No intruder?

[MurriFlower]

When you post like that, it makes it difficult to answer as everything but what is outside the quote box disappears.

Originally Posted by Let_Forever_Be View Post
> Patsy never wrote the ransom note via dictation over the phone. No such evidence exists for that. That's absolute baloney as Judge Judy would say.I know you're just speculating but c'mon?

MurriFlower:I'm speculating sure, but am suggesting a way that she may have written the note, but not been involved in the killing, because you stated the two went hand in hand If my speculation is correct then all she did is lie to the cops. Of course, if true, it would open up a whole new can of worms.

LFB: but we both know it's not true. The Police would have known. Was there evidence that an outside phone number contacted the Ramseys? We should only deal in facts and reasonable conjecture -- it is simply not true that the 'abductors dictated the ransom note to Patsy. How could they be sure she didn't know JonBenet was dead. Why didn't she tell the police about them etc etc.

Well, we couldn't say for sure as the phone records are not available. Funny that eh? You may think that it's not true about the abductors dictating, but it actually makes quite a bit of sense. If this scenario was true, then JBR would not have been dead at that time, say before midnight. Why didn't she tell the cops?? Perhaps if we understood the RN that might explain it.

MurriFlower":It goes without saying that RDI are committed to PR writing the note, but there was not enough evidence of this to charge her, so the reasonable doubt came into the matter well before it went to court.

>LFB: the red fibres from Patsy's jacket were found entwined.She denied being in the basement that night. They were fibres from her jacket -- the same jacket she had on at the White's Xmas party. How do they get entwined with rope?

MurriFlower: The cops said they were from her jacket and were entwined in the garotte. This was during an interview that they never expected to be made public. To my knowledge no one from BPD or DA held a press conference where this was announced. Cops frequently tell a suspect they have evidence that they do not, in order to try to get a confession. It is usual tactics.
LFB:> but it's an objective fact that Patsy's jacket fibres were entwined within the garrotte. There's no speculation needed.(I'll try and get a link or if someone else can that would be great) *update* In the interviews with Boulder prosecutors in August, 2000, prosecutor Bruce Levin summed up the evidence: MR. LEVIN: "I think that is probably fair. Based on the state of the art scientific testing, we believe the fibers from her jacket were found in the paint tray, were found tied into the ligature found on JonBenet's neck, were found on the blanket that she is wrapped in, were found on the duct tape that is found on the mouth, and the question is, can she explain to us how those fibers appeared in those places that are associated with her daughter's death.

This is the quote from the interview I'm talking about. This information was not made public outside that room, and would never have been, until the interviews were published. So, I'm thinking if there actually was a scientific report saying these fibers were definitely from PR's jacket and were in fact in these areas, then the cops would have been trumpeting it from the rooftops. As it happened, they were very quiet about it. Whereas by contrast, the DNA results were announced in a press conference.

If you have any evidence aside from this interview, I'd be pleased to see it.

 

[otg]

(quotes selectively snipped by otg for clarity)

MF:
There is another explanation; that she wrote the RN dictated in a telephone call made to her by the kidnappers. That means she both could have written the RN but was not involved in the crime. It also means, if true, that for reasons of their own they are not telling the full story.

LFB:
Patsy never wrote the ransom note via dictation over the phone. No such evidence exists for that.

MF:
I'm speculating sure, but am suggesting a way that she may have written the note, but not been involved in the killing, because you stated the two went hand in hand

LFB:
Was there evidence that an outside phone number contacted the Ramseys? We should only deal in facts and reasonable conjecture -- it is simply not true that the abductors dictated the ransom note to Patsy. How could they be sure she didn't know JonBenet was dead when they were doing it (if it was done over a phone). Why didn't she tell the police about them etc etc.

MF:
You may think that it's not true about the abductors dictating, but it actually makes quite a bit of sense. If this scenario was true, then JBR would not have been dead at that time, say before midnight. Why didn't she tell the cops?? Perhaps if we understood the RN that might explain it.

If you gentlepeople don’t mind me interjecting here...

I know the “dictated RN” is just a posit for the sake of argument (although it's close to an admission, Murri, to the possibility of PR having penned the RN), but it need not continue as a serious discussion. Had PR been forced under threat of harm to JB to write the RN, then once the body was found, the “kidnappers” would no longer hold a bargaining card for PR and JR to continue denying she wrote the RN. She would have simply said, “Yes, I wrote it, because they threatened to harm JonBenet if I didn’t. Check the phone records. Find out who made the call.”
.

 

[Let_Forever_Be]

This is the quote from the interview I'm talking about. This information was not made public outside that room, and would never have been, until the interviews were published. So, I'm thinking if there actually was a scientific report saying these fibers were definitely from PR's jacket and were in fact in these areas, then the cops would have been trumpeting it from the rooftops. As it happened, they were very quiet about it. Whereas by contrast, the DNA results were announced in a press conference.

If you have any evidence aside from this interview, I'd be pleased to see it.

I'm not sure if any such evidence exists. Not to say that it's not true because I believe it is. I'm just not sure to what extent it was made public.

I will obviously look for any links to the information.If anyone finds some please post them.

It's pretty much been a part of the common consensus that fibres from Patsy's red jacket were entwined within the garrotte.

Here is a link showing the interviews Patsy took in 2000 and it regards the fibres from her jacket. The information is linked from the 'candyrose' website:

http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-fibers.htm

 

[MurriFlower]

(quotes selectively snipped by otg for clarity)

If you gentlepeople don’t mind me interjecting here...

I know the “dictated RN” is just a posit for the sake of argument (although it's close to an admission, Murri, to the possibility of PR having penned the RN), but it need not continue as a serious discussion. Had PR been forced under threat of harm to JB to write the RN, then once the body was found, the “kidnappers” would no longer hold a bargaining card for PR and JR to continue denying she wrote the RN. She would have simply said, “Yes, I wrote it, because they threatened to harm JonBenet if I didn’t. Check the phone records. Find out who made the call.”
.

Not suggesting that she was under direct threat of harm nor JBR when it was written. Just a phone call and a menacing voice saying, write this down exactly as I say it.

I'm not really serious about it as a theory, but just suggested that there is an alternative to PR wrote the RN = PR either is killer/knows who did. People sometimes get tunnel vision regarding certain 'clues'. It doesn't hurt them to be reminded that what they see only as black/white might actually have grey areas. It could become a serious theory if we were to find out JR was involved in something threatening "National Security" -- perhaps we should search for his/his company's name in Wikileaks?

I don't think from the samples of PRs writing that she was the RN author. Aside from the fact that, rather than deflect blame (as RDI suppose was the intention) it has had the opposite effect. The length of the note, the content and that it was handwritten all point away from PR (supposing she was the murderer). "Experts not being able to eliminate her as the writer" is just to cover themselves in case it turns out she did write it and they were wrong.

The phone records are sealed apparently. I think we've discussed this before and from memory, it was because some tabloid tried to get them illegally or some such.

 

[Let_Forever_Be]

I don't think from the samples of PRs writing that she was the RN author. Aside from the fact that, rather than deflect blame (as RDI suppose was the intention) it has had the opposite effect. The length of the note, the content and that it was handwritten all point away from PR (supposing she was the murderer). "Experts not being able to eliminate her as the writer" is just to cover themselves in case it turns out she did write it and they were wrong.

Many handwriting experts do believe she is the author.

Also, I disagree with your logic that Patsy wouldn't have wrote the ransom note as it directed blame at her. If she was involved with the crime, she HAD to write the ransom note. Think about it : JonBenet's body is dead > they need a ruse to suggest/frame an intruder > they can't get rid of the body due to the snow that fell so can't leave the house > the ransom note introduced the narrative of a vengeful 'faction' out to get John Ramsey by harming his family.

If Patsy didn't write the note, how could she call the police? I mean, what would she say -- I can't find my daughter. She's missing? Whilst the police would come and investigate, a cursory search of the house would soon discover the dead body. And without the 'intruder' theory introduced via the ransom note, ALL attention would be on the parents. They would have nothing to act as a buffer to defend themselves.

Let's be honest -- the one thing that has kept the parents out of jail is the possibility that an intruder did it. Without that possibility, they would be in deep doggy doo dah!

 

[MurriFlower]

Many handwriting experts do believe she is the author.

And many do not.

Also, I disagree with your logic that Patsy wouldn't have wrote the ransom note as it directed blame at her. If she was involved with the crime, she HAD to write the ransom note. Think about it : JonBenet's body is dead > they need a ruse to suggest/frame an intruder > they can't get rid of the body due to the snow that fell so can't leave the house > the ransom note introduced the narrative of a vengeful 'faction' out to get John Ramsey by harming his family.

Well, no, I think not. Why say 'we have kidnapped your child and you need to pay money to return her', when you know she is dead in the basement. This makes no sense either for RDI or IDI. But with IDI you could argue that they meant to kidnap, but then 'accidentally' killed her, or at the least IDI was a total crack head nutcase.

Far better for PR/JR to dispose of the body (the snow isn't a problem, as they had to go out to get the ransom money to fulfill their own plot) and they might also reasonably do a search of the neighbourhood looking for a suspicious vehicle.

If Patsy didn't write the note, how could she call the police? I mean, what would she say -- I can't find my daughter. She's missing? Whilst the police would come and investigate, a cursory search of the house would soon discover the dead body. And without the 'intruder' theory introduced via the ransom note, ALL attention would be on the parents. They would have nothing to act as a buffer to defend themselves.

Ok, no note. PR comes down the stairs, makes breakfast, JR joins her (fully clothed thank goodness), they go to wake the kids. BR woken, no JBR, where's your sister?. What to do, look through the house in case she's hiding, search the neighbourhood/ask neighbours, phone her friends,then ring the cops. IF they were responsible, it would be far easier to make the house look like it was broken into, than write a RN (in your own handwriting with all that BS) and leave all the doors locked. Cops arrive, search the house thoroughly, find body.

Let's be honest -- the one thing that has kept the parents out of jail is the possibility that an intruder did it. Without that possibility, they would be in deep doggy doo dah!

If we are being honest for a change, the thing that has kept them from even being charged is a lack of evidence against them. There was innuendo, suspicion, even outright hostility by both the cops and the public, but the one thing sadly lacking was hard evidence. Even before the additional unidentified male DNA was found, there wasn't enough. The RN (which cast more suspicion on them than it cast doubt) could have not been there, and there still wouldn't have been enough evidence.

 

[UKGuy]

If we are being honest for a change, the thing that has kept them from even being charged is a lack of evidence against them. There was innuendo, suspicion, even outright hostility by both the cops and the public, but the one thing sadly lacking was hard evidence. Even before the additional unidentified male DNA was found, there wasn't enough. The RN (which cast more suspicion on them than it cast doubt) could have not been there, and there still wouldn't have been enough evidence.

MurriFlower,

There is evidence linking both John and Patsy to the wine-cellar crime-scene.

There is no evidence linking or matching to an intruder.

The Ramsey's only have one defense e.g. IDI.

Its not DNA is it, its touch-dna.


.

 

[Let_Forever_Be]

And many do not

But most do. You're ignoring how Patsy was the only person who could not be excluded as the author of the ransom note out of the original 73 samples.The fact that the notepad was Patsy's and so was the pen states how the writing apparatus came from within the home.The Ransom note had to be written to cover for the crime and with limited time and resources during the night, Patsy's notepad would have to do.

Well, no, I think not. Why say 'we have kidnapped your child and you need to pay money to return her', when you know she is dead in the basement. This makes no sense either for RDI or IDI. But with IDI you could argue that they meant to kidnap, but then 'accidentally' killed her, or at the least IDI was a total crack head nutcase.

They had to create a narrative that an intruder did all the horrible things to JonBenet. They weren't going to admit they did.Further, the idea that someone broke in to do this for a ransom made sense. Adding in the idea that the perpetrator knew of John's $118,000 bonus made it seem like a vendetta.

Far better for PR/JR to dispose of the body (the snow isn't a problem, as they had to go out to get the ransom money to fulfill their own plot) and they might also reasonably do a search of the neighbourhood looking for a suspicious vehicle.

They went out to get money AFTER the police arrived. If the Police arrived and saw footprints that would be suspicious. Add in the the possibility of leaving forensics in their car from JonBenet and of a neighbour seeing/hearing them drive during the night.Hence why she was dumped in the basement in the most obscure room.

Ok, no note. PR comes down the stairs, makes breakfast, JR joins her (fully clothed thank goodness), they go to wake the kids. BR woken, no JBR, where's your sister?. What to do, look through the house in case she's hiding, search the neighbourhood/ask neighbours, phone her friends,then ring the cops. IF they were responsible, it would be far easier to make the house look like it was broken into, than write a RN (in your own handwriting with all that BS) and leave all the doors locked. Cops arrive, search the house thoroughly, find body.

But they didn't search the house. They even admit this. They supposedly searched her bedroom. Why didn't they look to see if she was in the house, injured and needing medical treatment. Oh, perhaps because they knew she was dead.

If we are being honest for a change, the thing that has kept them from even being charged is a lack of evidence against them. There was innuendo, suspicion, even outright hostility by both the cops and the public, but the one thing sadly lacking was hard evidence. Even before the additional unidentified male DNA was found, there wasn't enough. The RN (which cast more suspicion on them than it cast doubt) could have not been there, and there still wouldn't have been enough evidence.

No. Actually, when the Boulder DA were running the show, the Ramseys were protected from proper investigation.Steve Thomas resigned due to the farce.

 

[MurriFlower]

But most do. You're ignoring how Patsy was the only person who could not be excluded as the author of the ransom note out of the original 73 samples.The fact that the notepad was Patsy's and so was the pen states how the writing apparatus came from within the home.The Ransom note had to be written to cover for the crime and with limited time and resources during the night, Patsy's notepad would have to do.

No, I think you are exagerating. PR was said to be the only one they tested that they could not exclude. There are more than 73 people in the world and my guess is that half of them would fall into this category if tested by a 'panel of handwriting experts' even if these experts were completely impartial. Refer to my earlier post regarding JMK's handwriting.

They had to create a narrative that an intruder did all the horrible things to JonBenet. They weren't going to admit they did.Further, the idea that someone broke in to do this for a ransom made sense. Adding in the idea that the perpetrator knew of John's $118,000 bonus made it seem like a vendetta.

If it is as you say, then why not tell what actually happened, as you are (I assume) saying the RN was written after the murder? They threatened beheading and denying remains for burial. Instead they bash, strangle and leave the body in their own house!

They went out to get money AFTER the police arrived. If the Police arrived and saw footprints that would be suspicious. Add in the the possibility of leaving forensics in their car from JonBenet and of a neighbour seeing/hearing them drive during the night.

Yes, in reality they did, but I'm suggesting that if they wrote the RN, they could have gone to get the money as a ruse to dispose of evidence.

Hence why she was dumped in the basement in the most obscure room.

If they wanted to have her obscured they would have left her in the crawl space, no one would have looked there for hours/days. If they didn't want to be implicated they wouldn't have handwritten the RN or discovered the body themselves. Think about it, it makes no sense.

But they didn't search the house. They even admit this. They supposedly searched her bedroom. Why didn't they look to see if she was in the house, injured and needing medical treatment. Oh, perhaps because they knew she was dead.

No, they didn't search the house, because they thought she had been abducted. They called the cops.

No. Actually, when the Boulder DA were running the show, the Ramseys were protected from proper investigation.Steve Thomas resigned due to the farce.

When the BPD (and ST) were running the show, they didn't investigate properly and therefore didn't find evidence of an intruder because they weren't looking for one, but spent an inordinate amount of time trying to nail the Rs. ST resigned before he was sacked for incompetence.

 

[Let_Forever_Be]

No, I think you are exagerating. PR was said to be the only one they tested that they could not exclude. There are more than 73 people in the world and my guess is that half of them would fall into this category if tested by a 'panel of handwriting experts' even if these experts were completely impartial. Refer to my earlier post regarding JMK's handwriting.

Let's not guess since you have no proof for your guesses -- it's mere speculation on your part. Let's deal with the conclusions of handwriting experts. Whilst the 'reasonable doubt' clause of the law precludes Patsy Ramsey from being explicitly stated as the author, most experts who studied her handwriting think she wrote it.

If it is as you say, then why not tell what actually happened, as you are (I assume) saying the RN was written after the murder? They threatened beheading and denying remains for burial. Instead they bash, strangle and leave the body in their own house!

Because the ransom note was presented to the police as the work of an intruder. It had to say that they were keeping the body for ransom. The fact that in reality the body was in the house was testament to the fact that probably one of the parents killed her. There's obvious reasons why the body couldn't be removed from the house as stated in my other post prior. Thus, the ransom note had to pretend to have the authority of a kidnapper. It's not going to say " we kidnapped your daughter for ransom but she is actually in the basement so don't bother getting us our money..." It was ransom note which tried to seem authentic.

Yes, in reality they did, but I'm suggesting that if they wrote the RN, they could have gone to get the money as a ruse to dispose of evidence.

By that time they were being watched by the Police. Their phone lines were were tapped. John Ramsey did disappear for an hour though so you're correct to speculate as to the potential for someone to dispose of evidence. John Ramsey was also still wanting to leave Boulder on the 26th too so much so he was talking to his pilot -- which Police officers felt weird.

If they wanted to have her obscured they would have left her in the crawl space, no one would have looked there for hours/days. If they didn't want to be implicated they wouldn't have handwritten the RN or discovered the body themselves. Think about it, it makes no sense.

The body HAD to be discovered. There was no ransom. No-one called. There was no small foreign faction. It was a lie invented by the fraudulent author of the ransom note. Thus, the body had to be discovered -- then the whole charade would begin.

No, they didn't search the house, because they thought she had been abducted. They called the cops.

Or they knew she was dead because they...............

When the BPD (and ST) were running the show, they didn't investigate properly and therefore didn't find evidence of an intruder because they weren't looking for one, but spent an inordinate amount of time trying to nail the Rs. ST resigned before he was sacked for incompetence

.That's a weird logic -- because they didn't find evidence of an intruder their work was 'incorrect'. So, was there a foregone conclusion that had to be satisfied, namely that an intruder must be proven at all costs even if no evidence (as is the case) exists? Maybe there's no evidence for an intruder because there isn't one. A bit like how there's no evidence for a moon made from marshmallows due to the fact that it isn't made of marshmallows.

 

[SunnieRN]

The same neighbor that heard the scream was the wife of the man who heard a sound he described as "metal scraping concrete". When the scream woke her up, she then woke her husband (who didn't hear the scream). That's when he heard the metal scraping sound. There were paint cans in the wineceller that could have been the source for that if they were moved out of the way. These can be seen in some crime photos of that room. There was also a large piece of sheet metal, if I recall, on the floor that seemed to have been moved out of the way from the spot were JB was placed.
LFB- if you haven't already, this site http://www.acandyrose.com is an excellent resource on this case (and some others). You have to click on the JonBenet archives to bring up the info. It used to have the police interviews too but they are gone now. All the crime photos available are on there as well as the autopsy report and the few photos that have been circulated publicly. There are also recommendations there of books on the case to read.

Or a bat hitting cement. Say the softball bat found outside the side of the house that had JonBenets hair on it.

I disagree that saliva, semen and blood are more difficult to pass from object to object. If the person was sexually assaulted before being murdered, and your DNA (from any source) was on two items of her underclothing, you might be questioned as to your alibi. If you sneezed into your bare hand and turned a door knob before the murdered person touched it, would that make you more liable to be guilty? Or if you had a cut on your hand and left blood? (I won't go into the other LOL).

There is none so blind as one who will not see. The difference has been explained to you many times by multiple posters MF. You had better hope and pray that touch DNA does not become a standard for solving crimes, and proof of guilt, or there will be a multitude of people arrested and convicted from crime scenes every day. Just because you touched something, anything, does not mean you committed a crime. This has VERY scary implications as everyone sheds skin cells. No matter where you are.

Not suggesting that she was under direct threat of harm nor JBR when it was written. Just a phone call and a menacing voice saying, write this down exactly as I say it.

I'm not really serious about it as a theory, but just suggested that there is an alternative to PR wrote the RN = PR either is killer/knows who did. People sometimes get tunnel vision regarding certain 'clues'. It doesn't hurt them to be reminded that what they see only as black/white might actually have grey areas. It could become a serious theory if we were to find out JR was involved in something threatening "National Security" -- perhaps we should search for his/his company's name in Wikileaks?

I don't think from the samples of PRs writing that she was the RN author. Aside from the fact that, rather than deflect blame (as RDI suppose was the intention) it has had the opposite effect. The length of the note, the content and that it was handwritten all point away from PR (supposing she was the murderer). "Experts not being able to eliminate her as the writer" is just to cover themselves in case it turns out she did write it and they were wrong.

The phone records are sealed apparently. I think we've discussed this before and from memory, it was because some tabloid tried to get them illegally or some such.

MF the Ramseys were VERY good at throwing accusations and blame. What makes you think that if Patsy had written the note due to a phone call, that she wouldn't have shouted it from every roof top. She would have carried on about that phone call until she passed away. In fact it's too bad for her sake that she didn't think of that. She needed you on her team MF. You are really good at spin!

 

[BBB167893]

This is the quote from the interview I'm talking about. This information was not made public outside that room, and would never have been, until the interviews were published. So, I'm thinking if there actually was a scientific report saying these fibers were definitely from PR's jacket and were in fact in these areas, then the cops would have been trumpeting it from the rooftops. As it happened, they were very quiet about it. Whereas by contrast, the DNA results were announced in a press conference.

If you have any evidence aside from this interview, I'd be pleased to see it.

I've been watching this rather fascinating back-and-forth, but I feel I must interject something here. A couple of somethings, actually.

1) Yes, COPS often use the tactic you describe. But in this interview, it wasn't the cops who were telling them. It was a pair of prosecuting attorneys who are forbidden from using such underhanded measures, public or not. I should also point out that the prosecutors in question, Mr Kane and Mr Levin, are known for their success and for their ethics.

You said it yourself, Murri: as an IDI, you have the luxury of believing every word the Rs say. Well, I reserve the same right to trust what Kane and Levin say.

2) More importantly, your assertion that since the scientific report was not made public, it does not exist, strikes me as ill-informed, to say the very least. Point-of-fact, I'd EXPECT it not to be "trumpted" as you say. I'd EXPECT them to play things close to the vest. That was one of the big problems with this case: giving the entire store away. And it was one of the problems that Kane made it a point to rectify.

3) The fact that the DNA results were announced in a press conference does not surprise me.

 

[BBB167893]

I'm not sure if any such evidence exists. Not to say that it's not true because I believe it is. I'm just not sure to what extent it was made public.

I will obviously look for any links to the information.If anyone finds some please post them.

It's pretty much been a part of the common consensus that fibres from Patsy's red jacket were entwined within the garrotte.

Here is a link showing the interviews Patsy took in 2000 and it regards the fibres from her jacket. The information is linked from the 'candyrose' website:

http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-fibers.htm

Patsy herself pretty much confirmed it. Not that she meant to, of course! But in a TV interview given some time later, she tried to explain the presence of her fibers there. Problem is, she only dug herself deeper because her story doesn't hold up.

 

[BBB167893]

I don't think from the samples of PRs writing that she was the RN author.

Well, if they don't convince you, I can't think of what will!

Aside from the fact that, rather than deflect blame (as RDI suppose was the intention) it has had the opposite effect.

That's HARDLY proof of innocence, Murri. Indeed, that tends to be the case with staging. Everybody thinks they can outsmart the law. And they're always quite surprised when they're wrong. She wouldn't be the first.

The length of the note, the content and that it was handwritten all point away from PR (supposing she was the murderer).

How do you figure? For most of us, those are some of the defining traits.

 

[BBB167893]

Many handwriting experts do believe she is the author.

Also, I disagree with your logic that Patsy wouldn't have wrote the ransom note as it directed blame at her. If she was involved with the crime, she HAD to write the ransom note. Think about it : JonBenet's body is dead > they need a ruse to suggest/frame an intruder > they can't get rid of the body due to the snow that fell so can't leave the house > the ransom note introduced the narrative of a vengeful 'faction' out to get John Ramsey by harming his family.

If Patsy didn't write the note, how could she call the police? I mean, what would she say -- I can't find my daughter. She's missing? Whilst the police would come and investigate, a cursory search of the house would soon discover the dead body. And without the 'intruder' theory introduced via the ransom note, ALL attention would be on the parents. They would have nothing to act as a buffer to defend themselves.

Let's be honest -- the one thing that has kept the parents out of jail is the possibility that an intruder did it. Without that possibility, they would be in deep doggy doo dah!

:clap: :clap: :clap: Perfectly put.

 

[BBB167893]

If they wanted to have her obscured they would have left her in the crawl space, no one would have looked there for hours/days. If they didn't want to be implicated they wouldn't have handwritten the RN or discovered the body themselves. Think about it, it makes no sense.

I HAVE thought about it. And it makes plenty sense to me!

When the BPD (and ST) were running the show, they didn't investigate properly and therefore didn't find evidence of an intruder because they weren't looking for one, but spent an inordinate amount of time trying to nail the Rs.

I think you've got that just the other way around. They didn't look for an intruder because they wasn't one. And as for an inordinate amount of time trying to nail the Rs, it goes back to what I said about the number of LE agents who are RDI. LE in this country has a nasty habit of focusing on criminals, especially killers.

ST resigned before he was sacked for incompetence.

Does anyone have any actual PROOF of that, or is it another one of those phantom claims that has grown legs?

Murri, I hate to be the one to tell you this, but LFB is ABSOLUTELY RIGHT:

No. Actually, when the Boulder DA were running the show, the Ramseys were protected from proper investigation. Steve Thomas resigned due to the farce.

And as far as I'm concerned, if he did nothing else right, ST is a HERO for making sure the world knows it!

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

And as far as I'm concerned, if he did nothing else right, ST is a HERO for making sure the world knows it!

This is nuts. Making sure the world knows what? Do you really believe the world knows that ST is the hero and PR/JR escaped justice?

C'mon the only thing the world knows is intruder DNA and the prosecuting attorney WANTS the R's free and clear.

 

[BBB167893]

This is nuts.

Is it? Shall we take a poll?

Making sure the world knows what? Do you really believe the world knows that ST is the hero and PR/JR escaped justice?

Perhaps I should rephrase: for doing all he could to make sure the world knows it. But to answer your question, I wouldn't bet against it.

C'mon the only thing the world knows is intruder DNA

No, that's just what they've been TOLD.

and the prosecuting attorney WANTS the R's free and clear.

Did you all read that? HOTYH FINALLY agree with me! In case you hadn't noticed, that's what I'm saying!

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Is it? Shall we take a poll?

Dont worry SD you're popularity is safe here in this forum. Comfy even.

Perhaps I should rephrase: for doing all he could to make sure the world knows it. But to answer your question, I wouldn't bet against it.

I can't tell you how to spend your money.


No, that's just what they've been TOLD. Like they've been told its going to snow. Those nasty newspeople and weathermen always lying to people.



Did you all read that? HOTYH FINALLY agree with me! In case you hadn't noticed, that's what I'm saying!

Whats your point?

 

[joeskidbeck]

Point: When Mary Lacy was the prosecuting attorney she wanted the Ramseys free and clear. That's what you said and SD agrees.
New Point: New prosecuting attorney and I don't think he has as much faith in the Ramseys as ML. He very well could have, but that's yet to be seen