No intruder?

[EGirl]

So maybe PR wrote the note.
Maybe an unknown person handled JB's clothes.
This is so weak anyway.
Even IF SO,doesn't mean one of them is the killer.
So where is the evidence re who KILLED JB?
All they got in the end is the possibility that PR and an unknown male were somehow involved in this.In the murder?In the cover up?In the staging?Who can tell?

But how reliable are handwriting analysis and possibly contaminated DNA?Did it help discover the killer so far?

No mother is going to write a rn to cover for her childs murderer unless she is covering for herself or someone else in her family. That is bottom line for me.

She wrote the note and one of the three R's in the house that night killed JB.

 

[Becky319]

Personally I think JR was/is a pedo so that covers both bases.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Personally I think JR was/is a pedo so that covers both bases.

Why do you say that? Do you believe he was molesting JBR? No one has ever came out and said that JR molested them when they were younger and if he was a pedo, then I doubt he waited until he was in his 50's to start molesting a child.

 

[PrintGal]

If we called IDI what it really is, the SODDI defense, would so many people passionately cling to it?

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

But I'll ask this again.If it was so obvious for the R team and LS that it was a pedo....why did the parents bury her in that pageant outfit,does that make sense?Not to me.If that's what baited the psycho perv I would feel guilty for all my life for exposing her.I would BURN those damn pageant clothes and thropies and crowns.

If it was a pedo how come did they keep saying the pageant thingy was fun and there was nothing wrong with it.It's what killed her,right?

Well if I claim JBR was murdered there would be an argument. If I say a pedophile was involved there would be an argument. What is there no argument about?

That a child beauty pageant contestant/winner was sexually assaulted.

There. No arguments.

I would add that the public generally refers to anyone who molests/sexually assaults a child to be a pedophile. I tend to agree because adding an ulterior motive doesn't subtract from the inappropriate contact. RDI is using semantics but it didn't work.

-----------------------------------------

What if all you knew was a child beauty pageant contestant/winner was sexually assaulted? In what direction should an investigator go? Have they gone there? How far?

 

[UKGuy]

But I'll ask this again.If it was so obvious for the R team and LS that it was a pedo....why did the parents bury her in that pageant outfit,does that make sense?Not to me.If that's what baited the psycho perv I would feel guilty for all my life for exposing her.I would BURN those damn pageant clothes and thropies and crowns.

If it was a pedo how come did they keep saying the pageant thingy was fun and there was nothing wrong with it. It's what killed her,right?

madeleine,

Well the Ramsey's have to defend themselves. If there was a pedo then this person was resident in JonBenet's the night of her death.

Yet there is no evidence linking or matching to an intruder, just plenty of Ramsey forensic evidence in places where it should not really be.

The manner of JonBenet's final send off will have made a lot of sense to the Ramsey's, this is how they saw her, their little star, a future pageant princess.


.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

madeleine,

Well the Ramsey's have to defend themselves. If there was a pedo then this person was resident in JonBenet's the night of her death.

Yet there is no evidence linking or matching to an intruder, just plenty of Ramsey forensic evidence in places where it should not really be.

The manner of JonBenet's final send off will have made a lot of sense to the Ramsey's, this is how they saw her, their little star, a future pageant princess.


.

It is a stretch, to claim that despite a sexual assault on JBR plus RDI's oft-touted prior sexual abuse, to believe there is no pedophile.

Its a safe bet on the pedophile, according to the statistics I've read.

 

[madeleine]

Then I can enlighten you.


.

About the doll?Please be so kind and do.Cause I looked and looked for quotes and pics that could prove the existence of one found down there but didn't find anything that satisfies me.

 

[madeleine]

BPD saw Patsy as the weakest link in the chain, so focussed upon her.


.

Maybe this is the explanation.Break her,make her spill the beans about someone else>the one responsible for the abuse.Still,it went a bit too far.

 

[madeleine]

That a child beauty pageant contestant/winner was sexually assaulted.

There. No arguments.

But she wasn't only that.She was also a daughter,a sister,a stepsister,a niece,a family friend.One doesn't exclude the other.

 

[madeleine]

this is how they saw her, their little star, a future pageant princess.


.

Sad if so.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

But she wasn't only that.She was also a daughter,a sister,a stepsister,a niece,a family friend.One doesn't exclude the other.

What I meant was this: what if you were a detective and all you knew was that a child beauty pageant winner was sexually assaulted. What direction would you take the investigation? Has it gone that way, and how far?

I believe that the sexual assault was the basest act. Someone may murder a child for various reasons including to silence a witness. So the sexual assault tends to be the basest or the most depraved act. Thats why it is important to the case.

I also think the child beauty pageant provides a huge public exposure for a child. Just like schools and day care might attract a pedophile, so does pageants I'm sure.

I'm saying that pageants and the sexual assault are potentially important aspects of the crime. Has the investigation proceeded along those lines and if so how far?

 

[BOESP]

hey Ukguy,

what barbie doll?:banghead:
see,this is happening again.we take a rumour as fact and base our theories on it.

What about the rest of UKGuys post? Ignoring information that is available to the public is as big, or bigger, problem than someone making a mistake (if indeed UKGuy erred).

 

[BOESP]

It is a stretch, to claim that despite a sexual assault on JBR plus RDI's oft-touted prior sexual abuse, to believe there is no pedophile.

Its a safe bet on the pedophile, according to the statistics I've read.

Statistics also say the offender is likely known to the victim and inthis case it is highly likely a parent was involved I see no earmarks indicating pedophilia. Abuse, maybe, but not pedophilia. I can also see a Desitin treatment-gone-wrong as an explanation.

 

[UKGuy]

About the doll?Please be so kind and do.Cause I looked and looked for quotes and pics that could prove the existence of one found down there but didn't find anything that satisfies me.

I've already posted this before including evidence that the barbie nightgown was blood stained. The source for the wine-cellar picture is a screen capture from the Schiller documentary, there are a few others from different angles. If you look closely enough you can make out the form of a barbie doll at the bottom right of the pink nightgown!

Following quotes are excerpted from Patsy's 1998 BPD Interview

Picture 145 is the wine-cellar e.g. paint can

19 TOM HANEY: 145.

20 PATSY RAMSEY: What is the pink thing?

21 TOM HANEY: We have next up, we have some

22 close-ups of the two items in 145, which is the white

23 blanket and the paint can. So if we take -- and if we

24 skip to the other numbered one and go to -- there is a

Trip DeMuth interjects with questions about the white blanket.
Still on the wine-cellar.

7 TRIP DEMUTH: Looking at picture 145.

8 PATSY RAMSEY: Okay. What is this pink --

9 what is that?

10 TOM HANEY: We will show you a photo of that

11 in just a second.

I assume the pink object is in an evidence bag?

21 TOM HANEY: This is the pink -- excuse me --

22 the pink item that again is in a plastic bag where the

23 photo was taken.

24 PATSY RAMSEY: That is her (inaudible). Why

25 was that there?

0383

1 TOM HANEY: What is it?

2 PATSY RAMSEY: It is her Barbie nightgown.

3 TOM HANEY: Is that hers or her Barbie

4 doll's? When would she have worn that last, do you

5 know?

6 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, she didn't wear it that

7 night

Patsy explcitly identifies the pink object as JonBenet's Barbie nightgown, but does not confirm if it is her Barbie Doll's , which is important if her doll is at the crime-scene.

Patsy and Tom Haney state they can see a Barbie Doll. I'm assuming its under the nightgown?

11 PATSY RAMSEY: I'm thinking of a Barbie

12 nightgown that had a big face of Barbie.

13 TRIP DEMUTH: It has a plastic over it, so

14 there is some glare there. You see the plastic.

15 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah; right. What I'm saying,

16 I'm -- I remember a Barbie nightgown with a picture,

17 big picture of the head of Barbie on it. So I am not

18 quite sure this is her -- you know, one that she had.

19 TOM HANEY: Okay. You know, it appears --

20 PATSY RAMSEY: That is a Barbie doll under

21 there.

22 TOM HANEY: It appears from the waist down

23 you can see that much, but from the waist up, because

24 of the plastic, there is a flash and the reflection

25 that is washed out.

Looks like we have the Barbie nightgown and a Barbie doll located in the wine-cellar and documented as evidence.

 

[madeleine]

Ignoring information that is available to the public is as big, or bigger, problem than someone making a mistake

What exactly am I ignoring?
Interesting that you make such a statement since I am dying here not to ignore anything,whether it's RDI,IDI or GodknowsDI.Why do I bother anyway.Seems that most of the people hate me for not being extreme (on one side or another).

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

How can you go by an interrogation? Who took the pictures? When were they taken? Are they dated? Do they come with an affidavit from the investigator?

Investigators lie, they do it all the time according to what I've read.

 

[madeleine]

What I meant was this: what if you were a detective and all you knew was that a child beauty pageant winner was sexually assaulted. What direction would you take the investigation? Has it gone that way, and how far?

Prima facie,yes,it screams pedo intruder/stalker.But that doesn't mean I would ignore the rest of the evidence.

I believe that the sexual assault was the basest act. Someone may murder a child for various reasons including to silence a witness. So the sexual assault tends to be the basest or the most depraved act. Thats why it is important to the case.

Very true.But that doesn't exclude family members,friends,etc

I also think the child beauty pageant provides a huge public exposure for a child. Just like schools and day care might attract a pedophile, so does pageants I'm sure.

ITA

I'm saying that pageants and the sexual assault are potentially important aspects of the crime. Has the investigation proceeded along those lines and if so how far?

They say they investigated in that direction.Do I trust them?NO.So I can't know.

 

[madeleine]

Ukguy,thanks.

PATSY RAMSEY: That is a Barbie doll under

21 there.



To ME this sounds like they showed her a gown in a plastic bag and she saw the picture of the barbie that was on the gown under it(plastic).

IMO

Maybe it was a gown like this with a barbie pic on it?

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

They say they investigated in that direction.Do I trust them?NO.So I can't know.

We have some case braniacs why not ask them:


When and where were the pageants that year?