, friends of the 11-year-old gathered tonight to launch balloons and place fresh flowers at the dam where divers found her body after an exhaustive search through the North Country.

Their quiet tribute served as a means of grieving — particularly for a handful of young friends who felt a public memorial weeks ago was too soon — and allowed them to keep Celina’s memory in the public’s mind at a time when word of developments in the criminal investigation has waned.

“I can’t let the story go without answers,” said Stewartstown mom Debbie Baglio, who helped organize tonight’s gathering. “I can’t let this little girl go.”

Investigators are awaiting results of toxicology tests and are responding to a score of new tips that followed the announcement of a reward of more than $30,000 for information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone who may have been responsible for Celina’s death. Investigators have called her death suspicious, but the medical examiner has not ruled it a homicide.

Read more at link: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/re...emember_celina_cass/srvc=home&position=recent

 

[Wanting2Help]

New article about 1 month memorial...

http://www.colebrookchronicle.com/Aug26.pdf

 

[Texsun]

And so we wait.

 

[LisRho]

With a hurricane/tropical storm headed here, I wouldn't expect anything this weekend.

 

[Kiln Wood]

New article about 1 month memorial...
http://www.colebrookchronicle.com/Aug26.pdf

BBM

And scroll down to Page 11 for related color photos.....

Thank you for your post, Wanting2Help!

 

[cluciano63]

Nest week, we move into September...surely any lab could start sending some results back by then...it'll be 5 weeks...I would hope Celina's tox tests could be moved up ahead someone's drug screens, i.e....

 

[Chris_Texas]

With a hurricane/tropical storm headed here, I wouldn't expect anything this weekend.

Hurricane or not, I expected nothing.

 

[Texsun]

Nest week, we move into September...surely any lab could start sending some results back by then...it'll be 5 weeks...I would hope Celina's tox tests could be moved up ahead someone's drug screens, i.e....

Yes, I think it has been long enough for results and I do know of some tox tests that were back in 2 and a half weeks. Full screen and it was a crime and they were positive. However, the body had not been submerged in water, so that may be entirely different, I don't really know how much of a difference that would make as far as testing.

Could it possibly be, that LE got them back earlier this week and that was the reason for KM's visit with police? Since they have not said anything so far, perhaps they are still keeping quiet and carrying on with the investigation, feeling it would benefit them more with the public still not knowing.

If by chance, LE did receive results, and they were positive, I think I could see them still not letting us know. I wish they would, but I could understand why not.

 

[Chris_Texas]

Nest week, we move into September...surely any lab could start sending some results back by then...it'll be 5 weeks...I would hope Celina's tox tests could be moved up ahead someone's drug screens, i.e....

Based on what I have read, it would not be abnormal for the tests to take 4 weeks assuming that there was a complicated positive result they were trying to work out -- for example, the insane cocktail of multiple drugs found in Michael Jackson's body.

In Celina's case, I kinda doubt there is anything like that. I don't think (my opinion here) the AG's office is in any hurry to get these results back. The longer they wait the less attention there will be, the fewer questions they will potentially face.

 

[Chris_Texas]

Yes, I think it has been long enough for results and I do know of some tox tests that were back in 2 and a half weeks. Full screen and it was a crime and they were positive. However, the body had not been submerged in water, so that may be entirely different, I don't really know how much of a difference that would make as far as testing.

Could it possibly be, that LE got them back earlier this week and that was the reason for KM's visit with police? Since they have not said anything so far, perhaps they are still keeping quiet and carrying on with the investigation, feeling it would benefit them more with the public still not knowing.

If by chance, LE did receive results, and they were positive, I think I could see them still not letting us know. I wish they would, but I could understand why not.

Anything is possible.

 

[Angelonline]

New article about 1 month memorial...

http://www.colebrookchronicle.com/Aug26.pdf

On page two this article also says "found wrapped in a blanket". I know some believe this and some don't but I just don't understand why the press would keep repeating it if not true. Especially this "hometown" paper, IMO..

 

[MarthaM]

On page two this article also says "found wrapped in a blanket". I know some believe this and some don't but I just don't understand why the press would keep repeating it if not true. Especially this "hometown" paper, IMO..

Because it's a detail they can use to try and make their articles interesting. There are really very few new details to report with this case, so they'll take anything they can get. And if it turns out there was no blanket, then that paper and many others can attribute the error to the news channel that first reported that tidbit (from an unnamed 'source').

Errors and rumors-reported-as-fact are so common in these cases that I've learned to wait and watch.

 

[Chris_Texas]

Because it's a detail they can use to try and make their articles interesting. There are really very few new details to report with this case, so they'll take anything they can get. And if it turns out there was no blanket, then that paper and many others can attribute the error to the news channel that first reported that tidbit (from an unnamed 'source').

Errors and rumors-reported-as-fact are so common in these cases that I've learned to wait and watch.

Well said.

So far as I know the only thing the authorities have said was that something about her location or condition was suspicious, but just finding her in the water covers that. As for the blanket thing, I have never really believed it. The only way a blanket would remain wrapped around her body is it it was attached in some way, and the medical examiner would consider that in deciding the manner of death.

 

[k4kathy]

On page two this article also says "found wrapped in a blanket". I know some believe this and some don't but I just don't understand why the press would keep repeating it if not true. Especially this "hometown" paper, IMO..

Exactly what I keep thinking, and then yesterday I read the "hometown" article and sure enough, the story states thats her body was found wrapped in a blanket.

 

[k4kathy]

Because it's a detail they can use to try and make their articles interesting. There are really very few new details to report with this case, so they'll take anything they can get. And if it turns out there was no blanket, then that paper and many others can attribute the error to the news channel that first reported that tidbit (from an unnamed 'source').

Errors and rumors-reported-as-fact are so common in these cases that I've learned to wait and watch.

I can see a larger newspaper doing this, but Colbrooke newspaper?

 

[MarthaM]

Well said.

So far as I know the only thing the authorities have said was that something about her location or condition was suspicious, but just finding her in the water covers that. As for the blanket thing, I have never really believed it. The only way a blanket would remain wrapped around her body is it it was attached in some way, and the medical examiner would consider that in deciding the manner of death.

Yes. If the body really was found wrapped in a blanket, there would be no reason to keep calling this death 'suspicious'. They'd be using 'homicide'. But they're not. That's a big reason why I'm treating the blanket thing as a rumor at this point.

Of course, there's a possibility that there was a blanket and that the investigators know for sure it was a homicide but they're just not saying that. And I think that's a weird thing to do.